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View Full Version : Trainer: Bonds Used Steroid in '03


Rocklive99
10-16-2004, 12:40 PM
So I turn on ESPNEWS at 11:30 am central, and a minute later "Trainer: Bonds Used Steroid in 03" appears in the little breaking news box on the bottom. It's just coming across the ticker, its from some SF newspaper, and he said it was an undetectable steroid. I think the trainer was caught on tape saying it?

Too bad, I liked him, I'm sure he will deny it though.

RKMeibalane
10-16-2004, 12:43 PM
I'm really looking forward to the day when every player who has ever used steroids finds his name on a published list that everyone can see. The frauds will finally be revealed for what they really are.

Wsoxmike59
10-16-2004, 01:24 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1903019

The link to the Bonds article off ESPN.

I for one will NEVER recognize Barry Bonds as the all time HR leader. For me it will always be Henry Aaron and Babe Ruth at 1 and 2.

Bonds HR records are such a farce and sham to the game of baseball his place in the record book should be accompanied by a huge freaking *

ode to veeck
10-16-2004, 01:34 PM
Let Bonds play with a 8 inch *on his sleeve

Jjav829
10-16-2004, 01:38 PM
I'm shocked! Barry took steroids? Noooo! I thought his head just naturally grew 2 sizes. :rolleyes:


Hey Barry, you'll never make people forget about Babe Ruth. Never.

Deadguy
10-16-2004, 01:46 PM
I'm about as shocked as when I found out Alyssa Milano has implants.

Barroid's stats should be taken with a grain of salt. Not that anyone in their right mind would believe that Barry made an unprecedented leap to the greatest hitter ever in his late 30s, without the aid of performance enhancing drugs .

santo=dorf
10-16-2004, 02:37 PM
I'm about as shocked as when I found out Alyssa Milano has implants.

She does? :o:

RKMeibalane
10-16-2004, 02:53 PM
She does? :o:
Yes, she does. The difference between the two situations is that even without breast implants, Alyssa Millano is a still beautiful woman. Without the steroids, Barry Bonds would not have as many home runs as he does. Barry Bonds will go down in history as a fraud.

There is an interesting sidebar to this situation. This marks the first time that Skip Bayless has been right about anything. He has been saying that Bonds is a steroid-using fraud for years.

StepsInSC
10-16-2004, 07:42 PM
Yes, she does. The difference between the two situations is that even without breast implants, Alyssa Millano is a still beautiful woman. Without the steroids, Barry Bonds would not have as many home runs as he does. Barry Bonds will go down in history as a fraud.
I'm being picky and maybe I'm just playing devil's advocate...but I don't think the analogy holds. Without breast implants, Alyssa Millano is still a beautiful woman. Without the steroids, Barry Bonds is still a helluva baseball player.

Point taken, though.

RKMeibalane
10-16-2004, 08:05 PM
I'm being picky and maybe I'm just playing devil's advocate...but I don't think the analogy holds. Without breast implants, Alyssa Millano is still a beautiful woman. Without the steroids, Barry Bonds is still a helluva baseball player.

Point taken, though.
You're right that the analogy is something of a stretch; however, I don't think anyone can deny that Barry Bonds would not be in the position he's in without the 'roids. Alyssa Millano first made a name for herself on the TV series Who's the Boss, when she was still just a kid. Barry Bonds has always been a great player, but he has received much more recognition because of the home runs.

fquaye149
10-16-2004, 09:27 PM
You're right that the analogy is something of a stretch; however, I don't think anyone can deny that Barry Bonds would not be in the position he's in without the 'roids. Alyssa Millano first made a name for herself on the TV series Who's the Boss, when she was still just a kid. Barry Bonds has always been a great player, but he has received much more recognition because of the home runs.


hm - barry was the best player in baseball before he was hitting 60+ hr. Was he on steroids all this time? Even when he was 40-40? Even in 1994 when Topps' simulation had him breaking Maris' HR record?

It's sad if he cheated, but Steroids didn't make him the best hitter in the game.

RKMeibalane
10-16-2004, 09:34 PM
hm - barry was the best player in baseball before he was hitting 60+ hr. Was he on steroids all this time? Even when he was 40-40? Even in 1994 when Topps' simulation had him breaking Maris' HR record?

It's sad if he cheated, but Steroids didn't make him the best hitter in the game.
Barry Bonds wasn't on pace to break Maris' record in 1994. Matt Williams, his teammate with the Giants, was. Furthermore, there are a number of players- Frank Thomas, Mo Vaughn, Albert Belle, Ken Griffey Jr.- who were all in their prime during the mid-nineties, and could easily dispute your assertion that Bonds was the best hitter in baseball.

Besides, that wasn't even my point in my earlier posts. Not once have I ever said that Bonds wasn't a great player. My problem with him is that he has achieved a great deal since the 2001 season while using steroids. Bonds would not be in a position to break Aaron's record if he hadn't cheated. That's the reason I have a problem with what he's done.

StillMissOzzie
10-17-2004, 01:03 AM
There is an interesting sidebar to this situation. This marks the first time that Skip Bayless has been right about anything. He has been saying that Bonds is a steroid-using fraud for years.
Not true, RK. Skip Bayless had Sammy Sosa pegged as a phony and a fraud YEARS before any other member of the media, local or national. When you look at what borders on piling-on for Sosa these days, I've gotta believe that Skip is getting a good laugh. Was this why he was banished from the Cubune?

SMO
:dunno:

bartmanisgod
10-17-2004, 01:48 AM
Any true athlete will tell you that taking steroids does not make you a better hitter. While everyone knows that steriods do increase muscle mass and make you stronger, no serious baseball player takes them for that reason. The biggest reason why players take steriods is to prevent injury or to recover from injury faster.

While I understand this is still cheating, since you can increase the longevity of a carreer and increase the amount of games played and amount of at bats. this dosen't take away the fact that Barry Bonds is the best hitter ever. His hand -eye coordination is second to none and his hands are lightspeeds ahead of anyone else.

Home Runs come from a great swing and Bonds has the best! Who else can see so few pitches and still put up the numbers he does. Best. Hitter. Ever.

SomebodyToldMe
10-17-2004, 02:01 AM
Any true athlete will tell you that taking steroids does not make you a better hitter. While everyone knows that steriods do increase muscle mass and make you stronger, no serious baseball player takes them for that reason. The biggest reason why players take steriods is to prevent injury or to recover from injury faster.

While I understand this is still cheating, since you can increase the longevity of a carreer and increase the amount of games played and amount of at bats. this dosen't take away the fact that Barry Bonds is the best hitter ever. His hand -eye coordination is second to none and his hands are lightspeeds ahead of anyone else.

Home Runs come from a great swing and Bonds has the best! Who else can see so few pitches and still put up the numbers he does. Best. Hitter. Ever.
I agree. Bonds, to me, is still great. Same with Big Mac. I still love that guy.

fquaye149
10-17-2004, 03:56 AM
Barry Bonds wasn't on pace to break Maris' record in 1994. Matt Williams, his teammate with the Giants, was. Furthermore, there are a number of players- Frank Thomas, Mo Vaughn, Albert Belle, Ken Griffey Jr.- who were all in their prime during the mid-nineties, and could easily dispute your assertion that Bonds was the best hitter in baseball.

Besides, that wasn't even my point in my earlier posts. Not once have I ever said that Bonds wasn't a great player. My problem with him is that he has achieved a great deal since the 2001 season while using steroids. Bonds would not be in a position to break Aaron's record if he hadn't cheated. That's the reason I have a problem with what he's done.

let's take this one by one.

a.) he may not have been on pace, but that's not what i said. topps did a computer simulation of the 1994 baseball season post strike to project the stats of all the players. These were included one per pack in the 1995 topps series. Bonds, in this computer simulation, was projected at 62 home runs. They did not pull this number out of the air. It doesn't make it fact or anything of the sort, but the point is, there was factual evidence that supported the idea that he could have hit 62 in '94 (well before anyone dreamed of accusing him of steroids.)

b.) i never said he was the best HITTER in baseball in '94 (though i did and will claim that he is the best hitter NOW and call anyone who says differently a fool). I said best PLAYER. This took into consideration his stellar hitting, gold glove defense and outstanding baserunning. Some players had two of the three (Griffey) but few to none had all three qualities. And yes, i'm not forgetting he couldn't throw out mark lemke. I'm just choosing to overlook it.

c.) He might not have had the exact number of homeruns he has now (though I would posit that most of Bonds' homerun don't BARELY clear the fence - the kind of homeruns steroids would actually aid) but I think even if you subtract ten home runs a year for every year you suspect him of steroids, he still would be within 4 or 5 years of the record.

LOOK - I'm not condoning Bonds' use of steroids (still alleged). I'm just saying, Bonds is a great player and just like cork wouldn't have really effected Sosa's homeruns, using or not using steroids wouldn't have effected Bonds' stats as much as some people like to make it out.

idseer
10-17-2004, 08:38 AM
Any true athlete will tell you that taking steroids does not make you a better hitter. While everyone knows that steriods do increase muscle mass and make you stronger, no serious baseball player takes them for that reason. The biggest reason why players take steriods is to prevent injury or to recover from injury faster.

While I understand this is still cheating, since you can increase the longevity of a carreer and increase the amount of games played and amount of at bats. this dosen't take away the fact that Barry Bonds is the best hitter ever. His hand -eye coordination is second to none and his hands are lightspeeds ahead of anyone else.

Home Runs come from a great swing and Bonds has the best! Who else can see so few pitches and still put up the numbers he does. Best. Hitter. Ever.
until i see proof that this is not the case i will continue to believe steroids also contributes to coordination and hand speed. the ONLY time i've ever read that steroids ONLY improves strength is from those who don't know. to suggest otherwise is to believe a power hitter becomes a better hitter after age 36 than at any other stage of his career. i say it doesn't happen.
look at bond's average the last 4 years. FAR better than at any other point.

i will also agree that bonds was a great player, but he was not the greatest player of his own era as he's appeared the last 4 years.

gosox41
10-17-2004, 09:55 AM
I'm being picky and maybe I'm just playing devil's advocate...but I don't think the analogy holds. Without breast implants, Alyssa Millano is still a beautiful woman. Without the steroids, Barry Bonds is still a helluva baseball player.

Point taken, though.
I think we all need to see a bunch of Alyssa Milano pictures jsut to verify how beautiful she really is.:D:



Bob

TornLabrum
10-17-2004, 10:10 AM
I think we all need to see a bunch of Alyssa Milano pictures jsut to verify how beautiful she really is.:D:



Bob
I agree. You can't take this kind of stuff on just hearsay! :rolleyes:

batmanZoSo
10-17-2004, 05:33 PM
I'm really looking forward to the day when every player who has ever used steroids finds his name on a published list that everyone can see. The frauds will finally be revealed for what they really are.

Makes Thomas's acievements that much more respectable as he did everything without cheating.

RKMeibalane
10-17-2004, 06:17 PM
Makes Thomas's acievements that much more respectable as he did everything without cheating.
Exactly. When it is finally revealed that Frank Thomas is the only slugger who didn't cheat, we're all going to have a reason to smile. Here's to you, Big Frank for playing the game the right way. :cheers:

bigfoot
10-17-2004, 09:07 PM
Enough about Frank, already. Where are the Alyssa Milano pix?

daveeym
10-17-2004, 11:58 PM
Any true athlete will tell you that taking steroids does not make you a better hitter. While everyone knows that steriods do increase muscle mass and make you stronger, no serious baseball player takes them for that reason. The biggest reason why players take steriods is to prevent injury or to recover from injury faster.

While I understand this is still cheating, since you can increase the longevity of a carreer and increase the amount of games played and amount of at bats. this dosen't take away the fact that Barry Bonds is the best hitter ever. His hand -eye coordination is second to none and his hands are lightspeeds ahead of anyone else.

Home Runs come from a great swing and Bonds has the best! Who else can see so few pitches and still put up the numbers he does. Best. Hitter. Ever. That is a load of crap, steroids lead to more injuries they don't prevent them. Anabolic steroids do not make you heal faster and are completely different than the steroids used and prescribed by doctors to heal injuries/reduce inflammation. Not only is the increased strength going to lead to quicker bat speed it allows for the batters to go to the plate swinging tree trunks because they're going to still be able to get the bat through the zone. The added mass of the logs they're able to swing has just a tiny bit of an effect on their power numbers.

fquaye149
10-18-2004, 10:52 AM
That is a load of crap, steroids lead to more injuries they don't prevent them. Anabolic steroids do not make you heal faster and are completely different than the steroids used and prescribed by doctors to heal injuries/reduce inflammation. Not only is the increased strength going to lead to quicker bat speed it allows for the batters to go to the plate swinging tree trunks because they're going to still be able to get the bat through the zone. The added mass of the logs they're able to swing has just a tiny bit of an effect on their power numbers.

you and babe herman seem to agree about size of bat.

anyway - yes steroids cause injuries, but their whole reason of existence is to help people recover from injuries. If you hurt your knee and are not a professional athlete see what a doctor prescribes you.

Foulke29
10-18-2004, 12:01 PM
Any true athlete will tell you that taking steroids does not make you a better hitter. While everyone knows that steriods do increase muscle mass and make you stronger, no serious baseball player takes them for that reason. The biggest reason why players take steriods is to prevent injury or to recover from injury faster.

While I understand this is still cheating, since you can increase the longevity of a carreer and increase the amount of games played and amount of at bats. this dosen't take away the fact that Barry Bonds is the best hitter ever. His hand -eye coordination is second to none and his hands are lightspeeds ahead of anyone else.

Home Runs come from a great swing and Bonds has the best! Who else can see so few pitches and still put up the numbers he does. Best. Hitter. Ever.
Just silly. It may not make you a better hitter if you're a bad hitter, but if you're already a good or great hitter, it makes you that much better - stronger. Try arguing that point with Ken Caminiti. Was he really that good before he started juicing? Could Sammy hit the homers he did consistantly before juicing?

Bonds was a great hitter, but he was never a 50+ HR hitter before grabbing some juice.

Best player ever - Babe Ruth - plain and simple. I'd like to see Dingle Barry go out and pitch for a whole season and win 20+ games.

Justafan
10-18-2004, 12:50 PM
Good! Lets see if ESPN still kisses his ass every night now that he has been exposed. Bonds this, Bonds that is all you ever get from that station(aside from Yankees/Red Sox).

fquaye149
10-18-2004, 01:34 PM
Bonds was a great hitter, but he was never a 50+ HR hitter before grabbing some juice.




There is almost no doubt Bonds would have hit 50 HR in 1994 had the strike not ended the season

Meanwhile, He's only hit more than 50 once in his career so besides from 2001 when he had 73, his home run numbers have not deviated much over the past 10 years. Has he been juicing all this time.

And yes, Sammy has been aided by roids because he's a fly ball hitter and he has a few HR's that BARELY clear the fence but Bonds' home runs are no doubt about them - clearing by 50 feet most of the time (and in a pitcher's park no less). Are you saying that it is steroids that is tacking on those fifty feet?

LOOK - Bonds is a great hitter. Period. If he felt he needed steroids, that's sad, but I really don't believe that steroids have added much more than 10-20 HR to his career. IF THAT.


Oh and P.S. - Ruth pitched during the dead ball era. Was a great pitcher, but let's not compare apples to monster trucks here. He also faced no black players in his entire career. Ruth was probably the greatest hitter of all time - his stats bear that out, but please, don't pretend that because Barry never tried to pitch he couldn't. Not to mention Ruth benefited from many extenuating circumstances just as you believe Bonds has.

(The Polo Grounds would have been a nice park to hit in. How many HR do you think Bonds would have hit there. Esp off pitchers who probably didnt' crack 90? And how do you think Ruth would have done against the slider considering he was bewildered by Hubbel's screwball? It's impossible to say. DON'T COMPARE ERAS)

maurice
10-18-2004, 02:12 PM
I agree. You can't take this kind of stuff on just hearsay! :rolleyes:
http://www.alyssa-milano-international.com/images/adult_fashion/alyssa_milano-adult_fashion026.jpg

maurice
10-18-2004, 02:15 PM
please, don't pretend that because Barry never tried to pitch he couldn't.
You other points are well-taken, but this is silly. I can throw harder than Bonds. There's a reason he plays LF, and not CF or RF.

fquaye149
10-18-2004, 02:38 PM
maybe - maybe not. It's impossible to say because never in his baseball career was Bonds a pitcher (I guess I don't really know about little league or H.S) because it wouldn't have done him any good to learn how to pitch since he was clearly an outstanding hitter from day one.

daveeym
10-18-2004, 04:39 PM
you and babe herman seem to agree about size of bat.

anyway - yes steroids cause injuries, but their whole reason of existence is to help people recover from injuries. If you hurt your knee and are not a professional athlete see what a doctor prescribes you. See my post again, doctors prescribe corticsteroids (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c2coff=1&q=corticsteroids&spell=1) which aid in reducing inflammation and also are used in asthma medicines etc. corticsteroids (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&c2coff=1&q=corticsteroids&spell=1) do not increase muscle mass. They are not the same as the anabolic steroids athletes are using.

TornLabrum
10-18-2004, 06:07 PM
http://www.alyssa-milano-international.com/images/adult_fashion/alyssa_milano-adult_fashion026.jpg
There ya go! Took ya long enough, though!