PDA

View Full Version : Trade official pending RJ's approval?


ozzman
07-14-2004, 12:10 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?

Randar68
07-14-2004, 12:10 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?
This morning's rumor had the Cubs as Nomar's destination.

ozzman
07-14-2004, 12:11 PM
and last night had us, so who knows.

iwcup
07-14-2004, 12:13 PM
wow, RJ to the boSox....ewww. not a friendly park for lefties.

OEO Magglio
07-14-2004, 12:13 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?I don't think a deal is done yet but even if it is, I've heard that rj might not waive his no trade to play for boston.

SOXSINCE'70
07-14-2004, 12:14 PM
I don't think so.You know how Uncle Jerry loves to see White Sox fans suffer.:redneck :redneck Anyways,16 mill in 2005 is too steep for a pitcher who will turn 42 and has had knee and back surgeries the past few years.:cool:

Baby Fisk
07-14-2004, 12:17 PM
If this happens, people will be hurling themselves onto the BoSox bandwagon in a limb-breaking frenzy. :angry:

Blob
07-14-2004, 12:17 PM
I don't think so.You know how Uncle Jerry loves to see White Sox fans suffer.:redneck :redneck Anyways,16 mill in 2005 is too steep for a pitcher who will turn 42 and has had knee and back surgeries the past few years.:cool:
we could use the money for Maggs instead...

bobj4400
07-14-2004, 12:22 PM
If this happens, people will be hurling themselves onto the BoSox bandwagon in a limb-breaking frenzy. :angry:As will the Flub fans renew their claims of Dustiny if they add Nomar. Although I think they will be in for a surprise when they find out he is average defensively and below average offensively away from Fenway...

mcfish
07-14-2004, 12:28 PM
As will the Flub fans renew their claims of Dustiny if they add Nomar. Although I think they will be in for a surprise when they find out he is average defensively and below average offensively away from Fenway...
Yeah, but he's going to Weeghman - not exactly a pitcher's paradise most days. I guess it does depend on where the wind blows.

brewerfan
07-14-2004, 12:34 PM
Nomar, for them, even if he is just above average, is a big, big upgrade over the Ramon Martinez/Rey Ordonez platoon they've got going. I mean, he will still improve their team a lot.

cbrownson13
07-14-2004, 12:34 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?
Yeah, the rumor via ESPN Insider is that the Red Sox would trade Nomar to the Cubs for prospects, and then turn around and package those prospects in a deal for Randy Johnson. Boston is going to do whatever it can to keep the Yankees from getting Johnson.

WhiteSoxFan84
07-14-2004, 12:48 PM
Whether the Cubs or White Sox get Nomar, it will be a one year rental. During the offseason when the Sox almost dealt Maggs for Nomar (thank God it didn't happen), Nomar made it clear that he wouldn't re-sign with any team in the midwest. He obviously wants out of Boston and where ever he winds up better win this year because next year he'll probably be playing for either the Dodgers or Anaheim. Maybe even the Giants or some other west coast team. His wife, Mia Hamm, has all her family in California and Nomar wants to be close by.

Besides, as previously mentioned, the Cubs are heavily persuing Orlando Cabrera from the Expos. A deal might actually be announced today or by Sunday, which would involve A-Gon and cash.

oeo
07-14-2004, 12:52 PM
I don't think we will get Nomar, and I don't care. I think we are perfectly fine with Valentin at short. Get us a catcher or another pitcher, not another SS.

Blob
07-14-2004, 12:56 PM
I don't think we will get Nomar, and I don't care. I think we are perfectly fine with Valentin at short. Get us a catcher or another pitcher, not another SS.
No way we'll get him. Sounds like this is actually the Scrubbies deal now, not the Sox.

If the Sox want to replace Jose it will be at the end of the year with Uribe. He's younger and cheaper...

Tekijawa
07-14-2004, 12:58 PM
Haven't seen anything yet anywhere and No visit from Otis... probably still a rumor

yeboredsox
07-14-2004, 01:00 PM
Is this a done deal or what? I had to go to therapy because of arodgate, I cannot take another psychological thrashing.

oeo
07-14-2004, 01:02 PM
No way we'll get him. Sounds like this is actually the Scrubbies deal now, not the Sox.

If the Sox want to replace Jose it will be at the end of the year with Uribe. He's younger and cheaper...
I just read that the Flubs will more likely go after Orlando Cabrera over Nomar.

Basten
07-14-2004, 01:02 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?If true....damn.

Come on, Steinny, make your magic -- divert RJ to either Chicago (SS) or
St. Louis.

SoxxoS
07-14-2004, 01:09 PM
If the Sox want to replace Jose it will be at the end of the year with Uribe. He's younger and cheaper...
Do you really want Uribe starting SS for us next year? The guy had a torrid first month, and I think he has gotten 4 hits since then. His overall numbers are on their way to being far less than spactacular after May.

The key is just not young and cheap, but young, cheap, and good.

illiniwhitesox
07-14-2004, 01:13 PM
My friend said he heard it on the latest sportcenter on wmvp. He said it was involving the bosox, dbacks, and chicago, but he caught the tail end of it and didnt hear sox/cubs. anyone else hear this?
Let the Flubs have Nomar. He'll get injured again (someone say Griffey), cost a lot of money, and the Flubs will still be in a platoon situation at SS.

Flight #24
07-14-2004, 01:14 PM
Do you really want Uribe starting SS for us next year? The guy had a torrid first month, and I think he has gotten 4 hits since then. His overall numbers are on their way to being far less than spactacular after May.

The key is just not young and cheap, but young, cheap, and good.
I'd much rather resign Valentin for $5mil than lose prospects, then have to resign Nomar for more (a lot more). Heck - since Jose's doing well this year, it would even be better to wait and try to sign Nomar as an FA in the offseason (thereby keeping the prospects).

Not to mention that Nomar doesn't have quite the humor value in misspellings that we get regularly from all those Valentine fans!

Basten
07-14-2004, 01:15 PM
Do you really want Uribe starting SS for us next year? The guy had a torrid first month, and I think he has gotten 4 hits since then. His overall numbers are on their way to being far less than spactacular after May.

The key is just not young and cheap, but young, cheap, and good.
When Uribe uses the all-field approach, he's flat-out good.

When he tries to pull of every pitch as was the case in June, he is a utility infielder.

At 24, he still has time to improve. Hopefully, he sticks with the former approach, even at the expense of HR totals.

Defensively and on the pads, he will be fine.

SoxFan76
07-14-2004, 01:18 PM
If the Cubs get Nomar, the Sox are screwed. We won't hear the end of it. Even though Jose is better, Cub fans aren't the brightest bunch.

Flight #24
07-14-2004, 01:21 PM
If the Cubs get Nomar, the Sox are screwed. We won't hear the end of it. Even though Jose is better, Cub fans aren't the brightest bunch.
Yeah, but the Cubs/media will behave as if they're adding a .970 OPS SS to their lineup with all the associated raised expectations, etc.

Meanwhile, in reality they'll be adding a .770OPS SS to their lineup, which is an upgrade over what they have now, but nothing to crow over.

So when they inevitably flop and miss the playoffs while the Sox win the division, the fall will be that much greater and the playoffs all the sweeter for Sox fans.

Fungo
07-14-2004, 01:25 PM
If the Cubs get Nomar, the Sox are screwed. We won't hear the end of it. Even though Jose is better, Cub fans aren't the brightest bunch.
They: Wanted Nomar
We: Got him

Basten
07-14-2004, 01:25 PM
I'd much rather resign Valentin for $5mil than lose prospects, then have to resign Nomar for more (a lot more). Heck - since Jose's doing well this year, it would even be better to wait and try to sign Nomar as an FA in the offseason (thereby keeping the prospects).

Not to mention that Nomar doesn't have quite the humor value in misspellings that we get regularly from all those Valentine fans!If Edgar Renteria is said to be looking for 10-12 Mill a year as a FA, you can safely assume Nomar is ready for 14-15 Mill a year, long-term deal.

For somebody who

A) hasn't been a great player since 2001 due to a serious wrist injury
B) isn't nearly as good away from Fenway
C) is 31
D) Choked badly the last time he went to the playoffs
E) Very average defensively and a non-factor on the pads

I don't think he is is remotely worth the money he'll be looking for. 1998-2000 was a long time ago.

SoxFan76
07-14-2004, 01:27 PM
Yeah, but the Cubs/media will behave as if they're adding a .970 OPS SS to their lineup with all the associated raised expectations, etc.

Meanwhile, in reality they'll be adding a .770OPS SS to their lineup, which is an upgrade over what they have now, but nothing to crow over.

So when they inevitably flop and miss the playoffs while the Sox win the division, the fall will be that much greater and the playoffs all the sweeter for Sox fans.
Good point. While NOMAH may be overrated, he is certainly better than Rey freakin Ordonez. Not to mention Mr. "I can't field a ground ball, but thankfully they blamed it on Bartman" Gonzalez. And they have another guy, Martinez I think.

Flight #24
07-14-2004, 01:34 PM
If Edgar Renteria is said to be looking for 10-12 Mill a year as a FA, you can safely assume Nomar is ready for 14-15 Mill a year, long-term deal.

For somebody who

A) hasn't been a great player since 2001 due to a serious wrist injury
B) isn't nearly as good away from Fenway
C) is 31
D) Choked badly the last time he went to the playoffs
E) Very average defensively and a non-factor on the pads

I don't think he is is remotely worth the money he'll be looking for. 1998-2000 was a long time ago.
Just to be clear - I actually don't really have any desire for Nomar, I'd rather resign Jose or even go with Uribe and use the $$$ elsewhere. I was just saying that if for some reason we DID want Nomar, we don't need him this year (given Valentin's performance), and it's better for us to sign him as a straight FA than trade top prospects for him.

WhiteSoxFan84
07-14-2004, 01:34 PM
If the Cubs get Nomar and go to the World Series, so be it, it's way overdue for those bastards to actually MAKE it (which they won't this year because how many teams in the NL which were preseason favorites have actually made it as far as predicted? it's always the underdogs in the NL since the Braves stopped their streak).

Now let's say the Cubs give up all those prospects for Nomar, he comes and he is injured until mid-August, he comes back, when comes back, he strikeouts during clutch at-bats, makes 10 errors in 25 games, Cubs don't make the playoffs, and Nomar leaves for the Dodgers in the offseason.

So let's get a breakdown of the downside of this trade; Cubs lose prospects, Nomar plays pretty bad, Cubs don't make the playoffs, and they don't even get a chance to re-sign him? Sounds like a Cubs move, do it.

StepsInSC
07-14-2004, 01:50 PM
If the Cubs get Nomar, the Sox are screwed. We won't hear the end of it. Even though Jose is better, Cub fans aren't the brightest bunch.
The Sox are not screwed. We don't play the Cubs again for the rest of the year so it in no way directly affects what happens on the field, which is all I care about.

HomeFish
07-14-2004, 01:59 PM
Nomar for prospects...oh my gawhd. The Cubs rip another team off two years in a row.

samram
07-14-2004, 02:05 PM
I don't think a deal is done yet but even if it is, I've heard that rj might not waive his no trade to play for boston.
I've also read this. He apparently has problems with Schilling, despite Schilling's wife's attempt to make things better by sitting next to Johnson's wife last night. The whole thing is in Johnson's hands. If he doesn't want to be around Schilling (or be that far from home), it's not happening.

South Side
07-14-2004, 02:08 PM
I've also read this. He apparently has problems with Schilling, despite Schilling's wife's attempt to make things better by sitting next to Johnson's wife last night. The whole thing is in Johnson's hands. If he doesn't want to be around Schilling (or be that far from home), it's not happening.
Who doesn't Johnson have problems with?

Flight #24
07-14-2004, 02:09 PM
Nomar for prospects...oh my gawhd. The Cubs rip another team off two years in a row.
1) If anyone givs up RJ-level prospects and gets Nomar....they get screwed.
2) If anyone gives up prospets based on Nomar's reputation for him....they get screwed.

Unless the Cubs are somehow getting nomar "on the cheap" (and given that the prospects are the lion's share of the offer for RJ, I doubt that very much), I don't see how tis is a good deal for the Cubs unless they have some assurances that he'll resign with them (which would be against everything I've heard about him).

Nomar is no longer one of the top 3 SS's in baseball. Away from Fenway he's had a .770 OPS over the past 3 years (per ESPN). He's not a great fielder and doesn't steal bases. So while he's an upgrade over the chumps they currently have @ SS, it's not like they're adding a star-level player. Plus, he's a known whiner, which is partially why he's getting dealt.

samram
07-14-2004, 02:11 PM
Who doesn't Johnson have problems with?
I don't know, I don't know him. However, in the context of these "trading floor" rumors which have him going to Boston, his animosity toward Schilling may preclude this trade from happening.

Basten
07-14-2004, 02:14 PM
Nomar for prospects...oh my gawhd. The Cubs rip another team off two years in a row.Yeah, no kidding.

Sisco is very mediocre in A-ball.
Guzman had surgery last year, hasn't pitched in a while.
Brownlie is good in AA but Arnie Munoz's stats were better and so were Honel's and Cotts's.


I don't understand Arizona's thinking here. Sox could give them Garland who could turn into an All-Star under proper guidance and is very cheap. Bobby Brownlie is no more ML-ready than Brian Anderson (both could make it in 2005), and Sox could toss them another couple of prospects Cubs wouldn't.

AND, Colangelo has a chance to screw both Red Sox and Yankees over after dangling him.

This whole thing is frustrating as hell. :mad:

samram
07-14-2004, 02:15 PM
1) If anyone givs up RJ-level prospects and gets Nomar....they get screwed.
So true. The only reason to overpay this much would be if the team is desperate at shortstop. I guess the Cubs could fit that description, but the Sox don't, which is why this trade never made sense with the Sox being part of it.

Basten
07-14-2004, 02:20 PM
I've also read this. He apparently has problems with Schilling, despite Schilling's wife's attempt to make things better by sitting next to Johnson's wife last night. The whole thing is in Johnson's hands. If he doesn't want to be around Schilling (or be that far from home), it's not happening.
So let me get this straight:

Unit doesn't like Shilling, so he is willing to go to a team where he if he succeeds, he'll have to share credit with Pedro, Shilling, Manny, Nomar and Epstein....and if he fails and Red Sox get bounced early, he will be run out of town by fans and media alike?

Jesus Christ, Mike Ditka could actually win the elections here......Does Unit not realize the upside of coming to the beautiful Chicago?

PorkChopExpress
07-14-2004, 02:23 PM
I don't understand Arizona's thinking here. Sox could give them Garland who could turn into an All-Star under proper guidance and is very cheap.
NO! I know RJ is still good and is a future HOF, but I do not want to give up Garland to get him. Let Boston have him. Even if we do not get a #1 ace, we are still a formidable opponent. Let's not get crazy here.

danjames
07-14-2004, 02:24 PM
Yeah, no kidding.

Sisco is very mediocre in A-ball.
Guzman had surgery last year, hasn't pitched in a while.
Brownlie is good in AA but Arnie Munoz's stats were better and so were Honel's and Cotts's.


I don't understand Arizona's thinking here. Sox could give them Garland who could turn into an All-Star under proper guidance and is very cheap. Bobby Brownlie is no more ML-ready than Brian Anderson (both could make it in 2005), and Sox could toss them another couple of prospects Cubs wouldn't.

AND, Colangelo has a chance to screw both Red Sox and Yankees over after dangling him.

This whole thing is frustrating as hell. :mad:
If the white sox traded Garland, wouldn't they just be in the same boat? Yes obviously Johnson is better than Garland, but you need both of them in the rotation to get schoe to the pen.

pearso66
07-14-2004, 04:17 PM
Please, do NOT trade Garland. He looks to finally be coming into his own. If we do get RJ, great, that would make JG the best #5 in baseball

Cubsuck_a_lot
07-14-2004, 05:02 PM
i will never understand what wrigley field is supposed to be the "shrine" of? 97 (you know they wont win this year) years of losing is not something to be proud of, let alone call the home from which you have done all your losing a "shrine". but, you know what they say, ignorance is bliss. Comiskey may not have the history, but at least i can pee without feeling like im in a barn.

SOX 2K4 WS

Cubsuck_a_lot
07-14-2004, 05:04 PM
what about Benson from the Pirates. Pitt seems to like to dump all their great players this time of the year anyway, and we could probably get him for cheap.

BigEdWalsh
07-14-2004, 05:58 PM
I don't think we will get Nomar, and I don't care. I think we are perfectly fine with Valentin at short. Get us a catcher or another pitcher, not another SS.
I've always been kinda hot and cold on Jose. But, I think whether one is pro or con on Jose, he is important to the team for his positive effect on team chemistry. I agree that we need a catcher way more than we need Garciaparra. Cubs can have Nomar.

DSpivack
07-15-2004, 12:03 AM
i will never understand what wrigley field is supposed to be the "shrine" of? 97 (you know they wont win this year) years of losing is not something to be proud of, let alone call the home from which you have done all your losing a "shrine". but, you know what they say, ignorance is bliss. Comiskey may not have the history, but at least i can pee without feeling like im in a barn.

SOX 2K4 WS
Oddly placed in this thread.

Cubbiesuck13
07-15-2004, 09:01 PM
I've always been kinda hot and cold on Jose. But, I think whether one is pro or con on Jose, he is important to the team for his positive effect on team chemistry. I agree that we need a catcher way more than we need Garciaparra. Cubs can have Nomar.
i agree, he has a big heart and with his improved defense this year i think he is earning his 5 mil a year. a poor, very poor man's tejada