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View Full Version : *Official* Postgame Thread - 6/2/04


eurotrash35
06-02-2004, 06:26 PM
How long is it going to take for us to put Shingo in as our closer?

soltrain21
06-02-2004, 06:28 PM
Tomorrow, hopefully

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 06:28 PM
Have at it.

Unregistered
06-02-2004, 06:30 PM
Originally posted by A.T. Money
Man, we are cursed. Thy name is Billy Koch. That's right, lets just keep putting him in in games we should win.

EVERYONE knew he was going to blow this game, and yet sometime in the near future we're gonna throw him out there again, and he's gonna luck into a 1-2-3 inning - to which all the FOK! (fitting) are gonna say "He's back!". And, well... you know the rest.

JGarlandrules20
06-02-2004, 06:31 PM
I'm sick of the seeing the sox lose like that.......

ndgt10
06-02-2004, 06:31 PM
:angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

BigEdWalsh
06-02-2004, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by dpbyron
Krotch must die :angry: :angry: :angry:

LOL!
That's about it. What more can you say?

JRIG
06-02-2004, 06:31 PM
I don't see what everyone is complaining about. Billy Koch is the least of our problems.

HaroMaster87
06-02-2004, 06:31 PM
So did anyone else hear what DJ said RIGHT BEFORE Adkins threw that last pitch? He says" Wow, Kotsay has some pop but he hasnt hit a homerun since last September". So I say, OUT LOUD, "well, here comes a homer on the next pitch now". Sure, enough...bam - gone - and we blow another one....

Navaro's Talent
06-02-2004, 06:32 PM
I never like losing games this way, but all we can do is hope for a good series against the Mariners. If there is any positve about this Oakland series, it's that the Sox played much better than in previous years. Granted, they lost both games, but at least the gave the A's a run for their money.

LongLiveFisk
06-02-2004, 06:32 PM
Who's the one keeping track of games thrown away? Feel free to add this one to your collection!

balboner
06-02-2004, 06:32 PM
I dont get why Ozzie didnt let Marte face Durazo to lead off the inning. Durazo, who's a patient lefty, is the exact type of hitter that Koch has no chance against.

kermittheefrog
06-02-2004, 06:33 PM
So remember when Koch came in with a three run lead and gave up two runs and so many people said that its okay he's still the closer because he didn't blow the save? Well this is why that isn't okay.

gosox41
06-02-2004, 06:33 PM
What two things to Neal Cotts, Billy Koch, and Jon Adkins all have in common (Other then then obvious)?

The both: 1. came from the Oakland A's and 2. choked against their former team this week costing the Sox 2 vicotries.

It's a simple fact. If you want to interpret this as them being failures as pitchers, they're not (except for Koch)


But if you want to look at this and think: 'Boy, that is a useless bit of information even though it is true and KW's bad trades came back and bit him directly the last 2 days' then you are good at reading my mind.




Bob

1951Campbell
06-02-2004, 06:33 PM
Billy Koch...you're the only guy on the Sox who makes me want to turn off the webcast and go back to studying for the bar.

ndgt10
06-02-2004, 06:33 PM
Marte should have pitched the freakin' ninth...

HaroMaster87
06-02-2004, 06:33 PM
not to mention...how mant times this year are we going to load the bases and not score a run..8th and 9th innings today, right??? :gulp:

LongLiveFisk
06-02-2004, 06:34 PM
Originally posted by Unregistered
Thy name is Billy Koch. That's right, lets just keep putting him in in games we should win.

EVERYONE knew he was going to blow this game, and yet sometime in the near future we're gonna throw him out there again, and he's gonna luck into a 1-2-3 inning - to which all the FOK! (fitting) are gonna say "He's back!". And, well... you know the rest.

Oh I knew he was going to blow this one big time. Having Billy Koch out there in a 1-run lead is like having 1 sheet of toilet paper when you have diarrhea!

balboner
06-02-2004, 06:34 PM
Anyone that finds playing the A's close is a positive must be foolish. This A's team today, without Chavez, might be the worst line-up in baseball. I find it terrible that the Sox let Dye, Durazo, and Hatteberg beat them. Those are the 3 most dangerous hitters in their line-up.

illiniwhitesox
06-02-2004, 06:34 PM
First he says in the bottom of the ninth that our bullpen is so good that the game is over.

Then, I listen to him talk about Scutaro having pop in his bat and not hitting a homer since September in the 10th.

JUST SHUT UP!!!

You're an athlete - you should believe in superstitions.

A.T. Money
06-02-2004, 06:35 PM
Botch is garbage.

I'm so tired of watching this team when they go west. PITIFUL!!!

BearSox
06-02-2004, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by LongLiveFisk
Oh I knew he was going to blow this one big time. Having Billy Koch out there in a 1-run lead is like having 1 sheet of toilet paper when you have diarrhea!

*****!!!!!! This gets my early vote for post of the week!

BigEdWalsh
06-02-2004, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by eurotrash35
How long is it going to take for us to put Shingo in as our closer?

This was the 1st post in the thread and it says it all. There's nothing else to say.
This is why we got Shingo, isn't it?

eurotrash35
06-02-2004, 06:37 PM
Well at least one positive on the day was Crede. Hopefully this won't just be that one breakout game that keeps him in the lineup for the next few weeks until he does it again.

Win1ForMe
06-02-2004, 06:37 PM
I thought it was pretty funny how people came out of the woodwork yesterday proclaiming our West-coast turnaround and how "nice" it was to see us play well. Meanwhile, we're now 0-2 and 1-13 the last 3 years.

the_valenstache
06-02-2004, 06:38 PM
Can't we turn off the language filters just once? I've got some colorful words for our entire team (minus Buehrle).

13 men left on in 9 innings.

Yeah Koch this and Koch that.

But, we had plenty of opportunities. We may win a lot of one-run games, but we certainly don't hold on to any leads. At least we shouldn't expect to.

I'm disgusted by our lack of production when it counts.

This game was lost when we were winning 2-1.

I'm not normally a pessimist, but something told me that there was no way 2 runs was going to do it.

ndgt10
06-02-2004, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by balboner
Anyone that finds playing the A's close is a positive must be foolish. This A's team today, without Chavez, might be the worst line-up in baseball. I find it terrible that the Sox let Dye, Durazo, and Hatteberg beat them. Those are the 3 most dangerous hitters in their line-up.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

gosox41
06-02-2004, 06:39 PM
I've been against Billy Koch since the day the Sox traded for him. So far I've been proven correct. So since I saw him as a bum before he threw his first pitch with the Sox, I get to rant about how crappy of a pitcher he is.


He is not closers material. Ozzie, do not let him close anymore. He sucks. Plain and simple. It's sad but every time he comes into a close game I turn off the TV because I expect to lose with him in there. If I'm at the game, I go home. I hate this guy. He has no business being a major league closer. Every time I see him pitch I thin of the fact that he single handedly cost the Sox the playoffs last year. Sure there were other holes on this team, but the Sox had a stud closer and gave him up for a crappy closer. Could that situation have been avoided??? I don't thin Beane had a gun to KW's head to do the trade so it could have. Which means in my mind that the Sox overcame a bunch of obstacles last season only to see their supposed closer turn out to be the a choke job pitcher.


I'm done...for now. But next time Koch sucks again (probably Friday) I'll be back with more rants.



Bob

kojak
06-02-2004, 06:42 PM
Originally posted by BearSox
*****!!!!!! This gets my early vote for post of the week!

They have that?

Lip Man 1
06-02-2004, 06:44 PM
This one hurts...hurts bad.

Between blowing the game (by the way this is the 6th time the pitching staff has lost the lead in the 7th inning or later---the Sox wound up losing four of those)

Leaving men on base by the bunches

and almost certainly losing Ordonez to the DL (White Sox.com has a story saying they now have different opinions about what's wrong and Mags could be gone in a worst case for a month.)

The only good thing is that it was a two game series, al least the Sox can't lose three. This is incredible losing what 12 of their last 13 there?????

Lip

BearSox
06-02-2004, 06:45 PM
Originally posted by kojak
They have that?

They might but either way my vote probably doesn't matter :cool:

patbooyah
06-02-2004, 06:46 PM
i will be burning a billy koch effigy.

anyone want to come?

greenpeach
06-02-2004, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by the_valenstache
Can't we turn off the language filters just once? I've got some colorful words for our entire team (minus Buehrle).

13 men left on in 9 innings.

Yeah Koch this and Koch that.

But, we had plenty of opportunities. We may win a lot of one-run games, but we certainly don't hold on to any leads. At least we shouldn't expect to.

I'm disgusted by our lack of production when it counts.

This game was lost when we were winning 2-1.

I'm not normally a pessimist, but something told me that there was no way 2 runs was going to do it.

You hit the nail on the head. You're not going to win too many road games when you strand 7 base runners in the last three innings while nursing a 1 run lead.

eurotrash35
06-02-2004, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by the_valenstache
Can't we turn off the language filters just once? I've got some colorful words for our entire team (minus Buehrle).

13 men left on in 9 innings.

Yeah Koch this and Koch that.

But, we had plenty of opportunities. We may win a lot of one-run games, but we certainly don't hold on to any leads. At least we shouldn't expect to.

I'm disgusted by our lack of production when it counts.

This game was lost when we were winning 2-1.

I'm not normally a pessimist, but something told me that there was no way 2 runs was going to do it.

Nobody's patting the offense on the back, but while our offense has been productive this year and they're not going to go out and put up 8 runs every day. The bottom line is that it is the closer's job to come in and put the game away in the 9th. Koch has not been that guy this year. It's easy to forgive isolated circumstances but when your "closer" has an ERA over 4 you have problems. We put the ball in Koch's hand with the game on the line and he failed, it's as simple as that. We didn't bring him in to pitch the 9th only in games where we're up by 8.

kittle545feet
06-02-2004, 06:47 PM
how much longer are the sox gonna fart around with the rowand experiment? this guys shows me nothing at the plate or with his glove. he's killing us with terrible defense and un-timely hitting. i could have had a better at bat in the 9th with a 2-0 count. by the way, can we kill dj with his "locked up" comment. just shut up dj until there are no outs left. this one hurt man. damn west coast crap again!!! :angry:

Mickster
06-02-2004, 06:48 PM
Originally posted by LongLiveFisk
Oh I knew he was going to blow this one big time. Having Billy Koch out there in a 1-run lead is like having 1 sheet of toilet paper when you have diarrhea!

:)

Post of the week, anyone???

OurBitchinMinny
06-02-2004, 06:51 PM
What is with guys with goatees and sucking on the sox? I would not mind if those two (koch and rowand) never suited up for the sox again. Please maggs get back so we dont have to watch rowand play RF anymore. Koch better lose his job as closer. Im pretty sure the league will eventually solve shingo, but until they do, let him close. Oh well, its just one game and it didnt help any the way the sox didnt hit outside of crede. Uribe had a bad game. 14 LOBs is way too many

OurBitchinMinny
06-02-2004, 06:53 PM
Buerhle pitched a great 6 innings, but he needs to get his pitch count down. 122 pitches after 6 innings is way too many. I mean he was great for six innings, but Id like to see him to it in less innings so he can go into the 8th and 9th. That being said he left them with the lead and this pen once again gave it up. Shingo and MJ did fine, but koch and adkins sucked. Looks like cotts and adkins are ready to step right into that 5th closer spot. Someone should have told them they shouldnt suck until they are the #5 starter.

LongLiveFisk
06-02-2004, 06:54 PM
Originally posted by Mickster
:)

Post of the week, anyone???

Oh, I'd be honored...

I've never had one of those before! :D:

Navaro's Talent
06-02-2004, 06:56 PM
Originally posted by balboner
Anyone that finds playing the A's close is a positive must be foolish. This A's team today, without Chavez, might be the worst line-up in baseball. I find it terrible that the Sox let Dye, Durazo, and Hatteberg beat them. Those are the 3 most dangerous hitters in their line-up.

I don't think I'm foolish at all for my comments. No team, no matter how good, can win every game. Yes, I understand that the Sox have now lost two games in a row, but it's been a while since they have done that. This is a good team and they are in first place.
Did they let this game go? Absoultely. Have they done that before? You bet. This happens to every team, good or bad. You may not think that playing the A's close is a positive, but I do. Would this team keep these games close last year with Manuel managing? I doubt it. The Sox lost the fist two games against the Twins earlier this season and everyone wanted to throw in the flag. Then, Ozzie called the guys out, and they gave the Twins a beating.
I understand that people are mad about this game, and I don't blame them for being so. I too am a little mad that they didn't win. But, if we don't try to look at the positives in each game, then we won't be very happy fans. I don't think there is anything wrong with staying positive.

HaroMaster87
06-02-2004, 06:58 PM
true about Rowand...if he doesnt bobble that ball in the ninth then that guy is on first and then the next hitter would have hit into a double play which would have meant...GAME OVER.

Rowand can be blamed as much as Botch...And rowand bobbled one exactly like that yesterday too!!!!!

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 07:00 PM
Originally posted by Navaro's Talent
I don't think I'm foolish at all for my comments. No team, no matter how good, can win every game. Yes, I understand that the Sox have now lost two games in a row, but it's been a while since they have done that. This is a good team and they are in first place.
Did they let this game go? Absoultely. Have they done that before? You bet. This happens to every team, good or bad. You may not think that playing the A's close is a positive, but I do. Would this team keep these games close last year with Manuel managing? I doubt it. The Sox lost the fist two games against the Twins earlier this season and everyone wanted to throw in the flag. Then, Ozzie called the guys out, and they gave the Twins a beating.
I understand that people are mad about this game, and I don't blame them for being so. I too am a little mad that they didn't win. But, if we don't try to look at the positives in each game, then we won't be very happy fans. I don't think there is anything wrong with staying positive. Wow, that's a great post. There's more wisdom there than in a tomato thread of rants. :smile:

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 07:01 PM
Originally posted by HaroMaster87
true about Rowand...if he doesnt bobble that ball in the ninth then that guy is on first and then the next hitter would have hit into a double play which would have meant...GAME OVER.

Rowand can be blamed as much as Botch...And rowand bobbled one exactly like that yesterday too!!!!! Now I'm dying to hear the FOC spin on this one. :D:

Navaro's Talent
06-02-2004, 07:03 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Wow, that's a great post. There's more wisdom there than in a tomato thread of rants. :smile:

Thank you! :smile:

HaroMaster87
06-02-2004, 07:03 PM
what is FOC again???

johnny_mostil
06-02-2004, 07:05 PM
Originally posted by the_valenstache
I'm disgusted by our lack of production when it counts.


The game last night featured a ridiculous number of scalded line drive outs. The Sox absolutely tatooed Redman the first three innings and got nothing from it because of one simple factor: bad luck.

Today had at least a couple too.

It happens. The breaks fall the other way. Oakland was not "superior" yesterday or today, they were luckier. Happens.

Mickster
06-02-2004, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Now I'm dying to hear the FOC spin on this one. :D:

Rowand will be fine. :D:

ndgt10
06-02-2004, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by HaroMaster87
true about Rowand...if he doesnt bobble that ball in the ninth then that guy is on first and then the next hitter would have hit into a double play which would have meant...GAME OVER.

Rowand can be blamed as much as Botch...And rowand bobbled one exactly like that yesterday too!!!!!

Unless you were expecting Rowand to throw out the runner at the plate, he didn't cost us the game at that point. He bobbled the ball and allowed the guy to get into 2nd base, however, that runner never ended up scoring.

If anything, we should be blaming Alomar for not being able to block that pitch in the dirt which allowed the eventual tying run into 2nd base.

cheeses_h_rice
06-02-2004, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Now I'm dying to hear the FOC spin on this one. :D:

There's nothing they can say in his defense.

Rowand sucks, plain and simple.

dwnstatesoxfan
06-02-2004, 07:07 PM
As long as we're screwing around with things like "Bullpen Day" and the Billy Koch experience every time the Sox have a slight lead, this is not a playoff bound team. KW can talk as much about World Series all he wishes, but Koch was a bum deal when he arrived here. Billy Beane knew what he was dumping into our laps.

As for the apologists on the ESPN 1000 postgame show today (Wills/Melton), they're trying so hard to put a spin on Koch, saying he has saved 8 of his last 10 games. But they fail to mention that in all honestly, he got probably have of those by sheer luck. A broken clock is right two times a day.

Thank god for this message board. With the official mouthpiece (AM 1000) and the Score (Cubs Central), it's difficult to handle these kinds of days.

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 07:08 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice
There's nothing they can say in his defense.

Rowand sucks, plain and simple. Cheeses, you sell SEAL short. I like the guy. He's very creative. :smile:

OEO Magglio
06-02-2004, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by dwnstatesoxfan
As for the apologists on the ESPN 1000 postgame show today (Wills/Melton), they're trying so hard to put a spin on Koch, saying he has saved 8 of his last 10 games. But they fail to mention that in all honestly, he got probably have of those by sheer luck.


Or maybe today was just unlucky. How about the fact he got beat on two bloop shots and a wild pitch that sandy could have blocked. Rowand's defense sucks and he couldn't pick the ball up in right field doesn't help either. This game sucks and hurts real bad. But if koch isn't going to be the closer.... what are you going to do with him, he will be useless in any other position. If kw can make a trade for another right handed reliever then you can move shingo into the closers role but for now there isn't many options with koch.

batmanZoSo
06-02-2004, 07:22 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Now I'm dying to hear the FOC spin on this one. :D:

Rowand pretty much lost the game for us by himself. Couldn't pick up the insurance run, then bobbled the ball in right. This is when you miss Magglio. If I know him, he'd have come through on both occasions. The latter could've been academic as a base hit in the top of the 9th would've meant a 3 run lead. This Rowand is just not a good ballplayer at all.

What happens when we go to Oakland or Anaheim in the playoffs? This crap has got to stop. There's no reason they should keep losing to the A's, they're not that good.

I don't give a rats ass about playing Oakland tough. What horse-s###. You either win or you don't. This series did terrible things for us, there's no confidence gained whatsoever. Now they truly believe they can't win on the west coast.

We need to improve the bullpen. They're just not very good.

And by the way, anyone don't like this? Kiss my ###. Everything isn't peachy f'in keen all the time.

Nard
06-02-2004, 07:30 PM
This is what happens when you start Dransfeldt, Crede, AND Rowand.

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 07:39 PM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
Now they truly believe they can't win on the west coast.And you know this how?

Al Capone
06-02-2004, 07:52 PM
:gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :gulp: :angry: :angry: :angry: :angry:

I'm more worried about the rest of the season......we have to produce with runners in scoring posistion......because obviously our closer sucks and should be pitching for the cubs...he make them loose close games....LONG LIVE BARTMAN!!!!!!

chisox06
06-02-2004, 08:00 PM
Koch doesnt play for the sox, he plays against them.

CHISOXFAN13
06-02-2004, 08:20 PM
Originally posted by Nard
This is what happens when you start Dransfeldt, Crede, AND Rowand.

Still trying to figure out what Crede did wrong today. Guess four hits wasn't enough for some people.

ode to veeck
06-02-2004, 08:32 PM
Oh I knew he was going to blow this one big time. Having Billy Koch out there in a 1-run lead is like having 1 sheet of toilet paper when you have diarrhea

LMAO! Quote of the week, even as much that I really think the Sox hitters and not Billy Koch were to blame today. Billie shoulda easily had his normal 5-2 lead at that point and finished with a save and another 1 run Sox victory.

By my scorecard the Sox left 15 men on base, including sacks loaded in the 8th and and 9th and a guy on third in the 10th. ... and that's not even counting Dransfeldt getting caught off second on Uribe's RBI grounder in the middle of the rally in the 2nd or Uribe getting picked off 1st in the 7th.

inta
06-02-2004, 08:37 PM
now i believe in koch, and he definitely didnt have it today.
but he wasn't insanely bad. rowand messed up that play in the 9th which allowed the run to score. alomar messed up that pitch in the dirt which allowed the runner to advance.


but lets not overlook our dismal offense.
the amount of sox left on base was ridiculous. i was so glad to see us hitting mulder but how many times did we go down with bases loaded today?

MRKARNO
06-02-2004, 08:45 PM
Blah. But what can you do?

Two game losing streaks can hurt, but every team has its down periods. The key is taking two out of three any way they can in Seattle. Don't get too down Sox fans because we'll be back.

I read in the paper today that 71% of teams in first at the end of may go to the playoffs since the advent of the Wild Card system. In the grand scheme of things we're going to just fine. You just gotta stay the course. I know it's tougher when they have these stupid off days after afternoon games so it's like two and a half days between games, but in the long run it's probably meaningless. But as opposed to last night if we did miss something by a game this is a game I'd look at and say we should have won.

Remember, it's a 162 game season and we have a long way to go. If we're in first at the all star break even if it's a tie we're in very good shape.

Hondo
06-02-2004, 08:54 PM
Does Rowand get the runner out even if he handles it cleanly??

Koch doesn't have an out pitch.

Once again Koch doesn't have an out pitch.

94 MPH fastballs with zippo for movement won't get it done all season. Shingo has proven me wrong but I guess I'm still holding on to the idea of having a guy with serious gas out there in the ninth. But alas that isn't Koch either.

Crede looked good today. He's starting to break out of the funk he's been in. He's never going to hit .300 but if he can hit .275 with the sort of power numbers he's capable of then I'm happy with that.

Burly-mon got hosed today. He pitched six strong. Jackson comes in and does his job. Shingo does the same then Koch comes in, followed by Adkins.

DJ needs to know when to shut up. He tried to downplay the importance of an insurance run!!!

Hawk said his sphincter sinches up whenever Rowand is running towards a wall.

Is Sharon Stone the actress in those enamel restoring toothpaste commercials???

I miss Magglio.

Willie Harris is a major league hitter.

We got to get guys home when they're in scoring position.

I think we'll take 2 out of 3 from Seattle.

idseer
06-02-2004, 09:04 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
So remember when Koch came in with a three run lead and gave up two runs and so many people said that its okay he's still the closer because he didn't blow the save? Well this is why that isn't okay.

DITTO!

doublem23
06-02-2004, 09:07 PM
Originally posted by HaroMaster87
what is FOC again???

Fan of Crash... The troupe of souls on the board dedicated to proving Aaron Rowand's worth as an everyday Major Leaguer to the rest of us.

idseer
06-02-2004, 09:16 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Now I'm dying to hear the FOC spin on this one. :D:

well now ... you love the post from the guy who says 'hey these things happen' and 'you can't win em all' etc etc. but let rowand commit an error and let's all jump on the foc again huh? :?:

if you want an excuse i'll spin you one. he was playing out of position.

rowand was not the reason we lost this game. :smile:

idseer
06-02-2004, 09:19 PM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
Rowand pretty much lost the game for us by himself. Couldn't pick up the insurance run, then bobbled the ball in right. This is when you miss Magglio. If I know him, he'd have come through on both occasions. The latter could've been academic as a base hit in the top of the 9th would've meant a 3 run lead. This Rowand is just not a good ballplayer at all.

What happens when we go to Oakland or Anaheim in the playoffs? This crap has got to stop. There's no reason they should keep losing to the A's, they're not that good.

I don't give a rats ass about playing Oakland tough. What horse-s###. You either win or you don't. This series did terrible things for us, there's no confidence gained whatsoever. Now they truly believe they can't win on the west coast.

We need to improve the bullpen. They're just not very good.

And by the way, anyone don't like this? Kiss my ###. Everything isn't peachy f'in keen all the time.


hey, believe it or not magglio has actually been known to commit errors ... even in the 9th inning. and he sure as hell has blown a lot of ab's with runners in scoring position.

and if you don't like that ..... well .... you know!

ode to veeck
06-02-2004, 09:24 PM
Ugh! Sox play another close one in Oakland, but get beat when their smoke and mirrors bullpen outplays ours again and the A's win for the second day in a row in extra innings with a walk off HR. They haven't had two walk offs in a row in 23 years. To make matters worse, today's hero, Mark Kotsay, their awsome everyday center fielder, hadn't hit a regular season HR in 9 months.

Oh great, the Sox play another close one in Oakland but lose again by essentially the same methods. Do Sox fans feel better about playing the A's closer, but losing in deja vu fashion again today? No, we feel like crap about it. Is the sky falling and are the Sox plumetting to earth? No frigging way! We're gonna beat the pants off this A's team this season and the rest of the AL Central by the times things are said and done with this year. This was only two close games we didn't win. As far as Oakland goes, close your eyes and think of Ozzie saying in his best broken english / Arnie accent: "Whiiell be Back!"

Early on, things looked better than last night early, as the Sox managed both hits AND runs in the 1st two innings, with Carlos extending his hitting streak to 20 games with an RBI single in the 1st and Juan Uribe hitting a fielder's choice ribbie in the 2nd. On Uribe's AB, Dransfeldt foolishly got caught going a little too far around the corner at 2nd. Losing a runner in scoring position and an out in the middle of the rally lead to Crede's run being a solo that inning. This would came back to bite the Sox, as they would fail to score again all afternoon.

Not that that was the only chance at all. By my scorecard, the Sox stranded 14 runners, including sacks packed in 8th AND 9th, and Crede on third yet again in the 10th, all for naught. They outhit the A's (with the surprising Crede 4/5 today) and had Alex Rhodes walking people like they going out of style, but still couldn't manage a single more run all day. This was the real gap for the Sox today.

Meanwhile, Burly-mon pulled a couple of escapes in the 1st and 3rd, and survived a number of long pitch count ABs in the 5th, before finally giving up a solo blast that Jermaine Dye crushed to start the 6th. Mark gave his all with 122 pitches and 6 SOs in 6 complete innings and handed a 2-1 lead to the pen about the same time he was announced as the MLB Pepsi AL pitcher for May.

Jackson and Takatsu pitched 3 up, 3 down 7th and 8th innings for the Sox, and then came the ninth ... A's fans were silent as Billy Koch warmed up on the mound before the 9th, but erupted in pure joy when he was announced to start the innning. Maybe he's already forgotten, possibly disguised with the goat-boy goatee, or maybe the past traumas in Oakland have blocked all memories of what the guy looked like to A's fans.

Nontheless, it was disgusting to Sox fans to see the "other" Billy Koch today, You know, not the one who's had some control and better velocity and actually done some sharp work closing games in recent days. No, today, we had the "other" Billy, who needs a 5-2 lead in order to preserve the one run Sox victory, the Billie A's fans expected and saw, & who gave up the tying run.

Not to say that Koch didn't have help; he did. After a lead off single to Durazo, Sandy blocked one in the dirt, but it bounced off his chest far enough in front of him & the left, that Durazo had an easy trot to 2nd base. Hatteberg's game tying RBI single followed and Rowand's flub allowed him to 2nd before an intentional pass to McLemore and a deep well struck fly by Burns ended the inning. No matter, the damage was done, and while the Sox would get Crede as far as third base to no avail in the 10th, the stage was set for Kotsay's heroics off Atkins with one gone in the bottom of the 10th.

Hey, did we mention Ozzie Ball was at work today, but just couldn't get the runs across. Dransfeldt, Harris, and even Valentin all had sac bunts that moved the runner(s) along today. Now if we could only complete the back end of that play ... Another positive note: other than the "Josh Paul" baserunning in the 2nd, Dransfeldt looked good at the plate, 1/3 with the two outs both solid shots, and did very well at short on D as well.

Screw the Curse! The As escaped with two lucky ones this week. They won't be so lucky come the Sox return to Oakland in mid July, where we've got four cracks at burying the curse once and for all.

FarWestChicago
06-02-2004, 09:28 PM
Originally posted by idseer
well now ... you love the post from the guy who says 'hey these things happen' and 'you can't win em all' etc etc. but let rowand commit an error and let's all jump on the foc again huh? :?: Heck id, I'm not jumping on the FOC. I figure there should be some fascinating posts. :smile:

idseer
06-02-2004, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
Heck id, I'm not jumping on the FOC. I figure there should be some fascinating posts. :smile:

not as many as i thought there'd be. :smile:

but then, he did piss me off something terrible when he swung on that 0-2 with the bases loaded and walks to the 2 batters before him. hey! i know he's no hitter and you don't want him batting in crucial spots, but then how many other sox players can we say that about?
no doubt he had a rough night, but he didn't lose us this game tonight. we all know who owns that distinction.

ChiSox7
06-02-2004, 09:40 PM
This game was all about offense. You can't leave 14 men on base and expect to win on the road. It just doesn't happen. THe offense needs to pick it up bigtimes in games other than against crappy pitchers and piling on when it is a blowout.

ode to veeck
06-02-2004, 09:43 PM
In Aaron's defence, the error was scary as hell, but didn't inflict any permanent damage as Koch finished the innning with the Burns flyout to deep right center. FOC have to be used to or even immune to scary. To FOC, scary must be like "OK". On the other hand, Crash getting only a grounder to short with 2 outs and sacks packed, after being given a 2-0 count by a guy who couldn't find the strike zone with both hands in the 9th... that's more like pathetic.

The FOC ought to rightly point out that 10 of 12 Sox hitters had LOB counts > 0 today, and Aaron was not alone in his failure to get the runs across today. The Sox were very consistent in this respect, both throughout the breadth of their lineup and in spreading the LOB in all but two of the innings today.

Also, as West would also be able to testify, Crash's cousins from NorCal, who often come to the Collesium to see him play, are cute, so he can't be all bad ...

I'm still cracking up by the remark on Koch and one run leads being like having diarrea with one sheet of toilet paper, definitely quote of the week material.

Lip Man 1
06-02-2004, 11:28 PM
Since the start of the 2001 season the Sox are now 1-13 in Oakland and 9-36 on the West Coast.

Friends, that Sox haven't been that bad of a team since 2001. Mediocre maybe but not 9-36 awful.

Yes, I do think this is starting to turn into a psych problem. They know the records, so they start pressing...it all adds up.

Karno...interesting number about playoff teams and May. I guess the 1996 Sox were the exception.

Lip

batmanZoSo
06-02-2004, 11:31 PM
Originally posted by idseer
hey, believe it or not magglio has actually been known to commit errors ... even in the 9th inning. and he sure as hell has blown a lot of ab's with runners in scoring position.

and if you don't like that ..... well .... you know!

I agree. Rowand is better than Maggs.

Sorry your dream hasn't come true yet, Maggs hasn't turned down 14 million to stay with us. But keep your fingers crossed.

MikeKreevich
06-02-2004, 11:55 PM
That no out sacrifice bunt was really working today. For a minute today I thought Manuel was back.

idseer
06-02-2004, 11:59 PM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
I agree. Rowand is better than Maggs.

Sorry your dream hasn't come true yet, Maggs hasn't turned down 14 million to stay with us. But keep your fingers crossed.

you think anyone here believes that's what i was saying?
you know, just cause someone doesn't agree with you all the time is no reason to try and paste things on them that don't belong.

grow up 'batman'! :cool:

jeremyb1
06-03-2004, 12:18 AM
1) Marte couldn't pitch because he threw 2+ innings and about 35 pitches last night. He was unavailable. This is the trouble with lacking depth in your bulllpen and playing back to back extra inning games.

2) Jon Adkins is not a solid major league pitcher. I couldn't care less what his ERA reads. He's walked 11 batters in 19 IP this season coming off a mediocre to poor season in AAA. Again the perils of back to back extra inning games. I'd have left the closer in for the 10th but there's the problem that he's also an awful pitcher. Jackson, Shingo, and Marte look to be the only three pitchers that can be counted on in the pen for the long haul which is going to cause problems down the line.

3) The Rowand bashing is simply out of control. I love how everyone talks about the FOC when far more posters on this board irrationally hate Rowand than love him. Accept him for what he is, a solid to good extra outfielder. I've posted this several dozen times by now but people either seem to fail to read my posts or disregard them because they have no defense against this argument:

'04 - .333/422/.590
'01-'03 - .298/.356/.463

Those are Rowand's numbers against lefthanded pitchers. Coupled with a bit of speed, good if not great defense, and an ability to play all three outfield positions, this makes Rowand a good platoon partner and backup outfielder which is the role Ozzie has now placed him in. Rowand played today and hit 1 for 4 against lefties as he's supposed to do and made a miscue in RF (he's the first outfielder to ever bobble a ball) which had NO IMPACT ON THE OUTCOME OF THE GAME. It is not Aaron Rowand's fault that Magglio Ordonez is injured. It is not remotely his fault that we lost today.

MRKARNO
06-03-2004, 12:31 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1

Karno...interesting number about playoff teams and May. I guess the 1996 Sox were the exception.


Yeah they definately were, but I dont think this team will be. The Twins aren't good enough IMHO to stay with us the whole year. I know they've been able to pull off a lot of magic the past two years (really just last year. We only won 81 in 2002), but it seems to be wearing off a bit. They're starting to lose a lot more of the games that they should be and they're losing games against bad teams.

Lip Man 1
06-03-2004, 01:04 AM
Part of the equation has to factor in how long Mags is out if he has surgery. This is a tough stretch of games and I don't how they could come close to replacing his bat in the lineup.

Lip