PDA

View Full Version : Wade Miller: Yea or Nay?....


Tragg
12-21-2004, 12:41 AM
This guy is a hell of a pitcher - as good as Clement; trouble is, he's off a rotator cuff. If he can pass a physical, I say he's worth a flyer.

One a side note, add $1.75 million to the reduced KW salary ledger this winter with the non-tender of Shoe (not that I disagree with that non-tender). Where oh where is our #3 pitcher, Kenny?

MeanFish
12-21-2004, 12:43 AM
I'm going to be in the minority and say Nay. Just too much of a risk for the money he's going to command. Though, I'm not an expert on arm troubles, but it seems that if the Astros non-tendered him, it was probably for a good reason.

OEO Magglio
12-21-2004, 12:43 AM
This guy is a hell of a pitcher - as good as Clement; trouble is, he's off a rotator cuff. If he can pass a physical, I say he's worth a flyer.

One a side note, add $1.75 million to the reduced KW salary ledger this winter with the non-tender of Shoe (not that I disagree with that non-tender). Where oh where is our #3 pitcher, Kenny?Hell yeah on Wade. Kenny might be able to sign Wade and A.J. and stay under the budget, I know I'm getting way ahead of myself but that would be an awesome offseason.

OEO Magglio
12-21-2004, 12:44 AM
I'm going to be in the minority and say Nay. Just too much of a risk for the money he's going to command. Though, I'm not an expert on arm troubles, but it seems that if the Astros non-tendered him, it was probably for a good reason.I think they non-tendered him to have as much money possible to resign Carlos.

CWSGuy406
12-21-2004, 12:44 AM
Miller would be an excellent pickup. He strikes out a fair number of batters, and he's a groundball pitcher. Miller ranks up there, IMHO, with Pedro (of course, not better than Pedro) as one of the best pitchers available this offseason. I'd love for them to go after Miller, assuming the health is there.

Also, if the whole Carlos Lee/Wade Miller trade rumors were true, I definitely think you'll see Kenny make a hard push after Miller. He'd be a great number three for this team.

DaleJRFan
12-21-2004, 12:45 AM
I'm going to be in the minority and say Nay. Just too much of a risk for the money he's going to command. Though, I'm not an expert on arm troubles, but it seems that if the Astros non-tendered him, it was probably for a good reason.
He had a "season-ending rotator cuff injury." I agree... I'd stear clear of this one.

DaleJRFan
12-21-2004, 12:47 AM
I think they non-tendered him to have as much money possible to resign Carlos.
I'd say, IMO, that they non-tendered him because they have Oswalt, Pettitte, Clements, Backe and about 15 other "could be" aces.

OzzieBall2004
12-21-2004, 12:54 AM
I say go for it, but im for signing any pitcher at this point if he could be had for 4 per for 3 years, and assuming he's healthy, I'd do it. My guess is he'll seek a one year incentive loaded deal, but with the way the pitchers market has been going, I wouldnt be suprised if he got something comparable to Clement money.

southsideirish71
12-21-2004, 12:59 AM
I say nay, go after Perez. The only thing that this does is cloud the waters a bit for other teams. KW has to do what he said he was going to do and fly under the radar.


Get Eck and AJ and Perez and we have a pretty good team for next year. :dtroll: :supernana:

HomeFish
12-21-2004, 01:03 AM
We're not getting Perez. Miller is better than Grilli. Get him now.

nodiggity59
12-21-2004, 01:03 AM
What did Miller make last year?

Chisox003
12-21-2004, 01:05 AM
I say nay, go after Perez. The only thing that this does is cloud the waters a bit for other teams. KW has to do what he said he was going to do and fly under the radar.


Get Eck and AJ and Perez and we have a pretty good team for next year.
Eckstein, Pierz and odalis=AWESOME offseason

benjamin
12-21-2004, 01:11 AM
What did Miller make last year?
$3.4 million.

This guy has rather poor throwing mechanics and it has finally caught up to him. I would steer clear.

JUribe1989
12-21-2004, 01:51 AM
3.77 ERA, I say we take a chance. I think he would sign with us

California Sox
12-21-2004, 02:03 AM
Rotator cuff surgery.

He's a very solid pitcher. When healthy, I'd say he's as good or better than Freddie, but rotator cuff surgery. 1 year 3-4 mil max, he might be worth a flyer, more than that and it's too big a gamble.

Banix12
12-21-2004, 03:56 AM
Depends on how injured he is right now. Ready by start of season or by midseason? or will he be gone even later? I don't know what the recovery is like from rotator cuff surgery. If he's healthy and can still get the ball up to 93 mph than very much yes, sign him. If not i'd still sign him to one of those deals like Jon Lieber had with the Yankees where he rehabs for a year with the team and gets a pay bump the next year when he makes the roster.

The bottom line is the guy has a career ERA under 4.00 and his home park has been in that launching pad in Houston. Take a chance.

Navaro's Talent
12-21-2004, 04:39 AM
I say take a chance. Kenny Williams has a knack for getting players who everyone thinks will not contribute and all of a sudden, they're some of the best players on the team. Loaiza, Uribe, etc.....

StockdaleForVeep
12-21-2004, 04:59 AM
Correct me if im wrong but isnt this the same guy who got demoted to the pen last season for havin a high era and not lasting long? Do we want a pitcher like that comin to the offensive minded AL? Yes we need a 5th starter to eat innings but remember we need one who can win a decent amount of games.

Banix12
12-21-2004, 07:26 AM
Correct me if im wrong but isnt this the same guy who got demoted to the pen last season for havin a high era and not lasting long? Do we want a pitcher like that comin to the offensive minded AL? Yes we need a 5th starter to eat innings but remember we need one who can win a decent amount of games.

You must be thinking of someone else. Probably one of the guys they had to insert after Pettite got hurt. Miller last year before he got hurt had an ERA of 3.35 and appeared in 15 games, all starts.

gosox41
12-21-2004, 09:05 AM
This guy is a hell of a pitcher - as good as Clement; trouble is, he's off a rotator cuff. If he can pass a physical, I say he's worth a flyer.

One a side note, add $1.75 million to the reduced KW salary ledger this winter with the non-tender of Shoe (not that I disagree with that non-tender). Where oh where is our #3 pitcher, Kenny?
I
I'd go for Miller. Anyone know when he's supposed to be healthy enough to pitch again? I don't see the Sox paying him decent money to rehab for a year.



Bob

skottyj242
12-21-2004, 09:16 AM
We were promised a pitcher and if he's it, I'd gladly take him.

SSN721
12-21-2004, 09:32 AM
I'll take it, lets get him if he can be had on the cheap.

Chek2002
12-21-2004, 09:47 AM
I'd say go for it. It is worth the risk. He can't be any worse than the 5th starters we have now.

Chek2002
12-21-2004, 09:56 AM
Before the injury he had an 3.35 ERA which is not bad even in the NL. Plus he is only 28. He has also won 52 games since 2001, quite an improvement over any 5th starter we have used.

Fungo
12-21-2004, 10:00 AM
Stay away. Pitchers come back from Tommy John surgery, but the rotator cuff is a different story. Pitchers are just not right after this.

Dadawg_77
12-21-2004, 10:10 AM
I say take a chance. Kenny Williams has a knack for getting players who everyone thinks will not contribute and all of a sudden, they're some of the best players on the team. Loaiza, Uribe, etc.....
Kenny and Sox got lucky with Loaiza in 2003 as evidence by Loaiza's career. Put his career down and 2003 stands out from all the rest of his career. Not saying everyone doesn't get lucky nor it is a bad thing to get lucky but the fact is the Sox got lucky.

Uribe put up some insane numbers the first few months of the season then completely fell flat on his face in June and July, and picked it up again in September. So lets wait to see what he does this year before making any major conclusions. Also remember his numbers are not park adjusted and Uribe had major split between the Cell and every where else, .315/.359/.600 and .248/.291/.405. His away number are much more aligned with his career numbers. So who knows if last Uribe was a fluke or a product of Coors Field East. This will be interesting to watch this year.

kittle42
12-21-2004, 10:13 AM
Notice that despite his rotator cuff problem, reports indicate that the Sox were talking about trading Lee for Miller before the Brewers wowed KW with their offer.

tstrike2000
12-21-2004, 10:15 AM
I'd say, IMO, that they non-tendered him because they have Oswalt, Pettitte, Clements, Backe and about 15 other "could be" aces.
Clemens is probably going to retire and Pettite is coming off surgery himself. From those standpoints, I wonder if the Astros will possibly try to resign him.

Ol' No. 2
12-21-2004, 10:33 AM
Stay away. Pitchers come back from Tommy John surgery, but the rotator cuff is a different story. Pitchers are just not right after this.Maybe I'm mistaken, but I thought he DIDN'T have surgery and chose to try to let it get better by rest. I think I'd be more confident if he DID have surgery. The only way I'd go for Miller is with a short-term deal with a low base and loaded with incentives. The last thing you want to do is blow your wad on someone who spends the season on the DL, and then you're REALLY stuck with Grilli because you don't have money left for a replacement.

batmanZoSo
12-21-2004, 10:37 AM
This guy did put up good numbers in a terrible pitcher's park in his career. If he's healthy, he's really good.

bobj4400
12-21-2004, 11:45 AM
Correct me if im wrong but isnt this the same guy who got demoted to the pen last season for havin a high era and not lasting long? Do we want a pitcher like that comin to the offensive minded AL? Yes we need a 5th starter to eat innings but remember we need one who can win a decent amount of games.I think you are thinking of tim redding.

And yes, sign Miller. He is a stud.

mdep524
12-21-2004, 11:48 AM
Thumbs up. The Sox really don't have that much to lose here, and his guy could be great if he's healthy. Do it KW!

Dadawg_77
12-21-2004, 11:49 AM
This guy did put up good numbers in a terrible pitcher's park in his career. If he's healthy, he's really good.
That is the problem, he went from elbow troubles, 2003, to shoulder surgery this year. I am trying to find out how long he will be out, but from what I have read I wouldn't expect him to be ready by opening day more like June. So I wouldn't sign him now unless you can get a bargin price, which I wouldn't expect to happen.

Joel Perez
12-21-2004, 12:23 PM
Medical records??? We don't need no stinkin' medical records!!!

Seriously, proceed with caution...having living near Houston for the last 4 years, his mechanics are funky and not even close to smooth. That being said, he did provide some results...maybe offering Wade about 2-3 mil for two years plus incentives would be a prudent move, a la Jon Lieber/Yankees' move a couple of years back too.

Worst case scenario is that he could turn out to be Danny Wright after surgery....best case is you have a low-cost, proven pitcher with moxie and experience that can help you in the back end of the rotation.

Go for it. Considering what else we have for the 5th starter, it's not too soothing.

SOXSINCE'70
12-21-2004, 02:03 PM
Nay.Steer clear of shoulder injuries.Unless the term "torn
labrum" is one you enjoy hearing when speaking of Sox
pitchers.:D: :D: :D:

Fungo
12-21-2004, 02:11 PM
Maybe I'm mistaken, but I thought he DIDN'T have surgery and chose to try to let it get better by rest. I think I'd be more confident if he DID have surgery. The only way I'd go for Miller is with a short-term deal with a low base and loaded with incentives. The last thing you want to do is blow your wad on someone who spends the season on the DL, and then you're REALLY stuck with Grilli because you don't have money left for a replacement. you might be right that he tried to just rest the rotator cuff, but that reminds me of Danny Wright. After he was shut down last year with elbow problems, turns out he had a bum shoulder as well, maybe not the rotator cuff, but still. Then after trying the "I'll just rest it method", he opted for surgery. Shoulder injuries are a much bigger problem for pitchers that elbow problems. IMO, he isn't worth the risk.

jordan23ventura
12-21-2004, 03:36 PM
Hell no thank you.

Somebody is going to pay this guy and it will not be us. Either the Vazquez deal goes down or we send out invites to ST. KW only takes risks on guys that have very small contracts, and he is smart for doing that.

John Barrett
12-21-2004, 03:53 PM
Rotator cuff surgery.

He's a very solid pitcher. When healthy, I'd say he's as good or better than Freddie, but rotator cuff surgery. 1 year 3-4 mil max, he might be worth a flyer, more than that and it's too big a gamble.
he didn't have surgery ... went with treatment instead

StockdaleForVeep
12-21-2004, 04:00 PM
I think you are thinking of tim redding.

And yes, sign Miller. He is a stud.Your right, i retract my statement

sign him

Ol' No. 2
12-21-2004, 04:01 PM
he didn't have surgery ... went with treatment insteadI'd be more confident if he had the surgery.