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View Full Version : Boston Herald speculates White Sox possible Nomar suitors


scottmt
11-24-2004, 01:57 PM
A wild card in the shortstop sweepstakes are the White Sox, who have money to spend and do not intend to give it to Jose Valentin, their aging shortstop who batted only .216 but with a career-high 30 homers. Having them become a suitor for Garciaparra cannot be ruled out, especially with Chicago owner Jerry Reinsdorf having a good relationship with the shortstop's agent, Arn Tellem.

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=55510

Take it for what it's worth...

FightingBillini
11-24-2004, 02:02 PM
Where is Ol' Numer 2 when you need him? I want that $ down the toilet graphic.

Ol' No. 2
11-24-2004, 02:13 PM
Where is Ol' Numer 2 when you need him? I want that $ down the toilet graphic.Yup.
http://www.hickmanfamily.us/images/misc/money_down_the_toilet_hg_wht.gif

SomebodyToldMe
11-24-2004, 02:14 PM
I've liked Nomar since he came to the big leagues, but yes, his injuries has really hurt the guy, if not his value.

But still. It would make me happy to have him on the team. That's "me", everyone, don't go and start a war just because I said that. I know how itchy you guys are to start flaming.

BainesHOF
11-24-2004, 02:23 PM
Nomar is not the answer.

Ol' No. 2
11-24-2004, 02:32 PM
Nomar is not the answer.Sure he is.

"I'll take overpaid shortstops for $400, Alex."

jackbrohamer
11-24-2004, 02:36 PM
Good to know Jerry Reinsdorf's personal relationships with agents is a deciding factor in who will play for the Sox.

I_Liked_Manuel
11-24-2004, 03:00 PM
he's not the all star he used to be, but for 15 mil over 2 years, he's better than any shortstop we've got or have had for at least 10 years. hell, as long as he hits around .300, i could tolerate his fielding.

1917
11-24-2004, 03:04 PM
I'll take the risk!

mweflen
11-24-2004, 03:15 PM
If he gets $7 mil or less for one year, hits .290-plus, plays 130 games and puts Willie on the bench, I'll take it.

Jerome
11-24-2004, 03:17 PM
Nomar would be amazing on the Sox. He's no A-Rod but still pretty damn good. Uribe could fill in for him for all the injuries.

I just don't want to trade Konerko and Lee away to free up the money. (Without getting something of equal value in return of course.) Because I know that the money would need to come from somewhere, and it won't be just addition to the payroll. There's gonnna have to be some subtraction.

1B Konerko
2B Uribe/Harris
SS Nomar/Uribe
3B Crede :(:

Thats a pretty outstanding infield, especially in the AL Central.

gosox41
11-24-2004, 03:35 PM
Sure he is.

"I'll take overpaid shortstops for $400, Alex."
Or how about "Whiny, cry babies who didn't want to come to the Sox in a tradebefore the '04 season."


Nomar could stick it. I don't want him.



Bob

HomeFish
11-24-2004, 03:38 PM
I was one of the few people to get excited over Wilson Valdez when we acquired him, but even I admit that Valdez is not the answer.

Nomar will outpreform Willie. Nomar will outpreform Wilson. Nomar will outpreform Uribe. I'm willing to accept that in a baseball player.

Foulke You
11-24-2004, 03:40 PM
I'd take a gamble on Nomar providing he doesn't break the bank. When healthy, the guy is a phenominal hitter and a servicable shortstop. Nomar and Uribe up the middle looks a hell of a lot better to me than Uribe and Harris. The team could also use another stick in the lineup to replace Maggs. Plus, I've always liked the guy and think the media has unfairly dogged on him similar to what they've done with Frank Thomas.

Of course, I'll believe Nomar is coming here when I see him hold up his White Sox jersey at the press conference.

jabrch
11-24-2004, 03:41 PM
WSI - one of the few places in the world that would actually bitch about adding Nomar Garciaparra. It's amazing how much smarter so many people here are than the professionals who own/run this team.

gosox41
11-24-2004, 03:46 PM
WSI - one of the few places in the world that would actually bitch about adding Nomar Garciaparra. It's amazing how much smarter so many people here are than the professionals who own/run this team.

I don't see the benefits of this guy. It's all about 'When he's healthy', how about 'IF he's healthy?'

It also irks me that he was against coming here in a trade before last season. Now it's OK. More like he's desperate for any team to take a risk on him. Wasn't he considered a clubhouse cancer with the Red Sox. I remember articles about how he had the blue flu. Sounds like he has an attitude problem to me.

Last, Nomar doesn't solve the long term solution at SS. He's a rent a player. I'd much rather have Cabrera or Renteria for the next few years then Nomar.


Bob

jabrch
11-24-2004, 04:03 PM
I don't see the benefits of this guy. It's all about 'When he's healthy', how about 'IF he's healthy?'

It also irks me that he was against coming here in a trade before last season. Now it's OK. More like he's desperate for any team to take a risk on him. Wasn't he considered a clubhouse cancer with the Red Sox. I remember articles about how he had the blue flu. Sounds like he has an attitude problem to me.

Last, Nomar doesn't solve the long term solution at SS. He's a rent a player. I'd much rather have Cabrera or Renteria for the next few years then Nomar.


Bob


Bob, he played all of 2003 and 2002 without a problem. The injuries in 2001 and 2004 seem flukish more than chronic.

As far as Cabrerra goes, take a look at his stats. He's really not...good...except for one year. And Renteria, a few years, but not great. Nomar is much more an impact player than any of those other guys.

Win1ForMe
11-24-2004, 04:09 PM
I would take Nomar in a second provided it's only a short-term deal...1 or 2 years. I like him as an option much more than overpaying Renteria for 5/6 years.

Foulke You
11-24-2004, 04:10 PM
Bob, he played all of 2003 and 2002 without a problem. The injuries in 2001 and 2004 seem flukish more than chronic.

As far as Cabrerra goes, take a look at his stats. He's really not...good...except for one year. And Renteria, a few years, but not great. Nomar is much more an impact player than any of those other guys.
Couldn't agree more.

Hangar18
11-24-2004, 04:16 PM
Nomar is not the answer.

Money is the answer

Foulke29
11-25-2004, 02:48 AM
Well, his ability to be the savior of a Chicago sports baseball team in 2004 certainly would translate well to the South Side.

TheBull19
11-25-2004, 04:43 AM
.
As far as Cabrerra goes, take a look at his stats. He's really not...good...except for one year. And Renteria, a few years, but not great. Nomar is much more an impact player than any of those other guys.
I guess you really value defense at shortstop.

gosox41
11-25-2004, 10:06 AM
Bob, he played all of 2003 and 2002 without a problem. The injuries in 2001 and 2004 seem flukish more than chronic.

As far as Cabrerra goes, take a look at his stats. He's really not...good...except for one year. And Renteria, a few years, but not great. Nomar is much more an impact player than any of those other guys.
It's just my opinion on the guy. I know his numbers. I just have a bad feeling about him. Hopefully IF the Sox sign him I'm 100% wrong and Nomar shuts his mouth and stays healthy a full season.


Bob

Baby Fisk
11-25-2004, 10:29 AM
It's just my opinion on the guy. I know his numbers. I just have a bad feeling about him. Hopefully IF the Sox sign him I'm 100% wrong and Nomar shuts his mouth and stays healthy a full season.

BobI'm with Bob on this one. There's some kind of "bad feeling" hovering over this guy like a tainted aura. For most of last season, Nomar was seen as an anchor (in the negative conotation), dragging the Red Sox down with his "injury" and his gloom from the post-ARod drama. As soon as he leaves, Boston rockets back up to striking distance of the AL East, romps in the post-season (barring a 3-game skid against the Skankees) and wins the World Freakin Championship for the first time in 8 decades. Did his departure from Boston have a role in that? I'd think so. It's one of those intangibles that can alter a team chemistry. Then Nomar goes to the north side and does his part, but definitely falls short of being any kind of historic saviour for the Cubs, as they choke in the last week and miss the playoffs.

Yes, sure, we're talking about Nomar here. But in the space of 12 months, he's gone from being The Hot Commodity out there, to being Other Teams' Detritus.

Flight #24
11-25-2004, 11:40 AM
I'm with Bob on this one. There's some kind of "bad feeling" hovering over this guy like a tainted aura. For most of last season, Nomar was seen as an anchor (in the negative conotation), dragging the Red Sox down with his "injury" and his gloom from the post-ARod drama. As soon as he leaves, Boston rockets back up to striking distance of the AL East, romps in the post-season (barring a 3-game skid against the Skankees) and wins the World Freakin Championship for the first time in 8 decades. Did his departure from Boston have a role in that? I'd think so. It's one of those intangibles that can alter a team chemistry. Then Nomar goes to the north side and does his part, but definitely falls short of being any kind of historic saviour for the Cubs, as they choke in the last week and miss the playoffs.

Yes, sure, we're talking about Nomar here. But in the space of 12 months, he's gone from being The Hot Commodity out there, to being Other Teams' Detritus.
One point is that since he's looking at a 1-yr deal to "prove himself", he'd hopefully be on his best behaviour and in great shape. I know that could have been said about 2004, but we should also have the advantage of not having all the bad blood from previous negotiations/trade attempts. If healthy & motivated, he's a pretty good player. And if he comes at a reasonable price (IMO - $6-7mil+incentives), I'd jump on it.

jabrch
11-25-2004, 12:04 PM
Baby, they got on a roll before the Nomar trade. The team voted him a full share of the playoff money. Obviously he wasn't as bad in the clubhouse as the Boston management wanted the fans to believe - or the players would sent him a box of stale fruitcake, not a full playoff share. And a "tainted aura" to me souds much like a curse....which I don't buy into.

I know he has his questions...all the SS out there do. But Cabrerra is grossly overrated. He's had one good season - and it was a few years ago. Renteria has been spotty, some good, some bad. But he's not a middle of the order guy. We need someone to replace Magglio's production in the middle of the order. Nomar does that quite nicely.

I'm not saying he is the perfect answer. I wouldn't give him 5/60. But if he'd come 2/22 or something like that, I think he'd be the best bet for us. He's surely going to be the highest quality guy that is in our budget since Beltran, Drew, Beltre all look to be getting more time/money than Nomar.

He's no lock....but lets think of the options. Some say we should run with Crede, Uribe, Harris, PK - I guess I can live with that. But we are eventually going to have to find guys who can hit in the front of the order. Crede/Uribe/Harris are all back of the order guys (unless Harris develops into a leadoff hitter). Add in our C...now we have 4 guys to hit 7-9.

I wouldn't give up a long time or a lot of money for Nomar. But if he fits into the plan, and we are getting one of the big 3 SS, he's the best of the bunch, I think.


I'm with Bob on this one. There's some kind of "bad feeling" hovering over this guy like a tainted aura. For most of last season, Nomar was seen as an anchor (in the negative conotation), dragging the Red Sox down with his "injury" and his gloom from the post-ARod drama. As soon as he leaves, Boston rockets back up to striking distance of the AL East, romps in the post-season (barring a 3-game skid against the Skankees) and wins the World Freakin Championship for the first time in 8 decades. Did his departure from Boston have a role in that? I'd think so. It's one of those intangibles that can alter a team chemistry. Then Nomar goes to the north side and does his part, but definitely falls short of being any kind of historic saviour for the Cubs, as they choke in the last week and miss the playoffs.

Yes, sure, we're talking about Nomar here. But in the space of 12 months, he's gone from being The Hot Commodity out there, to being Other Teams' Detritus.

RedPinStripes
11-25-2004, 12:23 PM
I could put up with Nomar at the right price and if he quits half the annoying **** he does before every pitch at the plate.

oldcomiskey
11-25-2004, 12:37 PM
it dont matter how much a player does or has done--the question is is he better than what we have now? I say he is heads and shoulders better than Harris and Uribe--although he has never been the elite status people make him out to be

oldcomiskey
11-25-2004, 12:40 PM
I know he has his questions...all the SS out there do. But Cabrerra is grossly overrated. He's had one good season - and it was a few years ago. Renteria has been spotty, some good, some bad. But he's not a middle of the order guy. We need someone to replace Magglio's production in the middle of the order. Nomar does that quite nicely.


and we dont need another power guy at any position in the order--we need hitters than can actually reach base

jabrch
11-25-2004, 12:52 PM
and we dont need another power guy at any position in the order--we need hitters than can actually reach base

Um - So how does Nomar's career .322/.370 fit into your model? or his .308/.365 last year? He's never had a season with an avg lower than .300 or an obp lower than .340, except the year he had his wrist injury. His power is limited - mostly magic in Fenway (under 30 HRs every year since 1998)

So by your definition of our needs, Nomar fits in perfectly. Compare his avg/obp to Renteria/Cabrerra/Uribe and Nomar should win out fairly handily...

MRKARNO
11-25-2004, 12:53 PM
If Nomar wants to sign a 1-2 year deal worth about 6-8 mil a year plus major incentives, by all means we should do so.

jabrch
11-25-2004, 01:18 PM
If Nomar wants to sign a 1-2 year deal worth about 6-8 mil a year plus major incentives, by all means we should do so.


More like 10/12....but I'd still pay him that if it was in a 1/2 year deal. The Flubs would give him 6-8 in a heartbeat. If he only takes 1 - 2 years, he'll get a good bit of money on a per year basis.

oldcomiskey
11-25-2004, 10:17 PM
Um - So how does Nomar's career .322/.370 fit into your model? or his .308/.365 last year? He's never had a season with an avg lower than .300 or an obp lower than .340, except the year he had his wrist injury. His power is limited - mostly magic in Fenway (under 30 HRs every year since 1998)

So by your definition of our needs, Nomar fits in perfectly. Compare his avg/obp to Renteria/Cabrerra/Uribe and Nomar should win out fairly handily...
I wasnt argiung--I was just trying to make a point--I dont care who gets the job as long as he can get on base

CWSGuy406
11-25-2004, 10:44 PM
I guess you really value defense at shortstop.
I don't know if you were kidding or whatever, but if you're making Cabrera out to be a good defensive shortstop, you're kidding yourself. He has mediocre range, and not very good ZR. And, considering how much better Nomar is offensively than Cabrera, Nomar >>> Cabrera.

Jerome
11-26-2004, 12:54 AM
I guess you really value defense at shortstop.


Defense at ss is important, ,but I think offense is a lot more important. Look at Boston. They had one of the best offenses in baseball. It was balanced. They can afford to stick a guy over at short who can't hit too well but is great at defense. Cardinals too. You can't tell me that injuries and money aside, you'd rather have Cabrera or Renteria than Nomar playing on the white sox.

cornball
11-26-2004, 11:16 PM
WSI - one of the few places in the world that would actually bitch about adding Nomar Garciaparra. It's amazing how much smarter so many people here are than the professionals who own/run this team.
I agree whole heartedly!!!! How could you complain about adding Nomar, without losing anything. It would be a huge upgrade from what the Sox have had the past several years at shortstop.

Sometimes I just don't get the reasoning of many on this board. Everyone wants a 24-25 year old stud who has a inexpensive salary to play for several years....NEWS FLASH.....that is not todays baseball.

MisterB
11-27-2004, 06:16 AM
I agree whole heartedly!!!! How could you complain about adding Nomar, without losing anything.
Except the $12M+ per year the Sox won't be able to spend on more pitching. Or a plan B in RF if Everett is injured/ineffective. Or 3B if Crede still can't get his act together. There's still too many holes in this roster to blow that kind of money on one position (except maybe an ace starter).

cornball
11-27-2004, 09:58 AM
Except the $12M+ per year the Sox won't be able to spend on more pitching. Or a plan B in RF if Everett is injured/ineffective. Or 3B if Crede still can't get his act together. There's still too many holes in this roster to blow that kind of money on one position (except maybe an ace starter).
The market will decide what he is worth. The budget is self imposed by the Sox....demand better.

MisterB
11-27-2004, 03:49 PM
The market will decide what he is worth. The budget is self imposed by the Sox....demand better.
Sure, JR has been so responsive to our 'demands' so far. :rolleyes:

Lip Man 1
11-27-2004, 11:33 PM
Mister B says: "Except the $12M+ per year the Sox won't be able to spend on more pitching. Or a plan B in RF if Everett is injured/ineffective. Or 3B if Crede still can't get his act together."

B you're assuming that the Sox in fact do something at all aren't you? Remember last Winter?

Lip

SouthSide_HitMen
11-28-2004, 03:25 AM
Sometimes I just don't get the reasoning of many on this board. Everyone wants a 24-25 year old stud who has a inexpensive salary to play for several years....NEWS FLASH.....that is not todays baseball.
Actually it is todays Minnesota Twins baseball. Brought to you by

Justin Morneau
Michael Cuddyer
Lew Ford
Johan Santana

and many other mid 20 year old low cost studs both at "The Show" and on their way.

LASOXFAN
11-28-2004, 09:56 PM
WSI - one of the few places in the world that would actually bitch about adding Nomar Garciaparra. It's amazing how much smarter so many people here are than the professionals who own/run this team.
Amen.