PDA

View Full Version : Kenny's bad?


nodiggity59
06-21-2004, 12:48 PM
It's already mid June and the Sox still haven't picked up any pitching help. Is Kenny to blame for not making a move or is the market not ready?

I think if he's waited this long then the move he makes better be dynamite. I haven't waited this long for him to duff this one.

SEALgep
06-21-2004, 12:53 PM
It's already mid June and the Sox still haven't picked up any pitching help. Is Kenny to blame for not making a move or is the market not ready?

I think if he's waited this long then the move he makes better be dynamite. I haven't waited this long for him to duff this one.What makes you think one of the most aggressive GM's out there is sitting on his thumb just for the hell of it. He's trying to make moves, but he needs to be sensible as well. Give him a break. If there were other clubs making extreme moves left and right, then there would major call for concern. However, no one is doing anything, so it is premature to start criticizing him for not doing anything when no one else is either.

TornLabrum
06-21-2004, 02:30 PM
Nothing is going to happen until after the All-Star Break. It has nothing to do with Williams. It has everything to do with clubs waiting to see where they stand at the half-way point before they become buyers or sellers.

The_Floridian
06-21-2004, 02:36 PM
Kenny has not made any moves for a simple reason: Every team in the league knows we desperately need a fifth starter and so they are trying to milk the trade for as much as they can get. That's what you do, you take advantage when a team is in dire need of something, which we are.

My guess is that all of the teams KW is trying to deal witha re asking for more than he wants to give. Suddenly, a balanced trade becomes severely unbalanced because of our obvious need for what is available.

I'm sure KW is doing his best, but anyone who says he's moving too slow better not get pissed when he has to give up two or three good prospects to get it.

pinwheels3530
06-21-2004, 02:43 PM
i Belive KW is going to make a move, right now the team just needs to keep winning!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:yup:

jabrch
06-21-2004, 04:19 PM
just one question - who were all the SPs who have been traded so far during the season that KW missed out on?

Flight #24
06-21-2004, 04:29 PM
just one question - who were all the SPs who have been traded so far during the season that KW missed out on?Well, there was Freddy Garcia....no...wait....
Oh yeah - Ben Sheets.....ummmm...
Livan Hernandez.....nah......
Kris Benson.....nope.....

AHA!!!! Fire KW- he missed out on the biggest name pitcher traded yet...Billy Koch!

(yes, I know he's not an SP)

jabrch
06-21-2004, 04:47 PM
Well, there was Freddy Garcia....no...wait....
Oh yeah - Ben Sheets.....ummmm...
Livan Hernandez.....nah......
Kris Benson.....nope.....

AHA!!!! Fire KW- he missed out on the biggest name pitcher traded yet...Billy Koch!

(yes, I know he's not an SP)
*****

thepaulbowski
06-21-2004, 04:50 PM
:threadsucks

comiskey
06-21-2004, 05:17 PM
For us to actually say that we have a fifth starter is ridiculous. I think the pitcher actually needs to make it through the first three innings of a ballgame before we can even call it a start. Right now, it is more like batting practice for the opposition. Anyone else sick of the White Sox just accepting the fact that we are continually giving away these games as if they don't matter? I know I have grown sicker and sicker as the Twins have blown by us once again in the standings due to our inability to produce at the fifth spot in the rotation.

Everyone has different theories on why the Sox haven't acquired a solid fifth starter yet, but I say look at the origination of the problem....the offseason. We should have had a full pitching staff prior to the start of the season. Let's face it, we're lucky to even be where we are now. Garland was still "growing" before the season started, and though he hasn't been stellar, he has been productive, especially in overall quality starts (6.0+ innings pitched). Schoeneweis was a huge gamble as an everyday starter, and fortunately to this point, that gamble has paid off. Buehrle and Loaiza were projected to be our #1 and #2 starters and have performed as expected. However, Kenny Williams insisted that pitching was an "offseason priority" for the White Sox. How did he do? We kept Koch as our main closer, thank goodness that chapter is now over for the Sox. Anyone still happy that we got rid of Foulke, or that we didn't try to acquire Armando Benitez or Ugeth Urbina? How about Cliff Politte? This acquisition has begun to draw my ire more and more with each outing. Of course, we all knew Politte wasn't going to be anything special anyway, so his performance has just about equalled our expectations. I still don't understand why filling the rotation prior to the start of this season was a problem? Oh yeah, the dreaded team "budget". Not much of a budget for a large market team, is it? What was it again, 58 million? Wow, that is almost enough money to retain our current players, let alone acquire additional ones. I can understand a team budget, as many baseball organizations need them these days. I cannot, however, tolerate a budget that doesn't allow the southside of Chicago to place a championship contender on the field each and every year. Offensively, we have a multitude of talent and production on our team. The White Sox are currently leading the majors in SLG %, Batting Avg., Runs Scored, RBI, and are second in total bases and HR. That is more than enough offensive support to get a team to the top. Our main problem, as it seemingly is every year, lies in the pitching staff. I appreciate the current effort being shown by Mark Buehrle, Esteban Loaiza, and even the blooming Jon Garland, but does anyone think we really have a shot to win the AL Central division, let alone a playoff series, without a solid fifth starter and bullpen staff? Let's make the move to get a Freddy Garcia or Livan Hernandez on our staff. Let's make the Twins sweat it out and try to match us as our team becomes even stronger. Let's show everyone in Chicago, especially on the southside, that the White Sox are serious about winning a world championship. For now, it's all words on Kenny Williams part. All we hear is "we're trying to get a deal done", or "right now, there is not a good fit trade-wise". Enough already. Don't tell us that you're trying to get it done, just get it done. White Sox fans are some the most supportive and vocal fans out there, and we're proud of that. We're also some of the most frustrated and unappreciated fans as well, through both the media and with Sox management and ownership. That is not something to be proud of, and the perception that we are an unimportant part of Chicago baseball is frustrating for all of us. It's time to change the perception. Get it done, Kenny. We all believe that you can do it, however, the faith and support that we provide will easily be outweighed by our frustration and discontent if the Sox can't pull out a division crown this year and make a run at the AL pennant.

GO WHITE SOX!!! - comiskey :bandance:

CWSGuy406
06-21-2004, 05:32 PM
Comiskey - my apologies if I'm being a jerk here - but I suggest you break up that huge paragraph.

I'm sure it's a real good post, but it's a lot easier on the eyes if you break it up every five or six lines. Just a suggestion, so take it for what it's worth...

34 Inch Stick
06-21-2004, 05:35 PM
Paragraphs!

fquaye149
06-21-2004, 05:48 PM
Comiskey - my apologies if I'm being a jerk here - but I suggest you break up that huge paragraph.

I'm sure it's a real good post, but it's a lot easier on the eyes if you break it up every five or six lines. Just a suggestion, so take it for what it's worth...

basically it just said:

a.) we don't have a 5th starter

b.) kenny should have traded for one in the offseason

c.) if we get garcia or livan we can make the twins sweat

hawkjt
06-21-2004, 06:06 PM
Comisky: short memory- last year the pitching was very solid. 3rd in the league. The payroll is 65million.Losing Flash was probably the biggest hit over the offseason. Who were the free agent hurlers available to the Sox last offseason? Colon- bad so far this year. Maddux- ok but not great. Vasquez, Brown were traded for - Ponson-bad Schilling- traded for. Clemens and Pettit- Texas only. I can not think of one great free agent pitcher available. Danny Wright had a season ending arm injury. That sucks and blows the plan apart.

It is easy to be critical of Kenny for not just trading for a pitcher but it is a balancing act between giving away the future outfielders when Maggs will go away most likely and not pulling the trigger to give us a chance this year. This team has had the best record of any pro team in town over the last 14 years and they sustain competive ability by being smart. Kenny will trade smart. Patience

dpbyron
06-21-2004, 06:09 PM
:threadblows:

beckett21
06-21-2004, 06:14 PM
Kenny has not made any moves for a simple reason: Every team in the league knows we desperately need a fifth starter and so they are trying to milk the trade for as much as they can get. That's what you do, you take advantage when a team is in dire need of something, which we are.

My guess is that all of the teams KW is trying to deal witha re asking for more than he wants to give. Suddenly, a balanced trade becomes severely unbalanced because of our obvious need for what is available.

I'm sure KW is doing his best, but anyone who says he's moving too slow better not get pissed when he has to give up two or three good prospects to get it.
Exactly.

The moment Kenny makes a Reed- for -Garcia-type deal he is sure to be branded the village idiot by some of the same people clamoring for a deal.

He either overpays now, or lets the other side get impatient and gets them to blink first. It's just like buying a car or a house. You have to be willing to walk away from the table, or else they know they have you over a barrel. You have to make them want the deal more. If the M's don't trade Garcia, he walks--let them sweat it out.

He is playing his hand about as well as one could hope for now. Patience. (Yes I am sick of the 5th starters too, :dunno: whatcha gonna do?)

Dadawg_77
06-21-2004, 08:49 PM
It's already mid June and the Sox still haven't picked up any pitching help. Is Kenny to blame for not making a move or is the market not ready?

I think if he's waited this long then the move he makes better be dynamite. I haven't waited this long for him to duff this one.
The market isn't right yet, but hopefully something will break soon. As soon as first trade happens, the market should break open.

Dadawg_77
06-21-2004, 08:59 PM
basically it just said:

a.) we don't have a 5th starter

b.) kenny should have traded for one in the offseason

c.) if we get garcia or livan we can make the twins sweat
The Sox have a fifth starter, just too bad he is the fourth starter on the team. The team needs a 2-3 guy. I think an ace won't be attainable for a reasonable price.

Also demand is high as there are several teams who should be making a run another starter and Yankees, who want buy everything. Supply is limited to three guys at most. Thus we have a sellers market. In additional teams which need to go younger, Seattle, they could value a top draft pick then some marginal prospects so they can afford to sit for a good deal.