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View Full Version : There is no such thing as "Ozzieball." It was and is nothing but a myth.


WSox8404
07-28-2004, 12:53 AM
What I mean by this is that we were told that things were going to be different this year. Are they? Hell no. Where is the bunting? Where are the hit and runs? Where are the grounders to the right side to get runners over to third from second? Nowhere to be found. Its homerun or nothing. This is how it has been for the last how many years, and this year it is the same. Sure we had some come from behind wins. But even then, how were most of those won? By homeruns. I mean come on. Three solo shots today? Pathetic. Yesterday? Two solo shots. This isn't working folks. And I don't care what people say about not having Maggs and Frank in the lineup. What is going to happen when they come back? More solo homeruns. They are both power hitters. With wee willie and Valentin providing as much offense at the top of the lineup as old ladies, we are going to set a record for solo shots. A home run hitting lineup is fine as long as you have at least two or three guys who can actually get on base more than once every couple of days. Uribe? Another joke. The beginning of the year was a fluke, just like Esteban's performance last year. Someting has to be done, and quick. I thought Ozzie was the answer, but either he isn't telling them to play small ball, or they are just not listening.

Pretty sad that Ben Davis had one of only four hits today.

ChiWhiteSox1337
07-28-2004, 12:57 AM
"Ozzieball" pretty much went away IMO when Willie and Uribe got back down to earth. They were great tablesetters at the top of the line up and boosted our offense a ton. Now we don't have anyone that can get on base because thomas is gone. I know Carlos and Konerko are good, but they don't make an impact when they can only hit solo HRs due to a lack of runners on base.

WSox8404
07-28-2004, 12:59 AM
"Ozzieball" pretty much went away IMO when Willie and Uribe got back down to earth. They were great tablesetters at the top of the line up and boosted our offense a ton. Now we don't have anyone that can get on base because thomas is gone. I know Carlos and Konerko are good, but they don't make an impact when they can only hit solo HRs due to a lack of runners on base.
Another thing that pisses me off is that Hawk not letting up on this Ozzieball thing. Jesus Christ Hawk, when we win a game by a homerun, thats not Ozzieball. That is White Sox of the last 5 years ball. Give me a break.

BainesHOF
07-28-2004, 01:00 AM
It was pretty sad that Ozzie let Davis hit in the eighth.

Ozzie is turning out to be a bad manager. Maybe he should stop looking into the crowd so much like he did as a player and concentrate on the game a little more.

Lip Man 1
07-28-2004, 01:01 AM
WSox:

I think Ozzie has tried but honestly what do you want him to do? Have you seen the Sox try to bunt? How about advancing runners?....executing the hit and run?....stealing bases?

You can't condemn Ozzie for not being able to do what he wants to do. Remember his quote from Sox fest?

"You can't win the Kentucky Derby by running donkeys...you've got to have the thoroughbreds."

You can't suddenly turn Carlos Lee into a guy who knows what he's doing on the bases, you can't suddenly give Paul Konerko speed, you can't suddenly get Joe Crede to go the other way on a pitch.

It's not magic...it just doesn't 'happen.' Ozzie and the coaches have done what they could but eventually the 'player' has to be able to put it into practice.

I think Ozzie realizes this team as presently composed CAN NOT realistically do what he wants to do. Give the organization time and after Lee is gone, and Maggs and Frank and Paulie see what happens.

If they are still executing like garbage THEN you can blame Ozzie.

Lip

WSox8404
07-28-2004, 01:06 AM
WSox:

I think Ozzie has tried but honestly what do you want him to do? Have you seen the Sox try to bunt? How about advancing runners?....executing the hit and run?....stealing bases?

You can't condemn Ozzie for not being able to do what he wants to do. Remember his quote from Sox fest?

"You can't win the Kentucky Derby by running donkeys...you've got to have the thoroughbreds."

You can't suddenly turn Carlos Lee into a guy who knows what he's doing on the bases, you can't suddenly give Paul Konerko speed, you can't suddenly get Joe Crede to go the other way on a pitch.

It's not magic...it just doesn't 'happen.' Ozzie and the coaches have done what they could but eventually the 'player' has to be able to put it into practice.

I think Ozzie realizes this team as presently composed CAN NOT realistically do what he wants to do. Give the organization time and after Lee is gone, and Maggs and Frank and Paulie see what happens.

If they are still executing like garbage THEN you can blame Ozzie.

Lip
So why couldn't we work on bunting and hitting the ball the opposite way in spring training? Don't tell me that one cannot learn to bunt over a two month span. That is BS. If you work at bunting the ball for a month and hitting it the other way for a month, you should be decent at it by the time the season rolls around.
But lets see it your way. Let's say it isn't Ozzie's fault. Who's fault is it? It is KW's and the previous GM's. How are we going to win when we have the slowest, stupidest team in the bigs? I would love to see a race between Crede, Konerko, Borchard, Frank, and Alomar. If we knew we had this kind of a team, then why did we hire Ozzie? Ozzie would be a great manager of a team like Florida. Not the Sox.

Lip Man 1
07-28-2004, 01:13 AM
WSox:

According to someone in a thread on this site (Perhaps it was Steff...) Ozzie reportedly told confidants in spring training that he couldn't believe how bad the team was at executing fundamentals.

Manager Gandhi (Jerry Manuel) supposedly tried for five years to teach fundamentals to the core group.

As I said sooner or later, regardless of how much time is spent showing these things to guys like Harris, Uribe, Lee etc. (and I'm not intentionally singling them out...) it's up to the players to EXECUTE in a game situation.

If Ozzie has gotten away from this it's because (in my opinion) he doesn't have the confidence that they can do the damn job when they have to.

Eventually if Ozzie is still here I think that three years from now the Sox are going to try to be a 21st Century version of the 'Go Go' Sox. Speed up and down the lineup, solid batting averages in the .280's and .290's, guys who'll slap the ball into the gap and then run like hell for doubles and triples plus an outstanding pitching staff. (Williams has already said he is focusing on pitching...)

Whether that happens or not, I have no idea, I also have no idea if it will work.

Bottom line is that this is not the type of team Ozzie wants and he's doing what he can to survive.

Lip

manuelsucks
07-28-2004, 01:13 AM
The way I see it the Sox are in a slump. Yes they haven't been hitting and only homeruns have put us on the board. In time, hopefully the next few days, we can get the offense going, the pitching will settle in, and the Twinkies will drop 3 to Boston while we take 3 or 4 from Detroit. Don't forget people, the Sox scored 14 runs just a week ago, and now were talking about ozzieball gone. Ozzieball is the stupidest pharse I've heard, but you seem to be talking about the offense in general, or just the Sox trying to score. I just hope Ozzie has a blowup to get these guys back into it.

Lip Man 1
07-28-2004, 01:25 AM
Depending on who you talk to Ozzie may have been hired simply to sell tickets. Supposedly Uncle Jerry said that to some friends of his.

Kenny Williams said he had no intention of hiring him but was bowled over by his enthusiasm.

A 'cynic' would say Ozzie was hired because he works cheap and is just happy to have the chance.

Also the list apparently wasn't very long for this job. What does that tell you? Remember Williams said he called Tom Kelly, he called Jim Leyland both said they weren't interested.

I don't know for sure why Ozzie was hired. I think it was probably a combination of all of the above.

Lip

OEO Magglio
07-28-2004, 01:26 AM
Another thing that pisses me off is that Hawk not letting up on this Ozzieball thing. Jesus Christ Hawk, when we win a game by a homerun, thats not Ozzieball. That is White Sox of the last 5 years ball. Give me a break.Hawk says that when the sox come back in the late innings and yes that is ozzieball because in years past the team was dead and the game was over if they were trailing going into the late innings.

MisterB
07-28-2004, 01:27 AM
It was pretty sad that Ozzie let Davis hit in the eighth.

Ozzie is turning out to be a bad manager. Maybe he should stop looking into the crowd so much like he did as a player and concentrate on the game a little more.Alomar's catching the day game tomorrow, Burke has a concussion - who do you propose should have caught the 9th inning?

So why couldn't we work on bunting and hitting the ball the opposite way in spring training? Don't tell me that one cannot learn to bunt over a two month span. That is BS. If you work at bunting the ball for a month and hitting it the other way for a month, you should be decent at it by the time the season rolls around. BTW, what baseball organization were you a coach for? You obviously know so much about baseball training methods.

Man Soo Lee
07-28-2004, 01:49 AM
Alomar's catching the day game tomorrow, Burke has a concussion - who do you propose should have caught the 9th inning?
I would hope Alomar could handle one extra inning of catching. Not having anyone on the bench worth sending up to hit vs. a LHP may have been the real issue.

BainesHOF
07-28-2004, 01:50 AM
Alomar's catching the day game tomorrow, Burke has a concussion - who do you propose should have caught the 9th inning?
Alomar.

mealfred13
07-28-2004, 05:50 AM
Hawk says that when the sox come back in the late innings and yes that is ozzieball because in years past the team was dead and the game was over if they were trailing going into the late innings.
In 2000, the game was never over until the last out. I don't know what the hell happened since then.

And LIP, I would love to see a team built on speed and execution, with Ozzie at the helm. If that means the Sox don't lead the league in homeruns, or they never HIT any homeruns....I love it. Homeruns are overrated, especially when no one's on base. I get as happy as the next guy to see one, but in the grand scheme of things, they're useless unless 2 or 3 guys are on base. I would love to see 10 singles in a row producing 6 or 7 runs over a grand slam and a couple solo shots any day. And if that means 2-3 years of crappy seasons while Ozzie builds a new team, I'll be sitting in the stands every year until it happens.

3Peater
07-28-2004, 07:17 AM
All will be better today. Sox have hammered Silva, who has a high Hits/IP ratio. A couple Homers and all will be well. I expect a 7-6/9-7 type game today.

Fungo
07-28-2004, 09:08 AM
:hawk

Ozzieball is an attitude.

bobj4400
07-28-2004, 09:24 AM
It was pretty sad that Ozzie let Davis hit in the eighth.


What was that by the way? How in God's name do you let Davis hit in that situation? I made a quick 5 bucks though as my buddy bet me he wouldnt strike out. Easiest bet I ever made...

wdelaney72
07-28-2004, 09:38 AM
All will be better today. Sox have hammered Silva, who has a high Hits/IP ratio. A couple Homers and all will be well. I expect a 7-6/9-7 type game today.
No, all will not be better. This was our division rival, who is in front of us in the standings. And they royally kicked our ass in every aspect of the game - WITH OUT TWO BEST PITCHERS ON THE MOUND and in our ballpark.

It appears that Corpseball is still alive and well.

Mickster
07-28-2004, 10:04 AM
No, all will not be better. This was our division rival, who is in front of us in the standings. And they royally kicked our ass in every aspect of the game - WITH OUT TWO BEST PITCHERS ON THE MOUND and in our ballpark.

It appears that Corpseball is still alive and well.
Go back and read the threads when we swept the twins weeks ago. It wasn't over then and it sure as hell isn't over now. Sheesh. :mad:

lowesox
07-28-2004, 10:57 AM
I couldn't agree more with the original sentiment of this thread. What's really concerning me, is that it seems Ozzie can't get these guys fired up.

Tell you what I would do if I were the manager tonight: I'd instruct Loaiza to throw his first pitch to Torii Hunter behind his back. Turn this thing into a war.

If nothing else, it would give the fans in the stands a little bit of excitement.

WSox8404
07-28-2004, 01:24 PM
I couldn't agree more with the original sentiment of this thread. What's really concerning me, is that it seems Ozzie can't get these guys fired up.

Tell you what I would do if I were the manager tonight: I'd instruct Loaiza to throw his first pitch to Torii Hunter behind his back. Turn this thing into a war.

If nothing else, it would give the fans in the stands a little bit of excitement.
Maybe that would help, maybe it wouldn't. It just drives me crazy to see this team constantly perform like it did last year. Except for a few more comebacks, this year looks just like last year. It really hurts.