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Gosox1917
11-30-2004, 12:44 PM
Here is our bullpen for 2005 as of right now.

CP Shingo
SU Damaso Wal-Marte
SU Cliff Politte
MRP Jon Adkins Diet
MRP Kevin Walker
LRP Neal Cotts
LRP Bejenaru/Grilli/Munoz/Diaz

Is anyone else the least bit frightened by the lack of talent in the MRP and LRP?
While we need to fill the hole in the fifth starters spot there seems to be a hole in a couple of spots in our bullpen we need to fill before we let guys like Munoz and Diaz take the job. Let them get some more work down in the minors and allow for some proven relievers do the job. Terry Adams, Antonio Alfonseca, Chris Hammond, Steve Kline, Curt Leskanic. Mike Myers, Antonio Osuna, Jay Witasick, and Esteban Yan just to name a few are free agents. I would like to see at least Osuna and Hammond come to the Southside, what do you guys think?

jabrch
11-30-2004, 12:53 PM
Is anyone else the least bit frightened by the lack of talent in the MRP and LRP?
A better question might be "is anyone NOT the least bit frightened"...

I hope KW has plans to bolster the pen somehow. Cuz that pen is clearly not only not a championship calibre pen, but it isn't even a ALC division contender type pen.

Baby Fisk
11-30-2004, 12:54 PM
Here is our bullpen for 2005 as of right now.

CP Shingo
SU Damaso Wal-Marte
SU Cliff Politte
MRP Jon Adkins Diet
MRP Kevin Walker
LRP Neal Cotts
LRP Bejenaru/Grilli/Munoz/Diaz

Is anyone else the least bit frightened by the lack of talent in the MRP and LRP? Hey hey! Halloween is long over. Quit it with this scary stuff! :o:

Ol' No. 2
11-30-2004, 01:05 PM
Here is our bullpen for 2005 as of right now.

CP Shingo
SU Damaso Wal-Marte
SU Cliff Politte
MRP Jon Adkins Diet
MRP Kevin Walker
LRP Neal Cotts
LRP Bejenaru/Grilli/Munoz/Diaz

Is anyone else the least bit frightened by the lack of talent in the MRP and LRP?
While we need to fill the hole in the fifth starters spot there seems to be a hole in a couple of spots in our bullpen we need to fill before we let guys like Munoz and Diaz take the job. Let them get some more work down in the minors and allow for some proven relievers do the job. Terry Adams, Antonio Alfonseca, Chris Hammond, Steve Kline, Curt Leskanic. Mike Myers, Antonio Osuna, Jay Witasick, and Esteban Yan just to name a few are free agents. I would like to see at least Osuna and Hammond come to the Southside, what do you guys think?Every year the bullpen gets put together as an afterthought with assorted spare parts, cast-offs, has-beens and never-weres. I fully expect one day to hear this from a TV announcer:

"Double-barrelled activity in the Sox pen. Looks like Flotsam and Jetsam warming up."

And the pitiful part of it is that decent relievers just aren't that expensive. Most of those guys you mentioned could be had for $3-4M or less. What's the point of pursuing a Randy Johnson for $16M and backing him up with the 2005 version of Mike Jackson?

santo=dorf
11-30-2004, 01:27 PM
Here is our bullpen for 2005 as of right now.

CP Shingo
SU Damaso Wal-Marte
SU Cliff Politte
MRP Jon Adkins Diet
MRP Kevin Walker
LRP Neal Cotts
LRP Bejenaru/Grilli/Munoz/Diaz

Is anyone else the least bit frightened by the lack of talent in the MRP and LRP?
While we need to fill the hole in the fifth starters spot there seems to be a hole in a couple of spots in our bullpen we need to fill before we let guys like Munoz and Diaz take the job. Let them get some more work down in the minors and allow for some proven relievers do the job. Terry Adams, Antonio Alfonseca, Chris Hammond, Steve Kline, Curt Leskanic. Mike Myers, Antonio Osuna, Jay Witasick, and Esteban Yan just to name a few are free agents. I would like to see at least Osuna and Hammond come to the Southside, what do you guys think?
I don't see Walker in our bullpen, his contract only guarantees $100,000.

LHP Munoz
RHP Diaz
LHP Marte
RHP Politte
RHP Shingo
LHP Cotts
RHP Diaz

I could live with this bullpen if we got Randy Johnson. IMO, it's stupid to give more than $2 million to a guy who will only pitch around 60 innings per year unless he is the closer.
It's time for some of these young guys to step up and help this team. Munoz and Diaz didn't do too badly in the bullpen last year, and Adkins was doing a good job until Ozzie started over using him.

Esteban Yan, Antonio Alfonseca, Terry Adams, and Curt Leskanic would simply be a waste of money.

Clembasbal
11-30-2004, 01:30 PM
Here is our bullpen for 2005 as of right now.

SU Damaso Wal-Marte
MRP Jon Adkins DietMan who are you, Chris Berman?


And yes, I am concerned...I would like a better bullpen, but really I think all we need is one more guy to do it - and that can be done without spending a lot of cash.

Gosox1917
11-30-2004, 01:34 PM
I don't see Walker in our bullpen, his contract only guarantees $100,000.

LHP Munoz
RHP Diaz
LHP Marte
RHP Politte
RHP Shingo
LHP Cotts
RHP Diaz

I could live with this bullpen if we got Randy Johnson. IMO, it's stupid to give more than $2 million to a guy who will only pitch around 60 innings per year unless he is the closer.
It's time for some of these young guys to step up and help this team. Munoz and Diaz didn't do too badly in the bullpen last year, and Adkins was doing a good job until Ozzie started over using him.

Esteban Yan, Antonio Alfonseca, Terry Adams, and Curt Leskanic would simply be a waste of money.
In my opinion if we can get a #3 starter in the rotation like Clement or Russ Ortiz and have enough money to get a guy that helped their team get to the postseason last year in the bullpen (Alfonseca, Leskanic) then we should go for it.

rdivaldi
11-30-2004, 01:39 PM
By and large, IMO, this is the weakest aspect of our team. There's no way in the world we can expect to compete with that poor of a bullpen.

hold2dibber
11-30-2004, 01:45 PM
The Sox clearly need to add an arm or two to the pen for '05. One option is to attempt to acquire two more starters, moving Garland or Contreras to the pen. I sure wouldn't mind seeing a trade for someone like B.J. Ryan or Guilermo Mota. Among the free agent relievers (link (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/features/freeagents?positionId=0)), I wouldn't mind seeing the Sox take a low-risk gamble on somebody coming off of injury, like Scott Williamson, Jeff Nelson or Matt Mantei. When those guys are healthy, they're awfully good. I'd try to sign one of those guys plus someone like Osuna, Kline, Alvarez, Hammond or Leskanic (i.e., a consistent, reliable MLB-veteran middle relief/set-up guy).

Brian26
11-30-2004, 01:51 PM
The Sox clearly need to add an arm or two to the pen for '05. One option is to attempt to acquire two more starters, moving Garland or Contreras to the pen

I called this awhile ago. It's been rumored that KW's master plan is for Contreras to become our closer.

MeanFish
11-30-2004, 01:52 PM
I'm going to say the same thing about our bullpen that I said about our lineup last year: it's only a hole once it's proven itself to be a hole.

Last year, we had a gaping hole in centerfield. The year before that, we had a fourth starter that nobody had ever heard of and we were all trying to figure out how to handle the fourth AND fifth starter revolving door. In neither year have either of those positions been the undoing of the team; on the contrary they've wound up being the bright spots of each season.

We have a *lot* of young arms in the bullpen mix, which can work both ways. I'm sure that there will be a couple busts in that group, but I'm not convinced that NOBODY will end up producing. We may be one proven arm away from having a decent pen, but we could just as easily be one quality-but-still-unproven arm away from the same.

A reason for a little optimism. The sky's not falling yet!

SDSoxFan
11-30-2004, 02:02 PM
I'd love to see Alvarez back in a Sox uni. Watching him in long relief with the Dodgers makes me think he can do the same for us.

santo=dorf
11-30-2004, 02:05 PM
I'd love to see Alvarez back in a Sox uni. Watching him in long relief with the Dodgers makes me think he can do the same for us.
I'd rather see him in the fifth starter's spot. :smile:

Baby Fisk
11-30-2004, 02:18 PM
I'd rather see him in the fifth starter's spot. :smile:But Santo=dorf, what happens to your sig when the RJ Doomsday deadline passes? :o:

santo=dorf
11-30-2004, 03:04 PM
But Santo=dorf, what happens to your sig when the RJ Doomsday deadline passes? :o:
I simply change the date of the quote. :tongue:

quade36
11-30-2004, 03:08 PM
I do not see moving Garland to the pen when he'll get 3.5 mil next year, let alone Contreras who will get 8 or 9.

striker60657
11-30-2004, 05:03 PM
I say we bring back Radinsky, McCaskill and Deleon.

FightingBillini
11-30-2004, 05:13 PM
The solution to a lot of our problems:

Osuna - (Oh- SOON- uh)
n.
1.Right handed reliever, known for his great moustache
2.Very productive but relatively inexpensive
3.Well worth the money
4.Solution to a long standing problem

Osunad - (Oh- SOON- uh- d)
v.
To be traded for a fat, lazy pitcher

:osuna "Yo soy el savior"

bc2k
12-03-2004, 01:35 AM
The solution to a lot of our problems:

Osuna - (Oh- SOON- uh)
n.
1.Right handed reliever, known for his great moustache
2.Very productive but relatively inexpensive
3.Well worth the money
4.Solution to a long standing problem

Osunad - (Oh- SOON- uh- d)
v.
To be traded for a fat, lazy pitcher

:osuna "Yo soy el savior"
:worship:

SoxFanTillDeath
12-03-2004, 09:52 AM
I'm going to say the same thing about our bullpen that I said about our lineup last year: it's only a hole once it's proven itself to be a hole.

Last year, we had a gaping hole in centerfield. The year before that, we had a fourth starter that nobody had ever heard of and we were all trying to figure out how to handle the fourth AND fifth starter revolving door. In neither year have either of those positions been the undoing of the team; on the contrary they've wound up being the bright spots of each season.

We have a *lot* of young arms in the bullpen mix, which can work both ways. I'm sure that there will be a couple busts in that group, but I'm not convinced that NOBODY will end up producing. We may be one proven arm away from having a decent pen, but we could just as easily be one quality-but-still-unproven arm away from the same.

A reason for a little optimism. The sky's not falling yet!

:chickenlittle
But don't you realize that This bullpen is horrible? I mean, Adkins and Cotts couldn't simply get any better after a full year in the majors, and Munoz/Diaz are both no good because KW drafted them. There's no way shingo can duplicate his numbers from last year because they were a fluke, and Marte is going to stink again this year to prove that last year wasn't a fluke. Also, Politte is not the dominant reliever that we saw during stretches last year...he is the other guy we'd see for 1 week out of each month. There's no way he turns it around.

I have only one question for those of you who are unwilling to give Cotts, Adkins, Munoz, and Diaz a chance in ST for the BP: Of all the greatest relievers in the game, how many of them were NEVER minor leagers before they got a shot at the bigs? What would have happened if their clubs decided to go with an average veteran because they weren't willing to go through the growning pains of a young pitcher?

I do not think this bullpen is one of the greatest pens in the league, and I would love to have another arm here, but don't write off these guys just yet. There's a reason they are playing baseball professionally, and I say you give them at least a shot at winning the job in ST and not shy away from them because they're young.

There is no room for optimism on this board. If you are an optimistic Sox fan then find somewhere else to post, because this is reserved for those "true" white sox fans who faithfully bash their own team day after day.

Gosox1917
12-03-2004, 11:32 AM
Outstanding use of teal, really, I giggled quite a bit. Anyway, I just don't feel comfortable with that many youngsters in the bullpen. Cotts and Adkins would be fine in the bullpen if we could get one or two more guys that have already proved themselves at the big leagues. I know it's nice to think that all the kids will come through and be heroes, but teams like the 2000 White Sox don't come around but once every 20 years or so. Just trying to be realistic, not pessimistic.

SoxFanTillDeath
12-03-2004, 12:36 PM
Again, I'm totally with you. Just making a point that the sky isn't falling quite yet...

Lip Man 1
12-03-2004, 02:03 PM
Sox Fan:

Just wondering....

Will you be saying that in May?

Lip