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SoxFanTillDeath
10-14-2004, 10:16 AM
What are our outfield options for 2005? Rowand is a lock for an outfield spot, and it looks like we're stuck with Crazy Carl next year as a backup. Who will fill the other 2 starting spots?

I'd like to see the Sox keep C-Lee (he's my favorite player on the sox) as his defense has improved and he is one of our most consistent hitters. Is their a cheap CF/RF option available that we could pick up? I know names like Hairston and Pierre have been thrown around, but are they in any way realistic, given the Sox tendency to wait until players are completely washed up before trading for them?

Also, I want everyone to know that I am not among the Joe Borchard bashers. Look at the following stat lines from this year:

Maggs: 202 AB, 9 HR, 16 BB
Borchard: 201 AB, 9 HR, 19 BB

I know that I am throwing out every other stat to make that comparison (average, OBP, RBI, Strike outs). But before everyone gets all doom and gloom with Borchard (too late), realize that this was his first chance to play regularly with the big club, and he got better every week.

I don't think I would be too excited to see him starting next year, but I do think he's got more potential than most people give him credit for.

**********************

crc#4

:bandance: :dtroll: :bandance:

SoxFanTillDeath
10-14-2004, 10:17 AM
By the way, this is my first ever post, so if I broke any unwritten rules (like being optimistic), than I'm sorry...

Rocky Soprano
10-14-2004, 10:20 AM
First of all, welcome.

Second of all, if you are going to compare them, how about posting averages, rbi's, strike outs, etc.

Borchard cant hold Maggs' jock.

munchman33
10-14-2004, 10:37 AM
Borchard really seemed to pick it up in the last few weeks. I'm not adverse to him being the starting rightfielder to start the season. If it doesn't work out, we've got Crazy Carl to fill in. If it does work, Carl becomes one of the better bench players in the league (provided he doesn't constantly complain about playing time).

wdelaney72
10-14-2004, 10:55 AM
LF - C. Lee
CF - A. Rowand
RF - C. Everett

Utility OF - J. Borchard

This is what we currently have and no matter imaginative (or high) people want to get, C. Lee is not going anywhere - and neither is crazy Carl.

All we can do is pray the Everett shows up next season in shape. "Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life, son."

SSN721
10-14-2004, 11:28 AM
I never thought I would say it, but I still want to give Borchard more of a chance. He seemed to improve a lot before the end of the season,I dont know if it was just garbage time and didnt matter or actually learning how to play better. Obviously a club with more resources it wouldnt be a question, we would pick someone up to fill the hole, but I dont mind starting next year with Borchard in right and Carldactyl backing him up. If we do that though, we better not trade Lee, because I dont have full confidence in Borchard blossoming and would like to have consistent production from 2/3rds of the outfield.

Clembasbal
10-14-2004, 11:47 AM
I never thought I would say it, but I still want to give Borchard more of a chance. He seemed to improve a lot before the end of the season,I dont know if it was just garbage time and didnt matter or actually learning how to play better. Obviously a club with more resources it wouldnt be a question, we would pick someone up to fill the hole, but I dont mind starting next year with Borchard in right and Carldactyl backing him up. If we do that though, we better not trade Lee, because I dont have full confidence in Borchard blossoming and would like to have consistent production from 2/3rds of the outfield.
I like Borchard as well and I think he needs a 2nd chance. I just hope he doesn't continue to be a bust.

Ol' No. 2
10-14-2004, 11:58 AM
LF - C. Lee
CF - A. Rowand
RF - C. Everett

Utility OF - J. Borchard

This is what we currently have and no matter imaginative (or high) people want to get, C. Lee is not going anywhere - and neither is crazy Carl.

All we can do is pray the Everett shows up next season in shape. "Fat, Drunk, and Stupid is no way to go through life, son."I would hope to be able to improve on Dino, but I agree otherwise. Borchard should be on the major league roster, but unless he shows rapid and dramatic improvement, I don't think they can afford to have him starting every day. But there's nothing to be gained by sending him back to AAA. He needs time at the major league level. Keeping him as a utility OF and playing him once or twice a week (like they did with Rowand) gives him the oppportunity to learn. If another year goes by and he's still below the Mendoza line, you have to cut your losses. But lots of HOF players had awful rookie years. Mike Schmidt hit .196 his first full year and he turned out pretty well.

MrKinsella
10-14-2004, 12:11 PM
I have to go with the borchard people on this one even though I don't really like him. All our talented prospects are outfielders so it makes little sense to go pay a guy for 2 or three years and never have room to bring up a new player. The only way that would work is if we get a franchise player like Beltran and although Im hopeful, it doesn't seem likely. If we don't get Beltran then we can go after bullpen help and a mid to tail end starter.

Lip Man 1
10-14-2004, 01:01 PM
Just wondering...(and this is not a slam)

How much stock can you put in a players stats in September? particularly playing for a team that was out of the race?

I recently read a comment where the author stated that most MLB scouts are told not to believe any September stats given the fact that many of those games are played against other teams out of the race and using a lot of minor leaguers.

That comment was not found on this board by the way, I think I read it in S.I.

Lip

MisterB
10-14-2004, 01:48 PM
But lots of HOF players had awful rookie years. Mike Schmidt hit .196 his first full year and he turned out pretty well.Could we please refrain from mentioning Borchard and Hall of Fame in the same sentence without the phrase 'will never be in the' in between? :D:

Brian26
10-14-2004, 01:57 PM
Just wondering...(and this is not a slam)

How much stock can you put in a players stats in September? particularly playing for a team that was out of the race?

I recently read a comment where the author stated that most MLB scouts are told not to believe any September stats given the fact that many of those games are played against other teams out of the race and using a lot of minor leaguers.

That comment was not found on this board by the way, I think I read it in S.I.

Lip

This is actually a great point. September is garbage time.

Brian26
10-14-2004, 01:58 PM
Could we please refrain from mentioning Borchard and Hall of Fame in the same sentence without the phrase 'will never be in the' in between? :D:

Borchard will be inducted into the Hall of Fame the same year Rob Deer, Steve Balboni and Bob Hamelin go in.

Flight #24
10-14-2004, 02:42 PM
Just wondering...(and this is not a slam)

How much stock can you put in a players stats in September? particularly playing for a team that was out of the race?

I recently read a comment where the author stated that most MLB scouts are told not to believe any September stats given the fact that many of those games are played against other teams out of the race and using a lot of minor leaguers.

That comment was not found on this board by the way, I think I read it in S.I.

Lip
That's fine, but then you really can't evaluate Joe at all since he has a total of like 125 ABs, which is WAY to low to say much of anything about a guy.

Sell Jerry Sell!
10-14-2004, 02:50 PM
I am against Borchard being a full time OFer! he should be the guy who comes in and gives carl and clee the day off when they need it. You talk about improvement at the end of the year but he improved from .160 to .200, that isn't progress.

Cubs 2004

The Cubs thought they were in the playoffs,

They thought they were great,

But, as usual, they choked again,

and lost 7 out of 8

Could they have won the pennant?

It's really hard to say

They'd probably be the champions

if they'd play Pittsburgh every day

The Cubs lack lots of character

They really have no class

It was great when the Mets and Reds

beat them and kicked their ####

The Cub fans were stunned

They couldn't believe their eyes

But to all of us who know them

This wasn't a big surprise

For the Cubs not to win the pennant

it really was quite absurd

The weirdest thing of all, however

is they finished a dismal third

Your fans were really fired up

and now all they do is sob

They should give up their season tickets

and go out and get a job

Sammy's home run hop is stupid

It's something opponents really hate

His throws are closer to the dugout

then they are to home plate

The Cubs have some players

that fans just love to boo

They have babies like Zambrano

and idiots like Alou

When LaTroy went after an umpire

He thought he was a man

Farnsworth went on the disabled list

for kicking an electric fan

Prior and Wood are idolized

You think they're Hall of Fame?

The wimps could only win

a measly total of 12 games

When Nomar came from Boston

pennant fever you could feel

But he played very sparingly

nursing his Achilles heel

The Cubs always have excuses

They look for someone to rip

So why not choose the announcers

Blame it on Stone or Chip

You have the most selfish players

It's really not a good sign

When things don't go your way

all you do is whine!

Baker needs to think this winter

and try and figure it out

He needs to do more than sit in the dugout

with a toothpick in his mouth

You had the most talent

to win it all it would seem

But the ones who win championships

They play like a team

If you've been to Wrigley Field

Be lucky you're not dead

>From being hit with falling concrete

landing on your head

So it's not Steve Bartman

or even the goat you should fear

Just have all your whiney players

go and look in the mirror

Michael S. Bloch

Shaker Recruitment Advertising & Communications

Office Services Supervisor

RKMeibalane
10-14-2004, 03:08 PM
Borchard will be inducted into the Hall of Fame the same year Rob Deer, Steve Balboni and Bob Hamelin go in.
Don't forget Kal Daniels and Dan Pasqua.

Ol' No. 2
10-14-2004, 03:21 PM
Don't forget Kal Daniels and Dan Pasqua.I happen to know that Joe reads this board and he's taking names so he can call out all you doubters when he IS inducted into the HOF.

Clembasbal
10-14-2004, 04:19 PM
Just wondering...(and this is not a slam)

How much stock can you put in a players stats in September? particularly playing for a team that was out of the race?

I recently read a comment where the author stated that most MLB scouts are told not to believe any September stats given the fact that many of those games are played against other teams out of the race and using a lot of minor leaguers.

That comment was not found on this board by the way, I think I read it in S.I.

Lip
Not the Sox scouts, I mean that is why Crede is a god. He has had three great Septembers and not too many other months (1st Sept was a call up).