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View Full Version : Kenny Williams' Greatest Blunder


PaleHoseGeorge
10-04-2001, 07:34 PM
Explain your vote below.

LongDistanceFan
10-04-2001, 07:40 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
Explain your vote below. la made him look like a rookie with no clue what so ever.

Daver
10-04-2001, 07:45 PM
It's not that I miss Myette,but Royce poisoned this whole team for half a season,and brings nothing to the table that Valentin doesn't.

Vsahajpal
10-04-2001, 07:49 PM
If you'd allow me to chime in...

I think drafting Olivo in the Rule V and only giving up Chad Bradford was a good move. You'll be pleased with Olivo; major league ready defensively, and his bat is coming along (when he doesn't cork it).

LongDistanceFan
10-04-2001, 07:53 PM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal
If you'd allow me to chime in...

I think drafting Olivo in the Rule V and only giving up Chad Bradford was a good move. You'll be pleased with Olivo; major league ready defensively, and his bat is coming along (when he doesn't cork it). thanks, , i think that olivo is a josh paul version with better defense. btw what is your vote?

Vsahajpal
10-04-2001, 07:57 PM
Osuna. That was pretty comical. The best touch was sending Majewski to L.A. for Osuna, and then getting him back for Baldwin. I like Majewski.

GASHWOUND
10-04-2001, 09:17 PM
I chose that cause we could of used Bradford this season with all our bullpen problems and injuries. I'm not sure about Olivo, but tha again i never seen him play. The others aren't SO terrible. Myette for Clayton. We needed some defense this year and thats what he's gven us, defense. When some guys say that he doesn't give anythng Jose could've given is wrong. Royce isn't that bad. We had no room for Myette on this club. So whats the big deal. We got enough good young arms. He hasn't really done anything for Texas yet. Clayton has contributed to ours. Everybody keeps saying he's a bad cub house guy. How the hell do we know? We aren't in the Club House. He has Frank Thomas syndrome. The players don't seem to mind him.

The Osuna deal I thoght was a good deal. We needed a guy to replace Simas and Osuna was the best guy out there. He finished the season with the Dodgers with some good #'s. ERA in the 3's. Who knew? Maybe we would of lucked out this year and Osuna coud've stayed healthy. Nope..Not so lucky.

The other trades stunk.

idseer
10-04-2001, 10:42 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
Explain your vote below.

the barry berry fiasco. i mean this is almost the definition of 'blunder'! he screwed up. he had to admit it cause there was no way to hide it.

all the other choices, imo, the jury is still out.

doublem23
10-04-2001, 11:09 PM
The Barry/Berry thing was BAD, but Clayton/Myette was one of his first deals and it really has shown just how bad at this "baseball" stuff he really is. I mean, what on Earth would posess him to trade for a player who was a known clubhouse cancer and who played the same position as your heart and soul team leader? The very fact that Clayton takes time away from guys like Singleton and Perry (who at least know what a bat is used for) makes playing Clayton a total goofy move.

The word is that KW wanted to dump Royce before the season started, but it looks like everyone is a tad smarter than our man in the office.

duke of dorwood
10-04-2001, 11:21 PM
I was a big Jeff Abbott fan. He was a versitile chemistry guy that delivered in the clutch. I dont think Ramierez will ever hit.

PaleHoseGeorge
10-04-2001, 11:33 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
I was a big Jeff Abbott fan. He was a versitile chemistry guy that delivered in the clutch. I dont think Ramierez will ever hit.

I voted for Berry/Barry but this Abbott trade looks like a bust, too. I doubt Ramirez will ever hit, too.

This trade really cost us early in the season when Maggs, Frank, and Durham were all in slumps. We sure could have used some offense off the bench from Jeff Abbott. Instead we had Mr. 067 up there.

Second runner-up choice was Osuna. KW trades Majewski for this guy, turns around and gives Osuna a new 2-year deal (that sits real well with guys already on the team who can't get one), and then finds out the guy has a torn labrum. Four months later he trades with L.A. again to get Majewski back and screws up the Barry part of the trade.

Even KW graded himself an "F" for the year. At least he has a firm grasp of reality.


:dumbash
"I lost my job for half as much incompetence."

chisoxt
10-04-2001, 11:38 PM
There are two things that bothered my about the Osuna deal. One, an outsider was given a contract extension without proving himself while more deserving players on the team have to wait. Also, the guy was damaged goods

Jerry_Manuel
10-04-2001, 11:41 PM
Originally posted by chisoxt
There are two things that bothered my about the Osuna deal. One, an outsider was given a contract extension without proving himself while more deserving players on the team have to wait. Also, the guy was damaged goods

Not saying this was the right thing to do, but Osuna's contract was up after this season. I assume Williams logic was that he traded away one of our pitching prospects and didn't want a rent a player. Again not saying it was the right thing to do.

Jerry_Manuel
10-04-2001, 11:45 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
This trade really cost us early in the season when Maggs, Frank, and Durham were all in slumps. We sure could have used some offense off the bench from Jeff Abbott. Instead we had Mr. 067 up there.


I know I'm going to get told I'm wrong on this but I'll say it anyway. Yes Abbott would have been nice to have around when the above 3 were slumping. But had Harold Baines not made the team guess who does? Yep Jeff Liefer. So he could DH or play the outfield. Ok I'll sit back and wait for someone to tell me I'm wrong.

PaleHoseGeorge
10-04-2001, 11:46 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel

Not saying this was the right thing to do, but Osuna's contract was up after this season. I assume Williams logic was that he traded away one of our pitching prospects and didn't want a rent a player. Again not saying it was the right thing to do.

Well obviously not since the first year of the 2-year deal has Osuna on the DL and the second year of the deal he'll be rehabbing his surgically-repaired shoulder. He ought to be back to full health just in time to become a free agent again.

Acquiring Osuna wasn't a bad move. Not checking his shoulder, and then giving him a mult-year deal was. All KW succeeded in doing was pissing off the rest of the pitching staff.

LongDistanceFan
10-05-2001, 07:40 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


Well obviously not since the first year of the 2-year deal has Osuna on the DL and the second year of the deal he'll be rehabbing his surgically-repaired shoulder. He ought to be back to full health just in time to become a free agent again.

Acquiring Osuna wasn't a bad move. Not checking his shoulder, and then giving him a mult-year deal was. All KW succeeded in doing was pissing off the rest of the pitching staff. i was gone, so pls educate me on this...ok...... you mean that osuna was damaged goods when he came to the sox? no medical checkup or anything? he had his shoulder damage.

Chisox353014
10-05-2001, 12:58 PM
The Barry screw-up was definitely the most embarrasing moment, but I voted for Royce. The domino effect of him being the starting shortstop screwed up the entire team for 2 months. The Barry thing won't really hurt the team in the long-run even though he could have gotten much more for JB. Royce essentially killed our playoff hopes before they even got started this year.

Joel Perez
10-05-2001, 01:52 PM
When you don't know who you're getting, or trying to get, etc., than that looks 10x worse than any bad trade.

Jerry_Manuel
10-05-2001, 02:03 PM
Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
i was gone, so pls educate me on this...ok...... you mean that osuna was damaged goods when he came to the sox? no medical checkup or anything? he had his shoulder damage.

I don't recall the exact details of the situation but I believe he had tendenitis(I know I spelled it wrong) and the Sox thought it was gone. In the spring training game he looked great. In the home opener vs. Detroit he gave up a grand slam to Tony Clark and in our season opener he gave up a homer to Juan Gone. Again I'm not sure what he had while he was with LA, but when he came here he seemed to be fine. Perhaps someone else will recall the exact details.

Paulwny
10-05-2001, 03:12 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
I was a big Jeff Abbott fan. He was a versitile chemistry guy that delivered in the clutch. I dont think Ramierez will ever hit.

Same reason for my vote.

Dadawg_77
10-05-2001, 03:31 PM
Would you trade for a player that everybody knows is on the block and will come cheap? Now remeber you are not trading for this guy becuase he can help your team, you are trading for him in order to turn around trade for someone else. Unless you got a three way deal done for a another player who will help your team, you just don't do it. Why, becasue you will not get equal or better value then what you gave up to get the orgin player. If the another team wanted him so badly then they would of made their offer to the Rangers who would of taken the better deal. There is some arbitrage in sports trade, but you will always make a bad deal if it is the sole purpose to make the deal.
This deal made no sence baseball wise, clubhouse wise, buisness wise. It was just a plain dip s$#t thing to do.

Randar68
10-05-2001, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
thanks, , i think that olivo is a josh paul version with better defense. btw what is your vote?

Well, Olivo has a lot more power than Paul, and for a guy hitting only in the mid .200's, he keeps a VERY respectable OBP.

Again, I would not be surprised to see him beat Paul out for a spot out of ST.

CerberusWG
10-05-2001, 03:53 PM
KW isnt the greatest GM, but cut him some slack already. The Siro for Wells deal was a good deal. If anyone pictured him doing this, of course we wouldn't of traded for him. Myette for Clayton was a steal, and Clayton finally came around at the end of teh year, but when nothing mattered. Berry/Barry, who cares! Osuna, good deal. gave away some minor leaguers for a guy who had a good ERA. He got injured, go figure.

The one trade I don't understand is the Bradford for Olivio. Bradford makes right handers look confused. I remember last year, he threw a changeup to Alex Rodriguez I think, and A-Rod stood there, confused as hell.

Jerry_Manuel
10-05-2001, 04:44 PM
Originally posted by CerberusWG
The one trade I don't understand is the Bradford for Olivio. Bradford makes right handers look confused. I remember last year, he threw a changeup to Alex Rodriguez I think, and A-Rod stood there, confused as hell.

We have 0 catching prospects. Reinsdorf won't pay the ones we draft so we had to get one via trade.

longshot7
10-05-2001, 06:40 PM
how come nobody's mentioned that KW released Craig Wilson, who just tied the major-league record for pinch-hit homers?

When did he learn to hit?

LongDistanceFan
10-05-2001, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
how come nobody's mentioned that KW released Craig Wilson, who just tied the major-league record for pinch-hit homers?

When did he learn to hit? kw never learned to hit, that is why he hardly played in the bigs.

or are you referring to wilson, maybe he is taking some of those magic pills that shammie is taking.

Jerry_Manuel
10-05-2001, 06:44 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
how come nobody's mentioned that KW released Craig Wilson, who just tied the major-league record for pinch-hit homers?

When did he learn to hit?

Are you talking about the Craig Wilson who plays for the Pirates? If so that is not the guy who played for the Sox.

ode to veeck
10-06-2001, 01:30 AM
tough screw ups to pick from but the choice deal was the biggest in terms of impact to the '01 Sox- I won't dwell on why--now in terms of DUMBEST, it has to be berry/barry about the most pathetically stupid deal ever

Tragg
10-06-2001, 09:09 AM
I thought the Osuna trade was the worst.
First, it shows that KW really doesn't understand that career veteran middle relievers are middle relievers for a reason - they aren't that good. Second, extending his contract was obscene. Like in any business, you need to promote your young talent in order for it to nurture and grow - middle relief would have been a perfect stop for some of our young arms.
The clayton trade, the alomar signing, the embree signing - all made of the same cloth - try to cover a signficant weakness (up the middle defense, left handed pitching) with a mediocre player. Championships are not won that way.

And today, we still have a) a poor up the middle defense and b) a poor obp team and c)weak lefty relief.