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dougs78
09-24-2001, 10:45 PM
Hi there, long time reader, but first time poster. Here are my opinions for heading into next season. First and foremost, about the trade scenarios. I very much like the lineup we have coming back, but we have too much overlap at certain positions...LF and DH mostly. My thoughts on fixing this are to translate these backlogs into improvements. I know I will make some enemies, but a trade I have bantered about with other sox fans is Carlos Lee, Jose Valentin and Ginter and a lesser pitching prospect to Detroit for Weaver and Inge. Dont get me wrong, I do love Carlos and Jose, but I think it makes too much sense to take a deal like that. I am not sure Detroit would go for that, but it would be interesting. the one thing I am sure of is NOT to trade Paul Konerko. He is about to become only the 4th White Sox player in history to go for 30-100....you just can't trade a 25 year old player that does that. I have many more opinions, but I figured I would let you guys rip on me for this one first :)

FarWestChicago
09-24-2001, 10:48 PM
Welcome to WSI, dougs. I won't do any ripping since you're new here. :)

Jerry_Manuel
09-24-2001, 10:50 PM
Originally posted by dougs78
a trade I have bantered about with other sox fans is Carlos Lee, Jose Valentin and Ginter and a lesser pitching prospect to Detroit for Weaver and Inge. Dont get me wrong, I do love Carlos and Jose, but I think it makes too much sense to take a deal like that. I am not sure Detroit would go for that, but it would be interesting.

Welcome!

I wouldn't make this deal, for a few reasons. First making a trade this big inside your own division could really bite you in the ass if you are on the down side of the deal. Second Weaver really does not like the Sox due to the way his contract talks went after the Sox drafted him. So you really don't want a player on your team who you know doesn't want to play for you. I like Inge and would trade Ginter for him but not Valentin or Lee. I doubt the Tigers as dumb as they are would trade him to us anyway.

Daver
09-24-2001, 11:01 PM
Weaver will not play for the White Sox and has been Quoted as saying that.I agree that with the fact that you have to trade either Konerko or Lee to get any value back in the trade,and my first choice would be Lee in that scenario.
That being said I think you could trade Lee,Ginter,and Kip Wells and maybe a prospect,to the Rangers for I-Rod,a team that is desperate for pitching and can't afford both Payrod and I-Rod.
But then again what the hell do I know?

KempersRS
09-24-2001, 11:05 PM
Originally posted by dougs78
Hi there, long time reader, but first time poster. Here are my opinions for heading into next season. First and foremost, about the trade scenarios. I very much like the lineup we have coming back, but we have too much overlap at certain positions...LF and DH mostly. My thoughts on fixing this are to translate these backlogs into improvements. I know I will make some enemies, but a trade I have bantered about with other sox fans is Carlos Lee, Jose Valentin and Ginter and a lesser pitching prospect to Detroit for Weaver and Inge. Dont get me wrong, I do love Carlos and Jose, but I think it makes too much sense to take a deal like that. I am not sure Detroit would go for that, but it would be interesting. the one thing I am sure of is NOT to trade Paul Konerko. He is about to become only the 4th White Sox player in history to go for 30-100....you just can't trade a 25 year old player that does that. I have many more opinions, but I figured I would let you guys rip on me for this one first :)

Not a bad first post Dougs. The trade is iffy, but atleast it's more realistic than that Pirates deal that was mentioned earlier! Welcome aboard anyhow. I think if there are any other long time readers that don't post should also get involved. So if you read this, start postin, we are gonna start thinning out during the offseason so we will need you all.

LongDistanceFan
09-24-2001, 11:12 PM
Originally posted by daver
Weaver will not play for the White Sox and has been Quoted as saying that.I agree that with the fact that you have to trade either Konerko or Lee to get any value back in the trade,and my first choice would be Lee in that scenario.
That being said I think you could trade Lee,Ginter,and Kip Wells and maybe a prospect,to the Rangers for I-Rod,a team that is desperate for pitching and can't afford both Payrod and I-Rod.
But then again what the hell do I know? weaver stats outside killing the sox is not that good, plus he won't play for us, that leaves inge and giving lee in exchange is too high of a price IMO.......

GASHWOUND
09-24-2001, 11:25 PM
Did I see that right? You want to trade Jose, Lee and Ginter for the DEVIL himself, Weaver? AHHHH!! The same guy who was the key culprit in last years BIG FIGHT. Inge? Isn't this the same guy who was provoking the crowd last year too? I rather go bungy jumping of MT. Everest than make that trade. Good grief! I need to congratulate you on your post, you almost made me ill thinking about that trade and its very hard to make me ill. Well, I do get ill when I see the Chubs on TV but thats a whole nother story.

Portage, Hmmm..I think I may have heard of that place.
Welcome the heaven :)

Jerry_Manuel
09-24-2001, 11:30 PM
Originally posted by GASHWOUND
Inge? Isn't this the same guy who was provoking the crowd last year too?

No that was Robert Fick he sucks, Inge can throw.

longshot7
09-25-2001, 01:35 AM
I could be wrong, but I remember reading in the Trib that Weaver is a free agent this offseaon - and the Sox are a possibility.

That being said, I don't make the deal. We could sign 'em. Money talks, ya know.

LongDistanceFan
09-25-2001, 01:47 AM
Originally posted by longshot7
I could be wrong, but I remember reading in the Trib that Weaver is a free agent this offseaon - and the Sox are a possibility.

That being said, I don't make the deal. We could sign 'em. Money talks, ya know. scott boras is his agent and i would not give up a potential 1 rounder for him

Bmr31
09-25-2001, 01:53 AM
Originally posted by GASHWOUND
Did I see that right? You want to trade Jose, Lee and Ginter for the DEVIL himself, Weaver? AHHHH!! The same guy who was the key culprit in last years BIG FIGHT. Inge? Isn't this the same guy who was provoking the crowd last year too? I rather go bungy jumping of MT. Everest than make that trade. Good grief! I need to congratulate you on your post, you almost made me ill thinking about that trade and its very hard to make me ill. Well, I do get ill when I see the Chubs on TV but thats a whole nother story.

Portage, Hmmm..I think I may have heard of that place.
Welcome the heaven :)

Weaver is a future ace. We would be crazy not to make that deal!

dougs78
09-25-2001, 09:16 AM
Ok, thanks for the thoughts on my post there. Here is my rationale behind the move...First and foremost is our pitching staff. With Weaver you get a guy who is very near the top of the AL in IP and CG. Put him with Buehrle and you have some major innings eaters, both of whom are about 25. Then if..if..if...Boomer can come back and be anywhere close to his old self...we can virtually forget about the bullben 3 days in a row. Inge IMO is a no-brainer, he is 24, has a cannon arm (even if he hasn't hit in the bigs yet) and I can recall reading numerous reports that they were shopping him last offseason. From our side, I hate to see the potential of Lee let go, but i think that Borchard may be up next year anyway. I still feel he will be playing left and not center when its all said and done. If not, I would feel fine playing rowand there until he is ready. Valentin is kind of the sticking point, since they have Cruz at SS and becuase of Jose's salary. I'm not saying its the right deal for us, but something like that sure would make sense to me.

Hundley for Prez
09-25-2001, 09:52 AM
I wish Weaver would want to play for the Sox, but I don't see it happening. He's a solid pitcher who will get much better as he gets older. I'm still not sold on Inge. A great throwing arm does not accurately compensate for a weak bat. Inge has never hit at any level, and he was overmatched at AAA when I saw him last year. By way of comparision, Josh Paul looked very solid at the plate in AAA. We don't need a Henry Blanco/Mike Matheny type who will drag down an other wise good offense. It's a high scoring era, stolen bases don't have the value they had in the late 60's and 70's. We've already had one Ron Karkovice, I don't want a second. Sorry Officer!

LongDistanceFan
09-25-2001, 11:20 AM
I think we can get weaver and not for lee. They are in a real need for pitching, and we can help there. Weaver may have worn out his welcome in det, same as roger cedeno - ufa.

but i am not sold on weaver stuff, maybe if he was pitching for us, i would have a different opinion.......

Joel Perez
09-25-2001, 01:03 PM
IF Jeff Weaver changes his stance on not coming to Comiskey, then HELL YES, let's take him. He's still one of the top 10 young pitching prospects IMO, plus his stuff is nasty. As much help that the Tigers need, I think we can get someone with some baseball pitching experience to help us at the South Side.

PaleHoseGeorge
09-25-2001, 01:44 PM
Originally posted by Joel Perez
IF Jeff Weaver changes his stance on not coming to Comiskey, then HELL YES, let's take him. He's still one of the top 10 young pitching prospects IMO, plus his stuff is nasty. As much help that the Tigers need, I think we can get someone with some baseball pitching experience to help us at the South Side.

I don't know too much about the situation in Detroit, but I believe the availability of Weaver is a story certain people have a vested interest in getting out to the public. The primary suspect is Phil Garner. His team has quit on him and he needs to make an excuse for who is to blame. Making Jeff Weaver the bad guy makes Phil faultless.

Of course Weaver is the only decent pitcher on the entire team--a point I'm sure isn't lost on Tigers ownership. If Weaver acts like an animal, he certainly isn't the first or only one to be goaded by Fightin' Phil to behave that way.

By all means, blame Weaver and trade him away. That leaves Garner as the manager. The alternative is to dump Phil and get a manager who can rein in his players. That leaves Weaver as staff ace.

The choice is obvious to everyone except Phil Garner. Which is why (I believe) Detroit's willingness to deal Weaver is bogus.

ihatethecubs
09-25-2001, 02:31 PM
you dont trade the "heart and soul" of the sox for a crybaby who likes to start brawls. plus im sure a lot of sox players dont like weaver and im sure they all like valentin.

Dadawg_77
09-25-2001, 02:49 PM
Weaver is nice, but take a look at the A's. Zito, Mulder and Hudson, I would take any of those three over Weaver. No, I'm not thinking like a scubs fan here. First, given the A's are a small market team, second their best player is a free agent this off season, thrid their won't be a new CBA this off season but a extension of the current one. This also relies on Hudson being up for salary abritration, next year is his fourth year, not sure if the A's have him signed for the long term, (right now he is making 1/2 million so I kind of doubt it)
If the A's keep Jason Giambi, I am not sure they can afford to keep those three arms. The Sox with the right amount of talent, ie Rauch and some other pitching, might be able to work out a deal for one.

LongDistanceFan
09-25-2001, 03:33 PM
Didn't the det players throw weaver into a locker? I think that may have said it right there.

" but then again, what do i know" :)

OfficerKarkovice
09-25-2001, 04:28 PM
We've already had one Ron Karkovice, I don't want a second. Sorry Officer!

That hurts...that really hurts. We'll see after I post a poll. KARK WAS THE MAN.