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View Full Version : If you could bring back ONE PLAYER from anytime in Sox History...


Tekijawa
10-13-2004, 10:37 AM
To play on this team next year, who would it be?

HomeFish
10-13-2004, 10:47 AM
My heart tells me third baseman (Milkman!!), but my brain says SP.

I obviously never saw him in action, but Billy Pierce seems like a decent pitcher from what I've read.

He was also good over a long period of time, iirc, rather than some other good Sox pitchers that were brilliant for a year or two. I'm thinking long-term here. As a guy from the pre-FA era, he would also be more likely to sign with us long term.

Deadguy
10-13-2004, 10:50 AM
The greatest player to ever wear a White Sox uniform, Eddie Collins. He'd fit in nicely in the lead off spot, playing 2b.

Brian26
10-13-2004, 10:51 AM
1982/1983 Lamarr Hoyt.

Baby Fisk
10-13-2004, 11:25 AM
Knuckleballing multiple-20-game-winner Wilbur Wood at the top of his game could fill the #3, 4 and 5 spots in the rotation! Pitch him every second day! :cool:

Chez
10-13-2004, 11:43 AM
'93-4 Black Jack McDowell

fusillirob1983
10-13-2004, 11:45 AM
Fisk

benjamin
10-13-2004, 12:11 PM
Ed Walsh and his 40 wins...

This thread is dumb.

santo=dorf
10-13-2004, 12:13 PM
Looking at his stats, I would love a DP combination of Uribe and Nellie Fox.:smile:

216 K's in 2367 games? :nuts: That's unreal!

steff
10-13-2004, 12:13 PM
1995/1996 Albert...

TommyJohn
10-13-2004, 12:20 PM
Ed Walsh and his 40 wins...

This thread is dumb.
Don't contribute to it, then.

At least you didn't post the "Thread Sucks" dork.

TommyJohn
10-13-2004, 12:21 PM
So many holes to fill. Are we limited to just one? Very well.

Luis Aparicio. Defense at shortstop, leadoff guy that can get on base, run fast,
steal, manufacture runs. I believe KW would call him a "grinder."

ja1022
10-13-2004, 12:30 PM
Eddie Gaedel.

Chez
10-13-2004, 12:36 PM
Eddie Gaedel.
Was a St. Louis Brown.

SpringfldFan
10-13-2004, 12:37 PM
Shoeless Joe Jackson. One, because he was an awesome player, but two, because bringing him back would imply he is no longer banned from baseball.

Tekijawa
10-13-2004, 12:40 PM
I'm only 27 so I've only seen a few of our "Greats" but I'd probably take either Thigpen or Black Jack.

Dick Allen
10-13-2004, 12:43 PM
Dick Allen, 1972 version.

pinwheels3530
10-13-2004, 12:45 PM
Robin Ventura in his prime!

longshot7
10-13-2004, 01:05 PM
Pierce definitely.

or '59 Early Winn.



ah, to dream.....

ja1022
10-13-2004, 01:29 PM
Was a St. Louis Brown.My bad. The Veeck connection and all.....That's what I get for trying to be a smart ass. In that case I'll take Harry Chappas ('78-'80 and about 5'3'). Otherwise....
1. Fisk
2. Nellie Fox
3. Aparicio

These guys made contributions over the long haul. Some of my other favorites like Britt Burns, Jack McDowell, Dick Allen etc. didn't have the longevity of those three.

gosox41
10-13-2004, 01:34 PM
To play on this team next year, who would it be?
Fisk is my first choice since he wouldn't put up with any crap from headcases like Garland and Contreras. He'd fill the need for a good defensive catcher who can hit.

Early '80's Lamarr Hoyt would be great too.


Bob

Tekijawa
10-13-2004, 01:40 PM
Fisk is my first choice since he wouldn't put up with any crap from headcases like Garland and Contreras.
Who would catch Buehrle then, I can't imagine that battery would work? or would it just be the fastest pitched 5 hour game ever?

ZachAL
10-13-2004, 02:14 PM
THE greatest ever- Shoeless Joe Jackson, he would also fill the void left by maggs nicely

Iguana775
10-13-2004, 02:14 PM
Shoeless Joe Jackson. One, because he was an awesome player, but two, because bringing him back would imply he is no longer banned from baseball.
That's the one i was thinking of. I wonder how good he would have been if he wasnt banned from MLB.

Iguana775
10-13-2004, 02:15 PM
Royce Clayton.:bandance:

jabrch
10-13-2004, 02:29 PM
Walsh - no doubt. IF you can assume the same stat line. 40 wins in 66 starts in 1908. We wouldn't need a 5th starter - Pitch Walsh every 3rd day!

idseer
10-13-2004, 03:28 PM
Shoeless Joe Jackson. One, because he was an awesome player, but two, because bringing him back would imply he is no longer banned from baseball.
and that you can bring back the dead. :smile:

idseer
10-13-2004, 03:31 PM
if i were going for a career i think i'd pick fisk for this team. he's an all time great catcher who can also hit and hit with power. more importantly, he'd straighten out these losers!


if i were going for the one best year from a player then i think it has to be walsh, doesn't it? it's like adding 2 - 20 game winners. :cool:

mweflen
10-13-2004, 03:40 PM
:maggs

hose
10-13-2004, 03:55 PM
every day player- Aparicio
starter- Gary Peters......Big Ed Walsh's spitter wouldn't be allowed today.
bullpen- Hoyt Wilhem
closer- Gossage
owner- Chuck Comiskey
park - Comiskey Park
fan- Andy the Clown
bat boy- Hildado
bullpen cart- Big White Machine
tv- Harry Cary
radio- no changes

Brian26
10-13-2004, 04:23 PM
Walsh - no doubt. IF you can assume the same stat line. 40 wins in 66 starts in 1908. We wouldn't need a 5th starter - Pitch Walsh every 3rd day!

I'm probably going to get some heat for saying this, but someone needs to.

Ed Walsh pitched in 1908. Granted, everything is relative, and he was a standout pitcher for his time. However, transporting him to the year 2004 doesn't guarantee that he could win 40 games again. Or work 6,000 innings in one season.

Same thing with Joe Jackson. Against today's pitching, I highly doubt Joe Jackson would hit .300 on a regular basis.

I'm more inclined to pick someone from the past 30 years who could definitely contribute to the team.

This team needs a pitcher in the starting lineup who can win 20 games with his eyes closed and shut down another team at anytime....Lamarr Hoyt.

hose
10-13-2004, 04:45 PM
I'm probably going to get some heat for saying this, but someone needs to.

Ed Walsh pitched in 1908. Granted, everything is relative, and he was a standout pitcher for his time. However, transporting him to the year 2004 doesn't guarantee that he could win 40 games again. Or work 6,000 innings in one season.

Same thing with Joe Jackson. Against today's pitching, I highly doubt Joe Jackson would hit .300 on a regular basis.

I'm more inclined to pick someone from the past 30 years who could definitely contribute to the team.

This team needs a pitcher in the starting lineup who can win 20 games with his eyes closed and shut down another team at anytime....Lamarr Hoyt.

One thing that has changed is the spitball is now an illegal pitch, so that in itself would put Big Ed at a disadvantage......I'll change my SP to Gary Peters.

jabrch
10-13-2004, 04:48 PM
Agreed - but I thought that was the question?

HITMEN OF 77
10-13-2004, 05:20 PM
This is tough, 3 that come to mind however are....

Carlos May
Black Jack
Billy Pierce

DumpJerry
10-13-2004, 05:26 PM
Koch and Navarro

Seriously, it's a tie between Shoeless Joe and Nellie Fox.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot............Sosa.

idseer
10-13-2004, 05:35 PM
Agreed - but I thought that was the question?
exactly so. why do some people make simple things so hard?

MikeKreevich
10-13-2004, 06:50 PM
I'd bring back the Big Frank Thomas of 1993 or 1994.

bafiarocks03
10-13-2004, 07:03 PM
D'Angelo Jimenez!:D:

Foulke You
10-13-2004, 07:04 PM
1993 Cy Young Winner, Black Jack McDowell

soxwon
10-13-2004, 09:30 PM
greg luzinski

idseer
10-13-2004, 09:59 PM
to those that want mcdowell ...

W . L GS CG SV IP . H . ER BB SO ERA
40 15 49 42 6 464 343 73 56 269 1.42 - walsh
22 10 34 10 0 256 261 96 69 158 3.37 - mcdowell

are your sure?

and career-wise ...

ed walsh ...
Black Ink: Pitching - 67 (13) (Average HOFer ~ 40)
Gray Ink: Pitching - 172 (62) (Average HOFer ~ 185)
HOF Standards: Pitching - 52.0 (30) (Average HOFer ~ 50)
HOF Monitor: Pitching - 148.0 (41) (Likely HOFer > 100)

mcdowell ...
Black Ink: Pitching - 13 (158) (Average HOFer ~ 40)
Gray Ink: Pitching - 85 (256) (Average HOFer ~ 185)
HOF Standards: Pitching - 18.0 (300) (Average HOFer ~ 50)
HOF Monitor: Pitching - 36.5 (336) (Likely HOFer > 100)

for explanation of above ... http://www.baseball-reference.com/about/leader_glossary.shtml#black_ink

MikeW
10-13-2004, 09:59 PM
Got to say Nellie Fox for sure. Joel Horlen or Wilbur Wood for pitching and Sherm Lollar catching. Smokey Burgess off the bench and Ken Berry for defense in the outfield. Relief would be Wilhelm.

Nick@Nite
10-13-2004, 10:20 PM
I'm probably going to get some heat for saying this, but someone needs to.

Ed Walsh pitched in 1908. Granted, everything is relative, and he was a standout pitcher for his time. However, transporting him to the year 2004 doesn't guarantee that he could win 40 games again. Or work 6,000 innings in one season.

Same thing with Joe Jackson. Against today's pitching, I highly doubt Joe Jackson would hit .300 on a regular basis.
I, for one, do not tow the line regarding todays players being superior because of the better nutrition, fancier equipment, bigger/stronger athletes, etc. argument.

In the pre-steroids era, the old timers ate nails for breakfast. You had to be very good just to get to the big club, considering the smaller number of teams that were around back then.

Considering the meatballs thrown by the so called pitchers of today, who are afraid to knock hitters off the plate, Shoeless Joe would easily hit his lifetime .356 average.

As for Big Ed, my guess he'd plunk the first batter taking too long digging in, spitter or no spitter. Who knows, maybe he was a nice guy. In which case he'd probably not hesitate to brush back hitters looking to comfortable at the plate... you can't win 40 by being THAT nice (if he was).

Oh yeah, shine ball or no shine ball, I'd like to see Eddie Cicotte in our rotation.

CubsfansareDRUNK
10-13-2004, 10:20 PM
-Nellie Fox
-Shoeless
-Black Jack (got his john hancock on a ball! :tongue: )

the_valenstache
10-13-2004, 10:46 PM
I'd bring back the Big Frank Thomas of 1993 or 1994.
Beat me to the punch.

Jerome
10-13-2004, 10:52 PM
MVP Frank Thomas

oharewx
10-13-2004, 10:55 PM
Ozzie Guillen because he is the world's expert on ozzieball.

kojak
10-13-2004, 10:56 PM
Don Drysdale

There will never be a better broadcast tandem than The Hawk and Twin D. Didn't much matter what product was on the field, these two made for a compelling 3 hours...

SSN721
10-14-2004, 06:51 AM
Either one of my guys, Eddie Cicotte or Nellie Fox.

Deadguy
10-14-2004, 07:11 AM
http://www.baseball-reference.com/w/walshed01.shtml

Just looking through his stats, some funny stuff:

-He won 40 games in 1908, and led the league in saves....with 6.
-He led the league with a 1.27 E.R.A. in 1910, yet still lost 20 games!

:jaime
"Looks like Ed received the same kind of run support that I got."
:eloaiza:
"No doubt. We can't hit for these guys too."

davenicholson
10-14-2004, 07:40 AM
To play on this team next year, who would it be?Gary Peters. Not only could he be that number one starter the Sox lack, but he could bat 6th or 7th every game! :smile:

Realist
10-14-2004, 07:48 AM
I'm a little bit surprised to be the first one on this thread to bring him up (unless I missed someone) but I gotta go with Early Wynn circa 1959. He had big "jaje" like Fisk but he could also pitch and win 22 games for us.


"A pitcher has to look at the hitter as his mortal enemy."

"A pitcher will never be a big winner until he hates hitters."

"I've got a right to knock down anybody holding a bat."

- Early Wynn
1959 Early Wynn CHW

W 22 L 10 G 37 GS 37 CG 14 SHO 5 IP 255.7 H 202 R 106 ER 90 HR 20 BB 119 SS 179 ERA 3.17

(then maybe we'd have at least one starting pitcher that isn't afraid to throw inside)

Realist
10-14-2004, 07:54 AM
Pierce definitely.

or '59 Early Winn.



ah, to dream.....
Aha. I did miss someone. :smile:

jamteh
10-14-2004, 09:30 PM
How about Buck Weaver? Let's give him a shot to prove he didn't throw the '19 World Series.:D:

RKMeibalane
10-14-2004, 09:57 PM
Carlton Fisk

With "Pudge" around, the Sox could employ this lineup:

2B- Harris
C- Fisk
DH- Thomas
LF- Lee
1B- Konerko
CF- Rowand
RF- Everett
SS- Uribe
3B- Crede

I like the idea of Fisk hitting in front of Frank. It reminds me of what LaRussa did with him during the 1983 season. It worked once. There's no reason to believe that it wouldn't work a second time.

RKMeibalane
10-14-2004, 10:00 PM
MVP Frank Thomas
I think the idea of this thread was to bring back players who aren't already in the team. Besides, the Frank the Sox have now isn't that far off from MVP production. People were talking about Frank being considered for the award before he got hurt in June.

santo=dorf
10-14-2004, 10:12 PM
Jeremy Reed, Jon Rauch, Gary Glover, or Miquel Olivo. :whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner:

RKMeibalane
10-14-2004, 10:27 PM
Jeremy Reed, Jon Rauch, Gary Glover, or Miquel Olivo. :whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner:
Rauch wouldn't stick around long enough to help the team.

Lem_Siddons
10-14-2004, 10:34 PM
I did think of the mid 90s Frank Thomas. He stopped crowds in bars when he was at the plate.

Since that pick isn't within the spirit, I'll go with either Fisk or Wood.

One of my favorite baseball poems of all time:

WILBUR WOOD
Iím like
throwiní ****iní junk
scraping the sides of the plate
fluttering across broken winged
accumulating insults
& lounging in stale air
Iím the junkballer
& from a few feet away
I look easy to hit
but, friend, understand
that my **** explodes
BOOM!
& it sure as hell ainít where you thought itíd be
when you started that swing
& yr fury fans the air impotent
while my junk falls behind you, immaculate
[Bill]

kittle42
10-14-2004, 10:48 PM
Jeremy Reed, Jon Rauch, Gary Glover, or Miquel Olivo. :whiner: :whiner: :whiner: :whiner:
Oh, Jeremy Reed without a doubt. Or Jose Paniagua. Or Kelly Paris. Or Billy Jo Robidoux. Or Don Wakamatsu.

fuzzy_patters
10-14-2004, 11:28 PM
Lance Johnson so I can here Hawk say, "Lance Johnson got a Lance Johnson jump on that one. Remember Lance Johnson DJ?"

AOEllis
10-14-2004, 11:32 PM
Mike Lavalliere

SomebodyToldMe
10-14-2004, 11:36 PM
Jesus Pena

Railsplitter
10-16-2004, 12:16 PM
How about Buck Weaver? Let's give him a shot to prove he didn't throw the '19 World Series.:D:
I believe Weaver was banned because he knew of the fix but didn't report it.

How about Norm Cash? Trading him was one of the worst deals the Sox ever made. Won a batting title and went to the World Series with Detroit. His bat might have brought pennants to the South Side in '64 and '67.

SOXintheBURGH
10-16-2004, 03:16 PM
:canseco

ondafarm
10-16-2004, 03:20 PM
Nellie Fox.

Never saw him play but my mom founded his fan club.

Wsoxmike59
10-16-2004, 06:46 PM
If I had to pick just one player to bring back, it would have to be "Shoeless" Joe Jackson. .356 lifetime BA. Case closed!

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/players/47979/

Somebody earlier said they doubted Shoeless Joe would hit .300 regularly if he played in the present day. I find that statement downright laughable.

I feel Joe would probably be an even BETTER hitter in today's game. With expansion teams, diluted pitching staffs, smaller strike zones, livelier ball, and better playing conditions....Joe would probably be like Ichiro but with more power.

Joe Jackson is probably one of the top 10 or 15 All-Time hitting greats. I Rank him right up there with Cobb, Ruth, Hornsby, Gehrig, DiMaggio, Ted Williams, Musial, Carew, Brett, Gwynn, Rose, Puckett, Molitor, Boggs ....etc

ode to veeck
10-16-2004, 10:44 PM
the best match for Ozzie ball might be Minnie Minoso, then we wouldn't have to rebuild for a few more decades either

chisoxmike
10-17-2004, 12:27 AM
:maggs <------ Him.

Nellie_Fox
10-17-2004, 01:01 AM
I feel Joe would probably be an even BETTER hitter in today's game. With expansion teams, diluted pitching staffs, smaller strike zones, livelier ball, and better playing conditions....Joe would probably be like Ichiro but with more power.Have you seen the gloves fielders used back then? They truly were just "gloves" instead of the Jai Alai cestas they use now. Nothing more than a little bit of padding and protection for the hand. A grounder that gets gobbled up today was six inches beyond the reach of a fielder then.

Don't forget that black players weren't allowed either, so he didn't play against the best possible competition.

Don't get me wrong. Shoeless Joe was a great, great player. It's just very difficult to tell how a player from that era would do in today's game. Too many things have changed.

idseer
10-17-2004, 07:57 AM
imo, the only way to make a comparison of players from different eras is by comparing them directly with their own contemporaries then looking at the percentages of differences between them.

joe jackson had a lifetime .356 average vs the .270 lifetime league average of everyone he ever played against.
ichiro so far has a lifetime average of .339 vs the .260 lifetime league average of everyone else.
a difference of only .007 between them. pretty damn close. joe did have much better power. his ops was almost .250 higher than the league average!
while ichiro's is only .085 higher.
and so far ichiro has averaged 40 sb's a year (4years) but then jackson was no slouch when it came to baserunning either averaging 25 a year in his 13 year career.


but i still go with fisk. he'd be more important in more ways to this particual team over a period of time.


EDIT: i should have prefaced this with the knowledge that ichiro came into the league already a pro whereas shoeless joe had to get his feet wet the traditional way ... and yet he hit .408 his first full season. ichiro with only 4 years to go by can't really stand up to joe as a hitter imo.

* also did you know that, like nellie fox, joe struck out very infrequently? averaged 19 times for a 162 game schedule for his career.

TornLabrum
10-17-2004, 09:09 AM
I'm going with pitching, and the best I ever saw in a Sox uniform was Billy Pierce.