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View Full Version : Apologize here: People who thought Rowand was 4th OF


Jerome
07-20-2004, 05:29 PM
Rowand has been great this year. Not only is his cheap production good for the payroll, but it gives me confidence that KW is a good judge of talent in the minors. Also, it takes a little of the sting out of losing Maggs next year.

OEO Magglio
07-20-2004, 05:35 PM
Rowand has been great this year. Not only is his cheap production good for the payroll, but it gives me confidence that KW is a good judge of talent in the minors. Also, it takes a little of the sting out of losing Maggs next year.Can we please stop all the aaron rowand threads, he's playing great right now and I hope he continues this but he was awful to start the year. Hopefully he'll continue to hit well but he's been a very streaky hitter.

Win1ForMe
07-20-2004, 05:35 PM
How many people are going to be fooled? Rowand has good numbers because he's done damage against lefties, which basically means he's a platoon player.

Talk to me when he improves his .303 OBP vs RHP.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-20-2004, 05:36 PM
Does a platoon player count as 4th outfielder?

Just checking.

thepaulbowski
07-20-2004, 05:37 PM
Does a platoon player count as 4th outfielder?

Just checking.
:rolling:

SEALgep
07-20-2004, 05:38 PM
Can we please stop all the aaron rowand threads, he's playing great right now and I hope he continues this but he was awful to start the year. Hopefully he'll continue to hit well but he's been a very streaky hitter.Note that this is his first opportunity where the role is finally his. However awful you thought his start was, his cumulative effort has been very good. .307 avg. 11 HR and 24 RBI's

doublem23
07-20-2004, 05:42 PM
Let's not put words in our mouths. No one ever said Aaron wasn't a starting, everyday outfielder.

We just said any team starting Aaron Rowand everyday wouldn't be any good.

SoxFan76
07-20-2004, 05:43 PM
I've always been behind Rowand, but I think this thread could count as trolling. You sound like you just want to start an argument.

Evman5
07-20-2004, 05:45 PM
Can we please stop all the aaron rowand threads, he's playing great right now and I hope he continues this but he was awful to start the year. Hopefully he'll continue to hit well but he's been a very streaky hitter.
His sporadic playing time at the beginning of the season is, IMO, the only reason he got off to a bad start. Since getting consistent playing time he has been one of our best players.

longshot7
07-20-2004, 05:45 PM
Why apologize? He IS - in a normal outfield.

Randar68
07-20-2004, 05:53 PM
How many people are going to be fooled? Rowand has good numbers because he's done damage against lefties, which basically means he's a platoon player.

Talk to me when he improves his .303 OBP vs RHP.
DING DING DING.

I want an apology for the 800th Rowand stroke-me Billy Squire Thread.

Randar68
07-20-2004, 05:55 PM
His sporadic playing time at the beginning of the season is, IMO, the only reason he got off to a bad start. Since getting consistent playing time he has been one of our best players.
He's held out of the line-up against tough righties because he doesn't hit them consistently. I'll be the first to tell you I've been impressed with his generally improved defensive play and he's playing with confidence.

However, having an inflated average because you're only in the game when you are in a favorable match-up is folly.

He's doing what good platoon players do, he's doing his half of the platoon job!

PaleHoseGeorge
07-20-2004, 05:55 PM
DING DING DING.

I want an apology for the 800th Rowand stroke-me Billy Squire Thread.
Do you get the impression Jerome might be in over his head on this one?
:cool:

Randar68
07-20-2004, 05:59 PM
Do you get the impression Jerome might be in over his head on this one?
:cool:
Lately, George, I get the impression that 75% of the people who post here are over their heads.

SEALgep
07-20-2004, 06:01 PM
He's held out of the line-up against tough righties because he doesn't hit them consistently. I'll be the first to tell you I've been impressed with his generally improved defensive play and he's playing with confidence.

However, having an inflated average because you're only in the game when you are in a favorable match-up is folly.

He's doing what good platoon players do, he's doing his half of the platoon job!That he is. Is he the best CF? No, but I'm glad the FOC and the BOC (bashers) have found some middle ground. Now let's just hope that everyone contributes in whatever way that helps us win, which is what we all want.:bandance:

nitetrain8601
07-20-2004, 06:18 PM
I've been a supporter of Rowand. I'm glad he's coming through. Let's hope it continues.

idseer
07-20-2004, 06:35 PM
Lately, George, I get the impression that 75% of the people who post here are over their heads.
you may be right randar. why not join the other 25% of us?

PaleHoseGeorge
07-20-2004, 06:44 PM
you may be right randar. why not join the other 25% of us?
Unlike Jerome who was calling out posters generally (or even Randar's post about "75% of the posts"), this is trolling for a fight.

You know where posts like this end up, right?

Soxfest
07-20-2004, 06:51 PM
I am not ready yet to do anything for a guy who has played well 2 months in 2 years.

Kadafi311
07-20-2004, 06:54 PM
Rowand has been great this year. Not only is his cheap production good for the payroll, but it gives me confidence that KW is a good judge of talent in the minors. Also, it takes a little of the sting out of losing Maggs next year.Just to make sure I'm understanding correctly:

If a guy starts the season playing like **** and then goes on a one or two week hot streak, KW morphs into a genius scout and Maggs is welcome to pack his bags?

Wow, great point.

Don't get me wrong, I honestly hope Rowand is turning the corner and developing into a solid CF. However, color me crazy, but I need more than two minutes of viewing time to decide if I like a movie.

owensmouth
07-20-2004, 06:58 PM
I am not ready yet to do anything for a guy who has played well 2 months in 2 years.
Like Garland?

Evman5
07-20-2004, 06:59 PM
I am not ready yet to do anything for a guy who has played well 2 months in 2 years.
He is a career .280 hitter and was on fire before we traded for Everett last year.

idseer
07-20-2004, 07:16 PM
Unlike Jerome who was calling out posters generally (or even Randar's post about "75% of the posts"), this is trolling for a fight.

You know where posts like this end up, right?
i believe calling 75% of the posters here 'over their heads' is asking for a fight.
i believe randar is almost always asking for a fight.

jerome was simply asking for apologies for those who've been wrong about aaron. i don't think it was wise but i also don't think it was insulting.

however. i'll drop it.

maurice
07-20-2004, 07:16 PM
The thing is, his OPS v. righties is better than either of his potential platoon partners. That's why he's not really platooning and probably will start at least 75% of the games between now and the end of the season.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-20-2004, 07:25 PM
i believe calling 75% of the posters here 'over their heads' is asking for a fight.
i believe randar is almost always asking for a fight.

jerome was simply asking for apologies for those who've been wrong about aaron. i don't think it was wise but i also don't think it was insulting.

however. i'll drop it.
Point taken, and thank you.

Dice
07-20-2004, 07:34 PM
I am not ready yet to do anything for a guy who has played well 2 months in 2 years.
Like Garland?THANK YOU! Rowand has done more in his limited playing time than Garland has done in his 3 full major league seasons!

Soxfest
07-20-2004, 08:22 PM
Like Garland?
I loathe Garland neither one has done alot in 2 years.

Flight #24
07-20-2004, 10:58 PM
He's held out of the line-up against tough righties because he doesn't hit them consistently. I'll be the first to tell you I've been impressed with his generally improved defensive play and he's playing with confidence.

However, having an inflated average because you're only in the game when you are in a favorable match-up is folly.

He's doing what good platoon players do, he's doing his half of the platoon job!
While it's true he's out against tough RHs, I believe he's hitting the "not so tough" RHs better than in the past, which is a nice improvement, and makes him more than a 50% platooner.

Also, IIRC, his avg v. RHs was at .253 sometime in late May, it's now .279, which means he's hit pretty well against them in the past 6 weeks. I can't recall what his OBP was v. RHs in late May, but my fuess is that it was a lot lower than .303. (it's also a solid improvement from the .289OBP v. RH of 2003).

Certainly a small sample size, but an indication that he's figuring things out v. RH's and has a shot to be a solid everyday hitter, which combined with fundamental albiet not spectacular D in CF is nice to have for cheap.

I've knocked & doubted ARow a lot, but I'm coming around. He looks like he'll end up a very solid all-around player and play against all but the toughest RHs. Not spectacular at everything, but solid - kind of like a Steve Finley.

Jerome
07-20-2004, 11:37 PM
WHOA

I did not mean to start any fights, I did not mean for this to end up somewhere else, and I do not think Rowand is as good as Maggs.


But I remember people saying as recently as last week that Rowand was a 4 Ofer at best. Anyone who is hitting .300 (in enough ABs) should be considered more than a 4th OF. Timo Perez is a 4th OFer. Ross Gload is a 4th OFer. Rowand is better than that. (and his defense is improving too.)

Calm down everyone

doublem23
07-20-2004, 11:48 PM
But I remember people saying as recently as last week that Rowand was a 4 Ofer at best. Anyone who is hitting .300 (in enough ABs) should be considered more than a 4th OF.
What's he hitting against righties? He may not be a 4th outfielder, but he's not a third, either.

OEO Magglio
07-20-2004, 11:52 PM
What's he hitting against righties? He may not be a 4th outfielder, but he's not a third, either.Doublem, there is no winning this argument. It doesn't matter what evidence you present everyone with, some people will continue to argue with you. I hope I'm wrong about aaron but he's very streaky and I wouldn't be surprised at all to see him go into another major slump, lets hope I'm wrong though.

jeremyb1
07-21-2004, 01:12 AM
A couple points here:

1. Yes Rowand is far better against lefties than righties and that boosts his overall numbers. However, his overall numbers are impressive despite the fact that he has more at bats vs. righties than lefties. Rowand has an OPS of .746 vs. righties which pales in comparison to his performance against lefties but those are still above average numbers for a CF. If you want to argue about his defense, that's another story but I feel he's been competent in CF and worse against RHP vs. LHP doesn't equal performing poorly vs. RHP.

2. Yes Rowand's OBP is quite poor. However, coming from someone who places a ton of value on OBP, a guy with a low OBP can still be valuable if he has good power numbers especially if he plays a position that's weak offensively (see Jose Valentin). Rowand has a .550 SLG and that's phenominal considering that he's a CF. Rowand currently has the fifth best VORP for centerfielders despite limited playing time and the second best EQA of any CF in the AL with 200 PA.

OurBitchinMinny
07-21-2004, 01:57 AM
Rowand has been great this year. Not only is his cheap production good for the payroll, but it gives me confidence that KW is a good judge of talent in the minors. Also, it takes a little of the sting out of losing Maggs next year.
NO. Rowand has not been great this year. He has been good for the last 2 months. He still is pathetic w/ RISP. Not a gold glover in the outfield. I hope he continues his hot play, but I know he will come back to earth. he just isnt that good.

OurBitchinMinny
07-21-2004, 01:59 AM
Let's not put words in our mouths. No one ever said Aaron wasn't a starting, everyday outfielder.

We just said any team starting Aaron Rowand everyday wouldn't be any good.
And we arent that good. We are 6 games over in a crappy division, in second place and have a good cleveland team on our heels

ClaudelSleptHere
07-21-2004, 02:55 AM
Perhaps the best thing to say about Rowand is that right now, center field has moved several spots down the list of our current problems.........

OEO Magglio
07-21-2004, 03:06 AM
Perhaps the best thing to say about Rowand is that right now, center field has moved several spots down the list of our current problems.........That's probably the best way to put it. Rowand still isn't great and might only be a 4th outfielder for his career but for now centerfield definitely isn't a need, well put claudel.

mealfred13
07-21-2004, 03:12 AM
That's probably the best way to put it. Rowand still isn't great and might only be a 4th outfielder for his career but for now centerfield definitely isn't a need, well put claudel.
And you had to go put him down at the same time, eh? ......tsk tsk...

gosox41
07-21-2004, 08:14 AM
Just to make sure I'm understanding correctly:

If a guy starts the season playing like **** and then goes on a one or two week hot streak, KW morphs into a genius scout and Maggs is welcome to pack his bags?

Wow, great point.

Don't get me wrong, I honestly hope Rowand is turning the corner and developing into a solid CF. However, color me crazy, but I need more than two minutes of viewing time to decide if I like a movie.
Funny how there are a ton of Aaron Rowand posts. Where are the posts about what a steal Juan Uribe was for the Sox. There were some who thought KW was a genius for that move. Not that it was a bad move (I was in favor of it) but I never expected Uribe to hit .300 let alone .360.


Bob


Bob

idseer
07-21-2004, 05:55 PM
Funny how there are a ton of Aaron Rowand posts. Where are the posts about what a steal Juan Uribe was for the Sox. There were some who thought KW was a genius for that move. Not that it was a bad move (I was in favor of it) but I never expected Uribe to hit .300 let alone .360.


Bob


Bob
and it looks like your expectations will be met.

RKMeibalane
07-21-2004, 08:58 PM
Another Rowand thread? Sheesh! I'm beginning to wonder if Gumshoe is paying people to post this stuff.

South Side
07-21-2004, 09:08 PM
Another Rowand thread? Sheesh! I'm beginning to wonder if Gumshoe is paying people to post this stuff.
Yeah, he deserves another one. Lead off double... HELL YEAH!

OEO Magglio
07-21-2004, 09:16 PM
And you had to go put him down at the same time, eh? ......tsk tsk...
I'm not putting him down, I absolutely love what he's doing right now, I'm just worried he might go back into another long slump, that's all.

Rex Hudler
07-22-2004, 01:32 AM
Is it not at all possible that Aaron Rowand could be coming into his own and that past years of mixed success and failure have provided the learning experiences needed to improve?

Is it not possible that he is talented enough to be a solid starting OF and those talents are finally being shown with an extended opportunity to play everyday?

Is it not possible that he has struggled against RH's because he wasn't getting consistent AB's before and now that he is playing more frequently against RH's, he has made the necessary adjustments?

I am not here to suggest he is an all-star. But it just seems to me that he has gotten labeled more so than any player I can remember and that just possibly he is improving enough to shake those lables. The goal of a player is to improve their game while helping a team win, isn't it???

Aidan
07-22-2004, 01:38 AM
I will admit that last season, even with his shaky defense, I loved having Crazy Carl in CF instead of Rowand. But now with Aaron Rowand hitting everything in sight, I'm glad we are able to have his glove/bat in CF and Crazy Carl as our DH.
:supernana: