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View Full Version : We have a ballsy GM


OurBitchinMinny
06-28-2004, 01:28 AM
I dont know who will end up with the better end of this trade. Time will tell. One thing is for sure Ken Williams is a pretty good GM to have. There are so many GMs who sit around and do nothing. KW is trying to do anything he can to win. And its not easy under Reinsdorfs reign. The trades may backfire, but you cant accuse him of not trying. I was on board for the foulke koch trade and so were most sox fans I know. Did it work out? No, but it made sense at the time. Koch was coming off the rolaids relief man award and foulke had a very mediocre year and wanted to become a starter. Most of the deals hes made Ive been happy at the time. I hope people give this trade a chance and if it turns out that we dont resign garcia and dont win the AL pennat or WS go ahead and rip KW. But keep in mind he did it to try and improve the teams chances NOW. Hindsight is always 20/20. I have a lot of respect for him and his passion to win. He doesnt make payroll excuses and tries to make things work. Im happy he is the GM.

ChiWhiteSox1337
06-28-2004, 01:38 AM
:hawk
"He just showed his huge stones on that trade"

I gotta give him credit. It's a shame we have to acquire our talent at the cost of prospects during the season because our owner won't let KW sign any big free agents during the offseason. He does the best that he can and what he thinks is in the best interest of the white sox.

OurBitchinMinny
06-28-2004, 01:41 AM
I agree. Id prefer if JR would uncuff him in the offseason so we dont have to give up so many prospects. But I guess it is good he eventually does uncuff him and allow him to go out and try and improve the team.

kojak
06-28-2004, 01:51 AM
You have balls of steel, my friend..

owensmouth
06-28-2004, 07:28 AM
:hawk
"He just showed his huge stones on that trade"

I gotta give him credit. It's a shame we have to acquire our talent at the cost of prospects during the season because our owner won't let KW sign any big free agents during the offseason. He does the best that he can and what he thinks is in the best interest of the white sox.
Just out of curiosity, what "big free agents" are you thinking of? If he had been able to, I guess we would have tried to pay more for Colon, and where would that have left us? Colon is floundering this year, at 51 million for 4 years.

I question if there was anyone as good as Garcia available this past winter. Pettitte possibly, but he wanted to pitch in his hometown. Clemens wasn't a free agent, he was retired and induced to come back by his buddy Pettitte. Who else of that level was available?

ChiWhiteSox1337
06-28-2004, 07:49 AM
Just out of curiosity, what "big free agents" are you thinking of? If he had been able to, I guess we would have tried to pay more for Colon, and where would that have left us? Colon is floundering this year, at 51 million for 4 years.

I question if there was anyone as good as Garcia available this past winter. Pettitte possibly, but he wanted to pitch in his hometown. Clemens wasn't a free agent, he was retired and induced to come back by his buddy Pettitte. Who else of that level was available? I'm not only talking about last offseason, ever since KW took over at GM he's been handcuffed in the offseason and has to acquire major pieces via trade. Wells, Ritchie, Colon, and Koch. You are right about the depth of pitching in FA last offseason. I'm pretty glad that KW didn't get colon or ponson. I do remember that he was trying to get Freddy G, either through trade or by signing him because there were rumors that the mariners weren't going to offer him arbitration. IMO, I'm happy that we gave up Olivo, Reed, and Morse rather than one of our big offensive guns in Lee, Konerko, or Ordonez

soxtalker
06-28-2004, 07:53 AM
I dont know who will end up with the better end of this trade. Time will tell. One thing is for sure Ken Williams is a pretty good GM to have. There are so many GMs who sit around and do nothing. KW is trying to do anything he can to win. And its not easy under Reinsdorfs reign. The trades may backfire, but you cant accuse him of not trying. I was on board for the foulke koch trade and so were most sox fans I know. Did it work out? No, but it made sense at the time. Koch was coming off the rolaids relief man award and foulke had a very mediocre year and wanted to become a starter. Most of the deals hes made Ive been happy at the time. I hope people give this trade a chance and if it turns out that we dont resign garcia and dont win the AL pennat or WS go ahead and rip KW. But keep in mind he did it to try and improve the teams chances NOW. Hindsight is always 20/20. I have a lot of respect for him and his passion to win. He doesnt make payroll excuses and tries to make things work. Im happy he is the GM. I agree with the title of your post, but not necessarily the conclusion that KW "is a pretty good GM to have." KW's aggressiveness seems to be the characteristic of his that most appeals to many of the WSI posters and to the media. I don't find it that appealing. If his trades backfire, they are bad moves, and we would be better served by not making the trades. I'm not advocating going back to Schueler, who would never make a move that would cost him anything in the farm system. In the end, it is the quality of the trades in addition to their frequency and magnitude that is important. I still think that the jury is out on KW, in general, as well as this trade.

What I do like about KW is his ability to find diamonds in other organizations. In fact, I have come to very much appreciate his minor trades. It's the big ones that I haven't been so crazy about. So, maybe he has seen something in Davis that will make this look great. Maybe he does know he can sign Garcia long term. Maybe.

JRIG
06-28-2004, 08:42 AM
I dont know who will end up with the better end of this trade. Time will tell. One thing is for sure Ken Williams is a pretty good GM to have. There are so many GMs who sit around and do nothing. KW is trying to do anything he can to win. And its not easy under Reinsdorfs reign. The trades may backfire, but you cant accuse him of not trying. I was on board for the foulke koch trade and so were most sox fans I know. Did it work out? No, but it made sense at the time. Koch was coming off the rolaids relief man award and foulke had a very mediocre year and wanted to become a starter. Most of the deals hes made Ive been happy at the time. I hope people give this trade a chance and if it turns out that we dont resign garcia and dont win the AL pennat or WS go ahead and rip KW. But keep in mind he did it to try and improve the teams chances NOW. Hindsight is always 20/20. I have a lot of respect for him and his passion to win. He doesnt make payroll excuses and tries to make things work. Im happy he is the GM.
Yep, and that ballsyness has resulted in a grand total of zero playoff appearances in what is probably the weakest division in baeball. But at least we're being aggressive!

SoxFan76
06-28-2004, 09:06 AM
I was very upset last night, but I've had a night to cool off, and I know this deal is for the best. Miguel is a hell of a talent, but pitching wins championships. But damn Kenny, Miguel Olivo? I'm gonna miss that guy.

kevingrt
06-28-2004, 09:38 AM
I was very upset last night, but I've had a night to cool off, and I know this deal is for the best. Miguel is a hell of a talent, but pitching wins championships. But damn Kenny, Miguel Olivo? I'm gonna miss that guy.
I can't agree with you more SoxFan76! But if we can get Garcia to a long-term contract we should be good.

As for KW being ballsy. Hit the "GO" button on the Jones and Ortiz for Maggs deal, and KW isn't just ballsy but he is B squard, Ballsy & Brilliant!:rolleyes:

Dadawg_77
06-28-2004, 10:13 AM
"There is no try. There is do and do not."
-Yoda.

bobj4400
06-28-2004, 10:29 AM
Yep, and that ballsyness has resulted in a grand total of zero playoff appearances in what is probably the weakest division in baeball. But at least we're being aggressive!No playoff appearances is more a reflection on Gandhi Manuel if you ask me...

gosox41
06-28-2004, 10:36 AM
I was very upset last night, but I've had a night to cool off, and I know this deal is for the best. Miguel is a hell of a talent, but pitching wins championships. But damn Kenny, Miguel Olivo? I'm gonna miss that guy.
I liked Miguel's charisma most. He was always smiling and seemed to be having fujn playing the game.

I think Reed is going to be a damn good major league player assuming he's healthy. Morse also looked like he was turning the corner and it's not like the Sox have a ton of SS prospects in the minors.

Is anyone surprised the Sox did not give up one pitcher in this deal? I thought for sure it would require a top pitching prospect in a package to get a Freddy Garcia. Then again maybe Seattle didn't like any of our pitchers.


Bob

OurBitchinMinny
06-28-2004, 10:34 PM
Yep, and that ballsyness has resulted in a grand total of zero playoff appearances in what is probably the weakest division in baeball. But at least we're being aggressive!
Williams cant go out and play for them. Its not his fault that the team last year didnt win the division. You cant tell me the twins were the more talented team. A GMs job is to put talent on the field. The manager and the players themselves must produce. Its hard to win divisions when you are playing with your hands around your throat.

cornball
06-28-2004, 10:43 PM
:hawk
"He just showed his huge stones on that trade"

I gotta give him credit. It's a shame we have to acquire our talent at the cost of prospects during the season because our owner won't let KW sign any big free agents during the offseason. He does the best that he can and what he thinks is in the best interest of the white sox.

Agree and for the most part many of the prospects he traded are still prospects. Many of the smaller deals have worked for him such as Singleton for Harris or Bradford for Olivio.....ect. Thats what prospects are for, in part to bad you cant suppliment it with a FA signing here or there. I like the job he has done.

hawkjt
06-29-2004, 12:22 PM
I think it takes a ton of guts to make the deals he has made. It is so easy to criticize after the fact like the Wells for sirotka is considered a bust. Who knew that Well would herniate a disc and not pitch. He bounced right back with a couple of strong years. Bad luck. Sitoka also has crapped out for Toronto. Bradford for Miguel has turned into Bradford for Freddy. Foulke for Koch and Kotts was done cuz there was no way the sox were paying foulke 24 miillion a year later for 3 years, He would have been gone without even a Cotts or the ss from the Marlins in the koch deal. Ritchie for Wells and fogg was bad but fogg is a high era guy and wells is still garland -like in his erratic performance. I think it is so easy to look back on deals but looking forward and pulling the triggger is like high wire without a net. Good job KW!!