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View Full Version : Maggs interview....


John Barrett
11-10-2004, 12:32 PM
http://www.nypost.com/sports/mets/33820.htm

Brian26
11-10-2004, 12:48 PM
http://www.nypost.com/sports/mets/33820.htm

Boras sounds like such a scumbag used-car salesman.

Kogs35
11-10-2004, 12:51 PM
Boras sounds like such a scumbag used-car salesman.
also a evil librian who never lets any1 take out books to read

MisterB
11-10-2004, 12:53 PM
Boras sounds like such a scumbag used-car salesman.:tool
"I resemble that remark."

Lip Man 1
11-10-2004, 12:54 PM
Boras is doing the job that he is PAID to do. If he wasn't very good at it, he wouldn't be incredibly wealthy and wouldn't be in the demand that he is.

Lip

Ol' No. 2
11-10-2004, 12:56 PM
Boras is doing the job that he is PAID to do. If he wasn't very good at it, he wouldn't be incredibly wealthy and wouldn't be in the demand that he is.

LipWrong, Lip. I'm sure players are begging him to get them less money, but he's forcing them to hold out for a big contract against their wishes.

samram
11-10-2004, 01:00 PM
Boras is doing the job that he is PAID to do. If he wasn't very good at it, he wouldn't be incredibly wealthy and wouldn't be in the demand that he is.

Lip
Gotta agree with you on this one. It's not his job to look like a nice guy, but to be an advocate for his client, and make teams think his client is worth the money. It's the clubs' responsibility to make sure Maggs is healthy- if they're willing to take their word for it, and they get stuck with a bad contract, shame on them.

Paulwny
11-10-2004, 01:03 PM
Gotta agree with you on this one. It's not his job to look like a nice guy, but to be an advocate for his client, and make teams think his client is worth the money. It's the clubs' responsibility to make sure Maggs is healthy- if they're willing to take their word for it, and they get stuck with a bad contract, shame on them.

Maggs will do an audition for teams.
From Newsday:
Ordonez to audition

At the GM meetings, it's rare for a player to appear. Yet outfielder Magglio Ordonez was at the Ritz-Carlton yesterday for meetings with Boras, his representative, for what Boras described as "meetings." Ordonez played in only 52 games for the White Sox in 2004, as he underwent arthroscopic surgery to repair his left knee. Now a free agent, Ordonez will show off his physical prowess for interested clubs during next month's winter meetings in Anaheim, Calif., Boras said.

duke of dorwood
11-10-2004, 01:06 PM
Boras is doing the job that he is PAID to do. If he wasn't very good at it, he wouldn't be incredibly wealthy and wouldn't be in the demand that he is.

Lip
And that's why I'm sure he's not lying (at least extremely) because he has that earned reputation at stake

Flight #24
11-10-2004, 01:06 PM
Boras is doing the job that he is PAID to do. If he wasn't very good at it, he wouldn't be incredibly wealthy and wouldn't be in the demand that he is.

Lip
As with most jobs, there are both ethical and unethical ways to do them. Lying (as he did in the ARod deal) and preventing an employer from having legitimate medical access to examine an employee who is still their property (as he has done with Maggs) would IMO fall under "unethical".

Your complaint is often that JR got the state to build him a stadium and then takes advantage by not investing in the teeam. Using your logic, one could argue that he's doing what he's paid to do by the ownership group, no?

Flight #24
11-10-2004, 01:09 PM
And that's why I'm sure he's not lying (at least extremely) because he has that earned reputation at stake
The only rep that matters is the one he has with players. If players think he lies to clubs to get them better deals, and so they sign with him - clubs have no option but to deal with him.

If he was lying to the players, you'd have a valid point.

samram
11-10-2004, 01:09 PM
Maggs will do an audition for teams.
From Newsday:
Ordonez to audition

At the GM meetings, it's rare for a player to appear. Yet outfielder Magglio Ordonez was at the Ritz-Carlton yesterday for meetings with Boras, his representative, for what Boras described as "meetings." Ordonez played in only 52 games for the White Sox in 2004, as he underwent arthroscopic surgery to repair his left knee. Now a free agent, Ordonez will show off his physical prowess for interested clubs during next month's winter meetings in Anaheim, Calif., Boras said.
Interesting. If he goes through the workout and proves to be in good health, I wonder if that changes the dynamic of the Sox offseason. It seems as if they have already moved past the thought of resigning him, and Boras clients usually move to a different team. I also wonder if the fans will put pressure on the team to bring him back- it seems that as long as his health is in question, the fans have no problem with the Sox not assuming the risk.

Mickster
11-10-2004, 01:10 PM
I'd be very tempted to offer arb at this point if I were KW. 2 draft picks???? Opinions?

Ol' No. 2
11-10-2004, 01:43 PM
I'd be very tempted to offer arb at this point if I were KW. 2 draft picks???? Opinions?This is a very tricky area. I'm not sure what legal rights the Sox have to know Maggs' condition. I don't know if there's any rule in the CBA that applies. And more to the point, do they have any means to enforce those rights? Players can file grievances, so I suppose teams can also. Kenny is a smart boy. I'd be surprised if he wasn't working on this, but behind the scenes.

depy48
11-10-2004, 01:55 PM
why maggs, why?
i just dont get why he would change boras, hence changing his whole persona....

Mickster
11-10-2004, 01:56 PM
why maggs, why?
i just dont get why he would change boras, hence changing his whole persona....
$$ GREED! $$

gosox41
11-10-2004, 01:58 PM
I'd be very tempted to offer arb at this point if I were KW. 2 draft picks???? Opinions?
It's a risk. Because what if Ordonez isn't healthy. HTen he accepts arbitration and the Sox are on the hook for $11 mill for a player who is on the DL or who spends the first half rehabbing.


It's a tough call. Boras is hiding something. Why won't he let any team see him until after Dec. 7? To get him to free agency probably. Unless he's running a huge bluff and wants the Sox to think Magglio is as good as gone so he can get arbitration and then accept it from the Sox. THen next year Magglio can file for FA.


Bob

Mickster
11-10-2004, 02:00 PM
It's a risk. Because what if Ordonez isn't healthy. HTen he accepts arbitration and the Sox are on the hook for $11 mill for a player who is on the DL or who spends the first half rehabbing.


It's a tough call. Boras is hiding something. Why won't he let any team see him until after Dec. 7? To get him to free agency probably. Unless he's running a huge bluff and wants the Sox to think Magglio is as good as gone so he can get arbitration and then accept it from the Sox. THen next year Magglio can file for FA.


Bob
If he waits until the 7th and Maggs if not offered arb. by the sox it makes him that much more of an attractive free agent pickup.....a Class A free agent w/o giving up the 2 compensatory picks!

JKryl
11-10-2004, 02:02 PM
This is a very tricky area. I'm not sure what legal rights the Sox have to know Maggs' condition. I don't know if there's any rule in the CBA that applies. And more to the point, do they have any means to enforce those rights? Players can file grievances, so I suppose teams can also. Kenny is a smart boy. I'd be surprised if he wasn't working on this, but behind the scenes.
Come on now Ol', do you really think KW's that smart? According to the article, Mags is making 14 mil now, and should take a big pay cut. Yet, the Sox offered him $60 mil over 5 years, if I've read some of the comments here right. Also, he's refused to take a physical for the Sox, and changed agents in the middle of his recuperation. Something smells not quite right here, and I think the smell's name is Boras.

mdep524
11-10-2004, 02:08 PM
It's a risk. Because what if Ordonez isn't healthy. HTen he accepts arbitration and the Sox are on the hook for $11 mill for a player who is on the DL or who spends the first half rehabbing.


It's a tough call. Boras is hiding something. Why won't he let any team see him until after Dec. 7? To get him to free agency probably. Unless he's running a huge bluff and wants the Sox to think Magglio is as good as gone so he can get arbitration and then accept it from the Sox. THen next year Magglio can file for FA.


BobI don't know... I find it hard to believe Maggs switched agents to Super Villain Scott Boras just to accept a one-year deal. I would take the risk and offer Maggs arbitration, feeling he is more than likely to turn down a one-year contract. The draft picks are worth it. Boras wants more guaranteed years- if Maggs kept his old agent, I would definitely think twice though.

Rocky Soprano
11-10-2004, 02:11 PM
I agree, I would go ahead and offer arbitration. That shows the Sox are willing to keep him and if they say no then they can really say, WE TRIED.

gosox41
11-10-2004, 02:11 PM
I don't know... I find it hard to believe Maggs switched agents to Super Villain Scott Boras just to accept a one-year deal. I would take the risk and offer Maggs arbitration, feeling he is more than likely to turn down a one-year contract. The draft picks are worth it. Boras wants more guaranteed years- if Maggs kept his old agent, I would definitely think twice though.
It's slightly different circumstances, but 2 years ago Greg Maddux was a free agent. The Braves thought he was as good as gone after the 2002 season so they offered him arbitration. And Maddux accepted. I believe that's why they quickly dumped Millwood, out of panic.


Bob

Ol' No. 2
11-10-2004, 02:17 PM
Come on now Ol', do you really think KW's that smart? According to the article, Mags is making 14 mil now, and should take a big pay cut. Yet, the Sox offered him $60 mil over 5 years, if I've read some of the comments here right. Also, he's refused to take a physical for the Sox, and changed agents in the middle of his recuperation. Something smells not quite right here, and I think the smell's name is Boras.As a matter of fact, I do think Kenny's a pretty smart guy. But really, how smart do you have to be on this one? If the Sox have any legal rights, I'm sure the Sox lawyers have advised him of just what they are and their options for pursuing them. It's obviously in Magglio's interest NOT to get examined by the Sox doctors, and Boras is acting accordingly. Why would anyone expect anything different? It's only going to happen if the Sox have a legal right to do so and the means to enforce it.

mdep524
11-10-2004, 02:26 PM
It's slightly different circumstances, but 2 years ago Greg Maddux was a free agent. The Braves thought he was as good as gone after the 2002 season so they offered him arbitration. And Maddux accepted. I believe that's why they quickly dumped Millwood, out of panic.


Bob
You're right, and I knew that would come up. The ONE time a team got burned by arbitration. I would say the odds are against that happening with Maggs, but it is something the Sox would have to take into consideration.

If Magglio were really smart, he would do what Nomar is considering: the 2003 Pudge Rodriguez. If he really wants big money, I mean BIG money-- and by all indications he does (declining the Sox multi-year offer this summer, taking Boras on as an agent)-- he should sign a one year deal with a team and prove he is, without a doubt, worth the big bucks he wants.

Then everybody wins. The Sox could get one more year out of Ordonez, making Konerko expendable for '05. The Sox would have budget room to take on a stud pitcher. Magglio goes out and proves he is an All Star, while taking a one year hit in salary. He then quickly makes it back up with a monster contract in winter '05 for astronomical terms he won't be able to get this offseason because of the injury concern. So greed wins as well!

For Maggs to do anything other than that shows that a.) he is acting inefficiently or b.) something ain't quite right i.e. his injury is worse than he's letting on.

Flight #24
11-10-2004, 03:28 PM
I don't know... I find it hard to believe Maggs switched agents to Super Villain Scott Boras just to accept a one-year deal.
IMO it's highly likely that Maggs switched because he felt that he needed to fool owners into thinking he's 100% healthy and worthy of the corresponding contract. Thus he goes for the agent who's known for fooling owners into foolish things like bidding against themselves and paying more for players. The whole thing seems to indicate that Maggs injury is much more serious than they're letting on. Thus the need for a facade.

Anyone else notice that he'll "show off his physical prowess"? No mention of permitting medical exams, sound more like he'll work out in public for teams.

Yeah, everything's above board and he's fine. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

dickallen15
11-10-2004, 04:24 PM
I will tell you one thing, if Magglio isn't healthy, and the surgery in Vienna is found out to be something more than a minor scope, which Boras claims it to be, Boras would be through in the agent business.

Flight #24
11-10-2004, 04:30 PM
I will tell you one thing, if Magglio isn't healthy, and the surgery in Vienna is found out to be something more than a minor scope, which Boras claims it to be, Boras would be through in the agent business.
Why? Are players going to refuse him as their agent? I doubt it - in fact, he might point to the lengths that he'll go to for them. Are owners going to refuse to negotiate with him? That would either be called collusion, or at least dramatically reducing the talent pool they have to draw from.

dickallen15
11-10-2004, 04:38 PM
Why? Are players going to refuse him as their agent? I doubt it - in fact, he might point to the lengths that he'll go to for them. Are owners going to refuse to negotiate with him? That would either be called collusion, or at least dramatically reducing the talent pool they have to draw from.
That's not true. While he is a tough negotiator, and a lot of teams, if not all, don't want to deal with him, if he becomes dishonest, and that is what he would be here, a liar really, no team would ever negotiate with him. Not negotiating with a liar is not collusion. When teams decide they will not negotiate with him, he becomes a liability to the player. He makes his charts, and presentations, and player projections, and it may be full of crap, but it is not a total lie. Deceiving the league on one players health would not be worth the risk of what he would lose if it was false information. That said, there is no way I would sign Magglio,(and I really like him, my dog is named after him) without a complete physical.

Ol' No. 2
11-10-2004, 04:44 PM
That's not true. While he is a tough negotiator, and a lot of teams, if not all, don't want to deal with him, if he becomes dishonest, and that is what he would be here, a liar really, no team would ever negotiate with him. Not negotiating with a liar is not collusion. When teams decide they will not negotiate with him, he becomes a liability to the player. He makes his charts, and presentations, and player projections, and it may be full of crap, but it is not a total lie. Deceiving the league on one players health would not be worth the risk of what he would lose if it was false information. That said, there is no way I would sign Magglio,(and I really like him, my dog is named after him) without a complete physical.I think the truth here lies somewhere in between. I don't think Boras will be out of business necessarily, nor do I think owners will/can refuse to negotiate with him. But any player he represents will have a cloud of uncertainty attached to him that has to translate into a poorer negotiating position. An agent is a salesman, and if you don't trust the salesman, you might still deal with him, but his job is a whole lot tougher.

Flight #24
11-10-2004, 04:54 PM
That's not true. While he is a tough negotiator, and a lot of teams, if not all, don't want to deal with him, if he becomes dishonest, and that is what he would be here, a liar really, no team would ever negotiate with him. Not negotiating with a liar is not collusion. When teams decide they will not negotiate with him, he becomes a liability to the player. He makes his charts, and presentations, and player projections, and it may be full of crap, but it is not a total lie. Deceiving the league on one players health would not be worth the risk of what he would lose if it was false information. That said, there is no way I would sign Magglio,(and I really like him, my dog is named after him) without a complete physical.
I doubt it. It's rare that a player like Maggs has the injury questions that he does. It's already been admitted that Boras lied to Tom Hicks to make him think there were other bidders at $20mil+ for ARod, has that hurt his ability any in terms of negotiations with owners?

If/when there is another player that has an injury issue, it'll be as simple as him allowing a medical exam. If he has another player with an injury question that he doesn't allow an exam for, you're right. But otherwise, I can actually see what he's doing as making him MORE attractive to players, not less (i.e. he'll go to any & all lengths to get them max $$$).

Lip Man 1
11-10-2004, 08:01 PM
What Boras did in the A-Rod situation is no better, no worse then numerous owners who manipulated books for their own ends. (see 'The Lords Of The Realm.')

It's no different then a pitcher who scuffs a ball or a hitter who corks a bat.
EVERYONE tries to cut corners, short change the rules and take advantage where they can. Is it ethical? No...but then life isn't a utopia either is it? I'm sure everyone in baseball, from players, to owners, to G.M.'s knows there is a certain amount of outright lying going on in everything that is done.

Also remember the MLBPA can (and has) decertified agents who have crossed the line going beyond even the loose standards of the sport.

If Boras were to do something that was unethical and harmed his client OR did something outright illegal, he'd be nailed for it.

Lip