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View Full Version : Beltran will provide bigger boost than most SP


OzzieBall2004
07-13-2004, 05:02 PM
Im sick of people saying we don't need Beltran....Everyone needs Beltran. The kid can do it all. Would he be a rental, of course, but he's a five tool player that would bolster our offense and defense. Regardless of Franks progress with his foot and everything else aside, adding Beltran would be a HUGE plus. With the exception of Carlos' catch sunday, how often do we reach over and snag potential HRs??? Every time we play Minny, Hunter or Jones or Ford do that to us, and it would be nice to see us to that to people once a week.
Granted, giving up players like Sweeney, Diaz, Rauch, Cotts or whoever would be costly for the future, but who cares? Cleveland and Detroit are creeping up on us and are gonna be more competitive in years to come, and Minnesota isnt going anywhere. Would I rather have The Big Unit over Beltran? Of course, but I dont think that deal is feasible. Would I rather have Kris Benson over Beltran? Hell no. The day to day impact of a top 5 outfielder in the bigs over a slightly above average pitcher is not even close. Beltran would do more to put up over the proverbial "hump" than any average starter, midreliever, or setup man would.

Potential line-up with Beltran

1-Harris 2b
2-Uribe/Valentin ss
3-Maggs rf
4-Frank(when healthy) dh
5-Carlos Lee lf
6-Konerko 1b
7-Beltran cf
8-Crede 3b
9-Sandy/Ben/Burke
Bench: Rowand, Gload, Borchard (likely sent back down), Timo

Line-up with Beltran and without a healthy Frank

1-Harris - 2b
2-Uribe/Valentin - ss
3-Maggs - dh
4-Carlos Lee - lf
5-Konerko - 1b
6-Beltran - cf
7-Rowand - rf
8-Crede - 3b
9-pick a catcher, any catcher

Brian26
07-13-2004, 05:03 PM
Ugh. Enough already.

Houston is NOT going to trade Beltran. They are only 4 games out of the wild card, and that team could get hot and do some damage.

Let's move on...

habibharu
07-13-2004, 05:09 PM
Would I rather have The Big Unit over Beltran? Of course, but I dont think that deal is feasible. [/QUOTE] why is getting RJ not feasible if we can get beltran? both of them are comparable talent wise. and beltran doesnt really help us that much. we have enough offense. we need SP. the only way beltran helps us a great deal is if we know that we can sign him like KW knew with freddy.

OzzieBall2004
07-13-2004, 05:11 PM
Ugh. Enough already.

Houston is NOT going to trade Beltran. They are only 4 games out of the wild card, and that team could get hot and do some damage.

Let's move on...

Slow down there pal....4 and a half games back and behind 8 teams....of those 8 teams only 2 (Milwaukee and Cincinnati) are likely to falter in the second half. That leaves SF, Flubs, Padres, Braves, Marlins, and the Mets as the teams they have to play catch up with. If they dont have a substantial winning streak by the end of the month, not trading Beltran would be foolish.

habibharu
07-13-2004, 05:12 PM
Slow down there pal....4 and a half games back and behind 8 teams....of those 8 teams only 2 (Milwaukee and Cincinnati) are likely to falter in the second half. That leaves SF, Flubs, Padres, Braves, Marlins, and the Mets as the teams they have to play catch up with. If they dont have a substantial winning streak by the end of the month, not trading Beltran would be foolish. but they are also probably gonna make a manegerial change, which could give them a boost

OEO Magglio
07-13-2004, 05:13 PM
Would I rather have The Big Unit over Beltran? Of course, but I dont think that deal is feasible. why is getting RJ not feasible if we can get beltran? both of them are comparable talent wise. and beltran doesnt really help us that much. we have enough offense. we need SP. the only way beltran helps us a great deal is if we know that we can sign him like KW knew with freddy.Beltran would be nice but rj would be awesome. If the sox were ever to get Carlos I can guarantee you he wouldn't bat 7th.

SoxxoS
07-13-2004, 05:17 PM
The one thing I will give

:boston

credit on, is that he was behind Beltran from day 1, saying how good he is going to be. Then I realized even a blind squirrel gets a nut, and he is still a moron.

OzzieBall2004
07-13-2004, 05:18 PM
Would I rather have The Big Unit over Beltran? Of course, but I dont think that deal is feasible. why is getting RJ not feasible if we can get beltran? both of them are comparable talent wise. and beltran doesnt really help us that much. we have enough offense. we need SP. the only way beltran helps us a great deal is if we know that we can sign him like KW knew with freddy.[/QUOTE]

Of course we cant sign him. Dont be ridiculous. But RJ is owed in excess of 25 million over the next year and a half, and probably wouldnt include us on his list of "contenders". Houston needs prospects, namely young SPs and RPs, and we've proven we're willing to part with our "future".
And we have enough offense? For one, Franks hurt....and this recent 4 game winning streak included a sweep against the worst team in the AL. You cant have enough offense, and Beltran is an asset defensively as well.

OzzieBall2004
07-13-2004, 05:21 PM
Beltran would be nice but rj would be awesome. If the sox were ever to get Carlos I can guarantee you he wouldn't bat 7th.

I only listed that to show how dominant the lineup would be. Hell, I'd draw names out of a hat and still like my chances if I had those guys in my lineup.

habibharu
07-13-2004, 05:21 PM
.[/QUOTE]
Of course we cant sign him. Dont be ridiculous. But RJ is owed in excess of 25 million over the next year and a half, and probably wouldnt include us on his list of "contenders". Houston needs prospects, namely young SPs and RPs, and we've proven we're willing to part with our "future".
And we have enough offense? For one, Franks hurt....and this recent 4 game winning streak included a sweep against the worst team in the AL. You cant have enough offense, and Beltran is an asset defensively as well.[/QUOTE] actually you cant have enough SP. and we dont. i would feel much for comfortable with our current lineup and RJ in the rotation than with beltran in the lineup and scho in our rotation

Kadafi311
07-13-2004, 05:32 PM
....and this recent 4 game winning streak included a sweep against the worst team in the ALActually, didn't the experts already explain to you that the Royals are the worst team in baseball?

Sheesh buddy, resistence is futile. Prepare to assimilate.


EDIT: Oh, and by the way, I've never heard or read any mind involved in the game of baseball dispute a stud SP > a stud bat.

cbrownson13
07-13-2004, 05:40 PM
Beltran would be nice but rj would be awesome. If the sox were ever to get Carlos I can guarantee you he wouldn't bat 7th.

Agreed. Why would we bat a 5 tool player that we "need so much" in the 7 spot? If he were on this team, I would want him batting second.

Flight #24
07-13-2004, 05:42 PM
Adding either guy gets us to the playoffs virtually guaranteed(esp since I thik we'll make it without either guy). However, once in the playoffs, RJ can win a series for you almost singlehandedly, something Beltran will have a LOT harder time doing.

A playoff rotation of RJ-Garcia-Buehrle with 1 start from Garland is a lot better shot at advancing then Garcia-Buehrle-Garland with 1 start from ELo, but adding the upgrade from Rowand to Beltran in CF.

If available and willing to come, Randy's the guy. If available and not willing - KW needs to do a hard sell on what the Sox can achieve with him, what it would mean for Chicago (and how he'd therefore own the city), and what the Sox are ready to do payroll-wise next year.

It's a feasible sell, the main problem is that the Angels have the best total package to offer combining WC, prospects, and eating the whole salary. Sox can offer a lower prospect package, and salary relief, Yanks pretty much just the salary relief.

SoxOnTop
07-13-2004, 05:43 PM
Slow down there pal....4 and a half games back and behind 8 teams....of those 8 teams only 2 (Milwaukee and Cincinnati) are likely to falter in the second half. That leaves SF, Flubs, Padres, Braves, Marlins, and the Mets as the teams they have to play catch up with. If they dont have a substantial winning streak by the end of the month, not trading Beltran would be foolish.
I think you can add the Padres, Mets and Braves to the teams that will likely falter in the 2nd half. SF will hang around as long as BB is around, but only the Cubs and Marlins are as likely as Houston to put together a big second half.

SoxOnTop
07-13-2004, 05:47 PM
Adding either guy gets us to the playoffs virtually guaranteed(esp since I thik we'll make it without either guy). However, once in the playoffs, RJ can win a series for you almost singlehandedly, something Beltran will have a LOT harder time doing.

A playoff rotation of RJ-Garcia-Buehrle with 1 start from Garland is a lot better shot at advancing then Garcia-Buehrle-Garland with 1 start from ELo, but adding the upgrade from Rowand to Beltran in CF.

If available and willing to come, Randy's the guy. If available and not willing - KW needs to do a hard sell on what the Sox can achieve with him, what it would mean for Chicago (and how he'd therefore own the city), and what the Sox are ready to do payroll-wise next year.

It's a feasible sell, the main problem is that the Angels have the best total package to offer combining WC, prospects, and eating the whole salary. Sox can offer a lower prospect package, and salary relief, Yanks pretty much just the salary relief.
Would adding Garland to the deal help out? Young, cheap SP with MLB experience.

OzzieBall2004
07-13-2004, 06:08 PM
Actually, didn't the experts already explain to you that the Royals are the worst team in baseball?

Sheesh buddy, resistence is futile. Prepare to assimilate.


EDIT: Oh, and by the way, I've never heard or read any mind involved in the game of baseball dispute a stud SP > a stud bat.

I just want to make it clear that im in no way saying i'd rather have beltran over RJ. I just said it is more probable that we'd have a shot at Beltran (assuming Houston falters and deal him) than RJ because of competition from NY, Boston and Anaheim. Im just saying that if it came down to getting, say Kris Benson, or Beltran, I'd take a Stud bat and fielder over an average/above average pitcher like Benson.