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View Full Version : Another Cub Thread, But bare with me...


bennyw41
11-12-2004, 10:54 AM
I am confused about one thing. Why does it seem that lots of teams in the MLB are willing to just get hosed by the Cubs? It seems like every team is willing to do something stupid to help the cubs out. I know it seems paranoid, but look at these few examples:

-Pittsburgh sending key role players to the cubs for almost nothing. A interdivisional trade almost NEVER happens.
-L.A. sends two decent players to the cubs for Todd Hundley, who is horrible, didn't play this year and still makes massive amounts of money.
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.

If this trend continues with Sosa being "unloaded", don't you think the Integrity of the game is compromised? I'm not a conspiricy theorist, but these three examples just don't add up to me.

Justafan
11-12-2004, 11:10 AM
I am confused about one thing. Why does it seem that lots of teams in the MLB are willing to just get hosed by the Cubs? It seems like every team is willing to do something stupid to help the cubs out. I know it seems paranoid, but look at these few examples:

-Pittsburgh sending key role players to the cubs for almost nothing. A interdivisional trade almost NEVER happens.
-L.A. sends two decent players to the cubs for Todd Hundley, who is horrible, didn't play this year and still makes massive amounts of money.
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.

If this trend continues with Sosa being "unloaded", don't you think the Integrity of the game is compromised? I'm not a conspiricy theorist, but these three examples just don't add up to me.
How about Sammy Sosa for Luis Castillo and Encarnacion? That is what Florida and the Cubs are talking about Per Bruce Levine. Talk about a flippin robbery. If Hendry pulls that off, he should be sent to jail for stealing.

Iwritecode
11-12-2004, 11:18 AM
Just wait until Hangar chimes in with his patented rant about how the Cubs "stole" Prior from the Twins due to Bud Selig's incompetence...

BTW, I'm not usually the grammer police but "bare"???

jackbrohamer
11-12-2004, 11:21 AM
-L.A. sends two decent players to the cubs for Todd Hundley, who is horrible, didn't play this year and still makes massive amounts of money.
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.
Grudzialanek & Karros were considered more as overpaid headaches than decent players, at the time the deal was considered to be each team dumping off problem players. Plus the Marlins trimmed payroll last year & Choi was still considered to have some upside

Justafan
11-12-2004, 11:24 AM
Luis Castillo for Sosa is a joke. Encarnacion is just a throw in who would be a 4th outfielder.

Jjav829
11-12-2004, 11:25 AM
I am confused about one thing. Why does it seem that lots of teams in the MLB are willing to just get hosed by the Cubs? It seems like every team is willing to do something stupid to help the cubs out. I know it seems paranoid, but look at these few examples:

-Pittsburgh sending key role players to the cubs for almost nothing. A interdivisional trade almost NEVER happens.
-L.A. sends two decent players to the cubs for Todd Hundley, who is horrible, didn't play this year and still makes massive amounts of money.
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.

If this trend continues with Sosa being "unloaded", don't you think the Integrity of the game is compromised? I'm not a conspiricy theorist, but these three examples just don't add up to me.The Ramirez trade looks really bad now. I don't think the Pirates ever thought he would put up the numbers he did in 2004.

The LA trade was just a swap of bad contracts. Karros and Grudzielanek were both coming off bad years as was Hundley. The salaries were about even so the Dodgers figured they would take a chance on Hundley bouncing back as their backup catcher. The trade also allowed them to look for upgrades at first and second base.

The Lee trade was largely a salary dump. The Marlins needed to clear salary so that they could hold onto some other key players. Castillo, Urbina, and Pudge were all free agents. Guys like Penny, Redman, Lowell were arbitration eligible. They had to make a decision on who to keep and who to get rid of. I guess there was some sentiment in the Marlins front office that Lee might have peaked in 2003. They figured in getting Choi they were getting a good, cheap replacement who could possibly be their future first baseman.

I really hope no one takes Sosa from them. Unfortunately, some dope like Omar Minaya might take him because they think Sosa will bounce back. Mets fans are already pissed at the thought of getting Sosa. The Marlins want him to help raise attendance and help get them their new stadium.

DrCrawdad
11-12-2004, 11:27 AM
I am confused about one thing. Why does it seem that lots of teams in the MLB are willing to just get hosed by the Cubs? It seems like every team is willing to do something stupid to help the cubs out. I know it seems paranoid, but look at these few examples:

-Pittsburgh sending key role players to the cubs for almost nothing. A interdivisional trade almost NEVER happens.
-L.A. sends two decent players to the cubs for Todd Hundley, who is horrible, didn't play this year and still makes massive amounts of money.
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.

If this trend continues with Sosa being "unloaded", don't you think the Integrity of the game is compromised? I'm not a conspiricy theorist, but these three examples just don't add up to me.

Jim Hendry has done two things exceptionally well. One, Hendry has traded from a position of financial strength. Two, Hendry has dealt prospects when their value was high.

Hendry and the Cubs are in a position to take on the big contracts that other teams are looking to deal. That's why they got Lee & Clement.

Hendry has done a great job at trading away prospects while they're still valuable, still considered prized prospects. That's what he did with Hill and Choi. Hendry traded them before they were fully exposed.

On the other hand, the Sox do not barter from a position of financial strength. KW has to try and finagle things so that the Sox budget is not increased. KW usually has to give away more in exchange for the other team paying part of the salary of the high priced player they are trading.

KW has held on to players till they were virtually worthless. Consider Jon Rauch for example. A few years ago KW might have been able to get a good return on Rauch. The Sox held onto Rauch, went thru injuries, stints in the bullpen and AAA then KW blasts him in public, thereby with all this things lowering Rauch's value to the point where the Sox have to package Rauch to get an old, injured Carl Everett.

That's my take on it. I'm sure that if KW is reading this, he'd attempt to rip my head off.

Justafan
11-12-2004, 11:40 AM
Jim Hendry has done two things exceptionally well. One, Hendry has traded from a position of financial strength. Two, Hendry has dealt prospects when their value was high.

Hendry and the Cubs are in a position to take on the big contracts that other teams are looking to deal. That's why they got Lee & Clement.

Hendry has done a great job at trading away prospects while they're still valuable, still considered prized prospects. That's what he did with Hill and Choi. Hendry traded them before they were fully exposed.

On the other hand, the Sox do not barter from a position of financial strength. KW has to try and finagle things so that the Sox budget is not increased. KW usually has to give away more in exchange for the other team paying part of the salary of the high priced player they are trading.

KW has held on to players till they were virtually worthless. Consider Jon Rauch for example. A few years ago KW might have been able to get a good return on Rauch. The Sox held onto Rauch, went thru injuries, stints in the bullpen and AAA then KW blasts him in public, thereby with all this things lowering Rauch's value to the point where the Sox have to package Rauch to get an old, injured Carl Everett.

That's my take on it. I'm sure that if KW is reading this, he'd attempt to rip my head off.

Hendry is good, I agree. However, how the hell can you pull of a Sosa for Castillo swap? If that happens, like I said, he should be locked up for robbery.

Palehose13
11-12-2004, 12:10 PM
"bare with me"? Are we all getting naked for this thread? :o:

serena
11-12-2004, 12:18 PM
-Marlins send a gold glove caliber player in Derek Lee for Hee Sop Choi, who was later sent to LA as a throw in.

Choi is cheap OBP. He stunk it up in LA, but still posted an overall OBP in the .370 range for the year. My bet is that DePodesta selected him and the Marlins were ok with dealing him because of his K rate and the falloff in his power production.

StockdaleForVeep
11-12-2004, 07:11 PM
Does it really matter? Despite being loaded up they still cannot win

JB98
11-12-2004, 08:55 PM
Does it really matter? Despite being loaded up they still cannot win

As much as I enjoy it when the Cubs lose 95 games and are out of it by the All-Star break, I have to admit it's been hilarious to watch their fans eat crow the last couple years. Their agony seems to be even greater when they get close, only to have it snatched away from them in the 11th hour.

For what it's worth, I've often wondered myself whether there was a conspiracy among GMs to help the Cubs out. Hendry is able to trade absolute crap for quality players. It's like he has mind control over the people he's dealing with.

Hangar18
11-15-2004, 11:16 AM
[QUOTE=Iwritecode]Just wait until Hangar chimes in with his patented rant about how the Cubs "stole" Prior from the Twins due to Bud Selig's incompetence...
QUOTE]

I never said the cubs "stole", I implied there was a Huge Conflict Of Interest
between Bud Selig and a certain owner of the Minnesota Twins, who happened to be his best friend. Why PAY a humongous salary to a Messiah-like player
when your going to be "contracted" right? Sure, now the Twinks
are in Backpedalling mode, trying to tell everyone they always liked Joe Mauer
and he was going to be the cornerstone of the future for them. The baseball
gods acted swiftly because theres nothing worse than a Catcher coming off a Knee Injury, hahahahahahaha. As for the The Messiah, hes only seeing
some of the wrath the baseball gods can deliver ........