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View Full Version : Whats wrong with Buehrle??


SoxPAguy
08-25-2004, 11:28 PM
He is something like 1-5 in his last 11 starts. He was 10-3 at one point and now he is 11-8. Thats a pretty large fall off of what he was earlier. He was showing us the true Mark Buehrle then after the break he just wasn't the same, except for the indians game. Is it just a product of run support and hes not getting it anymore? Becuase if you look at his ERA through the season you will see that it was going down when we has getting that run support and now its going up that hes not. So basically he is doing worse out there, not just the bats behind them. What gives. When our #1 and #2 guys cant give up less than 4 runs to the tigers and such it makes it hard to believe that the staff we have now can really achor this team.

DrCrawdad
08-25-2004, 11:33 PM
He is something like 1-5 in his last 11 starts. He was 10-3 at one point and now he is 11-8. Thats a pretty large fall off of what he was earlier. He was showing us the true Mark Buehrle then after the break he just wasn't the same, except for the indians game. Is it just a product of run support and hes not getting it anymore? Becuase if you look at his ERA through the season you will see that it was going down when we has getting that run support and now its going up that hes not. So basically he is doing worse out there, not just the bats behind them. What gives. When our #1 and #2 guys cant give up less than 4 runs to the tigers and such it makes it hard to believe that the staff we have now can really achor this team.

Mark's got the Sox disease called "Can't Hold A Leaditis."

JB98
08-25-2004, 11:34 PM
He is something like 1-5 in his last 11 starts. He was 10-3 at one point and now he is 11-8. Thats a pretty large fall off of what he was earlier. He was showing us the true Mark Buehrle then after the break he just wasn't the same, except for the indians game. Is it just a product of run support and hes not getting it anymore? Becuase if you look at his ERA through the season you will see that it was going down when we has getting that run support and now its going up that hes not. So basically he is doing worse out there, not just the bats behind them. What gives. When our #1 and #2 guys cant give up less than 4 runs to the tigers and such it makes it hard to believe that the staff we have now can really achor this team.

Buerhle only gave up three runs tonight, and two of those guys should have been thrown out on the bases. Frankly, Mark is one of the players I'm least worried about. I do think, though, that he might be trying to be too perfect. Right now, I think all of our pitchers feel they are one mistake away from losing the game because of the depleted offense. That's a tough way to pitch.

Nard
08-25-2004, 11:37 PM
There are about 39 players on the 40-man roster you should be worrying about more than Buerhle.

The pitches are shaky, having to be backed up by this anemic offense, not to mention a bum call by the ump and Josephine's faults, and Burley-mon still got a quality start.

batmanZoSo
08-25-2004, 11:46 PM
He is something like 1-5 in his last 11 starts. He was 10-3 at one point and now he is 11-8. Thats a pretty large fall off of what he was earlier. He was showing us the true Mark Buehrle then after the break he just wasn't the same, except for the indians game. Is it just a product of run support and hes not getting it anymore? Becuase if you look at his ERA through the season you will see that it was going down when we has getting that run support and now its going up that hes not. So basically he is doing worse out there, not just the bats behind them. What gives. When our #1 and #2 guys cant give up less than 4 runs to the tigers and such it makes it hard to believe that the staff we have now can really achor this team.
That run support thing is totally misleading. I can think of probably 5 starts where he won 15-0, 10-3 (twice I believe, one I attended), 11-0, etc. The thing about him is when he wins, it's often horribly one-sided where he has a great game and the offense goes to town on the other team. But like every year, he's lost or didn't figure in a few games where he totally deserved to win. One example is that horrible cub game where we couldn't get a run off Glendon Rusch. He gave up a solo shot and that was it...only a Lee homer in the 9th saved him from a big L. Another was in Detroit a week or two ago where he pitched 9 and gave up 2 and I believe got another no decision.

ma_deuce
08-26-2004, 01:31 AM
Mark's got the Sox disease called "Can't Hold A Leaditis."
Also known as Esteban Loaiza Syndrome or the Koch Effect.

owensmouth
08-26-2004, 02:11 AM
Also known as Esteban Loaiza Syndrome or the Koch Effect.As was pointed out quite clearly by the Detroit TV commentators, two of the first three runs that Mark gave up were the direct reseult of a very bad call by the home plate umpire, and an abismal "play" by third baseman Joe Crede on a triple.

The second run credited to the Tigers should have been an out, as Burke tagged the runner before the runner touched home. Then there was Crede watching Guillen slide into third while not making a legitimate attempt to tag out the runner.

steff
08-26-2004, 07:39 AM
Engaged-itis.

thepaulbowski
08-26-2004, 08:05 AM
As was pointed out quite clearly by the Detroit TV commentators, two of the first three runs that Mark gave up were the direct reseult of a very bad call by the home plate umpire, and an abismal "play" by third baseman Joe Crede on a triple.

The second run credited to the Tigers should have been an out, as Burke tagged the runner before the runner touched home. Then there was Crede watching Guillen slide into third while not making a legitimate attempt to tag out the runner.

Stop being reasonable. Remember, according to half of people here
:chickenlittle

kittle42
08-26-2004, 09:39 AM
As was pointed out quite clearly by the Detroit TV commentators, two of the first three runs that Mark gave up were the direct reseult of a very bad call by the home plate umpire, and an abismal "play" by third baseman Joe Crede on a triple.

The second run credited to the Tigers should have been an out, as Burke tagged the runner before the runner touched home. Then there was Crede watching Guillen slide into third while not making a legitimate attempt to tag out the runner.
Can someone remind me why we'd want Crede around next season?

Baby Fisk
08-26-2004, 09:44 AM
Can someone remind me why we'd want Crede around next season?How could you even suggest we part ways with that slow, swooping swing that recalls the great DiMaggio (without the contact)? :cool:

Dadawg_77
08-26-2004, 09:56 AM
Well at Buehrle run support was over 10 at certain points this season. If you look at his game log, since July 24, he has only receive more then two runs in support twice, winning one and losing to a red hot Red Sox team. For any pitcher it is very difficult to win a game when your team only scores two runs.

PatK
08-26-2004, 09:58 AM
Like someone said, when a team's offense is slumping, sometimes pitchers try to be too perfect. Which seems like the case here.

Also, maybe Mark's getting a little tired. He's been a freaking workhorse the last few years and throws a lot of innings. He's also thrown the second highest amount of pitches this year. I think they should give him and Freddy a break, except that they really have no one to fill in and the pen blows.

brlysgrl56
08-26-2004, 10:19 AM
Engaged-itis.
Hmmm....is he getting married?! How did I miss that memo?

I_Liked_Manuel
08-26-2004, 01:31 PM
if i knew how to put the 'this thread sucks' pic in i would. you have to watch the games and not look at the stats if you want to say there's something wrong with somebody. buehrle has been pitching well while going 1-5 with the exception of one outing. if we had an offense, any offense for that matter, buehrle would probably turn 1-5 into 5-1

nodiggity59
08-26-2004, 04:06 PM
This was from the Sox site:

"Since the 2001 season, the lefty (Beuhrle) ranks first in innings pitched (875), second in starts (128) and he is tied for fourth in wins (60) and shutouts (5). He is also tied for sixth in complete games with 12."

Sure he may be in a decline, but as long as he doesn't totally drop off he'll put up more than respectable numbers and earn his salary. Many teams would love to have a guy who's done what MB has done the last 4 years.

I do agree, however, that we need another arm at least of Freddy's caliber, if not better, in our rotation.

balke
08-26-2004, 04:12 PM
I do agree, however, that we need another arm at least of Freddy's caliber, if not better, in our rotation.
KW eluded to a #1 #2 guy in an ESPN white sox article I read. I hope he makes good on the promise. HE said something like "The fans know me better than that, I won't be going after a #4 or #5 guy, I'll be looking for someone to fill in the top of the order." I guess I shouldn't quote that since I don't know for sure... so yeah, that's what I hope for. Make us proud Kenny, and get us a bullpen while you're at it. Make it snappy.

Whitesox029
08-26-2004, 08:41 PM
I believe that Burls is just a microcosm of the team as a whole--when we win, he wins. When he wins, we win. I realize that that's somewhat illogical, but that's what I think.

kitekrazy
08-26-2004, 08:52 PM
This was from the Sox site:

Many teams would love to have a guy who's done what MB has done the last 4 years.

Yes, but he doesn't show up for big games either. Just another guy with pretty stats. He sits well in the Sox mix.

pczarapa
08-26-2004, 09:49 PM
He is something like 1-5 in his last 11 starts. He was 10-3 at one point and now he is 11-8. Thats a pretty large fall off of what he was earlier. He was showing us the true Mark Buehrle then after the break he just wasn't the same, except for the indians game. Is it just a product of run support and hes not getting it anymore? Becuase if you look at his ERA through the season you will see that it was going down when we has getting that run support and now its going up that hes not. So basically he is doing worse out there, not just the bats behind them. What gives. When our #1 and #2 guys cant give up less than 4 runs to the tigers and such it makes it hard to believe that the staff we have now can really achor this team.
I think deep seeded in his mind now is that he doesn't believe in their bats or their defense when he's out there. That last game against the Tigers was ridiculous.

JB98
08-26-2004, 10:06 PM
Yes, but he doesn't show up for big games either. Just another guy with pretty stats. He sits well in the Sox mix.

Worst. Post. Ever.

Mark is 14-5 in his career against the Twins, who have been our biggest rivals pretty much since he broke into the big leagues. He's been one of the few to save his best for Minnesota.

Not to mention, he was pretty good against the Cubs at Wrigley on Sunday Night Baseball this year.

JB98
08-26-2004, 10:07 PM
And another thing, Buerhle has collected wins at both Yankee Stadium and Fenway Park this year.

samram
08-27-2004, 08:08 AM
Well, obviously his run support has gone down, but if you look at the AL, only Mulder, Sabbathia, and Santana have been really good from the left side this year. Guys like Mark, Zito, Washburn, Moyer, Rogers, and Lilly have all had less than great years than normal. The difference between them and the first three is the first three all throw 90+, which allows them to pitch more effectively inside on righties. Cliff Lee started off very well this year, and he throws 90+, although he has really struggled lately. I think Mark will be OK because he's smart and will make adjustments, just as Zito has started to do. You can definitely see a gap though between the hard-throwing lefties and the more crafty ones.