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DoggPhood
10-05-2004, 10:47 PM
i'm rooting for the twins. yes, i hate them. but i don't like the yankees either. the twins are getting no respect. i know how it feels. and i like what ozzie said about rooting for the twins because then we'll have lost to the champs. it's good for the AL Central, guys.

1951Campbell
10-05-2004, 10:49 PM
Screw the Twins. Let the Yankees win this series...after that, I'm more than prepared to root against them.

And "good for the AL Central"? As far as I'm concerned, anything less than the Sox winning the WS is neither here nor there as far as the AL Central is concerned. So what if the Twins' winning gets us some media love? It doesn't translate into any games in the W column for us next year.

DoggPhood
10-05-2004, 10:51 PM
if it's yankees vs. red sox, i'm for the yankees. i hate the red sox. they're my least favorite team. a bunch of whiners like the cubs. at least the yankees get it done. the red sox just complain. again, i'm for the twins here.

samram
10-05-2004, 10:53 PM
Screw the Twins. Let the Yankees win this series...after that, I'm more than prepared to root against them.
Yeah, my hatred hierarchy has the Twins higher than the Yankees right now. Hopefully, the Angels can come back and let me root for a team I like instead of trying to choose between the lesser of 2 evils in the Red Sox and Yankees, assuming they even win.

voodoochile
10-05-2004, 10:57 PM
Screw the Twins. Let the Yankees win this series...after that, I'm more than prepared to root against them.

And "good for the AL Central"? As far as I'm concerned, anything less than the Sox winning the WS is neither here nor there as far as the AL Central is concerned. So what if the Twins' winning gets us some media love? It doesn't translate into any games in the W column for us next year.
Exactly. This isn't the Big 10. The Twinkies winning makes it harder for the Sox to win in years to come because it gives the Twinkies more revenue, higher attendance and in the end more money to play with.

:threadsucks

dcb33
10-05-2004, 11:07 PM
How can you possibly root for the Twins. I am so damned sick and tired of watching these clowns mop the floor with us. I hope they crash and burn.

Rooting for the Twins to win the World Series is like rooting for the Packers to win the Super Bowl.

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:09 PM
the "this thread sucks" icon is the most abused icon in wsi's repertoire.
just what is it that sucks about this thread? the fact you disagree? imo anyone rooting against the twins tonight is flat out jealous to the point of being blinded to their ability to do things right. they are EXACTLY how i'd like the sox to be.
and i cannot fathom any long time sox fans rooting for the yankees.

LuvSox
10-05-2004, 11:13 PM
the "this thread sucks" icon is the most abused icon in wsi's repertoire.
just what is it that sucks about this thread? the fact you disagree? imo anyone rooting against the twins tonight is flat out jealous to the point of being blinded to their ability to do things right. they are EXACTLY how i'd like the sox to be.
and i cannot fathom any long time sox fans rooting for the yankees.
Go Twins. Enough is enough with these stupid Yankees. Same goes for Boston too.

MRKARNO
10-05-2004, 11:18 PM
Exactly. This isn't the Big 10. The Twinkies winning makes it harder for the Sox to win in years to come because it gives the Twinkies more revenue, higher attendance and in the end more money to play with.


While I definately do agree with your general sentiment, we also have to remember that their owner is Carl Pohlad, who makes Reinsdorf look like Steinbrenner. Pohlad is the wealthiest owner in Major League baseball and he doesnt put crap into the Twins.

That being said, I dont want to see the Twins go anywhere. Let the Yankees beat them.

dcb33
10-05-2004, 11:29 PM
the "this thread sucks" icon is the most abused icon in wsi's repertoire.
just what is it that sucks about this thread? the fact you disagree? imo anyone rooting against the twins tonight is flat out jealous to the point of being blinded to their ability to do things right. they are EXACTLY how i'd like the sox to be.
and i cannot fathom any long time sox fans rooting for the yankees.If you love the Twins so much and how they do everything right, why are you wasting your time rooting for the Sox since we're obviously inferior?
I can't fathom how a Sox fan couldn't root for the Yankees, because say what you will, but they are an organization that is unquestionably dedicated to doing one thing, and that's winning, and they will do everything they can to accomplish that goal. I'd rather the Sox be more like the Yankees and demand nothing but excellence, and I'd like to see them spend the money necessary like the Yankees to bring a winner to Chicago.

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:30 PM
While I definately do agree with your general sentiment, we also have to remember that their owner is Carl Pohlad, who makes Reinsdorf look like Steinbrenner. Pohlad is the wealthiest owner in Major League baseball and he doesnt put crap into the Twins.

That being said, I dont want to see the Twins go anywhere. Let the Yankees beat them.he puts enough in to have an topnotch minor league system. he pays enough to hire men who KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING!

you talk about steinbrenner paying whatever it costs regardless of profit as if he's not making any money on the team. pohlad CAN'T generate the kind of profit george does so why SHOULD he pay outrageous sums for "star" players?
the yankees are a blight on major league baseball and are almost SOLELY responsible for todays idiotic financial situation and the reason that only about 1/7th of teams in existance ever have a real shot at a title.
you want to come down on the side of king george and his buying of teams that's your right of course. as for me ... i'll take a well oiled machine made
up of spare parts who play the game the way it was meant to be played.

and i sincerely hope the twins kick the yankees ass 3 straight!

Aidan
10-05-2004, 11:31 PM
Screw the Twins. Let the Yankees win this series...after that, I'm more than prepared to root against them.

And "good for the AL Central"? As far as I'm concerned, anything less than the Sox winning the WS is neither here nor there as far as the AL Central is concerned. So what if the Twins' winning gets us some media love? It doesn't translate into any games in the W column for us next year.This is the way I feel. I'm rooting for the Twins to lose but I will damn sure be rooting for the Yankees to lose the next series if they beat the Twins.

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:32 PM
If you love the Twins so much and how they do everything right, why are you wasting your time rooting for the Sox since we're obviously inferior?

because i was/am/always will be a sox fan. any more stupid questions?

DoggPhood
10-05-2004, 11:35 PM
either way, i want the red sox to lose. they're my least favorite team by FAR.

MRKARNO
10-05-2004, 11:37 PM
he puts enough in to have an topnotch minor league system. he pays enough to hire men who KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING!

you talk about steinbrenner paying whatever it costs regardless of profit as if he's not making any money on the team. pohlad CAN'T generate the kind of profit george does so why SHOULD he pay outrageous sums for "star" players?
the yankees are a blight on major league baseball are are almost SOLELY responsible for todays idiotic financial situation and the reason that only about 1/7th of teams in existance ever have a real shot at a title.
you want to come down on the side of king george and his buying of teams that's your right of course. as for me ... i'll take a well oiled machine made
up of spare parts who play the game the way it was meant to be played.

and i sincerely hope the twins kick the yankees ass 3 straight!

Because it takes a lot of money to put out a great minor league system? It really doesn't, it just takes some smart hires and by that I mean GM Terry Ryan who really doesnt get enough credit. Pohlad could make his team a lot more competitive in October (WS perrenial contenders) by spending a lot less than the Yankees could to get to the same level due to the strength of their farm system, but he'd rather sit on his hands. I think if the Yankees went out and got Pedro, they'd see a lot of fans on days that he started. Spending more eventually does mean more revenues if spent wiesely.

If the Twins go far it could do more short-term harm to the White Sox because it could solidify their hold on the AL Central division via more revenues, more experience, etc. Last year was ideal from the White Sox perspective where the Twins hardly gained any experience and got nowhere.

MRKARNO
10-05-2004, 11:39 PM
This is the way I feel. I'm rooting for the Twins to lose but I will damn sure be rooting for the Yankees to lose the next series if they beat the Twins.

I agree with this sentiment too. I'd much rather see the Red Sox in the World Series than any other team (I dont know if you agree with this) because option A is the Twins, Option B is the Yankees and Option C is the Angels who just won but 2 years ago.

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:44 PM
Because it takes a lot of money to put out a great minor league system? It really doesn't, it just takes some smart hires and by that I mean GM Terry Ryan who really doesnt get enough credit. Pohlad could make his team a lot more competitive in October (WS perrenial contenders) by spending a lot less than the Yankees could to get to the same level due to the strength of their farm system, but he'd rather sit on his hands. I think if the Yankees went out and got Pedro, they'd see a lot of fans on days that he started. Spending more eventually does mean more revenues if spent wiesely.

If the Twins go far it could do more short-term harm to the White Sox because it could solidify their hold on the AL Central division via more revenues, more experience, etc. Last year was ideal from the White Sox perspective where the Twins hardly gained any experience and got nowhere.
yeah .... it really made a difference, didn't it?

pohlad has put a team into the post season 4 straight times and you have the nerve to complain he's not doing enough? and it's because he's not buying up every allstar that comes available? i think you should get out of the sun and sit down.

dcb33
10-05-2004, 11:46 PM
he puts enough in to have an topnotch minor league system. he pays enough to hire men who KNOW WHAT THEY'RE DOING!

you talk about steinbrenner paying whatever it costs regardless of profit as if he's not making any money on the team. pohlad CAN'T generate the kind of profit george does so why SHOULD he pay outrageous sums for "star" players?
the yankees are a blight on major league baseball and are almost SOLELY responsible for todays idiotic financial situation and the reason that only about 1/7th of teams in existance ever have a real shot at a title.
you want to come down on the side of king george and his buying of teams that's your right of course. as for me ... i'll take a well oiled machine made
up of spare parts who play the game the way it was meant to be played.

and i sincerely hope the twins kick the yankees ass 3 straight!The Yankees are not a blight on baseball at all- if anything they raise the standard for the other teams. There too many teams in baseball, which has dilutes the talent and divides revenues among even more teams, which has created the financial situation we're now in where the most ridiculously high bidder in the biggest market wins the free agent game. Most of the teams who aren't competitive have ownership that quite frankly doesn't care, like Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Minnesota, Colorado, Kansas City the list goes on. None of these owners have no trouble accepting the luxury tax and revenue sharing dollars that are given to them by the Yankees.

PaleHoseGeorge
10-05-2004, 11:47 PM
I'm rather amused at this debate... Sox Fans getting angry at Sox Fans for not hating the Twins or the Yankees more.

Whoever wins it won't be the Sox. Our team sucks.

There. I feel better. Carry on.

:gulp:

dcb33
10-05-2004, 11:53 PM
yeah .... it really made a difference, didn't it?

pohlad has put a team into the post season 4 straight times and you have the nerve to complain he's not doing enough? and it's because he's not buying up every allstar that comes available? i think you should get out of the sun and sit down.

Whooptie freakin do! The Twins are 3 time champs of the Comedy Central! Impressive! And what have they done in the postseason? NOTHING! If they were in the East or West they'd be no better than a 3rd place team.

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:54 PM
The Yankees are not a blight on baseball at all- if anything they raise the standard for the other teams. There too many teams in baseball, which has dilutes the talent and divides revenues among even more teams, which has created the financial situation we're now in where the most ridiculously high bidder wins the free agent game. Most of the teams who aren't competitive have ownership that quite frankly doesn't care, like Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, Minnesota, Colorado, Kansas City the list goes on. None of these owners have no trouble accepting the luxury tax and revenue sharing dollars that are given to them by the Yankees.
says you.

i say the luxury tax is a sham.

diluted talent (btw, i don't believe the talent is any more diluted than it's ever been in baseball) has nothing to do with what the yankees have done to baseball. the yankees don't raise the standard of the game either. they pay 2 and 3 times more than just about everyone else because their market let's them, meaning they will win a disproportionate amount of championships as long as they keep doing things no one else can do. how is that raising the standards for anyone else?

1951Campbell
10-05-2004, 11:55 PM
Rooting for the Twins to win the World Series is like rooting for the Packers to win the Super Bowl.
Hey now...

:D:

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:56 PM
Whooptie freakin do! The Twins are 3 time champs of the Comedy Central! Impressive! And what have they done in the postseason? NOTHING! If they were in the East or West they'd be no better than a 3rd place team.
i agree. it IS impressive. have the sox been able to do that?

and you're wrong about them not doing anything in the postseason. they did more 2 years ago than the sox have done in ..... what? ......... FOREVER!

idseer
10-05-2004, 11:58 PM
I'm rather amused at this debate... Sox Fans getting angry at Sox Fans for not hating the Twins or the Yankees more.

Whoever wins it won't be the Sox. Our team sucks.

There. I feel better. Carry on.

:gulp:
not much else to talk about. because ... as you say ..... our team sucks. :cool:

PaleHoseGeorge
10-06-2004, 12:05 AM
not much else to talk about. because ... as you say ..... our team sucks.
Hey, I'm just glad we're not arguing whether we ought to be rooting against the Cubs or the Yankees.
:o:

Not that will ever happen of course.
:cool:

dcb33
10-06-2004, 12:14 AM
says you.

i say the luxury tax is a sham.

diluted talent (btw, i don't believe the talent is any more diluted than it's ever been in baseball) has nothing to do with what the yankees have done to baseball. the yankees don't raise the standard of the game either. they pay 2 and 3 times more than just about everyone else because their market let's them, meaning they will win a disproportionate amount of championships as long as they keep doing things no one else can do. how is that raising the standards for anyone else?
:whiner: :whiner: Poor everyone else, they can't find a way to compete with the Yankees it's so unfair!!!:whiner: :whiner: What the hell, you'd swear that people in New York can put their pants on both legs at a time instead of one leg at a time like everyone else. We live in CHICAGO for God's sake. If we were managed properly there would be no reason we couldn't cough up the kind of coin the Yankees do.

And on second though, I agree with you, the luxury tax is a scam. Were you aware that all the teams in the AL Central recieved well over 10 mil apiece from the luxury tax (the Sox paid about 4 million in tax)? The luxury tax allows teams in small markets to put crap on the field, complain about how they are in a small market and don't stand a chance of competing, and yet still turn a profit because they know King George will write them a check. If there were no luxury tax, many of these teams would either cease to exist or find ways to make themselves competitive. I wouldn't mind seeing 24 teams in baseball anyway becuase then at least you could even out the leagues and balance the schedule...
The Yankees do raise the bar for everyone else because they accept nothing less than a winner, and if they can win why can't we? If only the Sox ownership would accept nothing but the same from their team...

Nellie_Fox
10-06-2004, 11:20 AM
Hey, I'm just glad we're not arguing whether we ought to be rooting against the Cubs or the Yankees.That is the only time I would root for the Yankees.

They are the evil empire. The Yankees have ruined my season far more times than they Twins have or ever will. I hope the Twins sweep them.

Fenway
10-06-2004, 11:28 AM
I have mixed emotions.

As much as I want to see the Red Sox beat the Yankees on the field, they are the Yankees....

BUT I would rather play in the Bronx than that farce in Minneapolis.

I just have a gut feeling we will see Roger pitch at Fenway again in 2004. Talk about a nightmare

cubhater
10-06-2004, 11:59 AM
This is the way I feel. I'm rooting for the Twins to lose but I will damn sure be rooting for the Yankees to lose the next series if they beat the Twins.
Same here. Go Angels!

ma-gaga
10-06-2004, 12:18 PM
When I don't care, I pick the underdog.

I can't stand the Yankees. I can't imagine rooting for the Yankees EVER. I'd cheer for the Indians over the Yankees. I'd cheer for the Braves over the Yankees. I'd cheer for the Dodgers over the Yankees, and those are the biggest thorns. I can't stand any of them, but they are preferrable to NYY.

The result of this years playoffs don't matter for the W.Sox. Really, it doesn't. Even if the Twins win, all that means is that they'll be able to plow a nominal extra $5MM into payroll this offseason. That's it.

I can see maybe how if the Yankees lose, that could drive Steinbrenner into a frenzy pushing their payroll over $200MM, but somehow I don't know how that will affect the W.Sox one way or the other. I mean that will be a league affect. It won't specifically affect one team more that another.

whatever. 1-0 Twins.

Paulwny
10-06-2004, 12:20 PM
They are the evil empire. The Yankees have ruined my season far more times than they Twins have or ever will. I hope the Twins sweep them.
Yep, those of us 50 yrs + retain the deep seated hatred, go twins in 3.

TDog
10-06-2004, 12:30 PM
I'm rather amused at this debate... Sox Fans getting angry at Sox Fans for not hating the Twins or the Yankees more.

Whoever wins it won't be the Sox. Our team sucks.

There. I feel better. Carry on.

:gulp:
I agree for the most part. Really, I thought the Sox were well positioned to overtake the Twinks before Ordonez and Thomas went down. Months later, for me the only joy I found this October was seeing the Cubs eliminating. I can't root for the Twinks or the Yankees or anyone else. It won't be the White Sox. I sort of hope everyone loses.

idseer
10-06-2004, 12:33 PM
I can see maybe how if the Yankees lose, that could drive Steinbrenner into a frenzy pushing their payroll over $200MM, but somehow I don't know how that will affect the W.Sox one way or the other. I mean that will be a league affect. It won't specifically affect one team more that another.

whatever. 1-0 Twins.
who knows? maybe after losing to the marlins last year then falling in the first round this year he'll be too discouraged to keep up the fight. he's getting pretty old isn't he? how long can he keep throwing his money around and not win it all?

or am i being naive? :?:

Iwritecode
10-06-2004, 12:42 PM
I don't think it's so much rooting for the Yankees to win as it is rooting for the Twins to lose. The Yankees winning is just a by-product.

I guess I'm young enough to not really care one way or the other about the Yankees. They've won 2 million WS rings already, what's one more?

The Twins on the other hand have been a thorn in my side for the past 3 years straight.

Moses_Scurry
10-06-2004, 12:55 PM
I don't think it's so much rooting for the Yankees to win as it is rooting for the Twins to lose. The Yankees winning is just a by-product.

I guess I'm young enough to not really care one way or the other about the Yankees. They've won 2 million WS rings already, what's one more?

The Twins on the other hand have been a thorn in my side for the past 3 years straight.
Exactly! My baseball following began in 1982, and as far as I know, the Yanks haven't done nearly as much to cause me aggravation as the Twinks. And for me, its even worse because I have relatives in Minnesota that make life miserable when the Twins or Vikings do well. 1987 and 1991 were torture! 1991 was worse because the Sox were decent, kinda like 2003. There are 0 years in my lifetime that the only thing between the Whitesox and a title was the Yankees. To me another Yankee title doesn't change much. They've already got about a hundred of them.

As far as I'm concerned, anybody can win it but the Twins and Red Sox. The Twins for the reasons above, and the Red Sox because misery loves company, and as long as I'm suffering, I need others to suffer with me!

mdep524
10-06-2004, 02:04 PM
Gotta say here, I am rooting for the Twins. I do hate the Twins, but that is mainly because they beat the bloody pulp out of the Sox every year. If they weren't in our division, I would admire the Twins a lot, muchthe way I did the '03 Marlins. They're such a solid baseball team, brought up mostly through their farm system and augmented by subtle but intelligent trades by their bright GM, terry Ryan. They operate on a small budget but don't turn it into some kind of new religion like the FOBBs in Oakland.

Most importantly, they just play the game right and do what it takes to win. I'm not talking about the superficial, short-sighted argument of "just bunting and playing smallball" that Ozzie is trying to bring to the Sox next year; it's all about execution with the Twins- they know what has to be done to win in the context of individual games, they're an intelligent baseball team.I really admire them- it's too bad I hate them for being in the Sox division.

Anyway, all that is to say I am rooting for them to beat the Yankees and Red Sox, trying to buy their way to glory, and I really wouldn't be upset if they went all the way to become champs.

SSN721
10-06-2004, 02:11 PM
I will be rooting for the Twins, all the reasons stated by mdep are excellent. I cant really add too much more. I hate them with a passion for what they do for the Sox. BUt I guess I dont want the Sox to lose every year to the supposed joke team of all the teams entering the playoffs. They get no pub at all. We complain about how slighted we are locally and nationally, we would be in a complete uproar if the Sox were ignored as much as the Twins are nationally, it is kinda sad considering they are such a well run organization. I will only switch sides if they play the Angels, Stros or Cards. Just that I have stronger attachments to those teams. Otherwise I want the Twinkies to do well.

Iwritecode
10-06-2004, 03:31 PM
As far as I'm concerned, anybody can win it but the Twins and Red Sox. The Twins for the reasons above, and the Red Sox because misery loves company, and as long as I'm suffering, I need others to suffer with me!

I’m really torn on rooting for the Red Sox. On one hand, it would be nice to finally go a year without hearing about how cursed they are and how long they have been waiting for a WS and how much they relate to Cubs fans etc…

On the other hand, you’re right. Misery does love company. If they win it, people may suddenly realize that they were #3 on the waiting list behind both Chicago teams. Sox fans know how long they’ve been suffering without making national headlines about it every year. I’d like to keep it that way. At least until they win it all…

ma-gaga
10-06-2004, 03:50 PM
The Twins on the other hand have been a thorn in my side for the past 3 years straight.
I totally understand the "thorn in my side" angle. I continue to harbor a grudge against the Braves.
Yes. The 1991 Braves whom the Twins BEAT. I admit it, it's petty and a little sad.

But I can't stand them. I can't stand that stupid tomahawk chop. I can't stand that chant, it's like nails on a chalkboard to me. I especially can't stand it that they continue to win. I'm cheering for the Astros to knock them out. Knock them out hard.

But my hatred of all things Yankee overrules this. The Yankees have pretty much ruined free agency. They spend ungodly amounts of money and call it "fair" because there is no rule against it. I'm generally not in favor of a salary cap, but the 3 to 1 spending advantage is rediculous. You can use all the cliche's in the book by my favorite is:

"Rooting for the Yankees is like rooting for the house in blackjack."

ma-gaga
10-06-2004, 03:53 PM
"Rooting for the Yankees is like rooting for the house in blackjack."Some other good ones:

Brad Pitt to get the girl
Bill Gates to win the lotto

Iwritecode
10-06-2004, 03:56 PM
"Rooting for the Yankees is like rooting for the house in blackjack."

That's only for those who are still in the casino...

voodoochile
10-06-2004, 10:44 PM
the "this thread sucks" icon is the most abused icon in wsi's repertoire.
just what is it that sucks about this thread? the fact you disagree? imo anyone rooting against the twins tonight is flat out jealous to the point of being blinded to their ability to do things right. they are EXACTLY how i'd like the sox to be.
and i cannot fathom any long time sox fans rooting for the yankees.
What about this thread sucks? The whole freaking concept sucks. Root for the Twins? Puh-leeze. Of course that is jusy my humble opinion. I'm allowed to have one too...:o: