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Viva Magglio
10-12-2001, 03:11 PM
There are rumors that Minnesota manager Tom Kelly is going to retire not because he's tired of managing but because MLB may implode the Twins as part of a downsizing.

duke of dorwood
10-12-2001, 03:21 PM
Heard that on Sports News at 1:00

:notwinks

Spiff
10-12-2001, 04:19 PM
I doubt the players association would ever let that happen. That's alot of lost jobs.

Jerry_Manuel
10-12-2001, 04:23 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
I doubt the players association would ever let that happen. That's alot of lost jobs.

Ok fine then just let them blow up the RollerDome.

duke of dorwood
10-12-2001, 04:25 PM
Twins manager Tom Kelly has announced his retirement in a press conference that is presently in progress. More information to follow shortly.

From Twinkies web site

Randar68
10-12-2001, 05:29 PM
I doubt the players association would ever let that happen. That's alot of lost jobs.

Actually, I believe the Players Association has absolutely no say in this. It would require a large monetary buy-back of the team and it's assets and redistribution plans, etc, etc. I really doubt they would do it unless there was absolutely no chance of getting a new stadium, and because they just had a great year.

ma-gaga
10-12-2001, 06:37 PM
The talk of 'contraction' always included the Twins up until this year. This season helped show that the Twin Cities can support a competitive major league team. That being said, the Twins aren't locked into any stadium lease, and they have no new stadium on the way. So if the owners were to attempt to contract, the Twins would be one of the easier teams to dis-assemble.

The Metrodome is one of the few terrorist targets i'd love to seen destroyed. It would help both the Twins and the Vikings get their new stadiums, with all the amenities therein, and the owners can stop their incessant complaining. Nothing bothers me more than billionares whining.

As the thread says, it sounds like TK is stepping down. As the token Twins' fan, I hope they hire Molitor to take over. Milwaukee and Toronto keep trying to lure him away, and (IMHO) he's one of the best baseball minds to play the game.

bwthdik.
:)

Spiff
10-12-2001, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by Randar68


Actually, I believe the Players Association has absolutely no say in this. It would require a large monetary buy-back of the team and it's assets and redistribution plans, etc, etc. I really doubt they would do it unless there was absolutely no chance of getting a new stadium, and because they just had a great year.

I think they have power enough to do something. They are a union, afterall, and if a company (MLB) all of a sudden cuts jobs for no reason except that they aren't profitable enough, then the union is right there fighting for those workers.

Maybe I'm wrong but it doesn't seem possible to just take a team away w/o anyone saying boo.

FarWestChicago
10-12-2001, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
The talk of 'contraction' always included the Twins up until this year. This season helped show that the Twin Cities can support a competitive major league team. That being said, the Twins aren't locked into any stadium lease, and they have no new stadium on the way. So if the owners were to attempt to contract, the Twins would be one of the easier teams to dis-assemble.Ma-gaga, if the Twinks really do get dismantled, you are more the welcome to join our lost cause! :)

Spiff
10-12-2001, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Ma-gaga, if the Twinks really do get dismantled, you are more the welcome to join our lost cause! :)

True dat. And we think we have it bad. The Twins finish in the cellar like 6 years in a row, then they finally start winning and they totally collapse. Not to mention the stadium and the total lack of financial support. I can respect Twins fans.

doublem23
10-12-2001, 07:18 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


I think they have power enough to do something. They are a union, afterall, and if a company (MLB) all of a sudden cuts jobs for no reason except that they aren't profitable enough, then the union is right there fighting for those workers.

Maybe I'm wrong but it doesn't seem possible to just take a team away w/o anyone saying boo.

No, I believe you are correct, Wh1teSox00... Whenever I hear about downsizing, I invariably hear, "Well, what does the Players Association have to say about it?" It is a union, and the downsizing I've heard about (2 teams - Minnesota & Montreal) would mean 50 jobs at the MLB level (80 max).

I'm not sure how much a say they really have or how much power they have, but I doubt that they are COMPLETELY powerless.

Jerry_Manuel
10-12-2001, 07:22 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
True dat. And we think we have it bad.

The Twins have won 2 World Series in most of our life times at least. While our Sox in all of our lifetimes have won... let me grab my calculator for this one.

0 + 0 = 0 World Series Titles

So it's not that bad.

Spiff
10-12-2001, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


The Twins have won 2 World Series in most of our life times at least. While our Sox in all of our lifetimes have won... let me grab my calculator for this one.

0 + 0 = 0 World Series Titles

So it's not that bad.

Well even the Marlins have won a World Series in the past 5 years. Does that mean it's easy being a Marlins fan?

Not when you see your favorite players get plucked away by bigger, richer teams.

Jerry_Manuel
10-12-2001, 07:37 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Well even the Marlins have won a World Series in the past 5 years. Does that mean it's easy being a Marlins fan?

Not when you see your favorite players get plucked away by bigger, richer teams.

The Marlins had an assclown for an owner. He broke up a World Series team which has casued the fans not to come out. Had he kept the team intact I doubt the Marlins would be drawing poorly. Since the current owner of the Twins doesn't want or have the money to run a team sell it to someone who does. Then see what happens. I'll shut up now because I'm a dumbass.

PaleHoseGeorge
10-12-2001, 08:20 PM
The only issues covered by the CBA are those regarding employment in MLB. MLB provides the jobs; MLBPA provides the players. The CBA is their agreement for work rules. The owners are free to do as they please on all matters that do not have direct economic impact on the player's salaries.

Yes, the MLBPA can go before the NLRB with a complaint that jobs were cut by MLB unfairly. IF there is language in the CBA specifying the number of jobs MLB is required to provide, the NLRB is likely to seek a court injunction preventing MLB from eliminating those jobs. To my knowledge, there is nothing in the CBA that specifies anything of the sort. Thus such a lawsuit by the MLBPA would be a long-shot to succeed.

I suspect what the MLB is really doing here is putting an issue on the table that the MLBPA must negotiate--presumably by giving up something else of value to the owners. The owners can threaten to cut jobs after the new CBA is agreed to UNLESS the MLBPA negotiates language preventing MLB from doing so. You can expect the players to give up something else of value to the owners in return for MLB's "concession" on contraction.

Can the owner's reduce their number? Sure, but it isn't as easy as they would like us to believe. If an outside party steps forward and offers more money for the franchise than what MLB is offering the "contracted" franchise owner, MLB could easily find itself sued on several fronts, and probably liable for treble damages.

The owners are stupid, but not that stupid. They folded up the tent last time they ran afoul of the law--back in 1995.

LongDistanceFan
10-12-2001, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


True dat. And we think we have it bad. The Twins finish in the cellar like 6 years in a row, then they finally start winning and they totally collapse. Not to mention the stadium and the total lack of financial support. I can respect Twins fans. i agree, and now their farm system is looking good to keep bringing up some extra stars.

GASHWOUND
10-12-2001, 10:06 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


The Twins have won 2 World Series in most of our life times at least. While our Sox in all of our lifetimes have won... let me grab my calculator for this one.

0 + 0 = 0 World Series Titles

So it's not that bad.

0 + 0 = 0
Hmmm, are you sure about that?

Well, at least its easy to remember how many world series we have won. Those poor yankees, they probably lost count after 15 and who needs all those world series anyway. It just gives you big egos and we don't want that. :)

Jerry_Manuel
10-12-2001, 10:28 PM
Originally posted by GASHWOUND
0 + 0 = 0
Hmmm, are you sure about that?

Well, at least its easy to remember how many world series we have won. Those poor yankees, they probably lost count after 15 and who needs all those world series anyway. It just gives you big egos and we don't want that.

I'm going to double check that 0 + 0 = 0 thing.

:reinsy
Yeah that's right I want to win but don't want the fans to get big heads.

doublem23
10-13-2001, 12:44 AM
Thanx PHG for clearing that up. Now I understand....

ma-gaga
10-13-2001, 10:44 AM
Thanks for all the support. I'll try to answer as many posts as best i can.

PHG is correct, the owners are using contraction as a bargaining chip. However, I read a very good article a couple of months back. When they were looking at teams that it would be possible to contract there were 4 that primarily came up: Expos, Twins, Marlins, Devil Rays. The two Florida teams are locked into stadium leases, and are vehemetly protected by their legislators. They made it clear that they would sue MLB for breach of contract if they tried to contract either of their teams. The Twins are locked in on 2 year contracts at the Metrodome, no such defense of the Twins has been expressed, and that if Bud Selig wanted to make an example of any teams, the Twins/Expos would be the easiest. Plus with our proximity to Wisconsin maybe emporer Bud thinks that all Twins fans would become Brewers fans, and more money for the Brew Crew... did i just say 'brew crew'?

I remember the Twin's championships. They were awesome. There was not that 'magical' feeling with this season, if they would have been able to handle, or split their games with Seattle and Cleveland in August there would have been a different spin on their September. They were never able to put together one of those 15 game streaks when it mattered. The Twins and the Sox both have good young talent that are ready to end Clevelands' dominance in the division. It's a question of whether either team can take the next step. The Twins 'collapse' was because they couldn't beat 3 teams (damn those Devil Rays).

The Marlins Huizenga should be drawn and quartered for the lack of respect he gave the game.

Like i said before, The food is good here. I get some dirty looks everyonce in a while, but the salty, greasy fries; mmmmmmmm. If my current employer fires me, is it possible for me to get a position here somewhere? I'm one awesome dishwasher.

:)

Daver
10-13-2001, 05:34 PM
Originally posted by ma-gaga
Thanks for all the support. I'll try to answer as many posts as best i can.

If they put up with me I'm sure they'd be more than happy to have you join the ranks.