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PatK
09-29-2004, 05:21 PM
This is just a crazy theory I've come up with, but do you think that the Sox could get better attendence by lowering their ticket prices?

I'm not saying to give them away, but if they lower the prices, I feel they could draw more fans to the park. Even more so if they are significantly cheaper than at the Urinal.

My thinking is that the revenue generated by the increase in attendance will offset the loss of income from the reduction in price.

They don't have to reduce the prices in all seating areas, just in some. Say, the upper deck, or in the sections far down the lines on the main level.

So what do you guys think? Flame away

AddisonStSox
09-29-2004, 05:24 PM
http://images.suntimes.com/images3/photos/reinsdorf.jpg
"That would never work."

:KW
"Got that right."

mike squires
09-29-2004, 05:34 PM
Would they be able to draw more fans..yes

pay the ball players what the players think they are worth..uh...no

GiveMeSox
09-29-2004, 05:49 PM
This is just a crazy theory I've come up with, but do you think that the Sox could get better attendence by lowering their ticket prices?

I'm not saying to give them away, but if they lower the prices, I feel they could draw more fans to the park. Even more so if they are significantly cheaper than at the Urinal.

My thinking is that the revenue generated by the increase in attendance will offset the loss of income from the reduction in price.

They don't have to reduce the prices in all seating areas, just in some. Say, the upper deck, or in the sections far down the lines on the main level.

So what do you guys think? Flame away
The question is weather it can earn you $$ to lower ticket prices. Im sure the sox would do this if their research projected it. If we lower ticket prices yes maybe we can attract some more fans to buy tickets, but the extra revenue in parking and food would have to make up for it. A decrease in ticket prices might come with an increase in concessions, souvaneirs, and parking. Who knows, every company has economists who do this stuff. My guess is they shouldn't necissarily lower ticket prices, but target a specific group which by trends has been showen to be dependent upon buying tickets from price. That is some people go when the teams in contention, some people go for luxury service, and some people go for half price nights. If they made a certain section of seats super cheap, like florida's fish tank, or pepsi bleachers in detroit, or upper deck in minny. They should have like tickets in the last rows of the UD, or down the foul lines like $7 to $12 everyday. They should also discount the obstructed view tickets in the corner by the foul pole. THey are the same price as tickets behind 1st base and the sightline is inferior. They are still good seats they should just have a special lower price, everyday, like $5-$8 lower. This could attract the more price dependent fan base while limiting your losses, maybe even creating more profit with the increase in sales as well as food and parking. This type of thing is overdue. All we see is new luxury seats, reastuarants, scout seats, club level seats which are all way out of normal peoples price range.

jabrch
09-29-2004, 06:02 PM
half price nights have been a disaster. a few more fans, but less net revenue, more fights, a bad scene all around.

Nope - the reason only 1.9mm people came this year was not the price of the ticket. No reasonable drop in the ticket price would have generated incrementeally more revenue. Nor would cheapening the product be the answer.

The answer is to win. The answer is to make the park iteself a place people want to be. The answer is to market the team and the experience. Lowering the price is not the answer.

bartmanisgod
09-29-2004, 06:15 PM
half price nights have been a disaster. a few more fans, but less net revenue, more fights, a bad scene all around.

Nope - the reason only 1.9mm people came this year was not the price of the ticket. No reasonable drop in the ticket price would have generated incrementeally more revenue. Nor would cheapening the product be the answer.
I think lowering the ticket price would do wonders for attendance. The trick is to look at the right target market. Obviously alot of the old time sox fans on this board who can afford to buy season tickets will go to most of the games, but for the 17-22 year old student market who don't have enough money to buy season tickets, and who cannot afford to go to every game because of the ridiculous amounts of money it costs to see a game these days would eat up lower ticket prices. I attended about 13 games this year, and most of the time I was with a group of 5-10 guys. However, chances are we would have gone 25 times if tickets were always half price. That's an average of 115 more ticket sales just on my group of friends alone. A cheaper ticket also means more money for dogs, beers and churros!:gulp:

Daver
09-29-2004, 06:19 PM
Why would the Sox want to devalue their product when they already offer the best deal in town to see MLB?

Mickster
09-29-2004, 07:17 PM
I think lowering the ticket price would do wonders for attendance. The trick is to look at the right target market. Obviously alot of the old time sox fans on this board who can afford to buy season tickets will go to most of the games, but for the 17-22 year old student market who don't have enough money to buy season tickets, and who cannot afford to go to every game because of the ridiculous amounts of money it costs to see a game these days would eat up lower ticket prices. I attended about 13 games this year, and most of the time I was with a group of 5-10 guys. However, chances are we would have gone 25 times if tickets were always half price. That's an average of 115 more ticket sales just on my group of friends alone. A cheaper ticket also means more money for dogs, beers and churros!:gulp:
With 1/2 price Mondays and Tuesdays, not to mention the Granton Marketing discount coupon books made available earlier in the year, anyone can afford to see dozens of a sox games without spending much money.

Lip Man 1
09-29-2004, 07:24 PM
For once Jabrch and I agree on something. He is exactly correct. Plus it wouldn't hurt for the crack Sox sales staff to up the number of season ticket holders. That's revenue in the bank which can be used to improve the team on the field. For some reason the impression I get is that the Sox don't care if they have a lot of season ticket holders (including companies) or not. This makes no sense to me.


Lip

FightingBillini
09-29-2004, 07:48 PM
If nothing else, they should give a student discount for at least select games. It doesnt have to be half price. Even a $5 discount for college and high school students would mean I could go to 5 or so more games a year. I went to around 10 this year.

Here is the thing... fans will come if the team is good, but Uncle Jerry doesnt plan on making them good any time soon. Most fans think about the money involved before they go to a game. If nothing else, it determined the amount of games they can go to.
Also, it is my perception that most people just figure the price of tickets, and dont plan on parking and concessions. While having a reduced ticket night will get more fans, they will still pay $16 for parking and probably buy food and or drink. People like saving money. More people will go to games if they are cheaper, they will think they are saving money. That is a two way street. People will go to more games, becuase they think they are saving money. Also, when reinsdorfians (miserly bastards) go to value dates, they will think "I saved $10 on tickets tonight, I can get a beer and a brat". Its human nature to overlook things like that. Im not saying we should have more half price nights, but any discount given to all fans or a certain group would be more than profitable for the team.

jabrch
09-29-2004, 08:14 PM
For some reason the impression I get is that the Sox don't care if they have a lot of season ticket holders (including companies) or not. This makes no sense to me.


Lip
WHy do you think that? I see no reason that this would be logical for this managements typical way of being....

ewokpelts
09-29-2004, 08:27 PM
WHy do you think that? I see no reason that this would be logical for this managements typical way of being....:reinsy
Jabrch,
You forget. I'm in charge here.

duke of dorwood
09-29-2004, 09:35 PM
Free parking is the answer folks-been saying it for years. Maybe free parking when its not half price night.

You make $ by having fans in the park-high prices with empty seats = zero

Daver
09-29-2004, 09:37 PM
Free parking is the answer folks-been saying it for years. Maybe free parking when its not half price night.

You make $ by having fans in the park-high prices with empty seats = zero
There is plenty of free parking near Comiskey, much more so than at the Urinal.

HomeFish
09-29-2004, 09:50 PM
If you get rid of half-price nights, I would certainly hope that a student discount replaces it.

I can honestly tell you that I have seen far more Sox fans here at the University of Chicago than I have seen Cub fans. These are not South Side natives either; these are complete out-of-towners, some of them even "casual" baseball fans. Every time I ask them why they are a Sox fan, I get the same answer: "six dollar tickets".

I'm not discounting closeness as a factor, but I am saying that half-price nights seem to at least help produce Sox fans here, ones willing to wear Sox gear in these dark days of Cubbie glory and Sox mediocrity. That tells me something.

fuzzy_patters
09-29-2004, 10:48 PM
I think the Sox should lower ticket prices to drive up concession and parking sales, but they should target their audience, as well. They could bring back ladies night, for example. Also, they could add more discounts for parents who bring their kids. This way they can offer discounts for people other than the drunk losers that attack umpires. Come to think of it, perhaps they should just completely elliminate half-price nights and go to more discounts like I mentioned above.

Rex Hudler
09-29-2004, 11:43 PM
Why would the Sox want to devalue their product when they already offer the best deal in town to see MLB?
Agreed. The one thing that I believe they could do (and this could be utilized for positive PR value) is to hold ticket prices at their current level for the next 3-5 years. Guarantee season ticket holders that their seats will not increase for at least three years. Guarantee they won't sell seats in the same section as full season ticket holders for half price on half price nights.

Tell their season ticket holders they are thanking them for their support and are making a commitment back to them.

I have no problem with limited discount programs, especially if they are geared toward families. But widely discounting tickets is not good practice.

GiveMeSox
09-30-2004, 03:12 AM
If you get rid of half-price nights, I would certainly hope that a student discount replaces it.

I can honestly tell you that I have seen far more Sox fans here at the University of Chicago than I have seen Cub fans. These are not South Side natives either; these are complete out-of-towners, some of them even "casual" baseball fans. Every time I ask them why they are a Sox fan, I get the same answer: "six dollar tickets".

I'm not discounting closeness as a factor, but I am saying that half-price nights seem to at least help produce Sox fans here, ones willing to wear Sox gear in these dark days of Cubbie glory and Sox mediocrity. That tells me something.
I went to 15 games this year. Mainly becuase they were in contetion, but 12 of the 15 i went to were either half price nights, dollar dog day, or free tickets. I love going to games, mainly when sox are good, however i only paid full price for tickets once. I simply cannot afford, nor came my family or friends to go to any games we please. There is no way a group of 4 of guys is gonna say yeah ill pay $22 over $11 for the same seat. Half price nights are key to attendance. They create an extra reason to go to a game your normally wouldn't or give you the price break u need to attend in the 1st place. Who wants to pay $22 to see the sox play the indians or tigers as it is. Not me, not multiple times a year with a 2nd or 3rd place team. Plus you need to take into account the fact that attendance is higher on half price nights. Translating into a more electric atmoshpere and a louder stadium. Its the ultimate home field advantage to have a large loud crowd on your side. The more people in the stands the greater an effect it can have on the team and players. And that is something often overlooked.

soxtalker
09-30-2004, 08:11 AM
The Granton ticket package was aimed at pulling in the fans who were very price conscious (and I was one of those). It applied to almost all the games (except the Cubs and Red Sox, IIRC). Four $1 tickets and a bunch of 2-for-1 tickets for about $30.

We have constant cries for JR to spend more money. Yet, we also have complaints that the tickets cost too much. Granted, getting more bodies in the seats is necessary, but it was interesting that -- even with the Granton pakage and half-price days -- the attendance fell off as they dropped out of the race. And the weather was pretty good this summer. Winning makes the biggest difference.

gosox41
09-30-2004, 08:35 AM
The Granton ticket package was aimed at pulling in the fans who were very price conscious (and I was one of those). It applied to almost all the games (except the Cubs and Red Sox, IIRC). Four $1 tickets and a bunch of 2-for-1 tickets for about $30.

We have constant cries for JR to spend more money. Yet, we also have complaints that the tickets cost too much. Granted, getting more bodies in the seats is necessary, but it was interesting that -- even with the Granton pakage and half-price days -- the attendance fell off as they dropped out of the race. And the weather was pretty good this summer. Winning makes the biggest difference.
Exactly. If this team wins fans will show up, even on weekends for the premium tickets. It's hard to judge on individual financial situations, but overall the Sox provide the best bargain in town for the big 4 professional sports. Between half price night, Kids Day's, $1 hot dogs, and Granton's coupons I can't think of any other professional team that does as much in Chicago. And keep in mind the Sox ticket prices (for equivalent seats) are already cheaper then any of the other 4 big professional teams. My guess is if people can't afford one Sox game they're probably not buying tickets to a lot of Bulls, Cubs, Black Hawks, or Bears games.

Of coruse there is minor league baseball, which is a lot cheaper and fun to watch. But it's not the same because very rarely do you get to see the talent of a Frank Thomas and truly come to appreciate his greatness.


Bob

ewokpelts
09-30-2004, 11:45 AM
There is plenty of free parking near Comiskey, much more so than at the Urinal.But Dave,
you forget.....comiskey's in the "ghetto". No one wants to park where black people live.
Gene

ewokpelts
09-30-2004, 11:48 AM
Agreed. The one thing that I believe they could do (and this could be utilized for positive PR value) is to hold ticket prices at their current level for the next 3-5 years. Guarantee season ticket holders that their seats will not increase for at least three years. Guarantee they won't sell seats in the same section as full season ticket holders for half price on half price nights.

Tell their season ticket holders they are thanking them for their support and are making a commitment back to them.

I have no problem with limited discount programs, especially if they are geared toward families. But widely discounting tickets is not good practice.You dont know how much that would help. That's a major commitment to thier number one customers. If they gave me that commitment, I'd be likely to renew every year.
Gene

ewokpelts
09-30-2004, 11:49 AM
I think the Sox should lower ticket prices to drive up concession and parking sales, but they should target their audience, as well. They could bring back ladies night, for example. Also, they could add more discounts for parents who bring their kids. This way they can offer discounts for people other than the drunk losers that attack umpires. Come to think of it, perhaps they should just completely elliminate half-price nights and go to more discounts like I mentioned above.My girlfriend remembers ladies nights(which ended up being on thursday getaway games, but hey...). The astros sell kids tix for the ud for every game...for a buck....provided an adult ticket is bought with it.
Gene

ewokpelts
09-30-2004, 11:50 AM
If you get rid of half-price nights, I would certainly hope that a student discount replaces it.

I can honestly tell you that I have seen far more Sox fans here at the University of Chicago than I have seen Cub fans. These are not South Side natives either; these are complete out-of-towners, some of them even "casual" baseball fans. Every time I ask them why they are a Sox fan, I get the same answer: "six dollar tickets".

I'm not discounting closeness as a factor, but I am saying that half-price nights seem to at least help produce Sox fans here, ones willing to wear Sox gear in these dark days of Cubbie glory and Sox mediocrity. That tells me something.Student pricing is good. Even "uecker" seats might be agood idea.
Gene

SOXintheBURGH
09-30-2004, 12:51 PM
As a college student I am quite poor, but I still make it to PNC Park whenever I can to watch the Bucs... because it is SO FREAKIN' CHEAP! Nonetheless, they don't sell out every game because of their product on the field (even though they have ROTY Jason Bay and the next dominant pitcher in Oliver Perez). Cheap tickets would help draw, but fielding a watchable team will draw alot more, that easy.

HomeFish
09-30-2004, 01:19 PM
As I hinted earlier, the usefullness of half-price nights is not that they necessarily make more money, which they don't, but that the enlarge the fan base.

People will see cheap tickets and go. Even though they may not come back, they will still have the experience. They will tell others that the White Sox exist and what an awesome experience going to a game here is. In turn, those others may end up going to a few games, or may simply pass it in, as in "hey, this other guy says the Sox games are pretty fun", and somebody down the line may go. This is exactly what goes on here. First-years at orientation here are told about half price nights in the same sentence they are told about Millenium Park and the Lakeview bar scene.

Anything that enlarges the fanbase at this point is good. It may not be profitable now, but more fans = more money down the line.

Etownsox13
09-30-2004, 01:35 PM
If nothing else, they should give a student discount for at least select games. It doesnt have to be half price. Even a $5 discount for college and high school students would mean I could go to 5 or so more games a year. I went to around 10 this year.

I would love to see a student discount much the way that the Hawks have done the past few years. If you bring your student ID to the UC you get in for half-price. This is good for any game. I would definately go out to more game w my friends if we could get in 1/2 price.

PatK
09-30-2004, 02:15 PM
I think the Sox should lower ticket prices to drive up concession and parking sales, but they should target their audience, as well. They could bring back ladies night, for example. Also, they could add more discounts for parents who bring their kids. This way they can offer discounts for people other than the drunk losers that attack umpires. Come to think of it, perhaps they should just completely elliminate half-price nights and go to more discounts like I mentioned above.

I agree.

When I was single, I know I went to a LOT more games.

Now, it's costing me well over $100 just to get in the door.

kitekrazy
10-02-2004, 11:09 PM
All it takes is for the team to win. Look how the Cubs ripped off their fan base.
MLB is becoming over priced entertainment. I can go see the Indianapolis Colts for $15-not bad and level of talent is good as well.

Rex Hudler
10-03-2004, 12:01 AM
As I hinted earlier, the usefullness of half-price nights is not that they necessarily make more money, which they don't, but that the enlarge the fan base.

People will see cheap tickets and go. Even though they may not come back, they will still have the experience. They will tell others that the White Sox exist and what an awesome experience going to a game here is. In turn, those others may end up going to a few games, or may simply pass it in, as in "hey, this other guy says the Sox games are pretty fun", and somebody down the line may go. This is exactly what goes on here. First-years at orientation here are told about half price nights in the same sentence they are told about Millenium Park and the Lakeview bar scene.

Anything that enlarges the fanbase at this point is good. It may not be profitable now, but more fans = more money down the line.Unfortunately, it does not work that way. It has been proven the method you speak of actually works against a team in the long run. Think of it this way, if you sell your tickets at half price frequently, then you are conditioning your fans that is all they are worth. Once you condition fans that the value of your product is less then that is all they will pay. Eventually they will stay away unless they get cheap tickets and never (or rarely) pay full price.

Yes there are variances and winning is definitely one of them, but if you lower the perceived value of your ticket, then it will be next to impossible to draw well in a year where things don't go well on the field.

Lastly, people that spend less on their ticket to a sporting event, spend less in the stadium once they are there. Per capita food, beverage and souvenir sales go down on discounted nights.

I am not saying they should never discount their ticket price, but it needs to be done sparingly or with a specific marketing purpose in mind. Doing it just "to get more people in the park" doesn't work in the long run.

batmanZoSo
10-03-2004, 01:03 AM
I despise paying 16 dollars for parking, but lowering parking prices isn't going to get anyone to the park. You don't see parking on a ticket stub. And people can always take the train. The one thing they should do is create a few sections in the park with reduced prices.

I think it would be a great idea (especially with our drunken brawls) to have a family section in one of the bleacher sections. No beer, no smoking, no fights (boring, I know). Have various packages based on number of family members and give them a discount and a few cheap handouts to the kids, i.e. coloring books, baseball cards, a snow cone...whatever.

Rex Hudler
10-03-2004, 02:55 AM
I despise paying 16 dollars for parking, but lowering parking prices isn't going to get anyone to the park. You don't see parking on a ticket stub. And people can always take the train. The one thing they should do is create a few sections in the park with reduced prices.

I think it would be a great idea (especially with our drunken brawls) to have a family section in one of the bleacher sections. No beer, no smoking, no fights (boring, I know). Have various packages based on number of family members and give them a discount and a few cheap handouts to the kids, i.e. coloring books, baseball cards, a snow cone...whatever.
The problem that comes with doing things like having limited sections for less is that people who buy those tickets want to go sit in other empty seats. For example, make upper deck seats half price, then those fans get pissed at the Sox when they won't let them come down to the lower deck and sit in an empty seat down there. They get pissed when they are limited to the upper deck and in their mind the Sox are the bad guys. That is just one example of problems that stem from creating various policies.

PaleHoseGeorge
10-03-2004, 09:01 AM
The problem that comes with doing things like having limited sections for less is that people who buy those tickets want to go sit in other empty seats. For example, make upper deck seats half price, then those fans get pissed at the Sox when they won't let them come down to the lower deck and sit in an empty seat down there. They get pissed when they are limited to the upper deck and in their mind the Sox are the bad guys. That is just one example of problems that stem from creating various policies.Thanks for the intelligent posts on this subject. There are lots of serious problems caused by lowering prices and you've done a great job illustrating them with this and your previous post. Any smart marketer knows that lowering prices is your last option, not your first.
:thumbsup:

We've had countless threads about the destructive value of the half-price promotions, usually right after another of the giant fights that break out in the seats with the first warm weather. It's completely predictable, year after year. Of course Sox Fans *expect* these half-price nights because of years of conditioning the Sox marketing department itself is responsible for creating. So now they've painted themselves into a corner. Gee, what a surprise.

Given this fact, I can only make one suggestion. Fans buying tickets for undesirable seating areas (i.e. the U.D.) ought to get something for being forced to stay in the U.D. For example, anyone buying an U.D. seat also gets a coupon for 1/2 off on any available seat for another game.

The Sox could offer the same 1/2 off coupons to fans buying full-price tickets for other mid-week dates not already trashed by Sox marketing boob Rob Gallas's "Half-Price Nights" (i.e. Wednesdays and Thursdays).

My point is simple. The Sox should offer incentives to get fans to come back to the ballpark not just for a single game ("Half price Empty Pop Can Night"), but for coming back multiple times ("Half-off your Next Ticket Night"). Obviously the Sox also need to offer more enticements for full and partial season ticket plans, something Gallas and his minions were utterly incompetent to accomplish.

Rex Hudler
10-03-2004, 06:56 PM
Good thoughts.......

Obviously the only perfect marketing is having a winning team, a limited number of seats and little competition. See Boston.

In any other situation, there are so many variables that it is a lot of guesswork as to what will work best.

mweflen
10-04-2004, 06:22 PM
To me, it's simple market theory. If you've got 10,000 empty seats in the upper deck, there must be some sort of issue which keep people from populating them. Price is a big one, and performance is the other big one.

Yes, we'd all like to see the Sox win. Yes, it's obvious that this will result in more fans attending (see increased attendance in 2000 and the 2001 spillover effect). But the simple fact is, Jerry will not pony up the dough to put a sure-fire contender out there. He ponies up only enough to make an "IF" team. IF Konerko and Lee perform to par, IF, Conteras irons out his inconsistencies, IF Frank can have one last gasp, IF Ordonez is not done for his career with a bleeding knee bone... etc... (next year: IF Crede is not a wash-out... IF Willie learns how to hit and draw walks and steal bases... IF Borchard is not a $5 mil Bonus Baby Bust...)

Therefore, the only solution to putting more fannies in seats is to decrease prices. Anyone who has gone to a game on monday or tuesday sees that this is the obvious truth. When people get a better value for their dollar, they care less about the end result.

I have yet to see anyone put forward real numbers which dispute the common sense assertion that a full seat automatically reaps a larger dividend than an empty one.

Instead of half price nights, which certain lower deck snobs pooh-pooh, why not make huge portions of the upper deck somewhere between $5 and $10 every night of the week? This way, you get the increased attendance benefits of half price nights (and all the full price parking and concession sales), but none of the alleged weakening of overall revenue, which I still dispute, given that 12-15,000 of any crowd is made up of pre-paid season ticket holders (who do not pay half price for monday or tuesday games, by the way), while the rest of the seats would have otherwise gone empty.

ewokpelts
10-05-2004, 12:16 AM
To me, it's simple market theory. If you've got 10,000 empty seats in the upper deck, there must be some sort of issue which keep people from populating them. Price is a big one, and performance is the other big one.

Yes, we'd all like to see the Sox win. Yes, it's obvious that this will result in more fans attending (see increased attendance in 2000 and the 2001 spillover effect). But the simple fact is, Jerry will not pony up the dough to put a sure-fire contender out there. He ponies up only enough to make an "IF" team. IF Konerko and Lee perform to par, IF, Conteras irons out his inconsistencies, IF Frank can have one last gasp, IF Ordonez is not done for his career with a bleeding knee bone... etc... (next year: IF Crede is not a wash-out... IF Willie learns how to hit and draw walks and steal bases... IF Borchard is not a $5 mil Bonus Baby Bust...)

Therefore, the only solution to putting more fannies in seats is to decrease prices. Anyone who has gone to a game on monday or tuesday sees that this is the obvious truth. When people get a better value for their dollar, they care less about the end result.

I have yet to see anyone put forward real numbers which dispute the common sense assertion that a full seat automatically reaps a larger dividend than an empty one.

Instead of half price nights, which certain lower deck snobs pooh-pooh, why not make huge portions of the upper deck somewhere between $5 and $10 every night of the week? This way, you get the increased attendance benefits of half price nights (and all the full price parking and concession sales), but none of the alleged weakening of overall revenue, which I still dispute, given that 12-15,000 of any crowd is made up of pre-paid season ticket holders (who do not pay half price for monday or tuesday games, by the way), while the rest of the seats would have otherwise gone empty.too bad tickets are going UP big time. i agree that there should be a "cheep" ticket everyday.
Gene

Rex Hudler
10-05-2004, 02:45 AM
too bad tickets are going UP big time. i agree that there should be a "cheep" ticket everyday.
Gene
So much for the idea of holding ticket prices, showing a commitment to season ticket holders...............

Railsplitter
10-05-2004, 10:32 AM
For some reason, the Sox have higher ticket prices on weekends, leaving the "regular" prices for Wednesday and Thursday and advance Tuesday tickets.

mweflen
10-05-2004, 10:34 AM
If the Sox really want to play up families and kids (a la their new Fundamentals deck in LF), they will make every Sunday "Kids Day" and promote it to high heaven. It becomes sort of a de facto half price day for families when you can bring 1 or 2 kids in for 2 bucks.

If I were in charge, I would eliminate Half Price days, and instead make 60% of the Upper Deck $5 every game (basically, sections 520-506 and 544-558, currently "Upper Reserved") and the rest of it no more than $15. This would make the UD a destination instead of a purgatory. Revenue would not be affected in the negative, because the season ticket holder base, 95% of which (if not more) is located in the Lower Deck and is prepaid, would still account for the baseline 15,000 attendance. The rest of the 5,000 or so LD seats always fill up, anyway, because people insist on paying the ever-spiraling prices to sit there.

I would make EVERY Sunday kids day, and launch a big promotion around it and the Fundamentals deck.

Quick and easy recipe for 30,000 plus average attendance, increased fan goodwill, and brighter days ahead.

Rex Hudler
10-05-2004, 10:51 AM
If the Sox really want to play up families and kids (a la their new Fundamentals deck in LF), they will make every Sunday "Kids Day" and promote it to high heaven. It becomes sort of a de facto half price day for families when you can bring 1 or 2 kids in for 2 bucks.

If I were in charge, I would eliminate Half Price days, and instead make 60% of the Upper Deck $5 every game (basically, sections 520-506 and 544-558, currently "Upper Reserved") and the rest of it no more than $15. This would make the UD a destination instead of a purgatory. Revenue would not be affected in the negative, because the season ticket holder base, 95% of which (if not more) is located in the Lower Deck and is prepaid, would still account for the baseline 15,000 attendance. The rest of the 5,000 or so LD seats always fill up, anyway, because people insist on paying the ever-spiraling prices to sit there.

I would make EVERY Sunday kids day, and launch a big promotion around it and the Fundamentals deck.

Quick and easy recipe for 30,000 plus average attendance, increased fan goodwill, and brighter days ahead.
I'm not sure anything is quick and easy, but I get your point. I'll say this again......... If UD seats are going to be discounted in such a fashion, then the Sox will have to protect the lower deck seating area even more, making sure that people do not decide to "wander" down to sit in an empty seat come the 3rd or 4th inning. Will fans be okay with watching the game in the upper deck and not being allowed to go to the lower deck? I know that policy is in place now, but I do not know how well it is enforced. I also know from reading message boards, that some people this it is the crime of the century and very customer unfriendly when an usher will not allow them to go sit in a seat that is "empty anyway."

mweflen
10-05-2004, 11:01 AM
I'm not sure anything is quick and easy, but I get your point. I'll say this again......... If UD seats are going to be discounted in such a fashion, then the Sox will have to protect the lower deck seating area even more, making sure that people do not decide to "wander" down to sit in an empty seat come the 3rd or 4th inning. Will fans be okay with watching the game in the upper deck and not being allowed to go to the lower deck? I know that policy is in place now, but I do not know how well it is enforced. I also know from reading message boards, that some people this it is the crime of the century and very customer unfriendly when an usher will not allow them to go sit in a seat that is "empty anyway."
Actually, I can say from experience that it is very well enforced. I attended 30 games this year, 3 of them with UD tickets. I was not allowed to go down to the 100 level by normal means - the ushers were very firm about it. The only way I could is if I entered the stadium through the Stadium Club entrance using my membership card and just got off the elevator at the 100 level.

I think people will not be so moved to try and go down to the 100 level from 500 if the concessions and facilities on the 500 level were actually staffed and usable. Most games, you have to go to the 530s (behind home plate) to get any sort of concession - the peripheral stands are always closed. Granted, it's a supply and demand issue - but if you fill the seats, that should take care of itself.

To make the 500 level more appealing, how about a free fast pitch? (not the $1 variety downstairs) The murals and weather shield are a great start, too. How about a minor reduction in concession prices? I bet dollar dogs or some other sort of cheap concession for the 500 level plebians would be a great enticement (I know it would be for me!)

PaleHoseGeorge
10-05-2004, 11:46 AM
Actually, I can say from experience that it is very well enforced....
I think you're missing Rex's point. It's not that the UD restriction isn't well-enforced. The point is that Sox Fans BITCH when they aren't allowed to get into the ballpark for $5 and sit in any empty expensive blue seat that suits them.

You only need to search this message board to find a raft of posts all blaming the WHITE SOX for enforcing this policy. Once a fan has paid for admission, they feel they're entitled to everything that isn't nailed down inside the park.

What we need to do is clone you a couple dozen times and have mweflen enforce the UD restriction policy at all six LD gates for 81 dates at the Cell. You'll understand very quickly how wrong you are this subject.

mweflen
10-05-2004, 12:00 PM
I can't speak for the feelings of fans who might want to switch seats. Certainly there are many of them. All I know is, if I paid 5-10 bucks for an UD seat, got dollar dogs, and could try out a fast pitch every once in a while, I could care less about ever going to the Lower Deck again. (Who needs a $30-$40 seat with a beer vendor blocking your view every 30 seconds?) And I'd go to a game a week at least. Maybe I need to be cloned 10,000 times - attendance problem solved! :tongue:

ewokpelts
10-05-2004, 12:35 PM
I think the sox need to adopt the Astrosd kids' ticket policy. They have a dollar ticket for kids, every day. Mind you, it in thier upper deck, but a dad could buy a five dollar ticket for himself, and get another one for his kid for a buck. That's six bucks only. He can then AFFORD to let his kid enjoy the game, as opposed to griping about how expensive the tickets were, then parking, and then the 5 dollar hot dog, ect.
Gene

mweflen
10-05-2004, 12:39 PM
I think the sox need to adopt the Astrosd kids' ticket policy. They have a dollar ticket for kids, every day. Mind you, it in thier upper deck, but a dad could buy a five dollar ticket for himself, and get another one for his kid for a buck. That's six bucks only. He can then AFFORD to let his kid enjoy the game, as opposed to griping about how expensive the tickets were, then parking, and then the 5 dollar hot dog, ect.
GeneI couldn't agree more. Hates Ewoks, hates high prices. Peas in a pod...

The Royals have had $7 UD corner seats for years - and what do you know - every game I see against them on TV, the corners of their UD are full while other sections are ghost towns.

ewokpelts
10-05-2004, 12:56 PM
I couldn't agree more. Hates Ewoks, hates high prices. Peas in a pod...

The Royals have had $7 UD corner seats for years - and what do you know - every game I see against them on TV, the corners of their UD are full while other sections are ghost towns.The tigers have a 5 dollar ticket. As well as the brewers. And let's not forget the ueker seats.
Gene

mweflen
10-05-2004, 01:22 PM
The tigers have a 5 dollar ticket. As well as the brewers. And let's not forget the ueker seats.
Gene
Hmmm... let's look at "big market" teams which actually made the playoffs...

Angels: All OF seats: $10 and $9 adults, $7 and $5 for kids. (At least 3,000 seats)
Braves: Upper Pavilion seats $5, "Skyline" section $1 (some 5,000 plus seats, at least)
Astros: $5 adult and $1 kids UD corners, $10 UD (at least 5k seats)
Dodgers: All OF seats $6, Top Deck (Center UD) $6, $10 UD reserved (5k plus seats)
Twins: Upper GA (whatever that means, Corner UD) $6 (about 7,000 seats)
Yankees: Bleachers $8 advance, $10 day of game, (about 2,000 seats)
St. Louis: unfortunately, their site has taken down pricing info for playoffs - but I recall their plentiful UD seats being very cheap
Boston: easily the worst of the bunch, bleachers are $20, upper bleachers $12... oh wait! reminds me of the White Sox' $22 to $26 bleacher tix!

As we see, all but one of our 8 playoff teams have significant sections which are $10 or under EVERY GAME, not on crappy dates no one wants to attend.

What's the problem here?

Rush20
10-05-2004, 02:41 PM
I think they should reduce prices on the upper deck seats located from 1B/3B to the respective foul poles. Those tend to be the seats most often unused and it looks bad on TV seeing them empty. A used $5 seat generates more money than an unused $12 seat.

I think the lower deck and upper deck seats behind home plate are priced competitively.

mweflen
10-05-2004, 03:20 PM
I think the lower deck and upper deck seats behind home plate are priced competitively.
Agreed. But our bleacher seats are atrociously priced, as well as the multi-tiered pricing (including weekend and Cubs premiums) of the Upper Deck.

Sox fans are by and large working class. Why not throw these good hard working people a bone? Is Jerry trying to gentrify Sox Park? If so, he had better seriously consider moving it some place snobby yuppies will actually commute to...

ewokpelts
10-05-2004, 03:30 PM
Agreed. But our bleacher seats are atrociously priced, as well as the multi-tiered pricing (including weekend and Cubs premiums) of the Upper Deck.

Sox fans are by and large working class. Why not throw these good hard working people a bone? Is Jerry trying to gentrify Sox Park? If so, he had better seriously consider moving it some place snobby yuppies will actually commute to...:reinsy
I wanted to go to addison, but Thompson and Daley told me to stay in the "ghetto". Cmon, do you realize how far we're from the lake. Fish dont go to ballgames. Look at the attendace for those "World Champion" homes games.
Gene

mweflen
10-05-2004, 04:12 PM
I just perused the tentative 2005 home schedule. I will say this: IF the Sox continue half price mondays (and it is a big IF, considering they are raising prices elsewhere), the fact that there are 10 of them next year instead of the measly 4 this year is a big plus for the fans.

The dates:

4/4 CLE
4/18 MIN
5/16 TEX
5/30 ANA
6/13 ARI
6/20 KC
7/4 TB
7/18 DET
8/15 MIN
9/19 CLE

Part of the reason I'm such a price hawk is that I know if I did not get free season tickets from my dad's company, I personally would not be able to afford to go to the 30 that I attended this year. And since it looks like his company is going will indeed be dropping the tickets due to price increases and the slow economy, the above 10 dates will be the only ones I can realistically afford! (2-4 people per game X 10 games still equals a chunk of change!)

Thank goodness Comcast will be broadcasting in HD next season...