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WhiteSoxFan84
08-06-2004, 02:55 AM
So we're 6 games back with just under 2 months remaining right? If we never played the Twins again this season, I would be worried. But we play them, guess how many more times? That's right, 6 more times. If we were to go just 4-2 in those 6 games, we would be 4 games back. If we were to win the 2 games we still need to play to catch up with the Twins (in terms of games played), we'd be 3 games back. If the Twins are to go 2-4 vs. the Yankees (who OWN the Twins), and we win all 6 of our games while New York plays Minnesota, we will be..... 1 game AHEAD o the Twins.

There are numerous other possibilities, but the 6 remaining games against the Mini-Men gives me much hope, especially if you take into account that we are 6-1 in the Metrodome, and hell, we need to at least win 2 of 3 at The Cell.

Anything's possible folks, including Maggz and/or Big Hurt making early returns.

DirtySouthsider
08-06-2004, 07:05 AM
So we're 6 games back with just under 2 months remaining right? If we never played the Twins again this season, I would be worried. But we play them, guess how many more times? That's right, 6 more times. If we were to go just 4-2 in those 6 games, we would be 4 games back. If we were to win the 2 games we still need to play to catch up with the Twins (in terms of games played), we'd be 3 games back. If the Twins are to go 2-4 vs. the Yankees (who OWN the Twins), and we win all 6 of our games while New York plays Minnesota, we will be..... 1 game AHEAD o the Twins.

There are numerous other possibilities, but the 6 remaining games against the Mini-Men gives me much hope, especially if you take into account that we are 6-1 in the Metrodome, and hell, we need to at least win 2 of 3 at The Cell.

Anything's possible folks, including Maggz and/or Big Hurt making early returns.

Your optimism is nice but.......have you seen this team play lately???? They're NOT GOOD!! So I don't think you're being realistic. We just got our BUTTS KICKED in two of three games against the Royals!!!!!!!!!!!

SOXSINCE'70
08-06-2004, 07:22 AM
Your optimism is nice but.......have you seen this team play lately???? They're NOT GOOD!! So I don't think you're being realistic. We just got our BUTTS KICKED in two of three games against the Royals!!!!!!!!!!!
So did the Twinkies after the all star break.But yeah,i'm just about ready to use my 5 remaining vacation days.I won't need them for playoff games this year.AGAIN!!!!!!:angry: :angry: :angry:

JRIG
08-06-2004, 07:24 AM
Even if Minnesota plays a game under .500 the rest of the way (27-28), the Sox need to go 34-23 just to catch them. We need a total Twins collapse to have a shot at this thing. And that's just not going to happen with Johan Sanatana going every 5th day.

Sad
08-06-2004, 07:37 AM
man I really hope I'm wrong...

but I think Cleveland's gonna kick our rear ends a good one :o:


lose 3 of 4 to the Ti-Girls?
and 2 out of 3 to KC?
:help:

JDP
08-06-2004, 09:44 AM
man I really hope I'm wrong...

but I think Cleveland's gonna kick our rear ends a good one :o:


lose 3 of 4 to the Ti-Girls?
and 2 out of 3 to KC?
:help:
Sox might just end up with a losing record this year.

Tekijawa
08-06-2004, 10:19 AM
man I really hope I'm wrong...

but I think Cleveland's gonna kick our rear ends a good one :o:


:help:
Agreed:whiner:

Lip Man 1
08-06-2004, 10:41 AM
In games played against the Twins AFTER the All Star break the past two years, the Sox are 2-8. They have lost eight straight under these narrow parameters.

Why is that significant? Because supposedly games mean more after the break especially when you are fighting a divisional rival for the lead.

Just something to think about when you say that the Sox could go 4-2 against Minnesota in the next two series.

Lip

Foulke29
08-06-2004, 11:07 AM
In games played against the Twins AFTER the All Star break the past two years, the Sox are 2-8. They have lost eight straight under these narrow parameters.

Why is that significant? Because supposedly games mean more after the break especially when you are fighting a divisional rival for the lead.

Just something to think about when you say that the Sox could go 4-2 against Minnesota in the next two series.

Lip
Regardless of our record in that first series - someone from the Sox needs to knock a Twinkie on his arse. We need to send a message of our own. I'd actually be proud of the Sox if they don't take the division but go down fighting.

mcfish
08-06-2004, 12:37 PM
So we're 6 games back with just under 2 months remaining right? If we never played the Twins again this season, I would be worried. But we play them, guess how many more times? That's right, 6 more times. If we were to go just 4-2 in those 6 games, we would be 4 games back. If we were to win the 2 games we still need to play to catch up with the Twins (in terms of games played), we'd be 3 games back. If the Twins are to go 2-4 vs. the Yankees (who OWN the Twins), and we win all 6 of our games while New York plays Minnesota, we will be..... 1 game AHEAD o the Twins.

There are numerous other possibilities, but the 6 remaining games against the Mini-Men gives me much hope, especially if you take into account that we are 6-1 in the Metrodome, and hell, we need to at least win 2 of 3 at The Cell.

Anything's possible folks, including Maggz and/or Big Hurt making early returns.First of all, we may be 6-1 at Minnesota, but they are 5-1 in Chicago. Second of all, this team can't beat the Royals, what makes you think they can beat anyone else? I am proud of those of you who still have hope, I just don't understand it. I will not sit around and wait for the Twins to give us the division. The Sox have to win it, and they so far appear to be failing in that regard.

JB98
08-06-2004, 12:54 PM
First of all, we may be 6-1 at Minnesota, but they are 5-1 in Chicago. Second of all, this team can't beat the Royals, what makes you think they can beat anyone else? I am proud of those of you who still have hope, I just don't understand it. I will not sit around and wait for the Twins to give us the division. The Sox have to win it, and they so far appear to be failing in that regard.
Running down once again the many reasons we have no prayer in hell:

1. Maggs and Frank are out indefinitely
2. Crede is hitting .230
3. Valentin is hitting .230 and making errors left and right
4. Our 2B situation is so bad that KW acquired washed-up Alomar
5. We have three back-up catchers
6. We don't have a RF who is anything resembling a threat at the plate
7. Garland sucks
8. Schoeneweis sucks and is now injured
9. We will have to call up the minor league pitcher of the week to replace Schoe
10. Shingo is the only reliable man in our bullpen
11. The Twins are a proven playoff team and continue to play well

The fact that we are six games out is not the problem. Six games out with 57 to play is hardly insurmountable, if you have a good team. The problem is, we do not have a good team.

the_valenstache
08-06-2004, 01:02 PM
I know it's easy to skim posts, especially froma relative newbie who has no interest in stirring up controversy on a thread-by-thread basis, but I'd like to see if anyone else shares my stance.


First of all, WhiteSoxFan84 deserves much respect for bringing up that word: the one Sox fans avoid at all costs, the one word that represents the antithesis of the Sox fan mentallity, the one word that - if you dare use it - you will instantly be ridiculed with the arguments of people who can obviously predict the future and know the futility of trying to find the positives when so many negatives are just dying to be brought to the forefront of attention. That word is hope.

Now, I understand the many viewpoints presented here; "we can't beat the Royals, how are we going to win at all?!?", "The Twins won't stop winning!", "This team plays way under their ability!" - yes, all of these are extremely valid concerns and their existence indicate a fanbase who want more, who truly believed at some point, who have paid their dues and spread their optimism blindly for long enough.

But, come on guys. This post was created for that 1% that stills sees a chance. But, instant criticism abounds when anything slightly optimistic pops up in a thread title. It's at the point where people on these boards are spending so much time bad-mouthing the inadequecies and failures of this season that I wonder why they're proclaiming to be a fan, at this point, at all. We're all disappointed. We all wanted to win this year. The fact of the matter is there are a precious few weeks of baseball left, and if you're like me, this is the time that you live for. I could sit around being mad about all the time I invested in this team, about all the hours/days/weeks I wasted this summer with the sole obsession of White Sox baseball. Or, I could enjoy the last part of this baseball season and see that yes, there is still a miniscule flake of hope.

I'm just sick of everyone trying to take a dump in my cereal.

LASOXFAN
08-06-2004, 01:13 PM
I know it's easy to skim posts, especially froma relative newbie who has no interest in stirring up controversy on a thread-by-thread basis, but I'd like to see if anyone else shares my stance.


First of all, WhiteSoxFan84 deserves much respect for bringing up that word: the one Sox fans avoid at all costs, the one word that represents the antithesis of the Sox fan mentallity, the one word that - if you dare use it - you will instantly be ridiculed with the arguments of people who can obviously predict the future and know the futility of trying to find the positives when so many negatives are just dying to be brought to the forefront of attention. That word is hope.

Now, I understand the many viewpoints presented here; "we can't beat the Royals, how are we going to win at all?!?", "The Twins won't stop winning!", "This team plays way under their ability!" - yes, all of these are extremely valid concerns and their existence indicate a fanbase who want more, who truly believed at some point, who have paid their dues and spread their optimism blindly for long enough.

But, come on guys. This post was created for that 1% that stills sees a chance. But, instant criticism abounds when anything slightly optimistic pops up in a thread title. It's at the point where people on these boards are spending so much time bad-mouthing the inadequecies and failures of this season that I wonder why they're proclaiming to be a fan, at this point, at all. We're all disappointed. We all wanted to win this year. The fact of the matter is there are a precious few weeks of baseball left, and if you're like me, this is the time that you live for. I could sit around being mad about all the time I invested in this team, about all the hours/days/weeks I wasted this summer with the sole obsession of White Sox baseball. Or, I could enjoy the last part of this baseball season and see that yes, there is still a miniscule flake of hope.

I'm just sick of everyone trying to take a dump in my cereal.
Nice job. Hope is a good thing. The cynics, like myself, are trying defeat hope because we know from a logical standpoint it's...well...hopeless. So instead of giving in to the notion that this team can rise from the ashes and make a stand - which we'd ALL love to see, mind you - we berate them for their failures. We're like the monks of old who wore those shirts with spikes and thorns on the inside, punishing ourselves for having any hope at all. A self inflicted punishment for investing faith in a team that is failing to satisfy a dream.

But I like what you said. What the hell, I'll play the optimist until we're mathematically eliminated.

the_valenstache
08-06-2004, 02:09 PM
What the hell, I'll play the optimist until we're mathematically eliminated.

Thanks. The best way to look at it, I feel, is to not dwell on the squandered opportunities, take each game as it is, and enjoy the fact that we aren't matehmatically eliminated. That, or pay attention to what the Bulls or Bears are doing.....**shudder**


Apparently, threads about "hope" aren't popular, seeing as how I had to save this from falling off of page 1. :D:

LASOXFAN
08-06-2004, 02:14 PM
BOLD PREDICTION:

Sox sweep the tribe, A's sweep the Twins. Come Tuesday, the Sox trail by two games, only one in the loss column. Robbie Alomar is to the Sox what lightening was to Frankenstein!:gulp:

gosox41
08-06-2004, 02:16 PM
BOLD PREDICTION:

Sox sweep the tribe, A's sweep the Twins. Come Tuesday, the Sox trail by two games, only one in the loss column. Robbie Alomar is to the Sox what lightening was to Frankenstein!:gulp:
I'll bet a lot of money that this scenario doesn't occur exactly as mentioned above. I'll also bet that this dream scenario ends tonight.


Bob

LauraJ14
08-06-2004, 02:22 PM
I like the sentiment that the Sox sill have hope because how many times have we seen other teams do what this thread is proposing? The Okland A's win lots of games in August and September, the Florida Marlins came from nowhere last year to win the World Series so why can't our team do that?

JRIG
08-06-2004, 02:27 PM
I like the sentiment that the Sox sill have hope because how many times have we seen other teams do what this thread is proposing? The Okland A's win lots of games in August and September, the Florida Marlins came from nowhere last year to win the World Series so why can't our team do that?
Um...because this team is not as talented as those teams were?

mcfish
08-06-2004, 02:27 PM
I like the sentiment that the Sox sill have hope because how many times have we seen other teams do what this thread is proposing? The Okland A's win lots of games in August and September, the Florida Marlins came from nowhere last year to win the World Series so why can't our team do that?Because our team doesn't have it's two best players.

the_valenstache
08-06-2004, 02:51 PM
Notice how two more positive posts pop up and then *ting* 4 posts to shut them down/squash foolish attempts at optimism/remind the ignorant, unrealistic Sox fans that dreaming is a waste of time. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, just that I think it's somewhat malicious and arrogant to deflate the opinions of those who don't want to gloom this season away. This is a thread for the more optimistic, can we try and leave it that way? I don't go into all the negative posts and refute others' opinions about the crappiness of the season (plus, there's only 24 hours in a day :smile: ).

LauraJ14
08-06-2004, 02:58 PM
Um...because this team is not as talented as those teams were?
But last year the Florida Marlins best player Mike Lowell got hurt and up comes Miguel Caberea to play beyond what anyone expects, Dontrelle Willis was a big surprise. So I don't think that you can say that the Sox are not as talented as those teams, sometimes the most talented team does not win the World Series and maybe this year it could be our team. The Oakland A's have great starting pitching but their bullpen is not good and at times their offense is as anemic as the Sox.

LauraJ14
08-06-2004, 03:00 PM
Notice how two more positive posts pop up and then *ting* 4 posts to shut them down/squash foolish attempts at optimism/remind the ignorant, unrealistic Sox fans that dreaming is a waste of time. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, just that I think it's somewhat malicious and arrogant to deflate the opinions of those who don't want to gloom this season away. This is a thread for the more optimistic, can we try and leave it that way? I don't go into all the negative posts and refute others' opinions about the crappiness of the season (plus, there's only 24 hours in a day :smile: ).

That's okay, I can dream all I want and then when the season is over I root for my other favorite teams in the playoffs (A's and Cardinals)

Soxzilla
08-06-2004, 03:03 PM
I still think we will win the division. And I honestly don't give a rats ass if anyone doesn't agree with me or doesn't like that I still have hope.

We are going all the way.

Edit - The twins gained 6.5 games on us in 21 games since the all star break. Whats to say we can't gain 6 on them in 57.

DirtySouthsider
08-06-2004, 03:04 PM
Notice how two more positive posts pop up and then *ting* 4 posts to shut them down/squash foolish attempts at optimism/remind the ignorant, unrealistic Sox fans that dreaming is a waste of time. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, just that I think it's somewhat malicious and arrogant to deflate the opinions of those who don't want to gloom this season away. This is a thread for the more optimistic, can we try and leave it that way? I don't go into all the negative posts and refute others' opinions about the crappiness of the season (plus, there's only 24 hours in a day :smile: ).
You know ....I was just outside picking flowers and dancing in the wind and I finally realized....Valentin...Crede..Borchard....Harris.. ..Garland......don't suck.

It's such a wonderful day! :smile:

mcfish
08-06-2004, 03:09 PM
Notice how two more positive posts pop up and then *ting* 4 posts to shut them down/squash foolish attempts at optimism/remind the ignorant, unrealistic Sox fans that dreaming is a waste of time. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, just that I think it's somewhat malicious and arrogant to deflate the opinions of those who don't want to gloom this season away. This is a thread for the more optimistic, can we try and leave it that way? I don't go into all the negative posts and refute others' opinions about the crappiness of the season (plus, there's only 24 hours in a day :smile: ). She asked why our team can't do what the A's or Marlins did, so I gave my opinion of what the answer is. The answer to her next question is we don't have anyone in the majors who can "play beyond what anyone expects", let alone a minor leaguer. Don't ask questions if you don't want answers. I'd probably post anyway, but at least then optimists would have a better reason to be upset.

the_valenstache
08-06-2004, 04:04 PM
You know ....I was just outside picking flowers and dancing in the wind and I finally realized....Valentin...Crede..Borchard....Harris.. ..Garland......don't suck.

It's such a wonderful day! :smile:
Cute.

Don't waste my time replying to what I have to say unless you have something intelligent to add. I'm simplying saying that it makes no sense whatsoever that posters jump all over anyone with the gall to be optomistic. We're a delusional, but happy bunch. But we're also White Sox fans. I'm not ignorant or naive. If money was involved, I wouldn't bet it on our team. But I'm simply supporting the fact that I live for the baseball season, and even the smallest chance is something to be hopeful of. What you do, besides mock me, is none of my business.

gosox41
08-06-2004, 04:09 PM
Notice how two more positive posts pop up and then *ting* 4 posts to shut them down/squash foolish attempts at optimism/remind the ignorant, unrealistic Sox fans that dreaming is a waste of time. I'm not saying I'm right or wrong, just that I think it's somewhat malicious and arrogant to deflate the opinions of those who don't want to gloom this season away. This is a thread for the more optimistic, can we try and leave it that way? I don't go into all the negative posts and refute others' opinions about the crappiness of the season (plus, there's only 24 hours in a day :smile: ).
She asked a question. It was answered. Nothing wrong with dreaming, but in reality KW should be looking to improve this team for next year.


Bob

gosox41
08-06-2004, 04:10 PM
That's okay, I can dream all I want and then when the season is over I root for my other favorite teams in the playoffs (A's and Cardinals)

If the Sox are out of it, my 2 favorite teams are the A's and whoever is playing the Cub.


Bob

LauraJ14
08-06-2004, 09:59 PM
If the Sox are out of it, my 2 favorite teams are the A's and whoever is playing the Cub.


Bob
I'm not wasting my time rooting against the Cubs, I will root for the Cardinals and it looks they picked up Larry Walker tonight!

gosox41
08-07-2004, 08:35 AM
I'm not wasting my time rooting against the Cubs, I will root for the Cardinals and it looks they picked up Larry Walker tonight!
I have this odd feeling that the Cards will be eliminated the first round of the playoffs.. Hopefuly I'm wrong. I like watchng their offense.



Bob

idseer
08-07-2004, 08:46 AM
Regardless of our record in that first series - someone from the Sox needs to knock a Twinkie on his arse. We need to send a message of our own. I'd actually be proud of the Sox if they don't take the division but go down fighting.
you won't be satisfied until baseball becomes hockey, right?
if you can't beat the other guys ... BEAT the other guys.
what a load of macho bull****.

idseer
08-07-2004, 08:52 AM
Cute.

Don't waste my time replying to what I have to say unless you have something intelligent to add. I'm simplying saying that it makes no sense whatsoever that posters jump all over anyone with the gall to be optomistic. We're a delusional, but happy bunch. But we're also White Sox fans. I'm not ignorant or naive. If money was involved, I wouldn't bet it on our team. But I'm simply supporting the fact that I live for the baseball season, and even the smallest chance is something to be hopeful of. What you do, besides mock me, is none of my business.
actually i say YOU are jumping all over the posters who see things as they are. what's the difference? 'dream' posts will always be tempered with reality posts .... get used to it.
and stop trying to act like you're some kind of super fan because you HOPE they win it all. i can guarantee you EVERYONE HERE 'hopes' they win it all.
you're no different than any other sox fan here

kitekrazy
08-07-2004, 11:31 AM
you won't be satisfied until baseball becomes hockey, right?
if you can't beat the other guys ... BEAT the other guys.
what a load of macho bull****.
Great response! They can't fight a losing streak.

kitekrazy
08-07-2004, 11:32 AM
actually i say YOU are jumping all over the posters who see things as they are. what's the difference? 'dream' posts will always be tempered with reality posts .... get used to it.
and stop trying to act like you're some kind of super fan because you HOPE they win it all. i can guarantee you EVERYONE HERE 'hopes' they win it all.
you're no different than any other sox fan here
Thank you!

the_valenstache
08-07-2004, 01:54 PM
actually i say YOU are jumping all over the posters who see things as they are. what's the difference? 'dream' posts will always be tempered with reality posts .... get used to it.
and stop trying to act like you're some kind of super fan because you HOPE they win it all. i can guarantee you EVERYONE HERE 'hopes' they win it all.
you're no different than any other sox fan here

Actually, I'm not jumping all over anyone. I never called anyone out by name until someone went and mocked what I had to say without providing any sort of actual, intellectual feedback. I've said many times that I don't consider my view to be right or wrong, and that all fans are allowed to see things the way they want to. I just thought it was nice that someone started a thread about us actually having a chance. I don't know if you've noticed, but 90% of the threads on Page 1 are about the disgusting inadequecies of the team this year. I know it, I've seen it, I've read about it enough already, I've swallowed it, digested it, had my fill and was just posting in this thread to say that it is refreshing to see other posters put a positive spin on such a disappointing season. I'm realistic. I know how this season will turn out. I just wanted to pretend and humor the optimist inside me by saying "yes, there is still hope."

And it seems that a lot of people took my comments as a direct attack on them. That's not how they were intended, but I don't think I need to apologize. My opinion is no more important than yours. But if you're going to call me out, try and actually read my posts and not everyone's responses to them.

idseer
08-07-2004, 02:28 PM
Actually, I'm not jumping all over anyone. I never called anyone out by name until someone went and mocked what I had to say without providing any sort of actual, intellectual feedback.
you want intellectual feedback? funny i always thought of an intellectual as someone educated beyond their intelligence.
anyway if you suggest my reply to your post is calling you out by name then i don't think you understand the posting process. by accusing those who point out the negatives of this team and saying they are 'jumping all over' those with the gall to be positive you open yourself to doing exactly the opposite ...jumping all over posters who have the gall to see things as they really are.

I've said many times that I don't consider my view to be right or wrong, and that all fans are allowed to see things the way they want to. I just thought it was nice that someone started a thread about us actually having a chance. I don't know if you've noticed, but 90% of the threads on Page 1 are about the disgusting inadequecies of the team this year. I know it, I've seen it, I've read about it enough already, I've swallowed it, digested it, had my fill and was just posting in this thread to say that it is refreshing to see other posters put a positive spin on such a disappointing season. I'm realistic. I know how this season will turn out. I just wanted to pretend and humor the optimist inside me by saying "yes, there is still hope."
ok, so it's nice. glad you liked it. but don't act as tho those 90% aren't pretty much correct in their thinking. that's the way it is with the sox.

And it seems that a lot of people took my comments as a direct attack on them. That's not how they were intended, but I don't think I need to apologize. My opinion is no more important than yours. But if you're going to call me out, try and actually read my posts and not everyone's responses to them.
see, i actually did read your post and i spoke directly to what YOU wrote.
all you did was try to crab on people for being real about the team. you have no more right to do that than someone crabbing on someone who still thinks the sox are going to win it. i think they're wrong, but i'm not out to stop them either.
no, you don't need to apologize. not if you don't want to.