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View Full Version : Who Feels Better about 2005 now?


Hangar18
12-22-2004, 02:23 PM
Signing El Duque, though not the best option, certainly fills the
Gaping Hole the SOX have had since 2001, the #5 pitchers spot.
I do feel good now ...... but I will be ecstatic if we do WHATEVER IT TAKES
to sign Eckstein. The hole at the TOP OF THE LINEUP since we traded
Ray Durham has been huge and we havnt filled it since ....
Cmon SOX, were feeling good here .........:smile:

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 02:26 PM
Do I think the Sox will have a winning record? No

Do I think I will be able to take friends from out of town to Sox games this spring without feeling embarassed? Yes.

That second part was a "no" until the el Duque signing, and will return to that if the signing turns out not to have occured.

batmanZoSo
12-22-2004, 02:28 PM
Signing El Duque, though not the best option, certainly fills the
Gaping Hole the SOX have had since 2001, the #5 pitchers spot.
I do feel good now ...... but I will be ecstatic if we do WHATEVER IT TAKES
to sign Eckstein. The hole at the TOP OF THE LINEUP since we traded
Ray Durham has been huge and we havnt filled it since ....
Cmon SOX, were feeling good here .........:smile:
When did we sign El Duque?

Jurr
12-22-2004, 02:28 PM
Do I think the Sox will have a winning record? No

Do I think I will be able to take friends from out of town to Sox games this spring without feeling embarassed? Yes.

That second part was a "no" until the el Duque signing, and will return to that if the signing turns out not to have occured.I am glad that there is usually a LARGE void between what one thinks and what actually happens.

johnnyg83
12-22-2004, 02:33 PM
Absolutely. That 5-hole has been a black hole. We've got four guys, who when they're on, have No. 1 stuff. And Garland a .500 pitcher in the last spot. I'm presuming Garland is goign to be be No. 5 and not Duque. Though it may be smart to keep Duque in the 5 spot to keep his innings down.

Kogs35
12-22-2004, 02:34 PM
i feel better for that have a pizza http://bears.hosttown.com/html/emoticons/pizza.gif (http://javascript<b></b>:emoticon(':pizza:'))

SoxFan76
12-22-2004, 02:38 PM
When did we sign El Duque?
That's what I'm wondering. I know there is a huge thread speculating the signing of Hernandez, but is it official now? I'm not about to go through 12 pages of speculation to find out.

Jurr
12-22-2004, 02:39 PM
You know what I feel better about???? Pitchers and catchers are reporting in a couple of months. The grass will be cut, we'll be seeing Buehrle, Garcia, and the gang stretching, Ozzie's lips will be flapping in the microphone after practices, and the fun will begin. As much as we think we know about this roster, we won't know anything until it's all in hindsight. The trip towards putting everything in hindsight is what I'm excited for.

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 02:39 PM
That's what I'm wondering. I know there is a huge thread speculating the signing of Hernandez, but is it official now? I'm not about to go through 12 pages of speculation to find out.Check out the main page of WhiteSox.com (http://www.whitesox.com/).

The Score is also reporting that it's a done deal and that the White Sox are now interested in David Eckstein.

Hangar18
12-22-2004, 02:40 PM
That's what I'm wondering. I know there is a huge thread speculating the signing of Hernandez, but is it official now? I'm not about to go through 12 pages of speculation to find out.
YES, he signed, its being reported on am670 and am1000.
Someone never started a Thread announcing his signing.

OEO Magglio
12-22-2004, 02:44 PM
I feel pretty darn good about 05. If we can eck or cora in here I would say this offseason has been a complete success. Kenny has remade the team to play more small ball and manufacture runs, and we now easily have one of the best pitching staffs from top to bottom in the american league. I'm very satisfied as of right now but I think we'll see eck or cora in here very soon(I think it'll be alex). I'm very satisfied with this offseason and I can't wait for soxfest and the season to start :smile: .

batmanZoSo
12-22-2004, 02:46 PM
YES, he signed, its being reported on am670 and am1000.
Someone never started a Thread announcing his signing.
Remember this day, folks. Some signing actually happened before a thread at WSI announced it.

I guess I'll weigh in, then: we could do worse. At least we have 5 starters now. In theory, we should be able to overcome the mid-80s win plateau we've been stuck on, which we can all agree was mostly due to our "5th starter woes." So let's hope all 5 are healthy and none are complete slugs. Maybe even a Garland breakout year? Kidding of course...I gave that up long ago.

And I certainly like the Eckstein idea. If they get him as well, I'll be pretty satisified with the team's efforts to follow through with all their talk. They will have done what they set out to do. Then, you just gotta play the games.

Dolanski
12-22-2004, 02:50 PM
Assuming El Duque signs, I have no problems with this Sox team. I am actually optimistic for the season.

I for one don't think Eckstein is that great. One good season on a WS team (see Mark Bellhorn) doesn't make a career. He has done little since 2000 and is OVERRATED. I would rather see Willie make a go at it than sign him.


Gee, I love how everyone has such a short memory. We NEED to sign a big time free agent to have a successful offseason. We need this guy, we need that guy. Well, its the off season. Sometimes great moves turn to crap and crappy moves turn out great. Patience people!

Did everyone forget how great the FA splashes we made in the 90s turned out? Albert Belle? Jaime Navarro?

How about more recent like say David Wells? Kenny Lofton?

I am perfectly happy with this team as is and am tired of all the complaining, whining, and moaning about how we need to spend more, we need to do this, we need to do that, let's trade crap and get this guy. We have a good team and we are going to compete for the central. That's plenty enough for me...

lths06
12-22-2004, 02:54 PM
If two months ago you were told of all the trades KW has made so far(Eckstein doesn't count), I think we would all...well...most of us...be ecstatic. Here's to Kenny:gulp:

NSSoxFan2
12-22-2004, 02:54 PM
Hangar, I do feel good about the 2005 season. I loved the team that we had from 99-04, but the bottom line is we didn't win. We would be selling our team short if we returned with the same players as the last five years, because we know they can't get it done.

IF we sign Eckstein or Cora, although I prefer Eck, our line-up will look good:
CF-Pods
SS-Eckstein
DH-Thomas
1B-Konerko
LF-Dye
RF-Rowand
3B-Crede
2B-Uribe
C-Davis

What do you guys think the line-up would look like if we either got Eck or Cora?

batmanZoSo
12-22-2004, 03:00 PM
Assuming El Duque signs, I have no problems with this Sox team. I am actually optimistic for the season.

I for one don't think Eckstein is that great. One good season on a WS team (see Mark Bellhorn) doesn't make a career. He has done little since 2000 and is OVERRATED. I would rather see Willie make a go at it than sign him.


Gee, I love how everyone has such a short memory. We NEED to sign a big time free agent to have a successful offseason. We need this guy, we need that guy. Well, its the off season. Sometimes great moves turn to crap and crappy moves turn out great. Patience people!

Did everyone forget how great the FA splashes we made in the 90s turned out? Albert Belle? Jaime Navarro?

How about more recent like say David Wells? Kenny Lofton?

I am perfectly happy with this team as is and am tired of all the complaining, whining, and moaning about how we need to spend more, we need to do this, we need to do that, let's trade crap and get this guy. We have a good team and we are going to compete for the central. That's plenty enough for me...
Last year, Eck batted .276 with a respectable .339 obp and has been as high as .363. These are full-season credentials, not part time speculation as with Willie. And I cannot stress enough that he's a smart player. His hustle will rub off on others. Willie can still play part of the time, no one's saying Eckstein is Jeff Kent where he has to be the undisputed, everyday guy. But if he's on this team, he's gonna get most of the at-bats wherever he's at. And I think he makes us better.

Jurr
12-22-2004, 03:03 PM
Last year, Eck batted .276 with a respectable .339 obp and has been as high as .363. These are full-season credentials, not part time speculation as with Willie. And I cannot stress enough that he's a smart player. His hustle will rub off on others. Willie can still play part of the time, no one's saying Eckstein is Jeff Kent where he has to be the undisputed, everyday guy. But if he's on this team, he's gonna get most of the at-bats wherever he's at. And I think he makes us better.Yeah..this is a guy that was given no shot of ever making an MLB roster, and he's risen above all of that and has flourished. If that wouldn't be an inspiration to his teammates, I don't know what would. Many people credit him for infusing a lot of spirit into his 2002 championship team, enough to help them get over the top.

To see a guy that's just thankful everyday for being a part of this sport, instead of looking at 5million dollar bonus babies who have it handed to them, would be great for the Sox.

wdelaney72
12-22-2004, 03:04 PM
I feel better.


I'd feel even better if we got Eckstein.

maurice
12-22-2004, 03:05 PM
KW has taken a lot of baby steps in the right direction. Hernandez is the latest baby step with maybe an IF or C still to come. I would have preferred a couple of big splashes (e.g., Mulder, Hudson, Johnson), but time will tell. Right now, we have a very deep pitching staff and lots of unanswered questions.

Frater Perdurabo
12-22-2004, 03:11 PM
I'd like to see Eckstein signed, but to play primarily at 2B with Uribe starting at SS. However, Eckstein would be an improved version of Graffy because he would allow for much flexibilty in the infield in case of injury or slumps.

From ESPN.com:
Eckstein ranked second in the league in fielding percentage among shortstops, and the Angels compare his on-field smarts to those of Alex Rodriguez. But his arm is weak and his range is limited. He may be better suited for his natural position of second base.

batmanZoSo
12-22-2004, 03:13 PM
I'd like to see Eckstein signed, but to play primarily at 2B with Uribe starting at SS. However, Eckstein would be an improved version of Graffy because he would allow for much flexibilty in the infield in case of injury or slumps.

From ESPN.com:
I would want him at second, too. Uribe's got a gun and he's got the range to play short. He's a shortstop. The only reason he played second is because he's versatile and Jose never played second. That said, Eckstein can handle shortstop, but he'd be even better at second.

Soxzilla
12-22-2004, 03:13 PM
White Sox are quietly becoming the best team in the American League Central.

You are DAMN RIGHT! that makes me happy.:cool:

Frater Perdurabo
12-22-2004, 03:13 PM
Right now, we have a very deep pitching staff and lots of unanswered questions.

At the very worst, the Sox have a team exactly opposite the past few seasons. Instead of a powerful offense with a questionable pitching staff (99-04), they have a deep rotation and bullpen with questions in the field.

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 03:16 PM
White Sox are quietly becoming the best team in the American League Central.

You are DAMN RIGHT! that makes me happy.:cool:They definately have the best rotation in the A.L Central now. :thumbsup:

MeanFish
12-22-2004, 03:42 PM
At the very worst, the Sox have a team exactly opposite the past few seasons. Instead of a powerful offense with a questionable pitching staff (99-04), they have a deep rotation and bullpen with questions in the field.
The thing is, they still do have a powerful offense, it's just very spread out.

We hit 242 HR last year. Take away Carlos' 31, Jose's 30, and Maggs' 9, and we're down to 172. Then you add in Dye's 23 and we're up to 195. Factor in the facts that a.) Dye will likely hit more HR this year than he did last year due to a change of scenery and b.) other players like Crede and Aaron might hit more this year and you've got yourself a recipe for 200 HR again. (There's no reason to think that Frank can't match his 18 HR from last year even if he only plays half the year. Even if he can't, Everett will probably hit more)

We've got a powerful offense, it just plays defense better and is better on the basepaths. Our pitching is pretty darned good right now, too.

It's less powerful, but it's powerful nonetheless.

Baby Fisk
12-22-2004, 03:44 PM
As part of a fanbase that has had to learn to "settle for second best", I guess I'm feeling pretty good right now. Not good enough to book holiday time to coincide with the World Series, but good nonetheless.

bmac5001
12-22-2004, 03:44 PM
i'm starting to get the feeling i can go into the season with cautious optimism, especially if we sign eckstein.

SoxFan78
12-22-2004, 03:45 PM
If we can get Eckstien, I will feel better about getting season tickets this year thats for sure.


Glass is half full, Glass is half full...

Jurr
12-22-2004, 03:50 PM
If we can get Eckstien, I will feel better about getting season tickets this year thats for sure.


Glass is half full, Glass is half full...Hell, if I lived in Chicago and could be at that park every night, I'd be there. When I get out of residency, I'm coming at first light the day after graduation.
Die hard Sox fans should be at that stadium as much as their finances will comfortably allow. That's just my opinion, though. I know it gets tough to give a financial commitment to a team that doesn't seem to give a huge financial commitment back, but there's something to be said for coming to that park, smelling that wonderful stadium food, hearing Gene Honda's voice, and going to Jimbo's after the game. I wish and wish that I could be at the park more than the 10 games I get to attend a year. I get excited just to go home and watch the game (live or taped) via Extra Innings.

GAsoxfan
12-22-2004, 03:51 PM
I'm optimistic about the 2005 season. KW did what he said he was going to do this summer: he improved the bullpen, got a 5th quality starter, and geared the team toward a small ball approach. There are definitely some question marks, but if Hernandez and Thomas can stay healthy this year the Sox should do well.

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 03:54 PM
They definately have the best rotation in the A.L Central now. :thumbsup:

No we don't, at least not at the top. We don't have anything close to Santana.

Mickster
12-22-2004, 03:55 PM
No we don't, at least not at the top. We don't have anything close to Santana.
One man does not a rotation make.

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 03:56 PM
No we don't, at least not at the top. We don't have anything close to Santana.After Santana and Radke, who do they have that's any good? Terry Mulholland? :tongue:

We now have the best 1 - 5 of any team in the A.L. Central.

johnnyg83
12-22-2004, 03:58 PM
So what's the bullpen makeup?

Vizcaino ??
Hermanson MRP
Marte SU
Takatsu CP
Adkins MRP
Cotts MRP
Politte SU

who I'm I forgetting?

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 03:58 PM
After Santana and Radke, who do they have that's any good? Terry Mulholland? :tongue:

We now have the best 1 - 5 of any team in the A.L. Central.

Best 3-5 maybe. Santana and Radke is better than Garcia and Buehrle.

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 04:00 PM
Best 3-5 maybe. Santana and Radke is better than Garcia and Buehrle.I agree on Santana but not Radke. Carlos Silva is decent but Kyle Lohse and Terry Mulholland suck.

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 04:01 PM
I agree on Santana but not Radke. Carlos Silva is also pretty good but Kyle Lohse and Terry Mulholland suck.

The other thing you have to figure in is that while, except for Santana and possibly Radke, the Twins pitchers might be less talented, but they somehow get the job done. Lohse and Mulholland are far more consistant than any pitcher we have on the Sox.

SOXSINCE'70
12-22-2004, 04:04 PM
I. If we can eck or cora in here I would say this offseason has been a complete success. :smile: .Be confident,OEO.Why not both Eckstein AND Alex Cora??


:reinsy
"Because I said so,that's why!!":D: :D: :D:

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 04:04 PM
So what's the bullpen makeup?

Vizcaino ??
Hermanson MRP
Marte SU
Takatsu CP
Adkins MRP
Cotts MRP
Politte SU

who I'm I forgetting?That's about right. I doubt these guys make the opening day roster...

Jeff Bajenaru
Felix Diaz
Jason Grilli
Arnie Munoz
Kevin Walker

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 04:05 PM
The other thing you have to figure in is that while, except for Santana and possibly Radke, the Twins pitchers might be less talented, but they somehow get the job done. Lohse and Mulholland are far more consistant than any pitcher we have on the Sox.Consistent at what -- sucking?

CHISOXFAN13
12-22-2004, 04:05 PM
The other thing you have to figure in is that while, except for Santana and possibly Radke, the Twins pitchers might be less talented, but they somehow get the job done. Lohse and Mulholland are far more consistant than any pitcher we have on the Sox.


Will you explain to me how 9-13 with a .305 BAA and 5.34 ERA is consistent?

minastirith67
12-22-2004, 04:07 PM
So what's the bullpen makeup?

Vizcaino ??
Hermanson MRP
Marte SU
Takatsu CP
Adkins MRP
Cotts MRP
Politte SU

who I'm I forgetting?
Grilli LRP
others?

MRKARNO
12-22-2004, 04:10 PM
That's about right. I doubt these guys make the opening day roster...

Jeff Bajenaru
Felix Diaz
Jason Grilli
Arnie Munoz
Kevin Walker
Adkins is utter garbage. Talk of him in our bullpen is just foolish. Cotts has a lot to change before he can be valuable to us. If he walks about half as many and learns to have better location and give up less HRs, then he could be pretty solid, but I'm pessimistic about that. Diaz and Munoz would be the best options for our bullpen as Diaz showed me a lot in relief last year and Munoz is by far the best talent of the bunch. He almost made the pen before a bad Spring Training in 2003, so it would surprise me if he didnt get a fair shot this year.

Mickster
12-22-2004, 04:14 PM
Diaz and Munoz would be the best options for our bullpen as Diaz showed me a lot in relief last year and Munoz is by far the best talent of the bunch. He almost made the pen before a bad Spring Training in 2003, so it would surprise me if he didnt get a fair shot this year.
I will NEVER forget Arnie's start up in Montreal. I don't think I have ever been so vocal watching any game on television.....:D:

MRKARNO
12-22-2004, 04:15 PM
The other thing you have to figure in is that while, except for Santana and possibly Radke, the Twins pitchers might be less talented, but they somehow get the job done. Lohse and Mulholland are far more consistant than any pitcher we have on the Sox. I think Santana is better than both Garland and Buerhle, but those two are both better than Bradke. Contreras is very inconsistant I agree. I dont think Silva is really that much better of a pitcher than Jon Garland. He just looks better because he plays in an easier home park. Give me El Duque any day of the week over Kyle Lohse. Mulholland vs Conteras? Contreras by a mile.

MRKARNO
12-22-2004, 04:18 PM
I will NEVER forget Arnie's start up in Montreal. I don't think I have ever been so vocal watching any game on television.....:D:
Well was that a relief appearance? You can decide not to forget it all you want, but he never should have been in that situation in the first place. He was miscast as a starter and then they had this great idea to have him fill the fifth starter spot coming up from AA Birmingham. He screwed up badly, but he was put in a position to fail. He is a very talented pitcher and is well-suited for relief. Unlike anyone else on that list, he was a well thought of prospect. His curveball is an awesome pitch.

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 04:20 PM
Cotts has a lot to change before he can be valuable to us.

No pun intended, I hope?

MRKARNO
12-22-2004, 04:26 PM
No pun intended, I hope?
I dont know what you took out of that but what I meant is he needs to learn better control and how to pitch without leaving easy pitches to hit for homers and I'm pessimistic about that happening

HomeFish
12-22-2004, 04:29 PM
I dont know what you took out of that but what I meant is he needs to learn better control and how to pitch without leaving easy pitches to hit for homers and I'm pessimistic about that happening

I was under the impression that one of Cott's major problems was his change-up, particularly in the homer sense.

Jurr
12-22-2004, 04:38 PM
I was under the impression that one of Cott's major problems was his change-up, particularly in the homer sense.What has been said about Cotts was his command of the change up was not very good, as he had just started developing the pitch. If he can develop that pitch, he could experience the success that Johan Santana, Gagne, and Hoffman has picked up with the development of that pitch. Cotts has an electric fastball, but it doesn't do you much good if that's the only pitch you can get over the plate.

Cotts got a lot better in the second half of the season, and started tailing off a little bit at the end due to very excessive work. If Cotts can get his change-up worked from the same arm slot as the heat while locating the pitch, he can become a top-notch closer or setup guy. Hell, he might even become a five guy. He's just got to get that change finalized. I'm excited about Neal's potential. Let's hope he gets it down.

duke of dorwood
12-22-2004, 04:41 PM
As bad as I have felt-I feel good about this. Its the "something" we've been conditioned to revell in during this regime.

Whitesox029
12-22-2004, 04:44 PM
Signing El Duque, though not the best option, certainly fills the
Gaping Hole the SOX have had since 2001, the #5 pitchers spot.
I do feel good now ...... but I will be ecstatic if we do WHATEVER IT TAKES
to sign Eckstein. The hole at the TOP OF THE LINEUP since we traded
Ray Durham has been huge and we havnt filled it since ....
Cmon SOX, were feeling good here .........:smile:I do feel much better now...interesting note though is that we probably just filled the 4th starter spot, the 5th already occupied by Garland. I think I'll go start a poll...

Soxzilla
12-22-2004, 04:55 PM
We may have a less powerful offense. But we also have a much more intelligent offense on the basepaths, and a much faster offense.

Not too mention the defense got a swift kick in the pants as well.

As it stands right now, this is a much better team than what we started off with last year. Now whether they perform better is another question ... I guess we will know in October.:o:

hose
12-22-2004, 05:05 PM
Signing El Duque, though not the best option, certainly fills the
Gaping Hole the SOX have had since 2001, the #5 pitchers spot.
I do feel good now ...... but I will be ecstatic if we do WHATEVER IT TAKES
to sign Eckstein. The hole at the TOP OF THE LINEUP since we traded
Ray Durham has been huge and we havnt filled it since ....
Cmon SOX, were feeling good here .........:smile:
Im feeling it Hangar. The starting pitching is in good shape w/ El Duque and the pen is solid.

Eck or Cora would be a great addition.

soxfan43
12-22-2004, 05:11 PM
despite everyone's bitching, including myself, KW may have actually had a pretty good offseason. if they sign eckstein, then KW may have actually come through on his promise to rebuild the club. the bullpen is solid, the starting rotation is pretty good and he got a decent cheap replacement for maggs. even though we all wanted clement or vazquez or someone, those guys are way overpaid and el duque could end up being a better investment. never thought i'd say this, but nice job kenny.

GAsoxfan
12-22-2004, 05:16 PM
I'm excited about the bullpen this year. The Sox have a solid four with Takatsu, Marte, Hermanson, and Vizcaino. It will be nice to rely on veterans rather than unproven youngsters. It will allow Ozzie to develop the younger relievers by putting them in situations where they are likely to be successful, instead of having to rely on them.

The Sox developing players, imagine that!

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 05:20 PM
Mark Buehrle
Freddy Garcia
Jose Contreras
Jon Garland
Orlando Hernandez

LF Scott Podsednik
2B David Eckstein
DH Frank Thomas / Carl Everett
1B Paul Konerko
RF Jermaine Dye
CF Aaron Rowand
SS Juan Uribe
3B Joe Crede
C Ben Davis


Get it done, Kenny!

CWSGuy406
12-22-2004, 05:44 PM
Be confident,OEO.Why not both Eckstein AND Alex Cora??


:reinsy
"Because I said so,that's why!!":D: :D: :D:
Or, because we already have a good enough SS and we don't need both of them... :rolleyes:

iwcup
12-22-2004, 05:45 PM
The thing is, they still do have a powerful offense, it's just very spread out.

We hit 242 HR last year. Take away Carlos' 31, Jose's 30, and Maggs' 9, and we're down to 172. Then you add in Dye's 23 and we're up to 195. Factor in the facts that a.) Dye will likely hit more HR this year than he did last year due to a change of scenery and b.) other players like Crede and Aaron might hit more this year and you've got yourself a recipe for 200 HR again. (There's no reason to think that Frank can't match his 18 HR from last year even if he only plays half the year. Even if he can't, Everett will probably hit more)

We've got a powerful offense, it just plays defense better and is better on the basepaths. Our pitching is pretty darned good right now, too.

It's less powerful, but it's powerful nonetheless.
I for one would prefer fewer homers......

that is fewer overall, and MUCH MUCH fewer one run shots...

dont think we will hit 200......but if all things go right, the run production will still be there......

glass half full....

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 05:46 PM
Or, because we already have a good enough SS and we don't need both of them... :rolleyes:You beat me to it.

NSSoxFan2
12-22-2004, 05:49 PM
So what's the bullpen makeup?

Vizcaino ??
Hermanson MRP
Marte SU
Takatsu CP
Adkins MRP
Cotts MRP
Politte SU

who I'm I forgetting?
Another good thing about this bullpen is the flexibility it will produce. In case El Duque goes down with some injury, Hermanson has been a SP before. The one person I look at in our bullpen that must step it up is Cotts.

CWSGuy406
12-22-2004, 05:53 PM
Well was that a relief appearance? You can decide not to forget it all you want, but he never should have been in that situation in the first place. He was miscast as a starter and then they had this great idea to have him fill the fifth starter spot coming up from AA Birmingham. He screwed up badly, but he was put in a position to fail. He is a very talented pitcher and is well-suited for relief. Unlike anyone else on that list, he was a well thought of prospect. His curveball is an awesome pitch.
Karno, why all the dislike for Cotts? I realize that he wasn't an awesome relief pitcher this year, but outside of that start in Minny, I don't think he was that terrible. He was close to the AL lead in holds at around the halfway point in the season, thus, he was good at not allowing the runners he inherited to score.

I really think Neal can be a real important part of our bullpen this year -- if he's utilized correctly... JMHO...

Palehose13
12-22-2004, 05:59 PM
Signing El Duque, though not the best option, certainly fills the
Gaping Hole the SOX have had since 2001, the #5 pitchers spot.
I do feel good now ...... but I will be ecstatic if we do WHATEVER IT TAKES
to sign Eckstein. The hole at the TOP OF THE LINEUP since we traded
Ray Durham has been huge and we havnt filled it since ....
Cmon SOX, were feeling good here .........:smile:
Hangar feels good about the Sox?!?!?!?

Is this a sign of the Apocalypse? :tongue:

hose
12-22-2004, 06:04 PM
Hangar feels good about the Sox?!?!?!?

Is this a sign of the Apocalypse? :tongue:

I bet his eggnog was spiked:D:

Jerome
12-22-2004, 06:16 PM
I feel much, much better about the pitching. But the offense? Remember, no Frank for the first month or so. Uribe is hot and cold, and there is no guarantee with Dye. Our offense could be good (great when Frank comes back) or it could be really terrible. What happens if the Podsednik we get is the 2004 version instead of the 2003 version? The only great hitter we have is Konerko. (Nothing against Rowand, I think he will develop into a great player)

champagne030
12-22-2004, 06:16 PM
"He was close to the AL lead in holds at around the halfway point in the season, thus, he was good at not allowing the runners he inherited to score."

where did you come across this stat? he had four the entire year. that's not going to put you near the top after 4/15.

"I really think Neal can be a real important part of our bullpen this year -- if he's utilized correctly... JMHO..."

are you a season ticket holder for charlotte? he might be important to their bullpen. granted he's a lefty and we don't have a lot of them, but his stats against lefties are brutal. actually you could argue his stats, as a reliever, were worse than mike jackson or koch.

Jabroni
12-22-2004, 06:23 PM
"He was close to the AL lead in holds at around the halfway point in the season, thus, he was good at not allowing the runners he inherited to score."

where did you come across this stat? he had four the entire year. that's not going to put you near the top after 4/15.

"I really think Neal can be a real important part of our bullpen this year -- if he's utilized correctly... JMHO..."

are you a season ticket holder for charlotte? he might be important to their bullpen. granted he's a lefty and we don't have a lot of them, but his stats against lefties are brutal. actually you could argue his stats, as a reliever, were worse than mike jackson or koch.Where's the Teal Police when you need em?

BRDSR
12-22-2004, 06:25 PM
So what's the bullpen makeup?

Vizcaino ??
Hermanson MRP
Marte SU
Takatsu CP
Adkins MRP
Cotts MRP
Politte SU

who I'm I forgetting?
If the White Sox emerge from spring training with the 5 starting pitchers healthy, I think you might see Adkins sent to the minors and the Sox going into the season with an 11 man pitching staff. Ozzieball works best with a deep bench, and freeing up a space will give him the opportunity to carry 3 catchers or put Valdez on the 25 man roster if he thinks the time is right. However, if the health of the starting rotation is in question going into the beginning of the season, Ozzie will probably be forced to carry 12 pitchers as insurance. I'm very interested to see what happens.

fquaye149
12-22-2004, 06:28 PM
I feel much, much better about the pitching. But the offense? Remember, no Frank for the first month or so. Uribe is hot and cold, and there is no guarantee with Dye. Our offense could be good (great when Frank comes back) or it could be really terrible. What happens if the Podsednik we get is the 2004 version instead of the 2003 version? The only great hitter we have is Konerko. (Nothing against Rowand, I think he will develop into a great player)
our offense is always God-awful in spring anyway... I don't know that we're giving all that much up... Maggs, Lee, and Frank all hit like puke in april and early may last year...When we did win last spring it was with pitching, not hitting.

FWIW

munchman33
12-22-2004, 07:03 PM
I can honestly say that today I'm the happiest I've been since we won the division in 2000. I've got a real good feeling about the way things have fallen this off-season. Signing Eckstein would make it complete.

Lip Man 1
12-22-2004, 07:04 PM
The problem with Neal Cotts is that he issues a lot of walks. Perhaps that will improve over time but right now it is a real problem for him and subsequently the team.

Jon Adkins another relief pitcher has a different problem, it's called the home run ball. He got nailed 13 times in 50 innings.

Lip

batmanZoSo
12-22-2004, 07:05 PM
our offense is always God-awful in spring anyway... I don't know that we're giving all that much up... Maggs, Lee, and Frank all hit like puke in april and early may last year...When we did win last spring it was with pitching, not hitting.

FWIW
And when we win in the future, it will be with pitching as well. I just think 70 steals plus the smart hitting Eck at the top of the order will help reduce those power funks. We should be better at manufacturing that one run when we need it. That, of course, helps our pitching...

chisoxmike
12-22-2004, 07:08 PM
I will NEVER forget Arnie's start up in Montreal. I don't think I have ever been so vocal watching any game on television.....:D:
I can't remember how many times I yelled " Take him out of the f***ing game!":angry:

Foulke You
12-22-2004, 07:36 PM
I can't remember how many times I yelled " Take him out of the f***ing game!":angry:(Shudder) Why do you guys have to bring that game up? I couldn't believe the shelling that guy got. Most of it was because he couldn't find home plate. Another in a long line of "not quite ready for prime time" Sox starters. Thank God we have 1-5 MLB pitchers now.