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View Full Version : A Red Sox fan visits "The Cell"


Fenway
05-29-2004, 09:11 PM
As promised, I am giving the South Side plenty of coverage on our Red Sox board

I posted some photos using my cheapo cell phone

Red Sox fan at Dog Day (http://redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=5222)

Anaheim scares me, they look solid

Nick@Nite
05-29-2004, 09:14 PM
Originally posted by fenway
As promised, I am giving the South Side plenty of coverage on our Red Sox board

I posted some photos using my cheapo cell phone

Red Sox fan at Dog Day (http://redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=5222)

Anaheim scares me, they look solid

Those were some kick ass pics... thanks! :cool:

Lip Man 1
05-29-2004, 09:17 PM
Fenway:

Just wondering...as a Red Sox fan did you ever read the WSI interview with Mike Andrews?

I think you'd enjoy it.

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/rwas/index.php?category=11&id=1998

Lip

HomeFish
05-29-2004, 09:22 PM
Thanks for at least painting a somewhat sympathetic picture. I probably outdo many Yankee fans at anti-Bostonism because of the arrogance and drama-queen nature of many of your fans, but you're one of the good ones. I didn't sense a single putdown in your posts.

As for the scoreboard, the fireworks didn't go off because it would scare the dogs.

vegyrex
05-29-2004, 10:02 PM
Originally posted by HomeFish
Thanks for at least painting a somewhat sympathetic picture. I probably outdo many Yankee fans at anti-Bostonism because of the arrogance and drama-queen nature of many of your fans, but you're one of the good ones. I didn't sense a single putdown in your posts.



I didn't mind their arrogance so much as I did how they consider Flub fans kindred spirits.

Lets face it. If the Red Sox finished last, in back to back seasons, they would never draw over 2 million.

SoxFan76
05-29-2004, 10:39 PM
Yeah, Red Sox fans should NEVER consider themselves and Cub fans in the same boat. Alteast the BoSox win every year. May not be the World Series, but they always contend. Or in other words, they aren't known as the "Lovable Losers"

Fenway
05-29-2004, 10:50 PM
I think it stems from the fact that both teams play in historic parks, and they NEVER play each other. This is the 8th year of interleague play and we still haven't played the Cubs. We train in Florida, they in Arizona so not even in the spring.

I have a hunch that 1908 and 1918 have been blasted into our heads and the WS have the misfortune of 1919. I did laugh when I saw a dog do its thing on the statue of Charles Comiskey

I miss playing thee White Sox as well, we only have 6 games this year....that stinks.



Originally posted by vegyrex
I didn't mind their arrogance so much as I did how they consider Flub fans kindred spirits.

Lets face it. If the Red Sox finished last, in back to back seasons, they would never draw over 2 million.

HomeFish
05-29-2004, 11:14 PM
Fenway, think of it this way, though:

You guys last won the World Series in 1918. You were last there in 1986. The White Sox haven't won since 1917 and haven't been there since 1959. The Cubs haven't won since 1908 and haven't been there since 1945.

You guys have NOTHING to complain about. Your team has won the pennant within your lifetime. That's something a lot of people in Chicago cannot say. I'm not sure if I ever will be able to say it.

Fenway
05-30-2004, 09:13 AM
I understand what you are saying. Yes the Red Sox have been close in my lifetime. 1967 they won a miracle pennant, we have the 75 HR by Fisk in Game 6. We also have suffered thru 3 Game 7 losses in the Series and there is sharp debate in Boston of wich loss was worse, Game 6 in 1986 or Game 7 of the ALCS in 2003. To be one out away from winning it all, a 2 run lead and nobody on is pain I wouldn't wish on anyone. But last year we had the Yankees beaten in the Bronx, a 3 run lead with 5 outs to go. We could have finally shut the Yankees fans up, now it is worse than ever.

But I can not even fathom what it must be like for a Chicago fan as you have to be at least 50 to remembeer the 59 Series.






Originally posted by HomeFish
Fenway, think of it this way, though:

You guys last won the World Series in 1918. You were last there in 1986. The White Sox haven't won since 1917 and haven't been there since 1959. The Cubs haven't won since 1908 and haven't been there since 1945.

You guys have NOTHING to complain about. Your team has won the pennant within your lifetime. That's something a lot of people in Chicago cannot say. I'm not sure if I ever will be able to say it.

hsnterprize
05-30-2004, 01:03 PM
Originally posted by fenway
I understand what you are saying. Yes the Red Sox have been close in my lifetime. 1967 they won a miracle pennant, we have the 75 HR by Fisk in Game 6. We also have suffered thru 3 Game 7 losses in the Series and there is sharp debate in Boston of wich loss was worse, Game 6 in 1986 or Game 7 of the ALCS in 2003. To be one out away from winning it all, a 2 run lead and nobody on is pain I wouldn't wish on anyone. But last year we had the Yankees beaten in the Bronx, a 3 run lead with 5 outs to go. We could have finally shut the Yankees fans up, now it is worse than ever.

But I can not even fathom what it must be like for a Chicago fan as you have to be at least 50 to remembeer the 59 Series. It is tough for us in Chicago...but remember this...you can pretty much divide the city's/suburban area's fans into 2 categories...Cubs fans and White Sox fans.

We Sox fans not only suffer from the lack of a winning team on the south side, but the constant bantering of "Go Cubbies" from Cubs fans and a willing media. Based on all they national hype they got last year, you'd think everyone in Chicago and all-points-wherever were Cubs fans, or at least "supported the Cubs" during their playoff run. Obviously, you learned by being here yesterday that's NOT the case.

Despite all the bad raps the White Sox and U.S. Cellular Field have gotten over the years, we fans still love our team, and there's nothing we want more than a World Championship. If anything, it'll stink it in the face of the "lovable losers" crowd and finally convince the nay-sayers that it's not about the ballpark, the surrounding neighborhood, and all the other crap that makes "beautiful Wrigley Field" the way it is. Let 'em keep all that stuff...we'll take a World Series title any day of the week.

To you Boston Red Sox fans...don't EVER let yourselves be compared to Cubs fans. Although your team hasn't won in generations like the Cubs haven't won, at least you've put up winning seasons and have had chances to win. Granted, 1986 and last year are tough to think about (I say it wasn't Buckner's fault for the '86 loss...blame Jimy Williams for using a crappy relief pitcher (Calvin Schiraldi) to close game 6 when he'd been struggling through the post-season). However, when your Red Sox and the Cubs are put into the same sentence, you're comparing a team who hasn't had a back-to-back winning season since 1972 (Cubs) to a squad which had 8 winning campaigns in the last 10 years. Historically, the Red Sox have 17 post-season berths, including 8 World Series berths and 5 World Championships. The Cubs have 14 post-season berths, including 10 World Series berths, and 2 WS titles.

You might not see it, but you Red Sox fans have a LOT MORE to be proud of compared to Cubs fans. Don't sink to the "lovable loser" level to get popular. It'll work for a while, but the truth will eventually come out, and no one will care anymore.

DirtySouthsider
05-30-2004, 01:38 PM
Originally posted by hsnterprize
It is tough for us in Chicago...but remember this...you can pretty much divide the city's/suburban area's fans into 2 categories...Cubs fans and White Sox fans.

We Sox fans not only suffer from the lack of a winning team on the south side, but the constant bantering of "Go Cubbies" from Cubs fans and a willing media. Based on all they national hype they got last year, you'd think everyone in Chicago and all-points-wherever were Cubs fans, or at least "supported the Cubs" during their playoff run. Obviously, you learned by being here yesterday that's NOT the case.

Despite all the bad raps the White Sox and U.S. Cellular Field have gotten over the years, we fans still love our team, and there's nothing we want more than a World Championship. If anything, it'll stink it in the face of the "lovable losers" crowd and finally convince the nay-sayers that it's not about the ballpark, the surrounding neighborhood, and all the other crap that makes "beautiful Wrigley Field" the way it is. Let 'em keep all that stuff...we'll take a World Series title any day of the week.

To you Boston Red Sox fans...don't EVER let yourselves be compared to Cubs fans. Although your team hasn't won in generations like the Cubs haven't won, at least you've put up winning seasons and have had chances to win. Granted, 1986 and last year are tough to think about (I say it wasn't Buckner's fault for the '86 loss...blame Jimy Williams for using a crappy relief pitcher (Calvin Schiraldi) to close game 6 when he'd been struggling through the post-season). However, when your Red Sox and the Cubs are put into the same sentence, you're comparing a team who hasn't had a back-to-back winning season since 1972 (Cubs) to a squad which had 8 winning campaigns in the last 10 years. Historically, the Red Sox have 17 post-season berths, including 8 World Series berths and 5 World Championships. The Cubs have 14 post-season berths, including 10 World Series berths, and 2 WS titles.

You might not see it, but you Red Sox fans have a LOT MORE to be proud of compared to Cubs fans. Don't sink to the "lovable loser" level to get popular. It'll work for a while, but the truth will eventually come out, and no one will care anymore.


Very well said! Just to add one thing .....the major problem with the Red Sox is they are always competeing with the Yankees (which I don't have to explain why that sucks).
But the Cubs have no excuse.....they just haven't gotten things done.

adsit
05-30-2004, 02:42 PM
I've lived in Red Sox Nation for about eight years now, and, on the whole, give Carmines fans very high marks for their knowledge of the game, of the history of their team, and for the passion of their fandom. They don't tolerate boneheadedness and indifference. Storied history aside, the Red Sox continue to earn the respect they get locally by being competitive, and would lose it quickly if they failed to remain that way. Look at how the Celtics' star has faded in recent years, and you can easily see that happening to the Red Sox if they ever settled for mediocre.

The only commonality between the Cubs and Red Sox is that they both play in "legacy" ballparks. And Fenway actually makes an effort to provide contemporary amenities within that old framework, something that can't easily be said for the North Side crypt-keepers. The Red Sox have never banked on being "cute," as the Cubbies do, and (amazingly enough) fill their ballpark with baseball fans, who watch the game and understand it, even when the hated Yankees are in town to turn up the background noise.

Boston's a great sports town, and particularly a great baseball town. To even entertain a notion of comparing what goes on here to what surrounds the Chicago National League Ball Club is an insult to every Bostonian. Even the ones I increasingly see trolling around Cambridge wearing Cub gear, because I assume either the universities brought them here, or they don't know any better... and would stop doing it if they did.

Even though this is home for me now, I've maintained my passion for the White Sox because that's my birthright. I don't have a lot of respect for people who easily exchange baseball allegiances. I've waited all my sentient lifetime for a White Sox world championship and will be damned if I ever give up on that dream. Yet, even if I were fickle, and decided to lean toward adopting the Red Sox as "my" team, I'd always consider myself an impostor next to a true Red Sox fan. And I feel that's my greatest show of respect for the Red Sox and their fans.

Unless/until our paths cross on the field, I wish you guys good luck.

Fenway
05-30-2004, 03:35 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
Very well said! Just to add one thing .....the major problem with the Red Sox is they are always competeing with the Yankees (which I don't have to explain why that sucks).
But the Cubs have no excuse.....they just haven't gotten things done.


Just to clarify, it was John McNamarra who brought Calvin Schiraldi back in the 10th at Shea after escaping the 9th mainly because of Davey Johnson being a boneheaded manager as well.

A good point was made by someone about the Red Sox and the Yankees. We have always been in the same group, and as wealthy as the Red Sox are now with sold out games and a powerful cable network, the fact is the New York market is so huge that it could have THREE teams and still each of the teams would have a bigger base than any other team in baseball.

Just look at the numbers comparing the Red Sox network NESN against YES (Yankees)



These numbers represented cable HOUSEHOLDS not population

Markets served by YES
New York 7,376,330
Hartford & New Haven (shares with Boston) 1,001,320
Buffalo 647,920
Wilkes Barre-Scranton (shares with Philadelphia) 590,100
Albany-Schenectady-Troy 542,670
Rochester 395,350
Syracuse 384,290
Burlington-Plattsburgh (shares with Boston) 323,070
Binghamton 139,190
Utica 105,300
Watertown 91,280

Markets served by NESN
Boston (Manchester) 2,391,830
Hartford & New Haven (shared with NY) 1,001,320
Providence-New Bedford 635,610
Portland-Auburn 398,500
Burlington-Plattsburgh (shares with NY) 323,070
Springfield-Holyoke 260,880
Bangor 139,550
Presque Isle 29,930


BTW a couple of our posters had this to say about this thread

MargoAdamsLoveChild Posted: May 29 2004, 10:54 PM
When I was at new Comiskey (1999), what amazed me (even shocked me!) was how you could walk around the entire stadium in a big circle on the main concourse level. It's just a huge, wide concrete circle. Amazing.

sioux Posted: May 30 2004, 11:10 AM
Joined: 4-December 03


The White Sox park looks much, much improved from when I last visited it. The upper deck used to be very high and very bleak with a view of a famous blighted housing project (now making way for yuppie condos instead of more affordable housing, alas). The park is better-looking and appears much more fan-friendly. And Nancy Faust does not age.

Of course, even though Cellular isn't a great name for a ballpark, it's better than naming anything after that disgusting old skinflint Comiskey. Why should that jerk (substituting a clean word for what he really is) be in Cooperstown when Shoeless Joe is not? With even a slightly less horrible human (I think) being as an owner, maybe even the bad guys on the Sox would not have considered throwing that Series.

The old park had a lot of seats with bad sightlines but I still liked it. And I still think it was a crime to tear down McCuddy's!

I also like the dog event. Great photos! Woof!




BTW The WS put out a great program for $4, far better than the Red Sox.

illiniwhitesox
05-30-2004, 04:07 PM
Don't ever let the tear down Fenway.

I miss the old Comiskey and it gets worse as the years go by. To many fond memories with my old man. Baseball is a game of history and stories, and it pains me that the connection between my dad and grandfather was broken over skyboxes and amenities.

Fenway
05-30-2004, 04:36 PM
it "appears" Fenway Park will be around for another 20-30 years

as you can see from the attached picture, the new owners have spent a lot of money trying to bring Fenway into the 21st Century
The new seats under the new Budweiser sign sold out in minutes and they are not cheap




Red Sox eye major plan for Fenway renovation (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2004/05/26/red_sox_eye_major_plan_for_fenway_renovation/)



Originally posted by illiniwhitesox
Don't ever let the tear down Fenway.

oheeoh...magglio
05-30-2004, 06:12 PM
I would like to echo the thoughts of some in this thread that you guys should never let them tear down Fenway.

I love "The Cell" as much as anyone, but the old ball park feel is just wonderful (with the exception of at Wrigley).

I never got to visit the old place (I was only 4 during the last season we played there) but I always hear such great things about it.

As for Fenway, I visted there last season (sat in RF behind the bullpen) and I really liked the park. You can just feel all the history at that place, it has an almost minor league cozy feel to it due to it not being very large, and I was pleasantly surprised to see that the bathroom and concession lines were not bad.

I was also pleasantly surprised at the Red Sox fans. Other than the fact they started chanting "YANKEES SUCK!!" during the 7th inning of a Devil Rays/Red Sox game which I found to be strange, they seemed very knowledgable and just about nobody arrived late or left early.

Fenway
05-30-2004, 07:19 PM
I think the one single issue holding up what they plan to do is, can they renovate and still play or be forced to move to Foxboro for one or two seasons. The new Patriots stadium was designed by HOK to be converted to baseball if the need arised.

Fenway has a number of problems, you can have as many as 26 seats in a row, the grandstand has no leg room and long lines at concessions.

The new ownership is trying very hard. One addition made last year was a batter/pitcher board.

http://www.kaeleighsplace.com/Red%20Sox%20Game%20May%2015th%202003/Fleet%20Pitchers%20scoreboard.jpg

The video board in CF is top notch

http://www.christine-murphy.net/clicks/images/scoreboard.jpg

but they must always keep this

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/baseball/mlb/1999/postseason/division_series/al_div2/news/1999/10/10/boston_offense_ap/lg_sb_ap_01.jpg

HomeFish
05-30-2004, 07:32 PM
I gotta admit I love the pitcher board you guys have up there. Nifty nifty thing.

MRKARNO
05-30-2004, 07:33 PM
Well it's good to know that they are trying to keep up with the times at fenway. I like stats (as does the GM Theo Epstein) and I would love to see all of those stat boards at the cell. It's great to see they have a video board there. It's small, but there's not too much they can do. Two Ideas for Fenway:

1. I dont think they could do this because of historic garbage or whatever, but have the Red Sox move somewhere else for 2 years, knock down the entire grandstand area and build a modern 3 deck grandstand, leaving the outfield as is.

2. Build a new Fenway with the same outfield. Build a new monster, keep the triangle, the pole at 300 feet in right, etc. I think I saw this in a proposal for a new Fenway and I think it's great. The Red Sox might have to move on from Fenway, as cool as it is. Some things dont last forever.

Fenway
05-30-2004, 08:10 PM
The video board is not as small as that first picture made it look.

http://daktronics.com/profiles/cc03216.jpg

http://www.frankiehots.com/images/blog/fenway_oops.jpg
( BTW I hope the person who allowed this to happen got fired)


A big unknown question is the state of Fenway's foundation. While much is made of the fact the Park was built in 1912, it was really rebuilt in 1934 when Tom Yawkey bought the team..

http://www.royalrooters.com/FenwayReconstruction1934.jpg

What is also forgotten is the park burnt down in 1934 during the reconstruction

Fenway Park Fire (http://www.ci.boston.ma.us/bfd/journal/fenway_fire.htm)

But the park has looked pretty much the same since 1912

http://www.bpl.org/store/IMGs/STMedium/tm_st10609.jpg

and the Green Monster did not become green until 1947

http://www.savefenwaypark.com/sfp/preserve/images/monster_ads.jpg

plus very few remember it was the home of the Boston Patriots before Tom Yawkey evicted them after the Pats wanted to install astroturf. That is part of the reason they moved to the burbs.

http://www.bpl.org/store/IMGs/STMedium/tm_st10786.jpg







Originally posted by MRKARNO
Well it's good to know that they are trying to keep up with the times at fenway. I like stats (as does the GM Theo Epstein) and I would love to see all of those stat boards at the cell. It's great to see they have a video board there. It's small, but there's not too much they can do. Two Ideas for Fenway:

1. I dont think they could do this because of historic garbage or whatever, but have the Red Sox move somewhere else for 2 years, knock down the entire grandstand area and build a modern 3 deck grandstand, leaving the outfield as is.

2. Build a new Fenway with the same outfield. Build a new monster, keep the triangle, the pole at 300 feet in right, etc. I think I saw this in a proposal for a new Fenway and I think it's great. The Red Sox might have to move on from Fenway, as cool as it is. Some things dont last forever.

Fenway
05-31-2004, 09:15 PM
now I have another problem

Doc has given me the green light to return home, but I got this ticket this morning


Some guy named Roger is pitching

Hondo
05-31-2004, 09:32 PM
Thanks for the love Fenway.

While your passion and loyalty are for the "sawx" it's good to have you here.

Does John Henry still get on Red Sox Nation quite a bit??

Fenway
05-31-2004, 09:34 PM
he does pop up in the early morning hours....

more important he DOES listen to fan input

Wsoxmike59
06-01-2004, 07:17 AM
It looks like one of your fellow Red Sox Rooters from yesteryear BBQ'd Fido in the stands during Dog Day! (just kidding) :D:

I found this neat old photo in the archive of Getty Images.


Red Sox Rooters Invade Comiskey Park during the 1950's (http://editorial.gettyimages.com/source/CFW/details.aspx?iid=50527055&print=true)

nitetrain8601
06-01-2004, 12:35 PM
Nice park. I hope they keep Fenway. It looks like a really great park. Nice picks too. Too bad you should of came to the game the night before or the day after as we stomped on the Angels. So tell RSN not to worry about the Angels.

BTW, make sure you continue being smart as all Red Sox fans are and invest in a Roger Clemens Astros jersey. Or at least go to the Southside and buy yourself a Cubs Suck shirt.

jabrch
06-01-2004, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by fenway
now I have another problem

Doc has given me the green light to return home, but I got this ticket this morning


Some guy named Roger is pitching


If you think the upper deck @ The Cell is bad (I don't - I like it) then just wait to see 525, row 5 at the Urinal. BRUTAL.

BlackSox
06-01-2004, 05:08 PM
Originally posted by fenway
As promised, I am giving the South Side plenty of coverage on our Red Sox board

I posted some photos using my cheapo cell phone

Red Sox fan at Dog Day (http://redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=5222)

Anaheim scares me, they look solid

I enjoyed the pictures, Fenway.

One thing... on your thread someone asked you about beer selection, to which you replied "not much in the concourse area". You must have missed the import beer stand, which is in the LF corner.

Fenway
06-01-2004, 07:44 PM
actually someone else made that comment about the beer and somebody corrected him...

I wouldn't spend a dime on beer at "The Cell" as the concessions are controlled by the owner of the Boston Bruins who is almost as bad as Dollar Bill Wirtz.

www.delawarenorth.com


Originally posted by BlackSox
I enjoyed the pictures, Fenway.

One thing... on your thread someone asked you about beer selection, to which you replied "not much in the concourse area". You must have missed the import beer stand, which is in the LF corner.