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LASOXFAN
05-29-2004, 03:19 PM
Has anyone else had enough of his home run swing and complete lack of production?

Why not make Uribe 3B, Harris 2B and bring up Borchard to platoon with Rowand and Perez in CF?

Enough is enough, Joe has a great glove at 3B and would be justified in keeping his job if he was hitting even .250, but .205? I haven't seen him over .210 in I don't know how long.

Uribe has the glove, give him a regular position. He's earned it, Joe hasn't. And that's what being in "the bigs" is all about.

Win1ForMe
05-29-2004, 03:49 PM
I'd bench him when Willie plays against RHP. Seems kinda unfair to me how they're jerking Willie around CF and 2B just so Crede can stay in the lineup. Even "Crash" deserves to play ahead of him at this point.

beckett21
05-29-2004, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by LASOXFAN
Has anyone else had enough of his home run swing and complete lack of production?

Why not make Uribe 3B, Harris 2B and bring up Borchard to platoon with Rowand and Perez in CF?

Enough is enough, Joe has a great glove at 3B and would be justified in keeping his job if he was hitting even .250, but .205? I haven't seen him over .210 in I don't know how long.

Uribe has the glove, give him a regular position. He's earned it, Joe hasn't. And that's what being in "the bigs" is all about.

A three-man platoon in CF? Yeah that would make everybody happy.

It's frustrating to watch Crede right now, but no way they abandon ship on him. June is when he starts to heat up. We're still 2 games up right now WITHOUT much help from him, except for a few clutch game-winners.

He's not going anywhere. May as well get used to it and hope he starts heating up. Which he will.

doublem23
05-29-2004, 04:57 PM
I'm pretty sure Crede would have to clear waivers to be sent down, so I don't think that's going to happen.

Herbal
05-29-2004, 05:14 PM
This would also leave them without any IF backups.

BigEdWalsh
05-29-2004, 05:20 PM
....and please send Rauch with him. Time to give up on the big guy. He's worthless.

doublem23
05-29-2004, 05:22 PM
Originally posted by BigEdWalsh
....and please send Rauch with him. Time to give up on the big guy. He's worthless.

Yes. 3 innings of work. Against the Angels.

DrummerGeorgefan
05-29-2004, 05:46 PM
On last nights game Hawk and DJ were talking about how Joe is hitting a hard .208. They specifically credited him for 5 of the sox wins for clutch performance. IMO, that statement is nice, but unbelieveable. I think they were just trying to say something good.

beckett21
05-29-2004, 05:46 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Yes. 3 innings of work. Against the Angels.

My thoughts exactly.

I've been pining for a trade since Wright went down, but if we need to show patience with anyone it's Rauch. Keep him in there until the move is signed, sealed and delivered. Nothing to lose at this point, and outside of a trade no one is likely to do any better.

ChiSox7
05-29-2004, 05:48 PM
Originally posted by beckett21
My thoughts exactly.

I've been pining for a trade since Wright went down, but if we need to show patience with anyone it's Rauch. Keep him in there until the move is signed, sealed and delivered. Nothing to lose at this point, and outside of a trade no one is likely to do any better.

He was easily the worst of all the starters tried at the spot this year. Wright actually had some decent outings but they didn't score any runs for him. It sucks to say it, but Rausch is not a MLB pitcher and he never will be. 8 runs with an 8 run lead agianst the Tigers, and spring training and minor league and this game tell all u need to know. It sucks too. He seems like a nice guy.

beckett21
05-29-2004, 05:50 PM
Originally posted by DrummerGeorgefan
On last nights game Hawk and DJ were talking about how Joe is hitting a hard .208. They specifically credited him for 5 of the sox wins for clutch performance. IMO, that statement is nice, but unbelieveable. I think they were just trying to say something good.

Of course they were trying to say something good. That's part of their job whether people like it or not.

The fact of the matter is, he is generallly worthless until June offensively. His defense is still valuable, and the team is thriving despite his slump. He does seem to come up with big hits in key situations.

He will come around.

beckett21
05-29-2004, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
He was easily the worst of all the starters tried at the spot this year. Wright actually had some decent outings but they didn't score any runs for him. It sucks to say it, but Rausch is not a MLB pitcher and he never will be. 8 runs with an 8 run lead agianst the Tigers, and spring training and minor league and this game tell all u need to know. It sucks too. He seems like a nice guy.

That's a matter of opinion as far as *worst*.

What's the difference, they've all been abysmal. Not like there is a prize for *best performance by a Sox 5th starter this season*--all of them have sucked.

This is something I was harping on before. So now what? He gets the boot back to Charlotte after one start? So much for giving a guy a chance. Don't know if people are expecting Randy Johnson out there, but it's not happening folks.

What do you suggest? Munoz gets his turn now? Total joke. It's becoming more than a bad joke, it's an embarassment. Stick with one guy or just make a trade already. It's foolish to expect a guy to get into a good groove with only one or two starts.

ChiSox7
05-29-2004, 06:05 PM
Originally posted by beckett21
That's a matter of opinion as far as *worst*.

What's the difference, they've all been abysmal. Not like there is a prize for *best performance by a Sox 5th starter this season*--all of them have sucked.

This is something I was harping on before. So now what? He gets the boot back to Charlotte after one start? So much for giving a guy a chance. Don't know if people are expecting Randy Johnson out there, but it's not happening folks.

What do you suggest? Munoz gets his turn now? Total joke. It's becoming more than a bad joke, it's an embarassment. Stick with one guy or just make a trade already. It's foolish to expect a guy to get into a good groove with only one or two starts.

He got into a groove alright. I don't buy this you have to give them time crap. If they suck they suck. But your right. There is no where to turn. We dont need a fifth starter for a couple of weeks so hopefully KW can get us a trade. I don't want to see Rausch back otu there tho. He's a great guy, but a terrible pitcher.

beckett21
05-29-2004, 06:22 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
He got into a groove alright. I don't buy this you have to give them time crap. If they suck they suck. But your right. There is no where to turn. We dont need a fifth starter for a couple of weeks so hopefully KW can get us a trade. I don't want to see Rausch back otu there tho. He's a great guy, but a terrible pitcher.

I will agree that a trade is the obvious answer. It's a matter of getting it done I guess.

doublem23
05-29-2004, 06:29 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
He got into a groove alright. I don't buy this you have to give them time crap. If they suck they suck. But your right. There is no where to turn. We dont need a fifth starter for a couple of weeks so hopefully KW can get us a trade. I don't want to see Rausch back otu there tho. He's a great guy, but a terrible pitcher.

Man, it's a good thing you don't run the show else you'd have dumped Garland 4 years ago.

TaylorStSox
05-29-2004, 06:31 PM
Crede's not really hurting us though. Also, he is hitting a "hard" .206.

We're winning. He's our best defensive option.

There's no way he'll finish the season under .250.

.250/25/80 from a slick fielding 3rd baseman is nothing to complain about.

JRIG
05-29-2004, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Man, it's a good thing you don't run the show else you'd have dumped Garland 4 years ago.

Yeah, and he probably would have dumped Kip Wells for some journeyman.

Oh, wait. We did do that. :D:

doublem23
05-29-2004, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by TaylorStSox

.250/25/80 from a slick fielding 3rd baseman is nothing to complain about.

Agreed, especially with his upside.

BigEdWalsh
05-29-2004, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Man, it's a good thing you don't run the show else you'd have dumped Garland 4 years ago.

There's a difference though. 4 years ago Garland was a kid. Rauch isn't a kid anymore. He'll be 26 I think in September. And frankly, he didn't show even a glimpse of anything to get excited about today. Heck, he hasn't been all that great in AAA.

ChiSox7
05-29-2004, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Man, it's a good thing you don't run the show else you'd have dumped Garland 4 years ago.

You know very well that there is a big difference. Bottom line. Garland showed enough promise. Rausch has shown nothing except one decent game against Minnesota's garbage players when the games didnt' matter anymore. He's not a kid anymore. He's had enough time to develop. Garland did. He didn't. It happened. Giving him more time won't help him be a good MLB pitcher. Don't give me that BS.

doublem23
05-29-2004, 06:41 PM
Originally posted by BigEdWalsh


There's a difference though. 4 years ago Garland was a kid. Rauch isn't a kid anymore. He'll be 26 I think in September. And frankly, he didn't show even a glimpse of anything to get excited about today. Heck, he hasn't been all that great in AAA.


Originally posted by ChiSox7


You know very well that there is a big difference. Bottom line. Garland showed enough promise. Rausch has shown nothing except one decent game against Minnesota's garbage players when the games didnt' matter anymore. He's not a kid anymore. He's had enough time to develop. Garland did. He didn't. It happened. Giving him more time won't help him be a good MLB pitcher. Don't give me that BS.

Sigh, I'm not even going to bother with this. I'll just sit back and hopefully watch everyone sing Rauch's praises in a month after some nice outings.

ChiSox7
05-29-2004, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Sigh, I'm not even going to bother with this. I'll just sit back and hopefully watch everyone sing Rauch's praises in a month after some nice outings.

I would love that. And gladly eat tons of crow. Gladly. I certainly don't root for these guys to do bad. I just don't think Rausch can get the job done. But if your right, I will gladly eat my crow. I wouldn't hold my breath however.

BigEdWalsh
05-29-2004, 06:54 PM
Ditto.

:smile:

elrod
05-29-2004, 07:07 PM
Rauch was not worthless out there. His command was way off, of course. But he got ahead of almost every hitter - 2 strikes on most, in fact. But then when he meant to throw one off the plate it came back over the heart and got crushed. His command is not there. In fact, he looked a lot like Greisinger when we hit him in MN. I definitely say stick with Rauch for awhile. The Angels are the best hitting team in the majors so it's not a surprise they took advantage. The reason we lost today was not Jon Rauch. It was Aaron Sele.

illiniwhitesox
05-29-2004, 07:09 PM
Originally posted by ChiSox7
You know very well that there is a big difference. Bottom line. Garland showed enough promise. Rausch has shown nothing except one decent game against Minnesota's garbage players when the games didnt' matter anymore. He's not a kid anymore. He's had enough time to develop. Garland did. He didn't. It happened. Giving him more time won't help him be a good MLB pitcher. Don't give me that BS.

Garland also has not had arm problems that required surgery.

white sox bill
05-30-2004, 11:01 AM
Imagine giving up a on pitcher after 3 innings...If he can't pitch weel after 3 innings, send him back! Thats enough chances!

fuzzy_patters
05-30-2004, 12:10 PM
Originally posted by white sox bill
Imagine giving up a on pitcher after 3 innings...If he can't pitch weel after 3 innings, send him back! Thats enough chances!

You would have a good point if this was Rauch's first chance. However, I think, more likely, this was his last chance. He is 26 years old and has had several chances in the past and failed. They brought him up and gave him one last opportunity, and he still has not learned how to put the hitters away when he gets ahead. It is time to cut bait. This guy does not have it.

white sox bill
05-30-2004, 12:50 PM
Originally posted by fuzzy_patters
You would have a good point if this was Rauch's first chance. However, I think, more likely, this was his last chance. He is 26 years old and has had several chances in the past and failed. They brought him up and gave him one last opportunity, and he still has not learned how to put the hitters away when he gets ahead. It is time to cut bait. This guy does not have it.

Yea I understand that, but I'm talking about THIS YR! I don't like how he made his exit either, but I'd like to see a little more patience here. If KW had been this impatient with JM, we woulda waved good bye to him in July 2001..woulda been a good thing!