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View Full Version : *Official Twins Update Thread* vs. D-rays - 6/3/04-


ndgt10
06-03-2004, 01:40 PM
Top 6th, D-rays 4 twins 2, Santana had a no-hitter going into the six only to give up 4 runs capped by an aubrey huff 2 out, 3-run homerun.

Palehose13
06-03-2004, 01:46 PM
Thanks for posting this. Keep us updated. GO D-RAYS!!!!

HomeFish
06-03-2004, 01:47 PM
1-2-3 inning for Hendrickson against the Twins in the 6th.

Tino, Hall, and Blum (who is 1-for-2) up next for Tampa. They need to keep scoring to Sosa-proof this game.

ndgt10
06-03-2004, 02:00 PM
Ford grounds into double play to end the 7th. We go to the 8th with the rays leading 4-2.

HomeFish
06-03-2004, 02:11 PM
D-Rays missed a wonderful chance to score. Still 4-2.

Uh-oh. Here comes the Devil Ray bullpen. 2-0 on the leadoff man.

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by HomeFish
D-Rays missed a wonderful chance to score. Still 4-2.

Uh-oh. Here comes the Devil Ray bullpen. 2-0 on the leadoff man.

Easy. 1-2-3 in the bottom of 8.

ChiSox7
06-03-2004, 02:23 PM
Drays add one. 5-2 in top of 9th

pudge
06-03-2004, 02:24 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
Drays add one. 5-2 in top of 9th

woo hoo!!

CyYoung5621
06-03-2004, 02:24 PM
3 more outs devil dogs take em!

Fungo
06-03-2004, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by HomeFish
1-2-3 inning for Hendrickson against the Twins in the 6th.

Tino, Hall, and Blum (who is 1-for-2) up next for Tampa. They need to keep scoring to Sosa-proof this game.
Hey, another Sosa had quite a day against Tampa a year ago today.

Cellview22
06-03-2004, 02:27 PM
I'll be a lot more at peace with 2 games in front than just 1 game in front.

It'll make this off day a bit more bearable!

Unregistered
06-03-2004, 02:28 PM
1 out, 2 to go...

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by Cellview22
I'll be a lot more at peace with 2 games in front than just 1 game in front.

It'll make this off day a bit more bearable!

Not only would it be a two-game lead, but also a three-game edge in the all important loss column.

Cellview22
06-03-2004, 02:33 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
Not only would it be a two-game lead, but also a three-game edge in the all important loss column.

True! That's huge..

1 more out to go :smile:

Unregistered
06-03-2004, 02:35 PM
:twinslose
:)
They're in a helluva skid right now...

mdep524
06-03-2004, 02:35 PM
...And this ballgame is ov-ah!! :)

ndgt10
06-03-2004, 02:35 PM
:twinslose

Cellview22
06-03-2004, 02:35 PM
He gone!!

Nice job Baez

HomeFish
06-03-2004, 02:36 PM
The Messiah strikes out.

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 02:37 PM
This series proves that the Twins don't have what it takes to win this division.

ChiSox7
06-03-2004, 02:40 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
This series proves that the Twins don't have what it takes to win this division.

Be careful what you say man. I said the SAME thing when the Twins lost 14 of 16 to crappy or mediocre teams and look what happened.

That was a HUGE loss for them to actually lose a series at home to the Drays.

But at the same time. They have sucked majorly for two weeks. Haven't won a series in two weeks. Have been injured out the wazoo all year, and yet they are only two games out of first. We need to start taking advantage, cause as much as we would like to think it, they won't suck all year.

Baby Fisk
06-03-2004, 02:43 PM
I'm less worried by the Twins than I am the Sox. What I mean is, I'm more worried that the Twins won't beat the Sox as much as the Sox will lose. Wait, I meant that I worry more about the Sox more than I worry about the Twins, even though the Sox could lose to them still. OH GOD THIS IS WHAT IT MUST BE LIKE IN YOGI BERRA'S MIND! :(:

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 02:46 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
Be careful what you say man. I said the SAME thing when the Twins lost 14 of 16 to crappy or mediocre teams and look what happened.

That was a HUGE loss for them to actually lose a series at home to the Drays.

But at the same time. They have sucked majorly for two weeks. Haven't won a series in two weeks. Have been injured out the wazoo all year, and yet they are only two games out of first. We need to start taking advantage, cause as much as we would like to think it, they won't suck all year.

I see what you are saying, but the schedule certainly doesn't bode well. We've played a lot more games against .500 or better ball clubs.

Losing three of 4 at home to a team with six road wins is not the way to get the job done.

I will sleep much better tonight.

HebrewHammer
06-03-2004, 02:51 PM
:notwinks

ChiSox7
06-03-2004, 02:52 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
I see what you are saying, but the schedule certainly doesn't bode well. We've played a lot more games against .500 or better ball clubs.

Losing three of 4 at home to a team with six road wins is not the way to get the job done.

I will sleep much better tonight.

Oh absolutely I agree with you. It definately makes me feel a lot better about the mess in Oakland. I will def sleep much better.

Now we need to take advantage and do some work in Seattle.

samram
06-03-2004, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
Oh absolutely I agree with you. It definately makes me feel a lot better about the mess in Oakland. I will def sleep much better.

Now we need to take advantage and do some work in Seattle.

Yep. The great thing is the Sox scratch two games with Oakland off the schedule and the Twins scratch four games at home off with Tampa- it can only get tougher for them. Maybe the D-Rays are to the Twins what the Tigers were to the Sox last year.

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by samram
Yep. The great thing is the Sox scratch two games with Oakland off the schedule and the Twins scratch four games at home off with Tampa- it can only get tougher for them. Maybe the D-Rays are to the Twins what the Tigers were to the Sox last year.

You know damn well that Twins fans are banging their heads off the wall like we did last year with the Tigers.

Thing is, even if Minny sweeps the two-game set in July, they still have lost the season series to a miserable team. To boot, six of those nine games will have been played in Minnesota.

Works for me :D:

Iwritecode
06-03-2004, 03:06 PM
For anyone that thought Sox fans were being a bunch of "chicken littles" yesterday, check out any Twins MB right now...

ChiSox7
06-03-2004, 03:07 PM
Originally posted by Iwritecode
For anyone that thought Sox fans were being a bunch of "chicken littles" yesterday, check out any Twins MB right now...

You have a link?

rahulsekhar
06-03-2004, 03:08 PM
Originally posted by Unregistered
:twinslose
:)
They're in a helluva skid right now...

Interesting that the skid sort of coincides with them gettign healthier: Hunter, Koskie, leCroy, Mauer have all come back in the past few weeks (OK - Mauer just today, but still).

I believe someone pointed out that the subs played WAY over their heads for a while and at least as well as the regulars were expected to, and that there could easily be a letdown when the regulars came back. Seems to be proven out a bit.

Iwritecode
06-03-2004, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
You have a link?

I'm sure there are more but the Twins troll board (http://boards.go.com/cgi/mlb/request.dll?LIST&room=mlb_min) is one place to look...

samram
06-03-2004, 03:15 PM
Originally posted by Iwritecode
I'm sure there are more but the Twins troll board (http://boards.go.com/cgi/mlb/request.dll?LIST&room=mlb_min) is one place to look...

Man, I love seeing them wonder if the Twins can keep pace with the Sox all year. They have to know that their schedule is pretty backloaded and each loss to these weaker teams just means they have to make it up against someone better. There's also some guy on there saying Mauer should be traded.

SOXSINCE'70
06-03-2004, 03:29 PM
YYYYEESSSS!!!


:twinslose

Lip Man 1
06-03-2004, 03:31 PM
Thank God for small favors. Do you think they can do this say for the next four weeks with Mags out?????

Lip

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 04:29 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
This series proves that the Twins don't have what it takes to win this division.

You hit it right on the head. The Twins are GARBAGE!!! I keep trying to tell everyone that this isn't the same Twins team that we saw last year where they were winning sooooo many games that they should not have. This is a garbage team with no starting pitching and the offense isnt that great either. The facts are that the team that has the best RS/RA differential will consistantly win more than the team with the worse. The Twins are finally regressing to where they should be. Two-horse race? Hells no. This division is a one horse race, but that doesnt mean that we dont need to be stronger to make a run at the World Series. Hell if we won the AL, I'd be happy as hell.

I was convinced the Twins would win after seeing they were up 2-0 in the top of the 6th. I decided not to bother to check the score until I got home so that I wouldnt be pissed until I got home, but then I got on the board and I was elated!

ma-gaga
06-03-2004, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
You know damn well that Twins fans are banging their heads off the wall like we did last year with the Tigers.


[throws hands up in air] It's worse. It's like you expect them to lose these games now. Kind of like earlier this year, I expected them to come back and win EVERY game. I'm sitting here at work 'watching' the game on CBS Sportsline's gamecaster, and as soon as Santana lost his no hitter I knew he was in trouble... He must have lost focus after that first hit, and Huff is too good of a hitter to lose focus on (think Maggs, 4 years ago)...

ugh. They need a series against Detroit... oh hey...
Man, I love the AL Central...

:gulp: going to drown some sorrows... mmmmm beer.

TomParrish79
06-03-2004, 05:24 PM
2 game lead boys gotta love it.

munchman33
06-03-2004, 08:16 PM
Originally posted by TomParrish79
2 game lead boys gotta love it.

That's the best news I've heard all day.

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 08:22 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
You hit it right on the head. The Twins are GARBAGE!!! I keep trying to tell everyone that this isn't the same Twins team that we saw last year where they were winning sooooo many games that they should not have. This is a garbage team with no starting pitching and the offense isnt that great either. The facts are that the team that has the best RS/RA differential will consistantly win more than the team with the worse. The Twins are finally regressing to where they should be. Two-horse race? Hells no. This division is a one horse race, but that doesnt mean that we dont need to be stronger to make a run at the World Series. Hell if we won the AL, I'd be happy as hell.

I was convinced the Twins would win after seeing they were up 2-0 in the top of the 6th. I decided not to bother to check the score until I got home so that I wouldnt be pissed until I got home, but then I got on the board and I was elated!
The twins aren't garbage. Sure they probably aren't as strong as they have been but they aren't garbage. Remember last year they went on a huge slump before the asb then went on a tear afterwards. The difference this year is that the twins tough opponents come after the break so hopefully they won't do that again this year. The twins always scare me though because they just know how to win and I won't count them out until they are mathematically eliminated. I do believe the sox have the best team in this division and should win it but that hasn't mattered in years past. I think the sox will win the central but I will never count the twins out.

iwannago
06-03-2004, 08:23 PM
Originally posted by ndgt10
Top 6th, D-rays 4 twins 2, Santana had a no-hitter going into the six only to give up 4 runs capped by an aubrey huff 2 out, 3-run homerun.

Go DRays

:)

ode to veeck
06-03-2004, 08:52 PM
Tampa went into Minnesota having only won a pathetic MLB worst 3 of 20 games on the road (the next worst Tribe with 2X as many road wins)

... and promptly won 3 or 4 from the Twinkies, their first road series win in 12 tries

(& we thought we had a bad series)

HomeFish
06-03-2004, 08:57 PM
He who doubts the Twins never lives long enough to regret it. I would caution against taking the Twins any less seriously because of this.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:00 PM
Originally posted by OEO Magglio
The twins aren't garbage. Sure they probably aren't as strong as they have been but they aren't garbage. Remember last year they went on a huge slump before the asb then went on a tear afterwards. The difference this year is that the twins tough opponents come after the break so hopefully they won't do that again this year. The twins always scare me though because they just know how to win and I won't count them out until they are mathematically eliminated. I do believe the sox have the best team in this division and should win it but that hasn't mattered in years past. I think the sox will win the central but I will never count the twins out.

I'll count the Twins as contenders again if they are ever able to reclaim first place. This isn't the same team as last year. Santana was just awesome last year and they had a decent pitching staff. They are already pitching their way out of it. Compare:

SP1 Buehrle vs Radke = Buehrle by a decent amount despite their similar ERAs
SP2 Loaiza vs Santana Loaiza by a ton
SP3 Garland vs Lohse Garland by a ton
SP4 Schoeneweis vs Silva Schoeneweis by a decent amount (because Silva has all the warning signs of a huge blowup, 3.5 K/9 .314 BAA, 1.48 WHIP)
SP5 5th starter vs Greisinger Greisinger by a lot

So basically we're destroying them in Starting pitching save for the 5th starter. We will win this division comfortably if this keeps up.

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
We will win this division comfortably if this keeps up.
If it keeps up of course the sox will win the division easily. Johan will be fine imo. I can almost promise you the twins will go on a hot streak again. I hope I'm wrong but the twins just know how to win, period.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by HomeFish
He who doubts the Twins never lives long enough to regret it. I would caution against taking the Twins any less seriously because of this.

You make it sound like the Twins are the Braves and have won 14 straight division championships or whatever. The Twins have won, what 2 division titles in a row and they've been challenged one of those two times. Yeah they have outperformed their Pythagorean W-L those two years by a lot, but you can only go so far when you're getting outscored by your opponents. It's the same line of reasoning that would lead one to conclude that it's unlikely the Reds keep it up.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by OEO Magglio
Johan will be fine imo.

I've heard rumors of arm problems....

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 09:07 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
I've heard rumors of arm problems....
Well if thats the case, I'm wrong as usual. :)

elrod
06-03-2004, 09:10 PM
I think Lohse is the one most likely to turn it around. Santana is pitching all year in the rotation for the first time. Once he lost his first game he hasn't had a good outing since. He seems to get a few good innings and then falls apart in the 4th, 5th or 6th inning. Sort of like Danny Wright was the last couple years, or Garland when he first came up. Or even Rocky Biddle. Santana might not have the mental makeup to pitch seven strong innings. Or he might be hurt. Any way you look at it, the Twins have only one pitcher throwing at the level our front four, and that's Radke. The Twins also have less depth in the bullpen. Rincon and Roa are solid and Nathan is tremendous. But they don't have the bridge type guys anymore. Romero is awful. Mulholland isn't doing it. With trouble in the bullpen the Twins will lose close games as often as they win them.

Win1ForMe
06-03-2004, 09:12 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
I've heard rumors of arm problems....

Karno,

Care to elaborate? Shoulder? elbow?

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:20 PM
Originally posted by Win1ForMe
Karno,

Care to elaborate? Shoulder? elbow?

I really dont know the specifics and I dont really have a source. I've just heard some rumors here and there through the media.

I know, I know. That makes me a non-credible source of info. I'm forgetting where I saw this, but I definately heard or saw something about that.

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 09:22 PM
Originally posted by OEO Magglio
If it keeps up of course the sox will win the division easily. Johan will be fine imo. I can almost promise you the twins will go on a hot streak again. I hope I'm wrong but the twins just know how to win, period.



It's a new season, and I hate to break this to you, but the Twins ahve not really shown me that they know how to win.

Save for that LeCroy grand slam that helped them rally against Torontp, what have they done in the last month? They just lost three games to the worst team in the AL AT HOME.

This isn't 2002 and 2003. It's time for us to take advantage and build a lead as big as we had in 2000.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:26 PM
Originally posted by elrod
I think Lohse is the one most likely to turn it around.

Lohse reminds me somewhat of a pre-2004 Jon Garland. If you look at their stats they both are similar (except Garland showed that he could be good for an extended period of time in 2001, unlike Lohse who was brutal). Both always seemed on the verge of a breakout season, but never seemed to put it together. Both are young and have a good deal of innings for their respective ages to have not broken out yet. Garland has finally broken out. Twins fans are still waiting on Lohse. That might be one of the major reasons we win this division

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
It's a new season, and I hate to break this to you, but the Twins ahve not really shown me that they know how to win.

Save for that LeCroy grand slam that helped them rally against Torontp, what have they done in the last month? They just lost three games to the worst team in the AL AT HOME.

This isn't 2002 and 2003. It's time for us to take advantage and build a lead as big as we had in 2000.
Hate to break what to me?? I want the twins to fall flat on their faces but I just don't think it's going to happen. Say what you want I know they're a different team but they still have a lot of that team, they're definitely weaker then last year but they're still the twins and they still know how to win.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 09:51 PM
Originally posted by OEO Magglio
Hate to break what to me?? I want the twins to fall flat on their faces but I just don't think it's going to happen. Say what you want I know they're a different team but they still have a lot of that team, they're definitely weaker then last year but they're still the twins and they still know how to win.

Well I guess no amount of convincing is going to sway you except playing out the season, which is reasonable. But if you look at the stats, the Twins are nowhere close.

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 09:55 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Well I guess no amount of convincing is going to sway you except playing out the season, which is reasonable. But if you look at the stats, the Twins are nowhere close.
That's what I'm waiting to see. I don't think the twins are a great team this year but they scare me, I've said this a ton of times but they know how to win. Last year they looked awful in the 1st half then they get stewart and all the sudden they're unstoppable. All those formulas aren't going to convince me, I want to see it happen.

elrod
06-03-2004, 10:49 PM
Stewart is the key. Is he off the DL yet? Stewart is the anchor for that offense. With him at LF and Ford at DH the Twins are a lot stronger offensively. Jones and Hunter are strong but not consistent. Mientkiewicz is still not 100%. Guzman is unreliable. Koskie is up and down. Mauer is not there yet. With Stewart the Twins have a formidable lineup that can compensate for their poor starting pitching. Without Stewart you get the Twins of the last couple weeks.

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 10:53 PM
Originally posted by elrod
Stewart is the key. Is he off the DL yet? Stewart is the anchor for that offense. With him at LF and Ford at DH the Twins are a lot stronger offensively. Jones and Hunter are strong but not consistent. Mientkiewicz is still not 100%. Guzman is unreliable. Koskie is up and down. Mauer is not there yet. With Stewart the Twins have a formidable lineup that can compensate for their poor starting pitching. Without Stewart you get the Twins of the last couple weeks.
No stewart is not back yet and yes he is the key to their offense. The twins were absolutely dead last year, then they trade for stewart and they get on a roll.

CHISOXFAN13
06-03-2004, 10:54 PM
Originally posted by OEO Magglio
That's what I'm waiting to see. I don't think the twins are a great team this year but they scare me, I've said this a ton of times but they know how to win. Last year they looked awful in the 1st half then they get stewart and all the sudden they're unstoppable. All those formulas aren't going to convince me, I want to see it happen.

I guess I still don't understand the argument here. You keep saying, "the Twins know how to win."

I don't get it. The last two games I've watched this team's supposed aces lose to the Devil Rays at home. They did the same thing last week in TB and KC, the two worst teams in the AL.

Granted, they knew how to win last season and in 2002, but they have yet to prove to me that they have that formula that made them successful the past two seasons.

I guess time will tell, but I'm not a believer in that ball club.

OEO Magglio
06-03-2004, 11:09 PM
Originally posted by CHISOXFAN13
I guess I still don't understand the argument here. You keep saying, "the Twins know how to win."

I don't get it. The last two games I've watched this team's supposed aces lose to the Devil Rays at home. They did the same thing last week in TB and KC, the two worst teams in the AL.

Granted, they knew how to win last season and in 2002, but they have yet to prove to me that they have that formula that made them successful the past two seasons.

I guess time will tell, but I'm not a believer in that ball club.
Ok they've been very injured, granted a lot of the replacements have been good. They've done everything right the last couple of years and so far they haven't. I guess what scares me is when Stewart comes back, he was their spark plug last year and could do the same this year. I just don't think counting them out is the right thing to do. They've looked awful the last couple of weeks but remember they were something like 8 or 9 games out at the asb last year and still won the division. All I'm saying is don't count them as dead, they're still the twins.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by elrod
Stewart is the key. Is he off the DL yet? Stewart is the anchor for that offense. With him at LF and Ford at DH the Twins are a lot stronger offensively. Jones and Hunter are strong but not consistent. Mientkiewicz is still not 100%. Guzman is unreliable. Koskie is up and down. Mauer is not there yet. With Stewart the Twins have a formidable lineup that can compensate for their poor starting pitching. Without Stewart you get the Twins of the last couple weeks.

http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/987116429.html

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=mlb&id=1805967

Shannon Stewart has Plantar Fasciitis. This is an injury which will possibly bother him the whole year depending on the severity. There's no way to be sure how long he'll be out, but they're saying at least till the beginning of July at this point.

http://rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.asp?sport=MLB&id=5509

elrod
06-03-2004, 11:59 PM
http://healthlink.mcw.edu/article/987116429.html

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire...=mlb&id=1805967

Shannon Stewart has Plantar Fasciitis. This is an injury which will possibly bother him the whole year depending on the severity. There's no way to be sure how long he'll be out, but they're saying at least till the beginning of July at this point.

http://rotoworld.com/content/player...ort=MLB&id=5509

Bad news for Stewart and the Twins then. Lew Ford has done a great job at LF but he hasn't really sparked the lineup the way Stewart did, especially in later innings. Ford has a great OBP and hits for power and a high average. He's a great table setter. I suppose the Twins really need Ford AND Stewart at the top of the order to set the table, especially considering they don't really have a legitimate "heart" of the order. Sorry, Koskie is not a cleanup man. And Hunter and Jones are better suited either in the 2 hole or the 6 or 7 (Jones couldn't handle the 1 because of his impatience) than the 3-4-5 slot. Oh yeah, Cuddyer is a real offensive stud...

We've all commented on how the Twins always step it up late in the game. They have one of the best team OPS in the 7th inning on of any team in baseball. Taking out Mauer and Bowen (few ABs), the top OPS in 7+ inning is...Shannon Stewart with an incredible 1.105. That's in 41 ABs, translating into a .390 BA and .519 on-base percentage. Their other top late inning guys are Koskie and Jones with 4 and 5 HRs respectively but not as impressive OBPs. And Lew Ford, the stud leadoff man hitting .333 overall? He still bats .304 after the 7th inning but has no HRs. His 7+inning OPS is .805, much lower than his .942 overall. Ford gets on base a bunch late in games (.394 OBP) but has little power late. This explains why Stewart is such a sparkplug for the Twins offense and why the late inning magic is missing.