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View Full Version : **The** Gameplan for the 2005 Sox Thread


AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 02:08 PM
-=Disclaimer=- This thread was created for those of us who have come to the realization that the Sox will not make the playoffs this year unless "Angles in the Outfield" occurs, and unless Danny Glover fills out today's lineup card, I don't see that happening either...so with that said, here is my idea, luckily it is quite similar to KW's. How about you guys?

Essential Sox: Thomas, Buehrle, Garcia, Contreras, Rowand, Marte, Shingo

"I've given up on them Sox": Crede, Valentin, Garland<how many more years are we gonna wait for this kid to obtain the greatness he has so often flirted with>, Borchard<anyone that has followed this guys young career, knows that he doesn't have that X factor necessary to make it in the bigs.

Indifferent Sox: Lee, Konerko, Jurassic

Young and/or Promising Sox: Harris, Uribe, Cotts<I haven't given up on him yet>, Gload <solid off the bench>, Davis <he may actually come close to fulfilling the lofty expectations he was awarded early in his career> Wunsch <why not> Sandy Alomar

Magglio Saga: You had your chance at the big contract, its unfortunate you went down with such a serious injury, thanks for your contrabutions in the past...we have heard our last OH-EE-OH. The Mags money is crucial to my plan.

I know the trendy thing on the board has been to rip on the current Sox <Valentin, Crede, etc.>, but I think we can create a solid core of 2005 players with some of our regulars from this year.

Without further adu, my plan...

Trade With Pittsburgh: Send off Crede, and either cash or other prospects for Kendall and Mackowiak. I know the Pirates are still very big on Mackowiak, as they should be, but I think if we give them Crede and ask to take on Kendall's huge salary, this may actually work. I like Ben Davis a lot, but I would like him even more backing up Jason Kendall. As for Mackowiak, he hits third in the Pirates dilapidated batting order, he grew up in northwest Indiana rooting for the Sox, and is available to play at 2B, 3B<where I would put him> RF, and LF.

Free Agency:

First and foremost SNATCH UP PAVANO. This kid is a complete stud. He is a youngester that is already a prooven gamer and has postseason experience. Maybe his former relationship with Ozzie will help bring him over.

Both Catalanotto and Eckstein perfectly represent the term "grinder" both of these guys would look great in Black and Silver. The Milkman is also available.

Bullpen help...I am completely disgusted with our bullpen. KW has his work cut out for him in this area. There is a huge list of bullpen free agents that KW should work over throughly. Thigpen?

And finally, I consider CLee, PK and Garland all to be great trade bait, as well as Borchard. I expect either CLee, or PK to be gone, although I would like to hold on to both.

Well, there it was. I know some of you guys are great with our ReisndorK financial situation...did I go over, or would this actually work? Lets hear some of your ideas.

C: Kendall/Davis
1B: PK/Gload/Thomas
2B:Harris/Alomar/Mackowiak/Uribe
SS:Eckstein/Uribe
3B:Mackowiak/Uribe
LF:CLee
CF:ARow
RF:Catalanotto/Jurassic/Mackowiak/Gload
DH:Thomas

SP:Buehrle
SP:Garcia
SP:Contreras
SP:Pavano
SP:Garland

Wouldnt that be nice?

habibharu
08-12-2004, 02:16 PM
-=Disclaimer=- This thread was created for those of us who have come to the realization that the Sox will not make the playoffs this year unless "Angles in the Outfield" occurs, and unless Danny Glover fills out today's lineup card, I don't see that happening either...so with that said, here is my idea, luckily it is quite similar to KW's. How about you guys?

Essential Sox: Thomas, Buehrle, Garcia, Contreras, Rowand, Marte, Shingo

"I've given up on them Sox": Crede, Valentin, Garland<how many more years are we gonna wait for this kid to obtain the greatness he has so often flirted with>, Borchard<anyone that has followed this guys young career, knows that he doesn't have that X factor necessary to make it in the bigs.

Indifferent Sox: Lee, Konerko, Jurassic

Young and/or Promising Sox: Harris, Uribe, Cotts<I haven't given up on him yet>, Gload <solid off the bench>, Davis <he may actually come close to fulfilling the lofty expectations he was awarded early in his career> Wunsch <why not> Sandy Alomar

Magglio Saga: You had your chance at the big contract, its unfortunate you went down with such a serious injury, thanks for your contrabutions in the past...we have heard our last OH-EE-OH. The Mags money is crucial to my plan.

I know the trendy thing on the board has been to rip on the current Sox <Valentin, Crede, etc.>, but I think we can create a solid core of 2005 players with some of our regulars from this year.

Without further adu, my plan...

Trade With Pittsburgh: Send off Crede, and either cash or other prospects for Kendall and Mackowiak. I know the Pirates are still very big on Mackowiak, as they should be, but I think if we give them Crede and ask to take on Kendall's huge salary, this may actually work. I like Ben Davis a lot, but I would like him even more backing up Jason Kendall. As for Mackowiak, he hits third in the Pirates dilapidated batting order, he grew up in northwest Indiana rooting for the Sox, and is available to play at 2B, 3B<where I would put him> RF, and LF.

Free Agency:

First and foremost SNATCH UP PAVANO. This kid is a complete stud. He is a youngester that is already a prooven gamer and has postseason experience. Maybe his former relationship with Ozzie will help bring him over.

Both Catalanotto and Eckstein perfectly represent the term "grinder" both of these guys would look great in Black and Silver. The Milkman is also available.

Bullpen help...I am completely disgusted with our bullpen. KW has his work cut out for him in this area. There is a huge list of bullpen free agents that KW should work over throughly. Thigpen?

And finally, I consider CLee, PK and Garland all to be great trade bait, as well as Borchard. I expect either CLee, or PK to be gone, although I would like to hold on to both.

Well, there it was. I know some of you guys are great with our ReisndorK financial situation...did I go over, or would this actually work? Lets hear some of your ideas.

C: Kendall/Davis
1B: PK/Gload/Thomas
2B:Harris/Alomar/Mackowiak/Uribe
SS:Eckstein/Uribe
3B:Mackowiak/Uribe
LF:CLee
CF:ARow
RF:Catalanotto/Jurassic/Mackowiak/Gload
DH:Thomas

SP:Buehrle
SP:Garcia
SP:Contreras
SP:Pavano
SP:Garland

Wouldnt that be nice? i would trade PK and keep caballo. trade PK for a stud SP. keep garland. get credes ass outta here for whatever. somebody on this board mentioned that one of the owners told him that they have 20 mil to spend. spend 12 on beltre. spend 4 on todd walker. sign catalanato for whatever it cost(3 mil?) if theres any left spend it on bullpen guys
2b walker
RF cat.
CF rowand
1b Big Frank
LF lee
3b beltre
DH everett
SS uribe
C. Davis

SP burly
SP Freddy
SP contreras
SP guy you trade PK for
SP garland

Flight #24
08-12-2004, 02:24 PM
2b walker
RF cat.
CF rowand
1b Big Frank
LF lee
3b beltre
DH everett
SS uribe
C. Davis


Ugh. That is quite possibly the worst defensive infield I've seen in a while, and the question with that lineup is what will you do in May when Frank goes out with more ankle problems. I can't believe you expect a 285+lb guy who hasn't played the field regularly in years and has had a couple of ankle issues to last as your everyday 1B.

habibharu
08-12-2004, 02:30 PM
Ugh. That is quite possibly the worst defensive infield I've seen in a while, and the question with that lineup is what will you do in May when Frank goes out with more ankle problems. I can't believe you expect a 285+lb guy who hasn't played the field regularly in years and has had a couple of ankle issues to last as your everyday 1B. yeah, well how good is our defensive infield right now? and who hell is gonna play first? gload?

Flight #24
08-12-2004, 02:31 PM
"I've given up on them Sox": Crede, Valentin, Garland<how many more years are we gonna wait for this kid to obtain the greatness he has so often flirted with>, Borchard<anyone that has followed this guys young career, knows that he doesn't have that X factor necessary to make it in the bigs.


Why are people down on Jon just because he's not an ace? He's our #4 pitcher for crissakes! And you know what - he's pitching like a good #4 pitcher! And he might still improve some.

Garland is currently 15h in the AL in WHIP / 35th in MLB. He's 15th in AL ERA & 34th in MLB. There aren't many teams with a better #4 starter. Yankee's isn't better. Boston's isn't. The only teams that I'd say are better off the top of my head are Oakland & the Cubs.

Stop waiting for Jon to be an ace and then blaming him when he's not. Be happy that we have an excellent #4 that might still improve.

OEO Magglio
08-12-2004, 02:33 PM
Why are people down on Jon just because he's not an ace? He's our #4 pitcher for crissakes! And you know what - he's pitching like a good #4 pitcher! And he might still improve some.

Garland is currently 15h in the AL in WHIP / 35th in MLB. He's 15th in AL ERA & 34th in MLB. There aren't many teams with a better #4 starter. Yankee's isn't better. Boston's isn't. The only teams that I'd say are better off the top of my head are Oakland & the Cubs.

Stop waiting for Jon to be an ace and then blaming him when he's not. Be happy that we have an excellent #4 that might still improve.Exactly. Garland can be real hard to watch sometimes because he can dominate on any given night, however he's a great number 4 starter and if the plan for 05 is to try to sign Pavano, well that would probably make Garland the best number 5 starter in all of baseball.

The Tom
08-12-2004, 02:36 PM
No, Crede will get one more shot to reach his potential. There is no point in arguing whether he should get another chance or not, because he's going to. So is Garland. Konerko should be traded for minor league arms/middle infielders. Trading Konerko would also allow us to free up more room for prospects by allowing Sweeney to move to 1B (even though he's a few years away) Valentin and Magglio should be gone. If were gonna spend the money, it should be spent on Beltran, and Carlos should be moved to right. If Brian Anderson is ready, i say put him into the lineup. Him and Beltran are both excellent defenders. We also need another starter, preferably Pavano. But i think we all no KW would rather spend the extra money on Pedro for media attention.
C- Davis
1B - Thomas/vet like Olerud, contact hitter
2B - Harris
3B - Crede
SS - Uribe
LF - Anderson
CF - Beltran
RF - Lee
DH - Thomas/Carl

Rotation
Buehrle
Garcia
Martinez
Contreras
Garland

We would still need bullpen help

Flight #24
08-12-2004, 02:36 PM
yeah, well how good is our defensive infield right now? and who hell is gonna play first? gload?
Defensively:
Crede>Beltre
Uribe=Valentin
Harris/Uribe>>Walker
Konerko>Thomas.

You upgrade one position in your lineup (SS), and that not by a ton since Jose's a pretty good defender. You downgrade the remaining 3 positions. And the question of who is gonna play 1B will come up in your lineup anyway as soon as Frank hits the DL, not to mention that you'll lose his bat. That'll happen in the first half, possibly as early as May. Then what are you gonna do?

AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 02:36 PM
Exactly. Garland can be real hard to watch sometimes because he can dominate on any given night, however he's a great number 4 starter and if the plan for 05 is to try to sign Pavano, well that would probably make Garland the best number 5 starter in all of baseball.
Yeah, I guess your right...I think Jon gets me so aggravated because this is another kid that had such high expecatations. I would have no problem with him as a fifth starter...as you said, hed be one of the best in baseball.

OEO Magglio
08-12-2004, 02:38 PM
No, Crede will get one more shot to reach his potential. There is no point in arguing whether he should get another chance or not, because he's going to. So is Garland. Konerko should be traded for minor league arms/middle infielders. Trading Konerko would also allow us to free up more room for prospects by allowing Sweeney to move to 1B (even though he's a few years away) Valentin and Magglio should be gone. If were gonna spend the money, it should be spent on Beltran, and Carlos should be moved to right. If Brian Anderson is ready, i say put him into the lineup. Him and Beltran are both excellent defenders. We also need another starter, preferably Pavano. But i think we all no KW would rather spend the extra money on Pedro for media attention.
C- Davis
1B - Thomas/vet like Olerud, contact hitter
2B - Harris
3B - Crede
SS - Uribe
LF - Anderson
CF - Beltran
RF - Lee
DH - Thomas/Carl

Rotation
Buehrle
Garcia
Martinez
Contreras
Garland

We would still need bullpen helpWhy would we trade Konerko for prospects in the offseason when we could trade him for a good or two good major leaguers? Also a possibility in the offseason might be to trade carlos to the dodgers and try to get Izturis and another arm for the bullpen.

AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 02:42 PM
No, Crede will get one more shot to reach his potential. There is no point in arguing whether he should get another chance or not, because he's going to. So is Garland. Konerko should be traded for minor league arms/middle infielders. Trading Konerko would also allow us to free up more room for prospects by allowing Sweeney to move to 1B (even though he's a few years away) Valentin and Magglio should be gone. If were gonna spend the money, it should be spent on Beltran, and Carlos should be moved to right. If Brian Anderson is ready, i say put him into the lineup. Him and Beltran are both excellent defenders. We also need another starter, preferably Pavano. But i think we all no KW would rather spend the extra money on Pedro for media attention.
C- Davis
1B - Thomas/vet like Olerud, contact hitter
2B - Harris
3B - Crede
SS - Uribe
LF - Anderson
CF - Beltran
RF - Lee
DH - Thomas/Carl

Rotation
Buehrle
Garcia
Martinez
Contreras
Garland

We would still need bullpen help
Anderson over Rowand? Martinez on the South Side? Um...errr....uh, ok.

soxtalker
08-12-2004, 03:13 PM
Ugh. That is quite possibly the worst defensive infield I've seen in a while, and the question with that lineup is what will you do in May when Frank goes out with more ankle problems. I can't believe you expect a 285+lb guy who hasn't played the field regularly in years and has had a couple of ankle issues to last as your everyday 1B.
I agree. There's no way Frank plays 1B, except in national league ball parks, and they were even a bit reluctant to do that this year. That bridge was crossed over 10 years ago. It used to be just his defense, but now they'd be risking injury to an $8M player who had the highest OBP in the AL before he went down.

ndgt10
08-12-2004, 03:15 PM
Looking over Pavano's career ERA's, besides this year, can somebody tell me why I should be excited about him?

OEO Magglio
08-12-2004, 03:19 PM
Looking over Pavano's career ERA's, besides this year, can somebody tell me why I should be excited about him?Because he's clearly turned the corner. If you watched him in the playoffs last year you'd understand why people love this guy so much, just watch him pitch and you'll understand, the guy is a stud.

batmanZoSo
08-12-2004, 03:34 PM
I'm totally for getting Pavano or Clement. One more pitcher of that caliber will give us one of the top 5 rotations in baseball. And what if Contreras reaches his full potential?

There's really no spot for Franky Cats as we have Uribe at short and Alomar at second (should be). I would like to acquire Kendall for a reasonable price. Let's not forget who this guy is...he's not that bloody great. He'll hit .310 with great defense and leadership, plus help "diversify" our offense. He's a consistent singles hitter, that's what we need. Eckstein is alright but we can do better...I think he's about a .250 hitter these days. Alomar is a nice fall back option but first and foremost they should go after a middle infielder catalyst type.

And finally we need two relievers. They're always out there..LaTroy Hawkins types, great setup men..Mike Remlinger (of a few years ago). Politte and Adkins suck. They're mop up guys.

Middle IF?
Kendall
Thomas
Lee
Everett
Konerko
Rowand
Uribe
Crede

Garcia
Buehrle
Pavano
Contreras
Garland

owensmouth
08-12-2004, 03:53 PM
Because he's clearly turned the corner. If you watched him in the playoffs last year you'd understand why people love this guy so much, just watch him pitch and you'll understand, the guy is a stud.
Yeah, and last year Loaiza turned the corner

OEO Magglio
08-12-2004, 03:56 PM
Yeah, and last year Loaiza turned the cornerDifferent story. Pavano pitched great in the 2nd half of last year as well not to mention that he was awesome in the playoffs. Pavano is the real deal.

skobabe8
08-12-2004, 04:35 PM
-=

"I've given up on them Sox": Crede, Valentin, Garland<how many more years are we gonna wait for this kid to obtain the greatness he has so often flirted with>, Borchard<anyone that has followed this guys young career, knows that he doesn't have that X factor necessary to make it in the bigs.


Without further adu, my plan...

Trade With Pittsburgh: Send off Crede, and either cash or other prospects for Kendall and Mackowiak. I know the Pirates are still very big on Mackowiak, as they should be, but I think if we give them Crede and ask to take on Kendall's huge salary, this may actually work. I like Ben Davis a lot, but I would like him even more backing up Jason Kendall. As for Mackowiak, he hits third in the Pirates dilapidated batting order, he grew up in northwest Indiana rooting for the Sox, and is available to play at 2B, 3B<where I would put him> RF, and LF.

Free Agency:

First and foremost SNATCH UP PAVANO. This kid is a complete stud. He is a youngester that is already a prooven gamer and has postseason experience. Maybe his former relationship with Ozzie will help bring him over.

Both Catalanotto and Eckstein perfectly represent the term "grinder" both of these guys would look great in Black and Silver. The Milkman is also available.

Bullpen help...I am completely disgusted with our bullpen. KW has his work cut out for him in this area. There is a huge list of bullpen free agents that KW should work over throughly. Thigpen?

And finally, I consider CLee, PK and Garland all to be great trade bait, as well as Borchard. I expect either CLee, or PK to be gone, although I would like to hold on to both.

Well, there it was. I know some of you guys are great with our ReisndorK financial situation...did I go over, or would this actually work? Lets hear some of your ideas.

C: Kendall/Davis
1B: PK/Gload/Thomas
2B:Harris/Alomar/Mackowiak/Uribe
SS:Eckstein/Uribe
3B:Mackowiak/Uribe
LF:CLee
CF:ARow
RF:Catalanotto/Jurassic/Mackowiak/Gload
DH:Thomas

SP:Buehrle
SP:Garcia
SP:Contreras
SP:Pavano
SP:Garland

Wouldnt that be nice?
People have to stop with this "Jon Garland sucks" nonsense. NEWSFLASH: HE'S NOT OUR #1 STARTER! HE'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE! STOP TREATING HIM LIKE HE IS! He's a reeeal good #4, even a marginal #3. Picking up a Pavano/Clement and pushing Jon back to #5 would be amazing. Besides, look at all of these guys who didn't mature as pitchers until they're 30 years old. Take the best pitchers in the game today....Schilling, Pedro, Johnson, Clemens. I'm guessing that none of these guys really had great numbers until they were late 20s/early 30s. I dont know for sure b/c I'm too lazy to look, but I'm willing to bet, with maybe the exception of Clemens, that none of them had lights out numbers at Garlands age. Probably close to the same. And even Clemens wasn't thought of high enough to have Boston not trade him. My point is, give this guy time. Let him mature and get savvy. Pitchers can pitch into their 40's today. He's not the "head case" everyone makes him out to be. It's the sheak thing to say right now, but what makes him a head case? Because Boers & Bernstein says so??

If I'm wrong, I'll be more than happy to eat crow. But the guys been pretty solid, and theres no indication he won't remain so and more than likely improve every year for the next few years.

As far as the Crede to Pitt trade, that sounds like the fastest way to get the Pirate GM fired. I would love it, obviously. The rest of the post sounds good to me.

habibharu
08-12-2004, 04:43 PM
People have to stop with this "Jon Garland sucks" nonsense. NEWSFLASH: HE'S NOT OUR #1 STARTER! HE'S NOT SUPPOSED TO BE! STOP TREATING HIM LIKE HE IS! He's a reeeal good #4, even a marginal #3. Picking up a Pavano/Clement and pushing Jon back to #5 would be amazing. Besides, look at all of these guys who didn't mature as pitchers until they're 30 years old. Take the best pitchers in the game today....Schilling, Pedro, Johnson, Clemens. I'm guessing that none of these guys really had great numbers until they were late 20s/early 30s. I dont know for sure b/c I'm too lazy to look, but I'm willing to bet, with maybe the exception of Clemens, that none of them had lights out numbers at Garlands age. Probably close to the same. And even Clemens wasn't thought of high enough to have Boston not trade him. My point is, give this guy time. Let him mature and get savvy. Pitchers can pitch into their 40's today. He's not the "head case" everyone makes him out to be. It's the sheak thing to say right now, but what makes him a head case? Because Boers & Bernstein says so??

If I'm wrong, I'll be more than happy to eat crow. But the guys been pretty solid, and theres no indication he won't remain so and more than likely improve every year for the next few years.

As far as the Crede to Pitt trade, that sounds like the fastest way to get the Pirate GM fired. I would love it, obviously. The rest of the post sounds good to me. everybody is tired of him because he supposedly has "ace" stuff and was a top 10 pick overall by the scrubs. also, he has shown flashes of dominance. if he was the same every single start, people wouldnt be as upset with him

AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 05:04 PM
everybody is tired of him because he supposedly has "ace" stuff and was a top 10 pick overall by the scrubs. also, he has shown flashes of dominance. if he was the same every single start, people wouldnt be as upset with him
Took the words right out of my mouth. Money.

skobabe8
08-12-2004, 05:09 PM
everybody is tired of him because he supposedly has "ace" stuff and was a top 10 pick overall by the scrubs. also, he has shown flashes of dominance. if he was the same every single start, people wouldnt be as upset with him
Like I said, the guy is only 24 years old and already has 4 years of major league experience under his belt. He may have ace stuff, all it takes is him harnessing that stuff and locating it. Getting big league batters out isn't an easy thing, believe it or not. He may not truly understand how to do it until he's 30. Until he does, I can handle him and his mid 4 ERA, and flashes of dominance. But he's ahead of Schilling and Johnson at the same stages in their careers. Maybe he's a late bloomer.

Anyone who is tired of a 24 year old kid with ace stuff who shows flashes of dominance for your 4th starter is a fool.

AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 05:17 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think the Sox have bigger problems to address than Garland. I really hope he can emerge as a solid, consistent starter, but he doesn't have what it takes between the ears at this stage in his career. His California Cool is driving me up the wall...show some emotion, stop blaming teammates, and I'll get off your case.

doublem23
08-12-2004, 05:21 PM
Ah yes, the Armchair GMs make their annual arrival. Like the Swans of Capistrano.

skobabe8
08-12-2004, 05:32 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think the Sox have bigger problems to address than Garland. I really hope he can emerge as a solid, consistent starter, but he doesn't have what it takes between the ears at this stage in his career. His California Cool is driving me up the wall...show some emotion, stop blaming teammates, and I'll get off your case.
Read my first post about the 'between the ears' thing. Why do people talk about this guy like he is John Rocker, for Christ sake? I think Carlos Zambrano is a head case. If he doesnt get a call he pouts for 2 innings, and he screams at everyone that takes him deep. He's got it between the ears??? LOL And the interview I heard from JG on tuesday night, he blamed no one but himself for digging his team a hole. I've never heard him call out teamates in the media.

AddisonStSox
08-12-2004, 06:32 PM
Ah yes, the Armchair GMs make their annual arrival. Like the Swans of Capistrano.
http://www.northernstars.ca/actorsabc/Media/carrey_dumber.jpg

its Salmons of Capistrano.

doublem23
08-12-2004, 06:40 PM
http://www.northernstars.ca/actorsabc/Media/carrey_dumber.jpg

its Salmons of Capistrano.
Was it salmons? I could have sworn he said swans. Man, I haven't seen that movie in forever.

jordan23ventura
08-13-2004, 03:33 PM
Was it salmons? I could have sworn he said swans. Man, I haven't seen that movie in forever.
Yeah, it's salmon.

"Petey's dead? How did he die?"

"His head fell off. He was getting old."

Joel Perez
08-13-2004, 03:40 PM
To all of the armchair GMs:


Adrian Gonzalez of Texas and Casey Kotchman of the Angels would look good in Sox uniforms.

Both are 1b top prospects for their respective teams, and from what I've been reading (Baseball America, Baseball Weekly), their paths are currently blocked. Both are stud hitters, and while Gonzalez is a bit better defensively, Kotchman is that much more powerful than Gonzalez.

If the Sox want to stay balanced in their lineup, and a little young at the same time, and want the flexibility in their payroll, they should find out what it would take to pry one of these two top prospects. Gonzalez could easily be a #3 hitter, as could Kotchman.

As much as it hurts me to say it, Paulie Walnuts gets hot during one part of the season, and that is in mid to late June to mid July, and that's it. For someone who is making millions of dollars, he has to produce better than that on a consistent basis.

jordan23ventura
08-13-2004, 05:07 PM
1B PK may be gone
2B Harris/Alomar (I think both stay)
3B Crede may be gone
SS Uribe (not going anywhere)
RF Everett (after this year's numbers, he's taking his option)
CF Rowand (not going anywhere, except maybe RF)
LF Lee (still hasn't had a "career" season. 2003 was him starting to come into his own and 2004 is about him showing consistency, despite a bad start on the year. This guy is going nowhere.)
DH Thomas (taking his option)
C Davis/Burke (no FA catchers make a huge impact besides Varitek, who will get big money somewhere)

That leaves possible holes at 1B and 3B. 3B is easy because if Robbie plays there, Uribe can play SS and Harris 2B. I'd hate to see him go, but Paulie may be the key here. If KW can subtract 8mil from the payroll, he can upgrade at other areas. First and foremost is the bullpen, then the No. 5 slot, then 3B, then 1B if Paulie is traded, then CF.

Bullpen: Troy Percival or Scott Williamson as a RH set-up man would be awesome, Bob Wickman would be nice also, as would Kent Mercker. I'd like Wilson Alvarez back and in our bullpen as a long reliever. Tons of bullpen help available.

No. 5 starter: This job belongs to Garland. I think KW gets us a legitimate #1 or #2 pitcher to push JG back. Aaron Sele, Derek Lowe, Pedro Martinez, Orlando Hernandez, Russ Ortiz, Matt Clement, Carl Pavano, Kevin Millwood, Eric Milton, Matt Morris, Brad Radke, Odalis Perez are available. Out of them all, I want Eric Milton. KW are you listening?

3B: Throw some money at Beltre! He solidifies a lineup 2-6 of Rowand/Thomas/Beltre/Lee. I know people will complain about wanting a LH bat, but check out the splits: vs. Left: .295 vs. Right: .334, .372 OBP, .609 SLG!!! He may be a better option than Beltran with Anderson probably in AAA next year. Finally, a guy that can hit behind Frank!

CF: The only guy available next year who are better options than than Rowand are Beltran and J.D. Drew. Drew has had injuries and Beltran wants a long-term big $$$ deal, which is why I say we should stay put. I think sometimes on this board we underrate Carlos Lee, and say "trade him" way too quickly. Lets not forget some of the plays he's made this year and add that to the fact that if there's been one player who has been the Sox MVP over the last two years, it has been CLee. If you trade him you are taking a huge risk. Rowand has done his job this year and has surpassed all expectations, while Everett is... serviceable for the time being. It would be nice to have another outfielder to push Everett out of RF, but then you have a $4mil 4th outfielder/bench player/DH, because Frank can not play 1B. All the people yelling for Catalanatto may not be too far off, as he would be a cheap option that could hit at either the top of bottom of the order and either push Lee to 1B if Paulie is traded or take over 1B himself.

1B: I think Paulie is gone, hopefully for some help in the bullpen. That said, I think our best option may be to put Lee at 1B and look for another outfielder like Catalanatto. Otherwise, Gload could always be given a chance, or maybe a platoon of a cheaper Valentin (who could also fill in in the infield) and Brad Fullmer (who is LH but somehow hits LH well and can't hit righties). Plus, if you platoon, then Frank can play 1B during interleague games without dismantling the lineup, and you either have Valentin or Fullmer available to pinch hit. Another idea would be Gload/Mintkiewicz, even though the guy is a prick.

habibharu
08-13-2004, 05:09 PM
To all of the armchair GMs:


Adrian Gonzalez of Texas and Casey Kotchman of the Angels would look good in Sox uniforms.

Both are 1b top prospects for their respective teams, and from what I've been reading (Baseball America, Baseball Weekly), their paths are currently blocked. Both are stud hitters, and while Gonzalez is a bit better defensively, Kotchman is that much more powerful than Gonzalez.

If the Sox want to stay balanced in their lineup, and a little young at the same time, and want the flexibility in their payroll, they should find out what it would take to pry one of these two top prospects. Gonzalez could easily be a #3 hitter, as could Kotchman.

As much as it hurts me to say it, Paulie Walnuts gets hot during one part of the season, and that is in mid to late June to mid July, and that's it. For someone who is making millions of dollars, he has to produce better than that on a consistent basis. no way the angels give up kothcman! he is a stud. and they dont have anybody to play first. erstad is old and often injured.

Gimm
08-13-2004, 05:54 PM
Reposted from another thread:


Who knows, maybe Randy Johnson changes his mind and approves an off-season trade.

I see Garcia and Buerhle as more #2 types (who are just entering their prime and might become #1 in a couple of years), and Contreras and Garland could be outstanding as #4 and #5 respectively.

Big Unit will be making 10 Mill in 2005, with 6 Mill deferred. If Sox are planning another WS push next year....then might as well take a one-year gamble on somebody as good and as marketable as Big Unit rather than giving unproven Pavano or Clement the big dough for 4 years. I think Unit has at least 1 really good year left in him.

Unit (10 + def)
Garcia (8.5)
Buerhle (5.5)
Contreras (6)
Garland (3?)

2B Harris/Hairston
CF Rowand
DH Frank (8)
LF Lee (8.5)
1B Konerko (8.5)
RF Everett (4)
SS Valentin (3?)
3B Uribe/Crede
C Burke/Davis

Shingo (2.5)
Marte (1.5)
Politte (1.5)
Cotts
Bajenaru
Munoz

Of course, if JR is not planning to expand the 2005 budget to 75-78 Mill levels, then disregard the above. Hopefully, with the revenue increases across the board this year, Comcast and rev. sharing next year, he does the smart thing and loosens the purse strings a bit. Is 20% too much to ask?

AddisonStSox
08-14-2004, 02:21 AM
i know its off the subject...but Gimm, you have only been a member since July yet you have 441 POSTS!!!! Just wondering, but how many posts do you average per day?

Gimm
08-14-2004, 02:41 AM
i know its off the subject...but Gimm, you have only been a member since July yet you have 441 POSTS!!!! Just wondering, but how many posts do you average per day?
32.38

Aidan
08-14-2004, 02:43 AM
32.38:supernana: :) :supernana:

Lip Man 1
08-14-2004, 01:38 PM
Instead of speculating here's straight from the horses (Ozzie's) mouth on 2005 to Joe Cowley of the Daily Southtown:


"The most important thing we have is the pitching staff. Out of 11 pitchers, we've already got nine. We just need to go out and find two guys (another starter and a setup man). A lot of teams have to find three or four guys to make their roster. We have a pretty good pitching staff and that's a good beginning. "From there," he continued, "we're going to try to build the best team we can build. Right now I don't know, because I don't know if Frank (Thomas is) coming back, I don't know if we're going to sign Magglio. I don't know what kind of team I will have. Besides that, I need some more speed and some more contact."

There you go pitching, speed and contact hitters. Works for me although it will be interesting to see if this can work in the A.L. which many times is a beer league softball game.

Lip

Gimm
08-14-2004, 03:22 PM
There you go pitching, speed and contact hitters. LipBoy are you in for a shock when not only are Konerko, Lee and Thomas are back in 2005, but also Valentin and Everett.

You'll see.

batmanZoSo
08-14-2004, 03:25 PM
To all of the armchair GMs:


Adrian Gonzalez of Texas and Casey Kotchman of the Angels would look good in Sox uniforms.

Both are 1b top prospects for their respective teams, and from what I've been reading (Baseball America, Baseball Weekly), their paths are currently blocked. Both are stud hitters, and while Gonzalez is a bit better defensively, Kotchman is that much more powerful than Gonzalez.

If the Sox want to stay balanced in their lineup, and a little young at the same time, and want the flexibility in their payroll, they should find out what it would take to pry one of these two top prospects. Gonzalez could easily be a #3 hitter, as could Kotchman.

As much as it hurts me to say it, Paulie Walnuts gets hot during one part of the season, and that is in mid to late June to mid July, and that's it. For someone who is making millions of dollars, he has to produce better than that on a consistent basis.
I don't want any player with any variation of "Koch" in a Sox uniform for the duration of time.

misty60481
08-14-2004, 03:51 PM
What is wrong with Konerko, lee, thomas, & Jose they had us in 1st place until the injuries we cant give up all our power and expect to score this ballpark is made for hitting we need the boomers

MRKARNO
08-14-2004, 03:55 PM
What is wrong with Konerko, lee, thomas, & Jose they had us in 1st place until the injuries we cant give up all our power and expect to score this ballpark is made for hitting we need the boomers
I agree that we need to keep Konerko, Lee and Thomas, but Valentin has been the epitome of our all or nothing offense in recent years. He has been a great clubhouse guy, providing us with some huge homers and also providing us with pretty good defense, but he's probably going to hit 30-35 Homers this year and want at least 5 million based on those home run numbers, but that's all of what he can do offensively. Not enough walks, way too many strikeouts and not enough singles and doubles. I really like Jose, but he has to go. Uribe will be a more than capable replacement. We have to keep some of our power for sure, but Jose is expendable.

AddisonStSox
08-14-2004, 04:38 PM
Ozzie's quote really didn't tell us anything we already were not aware of. Luckily, both Ozzie and KW realize that at least two new arms need to be added to the Sox pitching staff. I'm very happy to hear that we are going to build this team around pitching. However, we are still left with a lot of buts, in terms of offensive personal. Its going to be an interesting off-season to say the least....but hey in the meantime at least our boys have been keeping it interesting in 04'.

Lip Man 1
08-14-2004, 10:44 PM
Gimm:

Then Williams is a liar based on what he has been saying the past week to the media.

Valentin, Ordonez and either Lee or Konerko will not be back next year.

Lip

gosox41
08-15-2004, 09:06 AM
Gimm:

Then Williams is a liar based on what he has been saying the past week to the media.

Valentin, Ordonez and either Lee or Konerko will not be back next year.

Lip
DId he say this exactly? Hard to imagine him saying that Lee or Konerko won't be back knowing he's still got to trade one of them. I doubt it helps that the team wants to get rid of PK or LEe to the public in terms of negotiating a good deal to the Sox.

It's one thing to trade one of these guys. It's another to get fair value.


Bob

Lip Man 1
08-15-2004, 01:53 PM
Bob:


The second line in my post was my opinion, not a Williams comment. I was referring to Ken's comments about being 'sick of swinging for the fewnces all the time.'

Lip