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tstrike2000
06-07-2004, 12:32 AM
Ok, first, we don't even need to go into Billy Koch. Using this guy has always been horrifying experience. Yet, Sox management keep making excuses for this guy and still let him pitch. We've screwed around with this 5th starter thing for how long now...for about 3 years or so? Obviously, a need, placed in the hopes Danny Wrong would arrive. The only thing that arrived was his plane, when he was sent back down to Charlotte. We are fortunate, so far, that Schoeneweis even developed into a 4th starter. It's also very difficult to play small ball when no one on the team knows how to bunt. Unfortunately, with Maggs on the DL for a 4-7 weeks, the offense is going to suffer unless someone in the middle of the lineup gets red hot. The bullpen is another issue: Koch, Politte, and Adkins are the three right handed stooges in the bullpen. All three don't have an established breaking pitch and throw a straight mid 90's fastball, often for first pitch balls, getting behind in the count. We can't pitch Takatsu every night. Unless KW get's a rent-a-pitcher for a 5th starter that has an ERA under 6.00, we get rid of Krotch, and we learn to start manufacturing runs more when we aren't pounding out 10 runs a game, (to name a few things) it'll be hard for the Sox to again hold off a better managed and more disciplined Twins team.

SSN721
06-07-2004, 08:12 AM
I think this team has improved leaps and bounds in bunting over the last few years. They have shown the aility to play small ball and manufacture runs. As was pointed out in another thread if we cant close the game thought hats what makes games we get 1 or 2 run leads with small ball are hard to win. If we cant get someone to end the game then it wont work. But I think they can manufacture runs quite well. A fifth starter would be nice and I think we will get it but even if for some reason we dont I still think the staff and bullpen, minus Koch of course is much better then any team in our division and the top four of the rotation can stack up with most other great staffs in baseball. As long as we stop using Billy to closer I see no reason why this team will not win the division.

Bucktown
06-07-2004, 10:33 AM
Originally posted by tstrike2000
... it'll be hard for the Sox to again hold off a better managed and more disciplined Twins team.
Care to put money on that belief?

BearSox
06-07-2004, 10:37 AM
Bunting has not been one of our problems as of late as the team has been laying down some very good bunts. Last year, yes it was a problem but no this year.

MRKARNO
06-07-2004, 11:09 AM
Originally posted by tstrike2000
it'll be hard for the Sox to again hold off a better managed and more disciplined Twins team.

The only thing on the Twins which I envy is their closer and their catcher (Olivo is just too much of a free swinger for my taste). They can have the rest (except Greisinger would make a much better 5th starter). Our team is leaps and bounds better than theirs. If Ozzie gets his crap together and does what Manuel did last year (relegating Koch to clean up) then we'll be in good shape. Notice how we didnt start winning until he did that.

maurice
06-07-2004, 11:52 AM
:threadsucks

Nice title. I was shocked to see that the thread starter wasn't Lip.

PaulDrake
06-07-2004, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by maurice
:threadsucks

Nice title. I was shocked to see that the thread starter wasn't Lip. Oh well, that's the way things are around here lately. Don't like a posters comment? Just put up that hideous thumbs down "this thread sucks" tag. This one from a poster FWIW I consider to be pretty sharp.

Looking at the White Sox objectively, the team has a number of weaknesses and shortcomings. Last night was a gut wrenching loss. This is Ozzie's biggest test so far. If he can keep the team on track and help restore their equilibrium, then I say they have a good chance at winning the division. A Manuel led team would fold up like an accordion. They proved that more than once. Even if the Sox can swallow this bitter loss and come out fighting and prevail in the division race, there is no way I see this team going anywhere in the playoffs. I've rooted for the Sox a long time. This team isn't even in my own top ten Sox teams of my lifetime. My great hope is that Ozzie will be the caliber of Lopez and LaRussa, and that he can lead a team that will equal and surpass the two best Sox teams I ever saw. This team is not in their league, but hopefully they can build some momentum to take us where we haven't been for 87 years.

StepsInSC
06-07-2004, 12:10 PM
Well...no team is perfect...especially in this division. Minny has been struggling with the DRays so I'm not exactly terrified as of yet.

I can be very pessimistic but I'll wait until we're at least out of first place before I begin the doom and gloom.

maurice
06-07-2004, 12:26 PM
If you're looking at the White Sox completely objectively, you're missing the point of this board. Ditto for those who post a thread with a title proclaiming that the first-place White Sox will not win their division. There's a good chance that they (or any other first-place team) will fail down the stretch, but given the purpose and motto of this site, it's a poor choice of thread title.

I understand that Sox fans tend towards premature doom-and-gloom (often with good reason), but that's antithetical to the motto of this site. The previous post sums it up nicely.

PaulDrake
06-07-2004, 12:50 PM
If you're looking at the White Sox completely objectively, you're missing the point of this board I just can't look at the Sox through rose colored glasses. Your other comments are well taken. I just hate that tag. Call me an old grouch, whatever. Put a new tag "PaulDrake sucks", we'll both have a laugh. I just don't like the Jerry Springerization of society. Do you think I could copyright that phrase? I could use the dough.

idseer
06-07-2004, 12:54 PM
Originally posted by PaulDrake
Oh well, that's the way things are around here lately. Don't like a posters comment? Just put up that hideous thumbs down "this thread sucks" tag. This one from a poster FWIW I consider to be pretty sharp.



i agree! i see nothing wrong with someone labeling their thread as they wish and after giving a somewhat detailed analysis they don't deserve some clown throwing that crap picture up and telling the original poster his idea stinks.

Rocky Soprano
06-07-2004, 12:56 PM
:chickenlittle

How many games are left in the season? Are we not still in first. I am sure that we are not the only ones sick of seeing Kotch blow saves.

the_valenstache
06-07-2004, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by maurice
If you're looking at the White Sox completely objectively, you're missing the point of this board. Ditto for those who post a thread with a title proclaiming that the first-place White Sox will not win their division. There's a good chance that they (or any other first-place team) will fail down the stretch, but given the purpose and motto of this site, it's a poor choice of thread title.

I understand that Sox fans tend towards premature doom-and-gloom (often with good reason), but that's antithetical to the motto of this site.

Cheers. :gulp:

Although it is nice to be grounded in reality about our shortcomings every now and then, these weekly "Sox will lose it all because..." are becoming unnecessary and repetitive. Go to the Twins or Cubs board and post this trash.

maurice
06-07-2004, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by PaulDrake
I just can't look at the Sox through rose colored glasses. Your other comments are well taken. I just hate that tag. Call me an old grouch, whatever.

You're an old grouch. :D:

Consider "rose colored glasses" the happy mid-point between (1) cubbie crackheads, and (2) the "clowns" who constantly want to bitch about the impending doom to be visited upon Chicago's only first-place club and to whine if anybody calls them out on their BS. (The two groups often have the same membership).

Save the non-partisan objectivity for the PI board. (Not that you'll find much there.)

Skorch
06-07-2004, 01:59 PM
Originally posted by the_valenstache Although it is nice to be grounded in reality about our shortcomings every now and then, these weekly "Sox will lose it all because..." are becoming unnecessary and repetitive. Go to the Twins or Cubs board and post this trash.

Actually, as a Twins fan I don't think it'd get a lot of play there either. I know that I and everyone else I know that follows baseball realizes there's a lot of season left to play. It's not over by a long shot. The Sox have a decent shot at winning the division, especially if their starting rotation holds up as well as it has been.

Your feelings on Koch entering a game are similar to how I feel whenever JC Romero comes in for the Twins. Why Gardenhire insists on bringing him in during close and late situations is beyond me when he's clearly struggling. At least he's not closing like they'd talked about after Guardado and Hawkins left.

tstrike2000
06-07-2004, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by Bucktown
Care to put money on that belief?

No, I don't want to put money on it because I'm hoping I'm wrong.

gosox41
06-07-2004, 04:28 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
The only thing on the Twins which I envy is their closer and their catcher (Olivo is just too much of a free swinger for my taste). They can have the rest (except Greisinger would make a much better 5th starter). Our team is leaps and bounds better than theirs. If Ozzie gets his crap together and does what Manuel did last year (relegating Koch to clean up) then we'll be in good shape. Notice how we didnt start winning until he did that.

On paper the Sox were leaps and bounds better then there's the last couple of years. It hasn't gotten us very far. And if you consider Harris a second baseman and not a CFer (which I do) then I'd take Hunter over Rowand or Perez.



Bob

pinwheels3530
06-07-2004, 05:29 PM
THE SOX WILLWIN THE DIVISION!!!!