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View Full Version : Not to beat a deadhorse, but where are you?


BeerHandle
04-25-2004, 12:52 AM
I know this has been broght up year after year, but I felt I had to let my frustrations known. On a saturday afternoon we only had a little over 17,000. I know the overall cost of going to a game continues to rise and the Sox continue to focus on the families.

The Sox need to find a way to the young professionals that live in the West Loop, South Loop and the Bridgeport area. WE NEED FANS AT THE PARK; THE CELL IS MUCH BETTER THEN THE DUMP ON ADDISON! There is a great product on the field. I wonder how much better the team would do if there was more fans? Don't forget, we were 50-31 at home last year. Could we have won 55 games at home and been in the playoffs? No doubt!

batmanZoSo
04-25-2004, 01:22 AM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
I know this has been broght up year after year, but I felt I had to let my frustrations known. On a saturday afternoon we only had a little over 17,000. I know the overall cost of going to a game continues to rise and the Sox continue to focus on the families.

The Sox need to find a way to the young professionals that live in the West Loop, South Loop and the Bridgeport area. WE NEED FANS AT THE PARK; THE CELL IS MUCH BETTER THEN THE DUMP ON ADDISON! There is a great product on the field. I wonder how muc better the team would do if there was more fans? Don't forget, we were 50-31 at home last year. Could we have won 55 games at home and been in the playoffs? No dount!

We just gotta win. I don't care for young professionals myself. I think that crowd is a little obnoxious.

SaltyPretzel
04-25-2004, 01:29 AM
Just a thought. Do you think there would be any discussions about attendence if the number of women attending Sox games equaled the number of guys? It has to be at least a 3-1 ratio. Just look at the bathroom lines. I hope whoever replaces Gallas does a better job marketing the team towards women.

DMarte708
04-25-2004, 01:44 AM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
I know this has been broght up year after year, but I felt I had to let my frustrations known. On a saturday afternoon we only had a little over 17,000. I know the overall cost of going to a game continues to rise and the Sox continue to focus on the families.

The Sox need to find a way to the young professionals that live in the West Loop, South Loop and the Bridgeport area. WE NEED FANS AT THE PARK; THE CELL IS MUCH BETTER THEN THE DUMP ON ADDISON! There is a great product on the field. I wonder how muc better the team would do if there was more fans? Don't forget, we were 50-31 at home last year. Could we have won 55 games at home and been in the playoffs? No dount!

Yes, this topic is a dead horse that is practically mush from the beatings it has endured.

I'm not going to think of any more excuses anymore to justify why Sox fans can't (or refuse) to travel to the park. They remodeled the upper deck, check, but lets examine other noted reasons: Bad neighborhodd, inconsistant team, no commitment to winning (lack of offseason moves), team up North, JR, am I missing anything?

Now the fans on this site would go to the park regardless of any of the above circumstances.......but together, if EVERY registered member on WSI went to a ballgame there would only be a 2,741 person increase in attendance. Your intended audience is the other 2 million citizens of Chicago who are sitting on their asses.

This advice will be ripped apart by most of you, but this is common excuses my friends say why they can't go to many games: "got work, have homework to finish, don't have enough money". My response: "skip work, F homework, Work more." As you can see I contradict myself, but in all honestly Sox fans probably feel more comfortable in their living rooms watching a game then traveling down to the Cell. Maybe its just that easy. :?:

Most people who watch games at the Urinal note how much of an "experience" it is. Nobody mentions the gridlock leading up to the park or the smell of Urine in the air, their fairweather fan base LOVES going to the field because its the hip thing to do. For people in Wrigleyville a Cub game is a way of life, not just watching their scrubbies play some stickball.

Solution to attendance: Need this years team to succeed , and not just win division but ATLEAST make it into the ALCS. Current payroll is above JR's ceiling of 60 million, and if Sox can't get into the post season money will be shed at any cost. Winning almost forces the Sox organization to raise payroll, which in return will allow us to make significant offseason moves; hopefully keeping Maggs is one of those options. 05's FA list will become one of the best in recent years, and with the loose baggage (Botch, Valentin, POSSIBLY konerko) there would be enough to sign some grade A players.

Can't blame Sox fans for not attending (there are ligitimate reasons), but you're relaying your concern onto the wrong audience. It would be great if some reporters in chicago would spend less time complaining about the park/neighborhood and more about the great amneties of the Cell. I would collapse if one day I read in the paper: "Know what, the cell might not be full all the time but I had a hell of a time. No obnoxious frat boys, good food, great seats, and an parking lot to park my car!"

batmanZoSo
04-25-2004, 02:07 AM
Originally posted by DMarte708
This advice will be ripped apart by most of you, but this is common excuses my friends say why they can't go to many games: "got work, have homework to finish, don't have enough money". My response: "skip work, F homework, Work more." As you can see I contradict myself, but in all honestly Sox fans probably feel more comfortable in their living rooms watching a game then traveling down to the Cell. Maybe its just that easy. :?:



You just pinpointed why we don't get great attendance. See, Sox fans don't make sacrifices to see the Sox play. The cub fans (and mostly b-w jumpers) do.

Everyone has a damn good excuse not to go to an overpriced baseball game. Who has the money? Or the time? A few do, most don't. But some teams make their fans overcome their own reasons not to go. The Sox, on the other hand, give us excuses not to go.

What separates good crowds from bad crowds is the attraction value of the team. In some cases it's the mystique and charm of the ballpark (Wrigley). And in others, it's because the team is great (Yankees). We're gonna have to take the second route, because no one's ever gonna go to a Sox game to see the Cell. I'm not saying it isn't a beautiful park, but you get what I mean there.

If we can have a run of making the playoffs for a few years in a row--or, dare I say it, make a World Series--we'll gradually win a lot of fans back and you'll see 30k+ a night. We'll never sell out every game like the cubs, but we can be respectable in the attendance department.

The 2000 Sox started drawing better and better gradually as the season went on. In 2001 we were primed to win a lot of fans over but we fell on our faces. So here we are back to square one.

samram
04-25-2004, 02:43 AM
Originally posted by SaltyPretzel
Just a thought. Do you think there would be any discussions about attendence if the number of women attending Sox games equaled the number of guys? It has to be at least a 3-1 ratio. Just look at the bathroom lines. I hope whoever replaces Gallas does a better job marketing the team towards women.


This is a good point. With studies showing that a substantial majority of consumption decisions are made by women, the White Sox have to focus their marketing efforts on convincing women that attending White Sox games is worth their time and money. More than likely, a woman won't go to a game by herself, she'll either bring friends, or her significant other, or her family. Whichever way, convincing one woman to go to a game probably puts two or three people in the stands.

soxnut
04-25-2004, 03:26 AM
The crowds will get bigger as the season goes on, as long as the Sox stay in contention. But consistently getting big crowds will not happen overnight. They still need a larger season ticket base for that to happen. And for that to happen the Sox have to make it to the post-season consistently or the fans have to believe that the Sox will make it to the post-season on a consistent basis.

Then if after a good run, and they tailspin a little, hopefully enough goodwill wil have built up so that attendance stays at a repectable level.

So for this season, I wouldn't expect to see another 30,000 + crowd in April or 1st half of May, unless it is a half-price night. And that would be pushing it.

It's been that way for how long now 25 years, unless the Sox are expected to contend before the season starts.

soxnut
04-25-2004, 03:28 AM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
We just gotta win. I don't care for young professionals myself. I think that crowd is a little obnoxious.


That's being a little stereotypical don't you think?

SaltyPretzel
04-25-2004, 05:16 AM
Originally posted by samram
This is a good point. With studies showing that a substantial majority of consumption decisions are made by women, the White Sox have to focus their marketing efforts on convincing women that attending White Sox games is worth their time and money. More than likely, a woman won't go to a game by herself, she'll either bring friends, or her significant other, or her family. Whichever way, convincing one woman to go to a game probably puts two or three people in the stands.


The fact is, how many times do you see a group of women tailgating by themselves before the game? My sister is a huge Sox fan, but I don't remember her ever going to a game without me or my father. Not because she thinks that the neighborhood is bad, but she can't find anyone else to bring. Jimobs doesn't really cut it for the female crowd.

soxtalker
04-25-2004, 08:32 AM
Originally posted by DMarte708
Yes, this topic is a dead horse that is practically mush from the beatings it has endured.

I'm not going to think of any more excuses anymore to justify why Sox fans can't (or refuse) to travel to the park. They remodeled the upper deck, check, but lets examine other noted reasons: Bad neighborhodd, inconsistant team, no commitment to winning (lack of offseason moves), team up North, JR, am I missing anything?

...

Yes, you are missing a reason that isn't quoted quite as much as the others, but it is probably a more significant one. That is, the time it takes many fans to get to the Cell is significantly more than it takes fans to get to Wrigley. It isn't so much that the neighborhood is "bad" around the park, but there aren't nearly as many young affluent fans within easy travel distance. That's the big advantage Wrigley has. Sure, there are fans that will travel in from the suburbs to both parks, but there is significant travel time involved. Now, this is probably not as big a factor on the weekends, and the Sox do tend to draw better then. But the Sox are relying much more heavily on fans that have to travel a longer distance (actually time) than the Cubs are.

The Critic
04-25-2004, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
We just gotta win. I don't care for young professionals myself. I think that crowd is a little obnoxious.


Originally posted by soxnut
That's being a little stereotypical don't you think?

Any generalization anyone makes is going to be a bit stereotypical. It's unavoidable.
Doesn't mean his opinion's wrong, necessarily, if that's been his personal experience with young professionals.
Myself, I'm torn - on the one hand, I'd like for the Sox to have greater exposure, higher attendance, etc., for their own sake. However, I ALSO like not having to plan my entire summer's Sox attendance in early March. So having the Sox be the "hip" thing in town would affect the way I plan out my summer. Call it selfish, but I like things the way they are. I go to a couple Cub games each year, too ( mostly to see the visitors, but my wife's a Cub fan as well ), and I have a MUCH better time at USCF.

whitesoxwilkes
04-25-2004, 09:50 AM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
We just gotta win. I don't care for young professionals myself. I think that crowd is a little obnoxious.

Hmmph. A lot of us West Loop residing young professionals happen to think that the shot-and-a-beer crowd is obnoxious too. But like it or not, we're all Sox fans, and we're all there for the same reason...get out there and show some love!

RedPinStripes
04-25-2004, 10:06 AM
Once again jerry pissed the fans off. Weekend games were going well last year what does he do? Raise the prices for weekend games. That's NOT attracting a croud . it's chasing them away! This organization just dont get it.

soxnut
04-25-2004, 10:30 AM
I know we have of reasons here as wo why attendance is low. But isn't it amazing that since 1994:

Women don't go.
The young professionals don't go.
It takes longer to get to the Cell than to Wrigley.

Those things didn't seem to be a problem back then..........


I still say it's going to take winning/fielding a competitive team on a consistent basis in order to get attendance at respectable levels consistently.

It looked as that was going to happen starting in 2000, but they fell flat on their faces as batmanZoSo mentioned. That didn't help matters.


As for young professionals being obnoxious----basically anyone who has a couple of beers gets that way----except me :D:

gosox41
04-25-2004, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by The Critic
Any generalization anyone makes is going to be a bit stereotypical. It's unavoidable.
Doesn't mean his opinion's wrong, necessarily, if that's been his personal experience with young professionals.
Myself, I'm torn - on the one hand, I'd like for the Sox to have greater exposure, higher attendance, etc., for their own sake. However, I ALSO like not having to plan my entire summer's Sox attendance in early March. So having the Sox be the "hip" thing in town would affect the way I plan out my summer. Call it selfish, but I like things the way they are. I go to a couple Cub games each year, too ( mostly to see the visitors, but my wife's a Cub fan as well ), and I have a MUCH better time at USCF.

Not to read too much into your argument but if I break it down further it sounds like you don't want the Sox to win. Beacuse if they did go far in the playoffs, or maybe win a World Series or 2 it would disrupt your enjoyment of Sox games due to planning out games earlier, more travel time, longer lines ,etc.


Bob

Brian26
04-25-2004, 10:49 AM
Saturday afternoon crowds will get better as the weather heats up. Don't worry too much about it. Yesterday was a yucky day.

samram
04-25-2004, 10:54 AM
Originally posted by SaltyPretzel
The fact is, how many times do you see a group of women tailgating by themselves before the game? My sister is a huge Sox fan, but I don't remember her ever going to a game without me or my father. Not because she thinks that the neighborhood is bad, but she can't find anyone else to bring. Jimobs doesn't really cut it for the female crowd.

I think we're making the same point. The White Sox have to find a way for women to want to come to games with their friends. The Cubs have found a way to do it, even though it was exponentially easier for them to do. But I would bet that there are many groups of women only at those games and that brings guys to the park too. Any marketing person will tell you women are a key demographic and the White Sox should realize that too.

Brian26
04-25-2004, 10:58 AM
Quite frankly, it's a shorter drive for the 45-year old divorcees from Park Ridge to drive down to Wrigley or catch the L from Skokie so they can sit in the bleachers and tan their fat thighs than to drive down to the Cell.

soxnut
04-25-2004, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by samram
I think we're making the same point. The White Sox have to find a way for women to want to come to games with their friends. The Cubs have found a way to do it, even though it was exponentially easier for them to do. But I would bet that there are many groups of women only at those games and that brings guys to the park too. Any marketing person will tell you women are a key demographic and the White Sox should realize that too.


A few years ago, the White Sox used to have a Ladies Day/Night, where women got in for half-price. I really wish they'd come back with that, considering I'm single and I really need a date or two. :D:

DrummerGeorgefan
04-25-2004, 11:04 AM
I think the numbers are low because people that go to the games in the summer (HS and College kids) dont go in the spring. They got classes. I went to as many as I could last year and still try to get to a few despite law school finals.

There is a core group of young fans that have to come back from school. Don't worry, as soon as these next two weeks are up, its Baseball time.

cheeses_h_rice
04-25-2004, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
I know this has been broght up year after year, but I felt I had to let my frustrations known. On a saturday afternoon we only had a little over 17,000. I know the overall cost of going to a game continues to rise and the Sox continue to focus on the families.

The Sox need to find a way to the young professionals that live in the West Loop, South Loop and the Bridgeport area. WE NEED FANS AT THE PARK; THE CELL IS MUCH BETTER THEN THE DUMP ON ADDISON! There is a great product on the field. I wonder how muc better the team would do if there was more fans? Don't forget, we were 50-31 at home last year. Could we have won 55 games at home and been in the playoffs? No dount!

I went on Thursday and don't have tickets to another game until mid-June. I'm taking a 'wait and see' attitude as far as what games look to have enjoyable weather and a competitive opponent. Thursday night it was in the low 40s and it was ****ing miserable. I'm sure I'm not the only one waiting on the weather to really improve before pulling the trigger on spending a hundred bucks at the Cell.

MRKARNO
04-25-2004, 12:03 PM
If the Sox were able to win their WEAK division on a yearly basis, they would certainly be able to draw a larger season ticket base, which would increase attendence. The only way to get the fans back is to win. If you can get a big group of season ticket holders who know that more likely or not they will have first dibs on playoff tickets, the season ticket base will increase. It doesnt take that much to win this crappy division. The ownership needs to pump more money into the team. If we're still winning later in the year, we will get more fans. This team hasnt drawn in April and most of May for 10 years. Why should this year be different. Until the White Sox can put together two back to back seasons with success (playoffs), I dont see this club being able to draw more than 22,000ish per game over the course of the year, which is what the Sox have been doing recently.

batmanZoSo
04-25-2004, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by whitesoxwilkes
Hmmph. A lot of us West Loop residing young professionals happen to think that the shot-and-a-beer crowd is obnoxious too. But like it or not, we're all Sox fans, and we're all there for the same reason...get out there and show some love!

I was thinking about the "young professionals" crowd that flocks to cub games when I said that. I didn't mean to break out the broom there with that generalization. It was late...

Daver
04-25-2004, 12:21 PM
http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/daver/deadhorse.gif

cheeses_h_rice
04-25-2004, 12:29 PM
Also: I wouldn't even bother comparing what the Sox draw to the Flubs this year. The Flubs have already sold something like 2.5 million tickets, or even more. Thus, even on a crummy day, you're going to see a lot of folks at the Urinal, simply because they've already paid for their tickets. If the 'base' of ticket sales were comparable for both teams, you'd see poor crowds at the Urinal as well when the weather blows. The Flubs have the luxury of having a lot of season ticket holders, and a lot of sellouts or near-sellouts just based on ticket sales from March.

anewman35
04-25-2004, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
Once again jerry pissed the fans off. Weekend games were going well last year what does he do? Raise the prices for weekend games. That's NOT attracting a croud . it's chasing them away! This organization just dont get it.

You can't blame Jerry for raisiing ticket prices - ticket prices are up around the league. He's just following the trend...

CubKilla
04-25-2004, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by anewman35
You can't blame Jerry for raisiing ticket prices - ticket prices are up around the league. He's just following the trend...

Gimme a break. Where's the money from the raise in ticket prices going? It certainly isn't going into the team either now or during the offseason. And the Angels new owner made huge offseason FA signings while lowering prices on both tickets AND beer. JR's just following his annual trend of putting more money into his pockets.

JohnBasedowYoda
04-25-2004, 03:48 PM
i was there on sat....and i froze my arse off for the whole 9

ode to veeck
04-25-2004, 04:00 PM
Actually, I came down with the flu this week, and had to put my wife on the plane from SF by herself on Thur, otherwise I woulda been at Saturdays game with my father in law

duke of dorwood
04-25-2004, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
Once again jerry pissed the fans off. Weekend games were going well last year what does he do? Raise the prices for weekend games. That's NOT attracting a croud . it's chasing them away! This organization just dont get it.


BINGO

duke of dorwood
04-25-2004, 04:06 PM
I certainly wouldnt pay more to go on a weekend.

jabrch
04-25-2004, 04:16 PM
Originally posted by whitesoxwilkes
Hmmph. A lot of us West Loop residing young professionals happen to think that the shot-and-a-beer crowd is obnoxious too. But like it or not, we're all Sox fans, and we're all there for the same reason...get out there and show some love!

I resemble both of those groups - a West Loop/Shot and Beer guy. And I surely do see how anyone could find me obnoxious.

Lip Man 1
04-25-2004, 05:25 PM
For what it's worth WGN-TV Sports had a story shortly before opening day stating that the Cubs had the 2nd highest ticket prices in all of baseball. The Sox were 11th.

Is the team on the field as good as the 11th highest prices in the league? Especially when the last six years the Sox average record has been 83-79.

Just something to consider.

Lip

hsnterprize
04-25-2004, 05:47 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
I certainly wouldnt pay more to go on a weekend. I can see where you're coming from...I personally can't afford to pay more for a game on the weekend...especially since I have a wife and kids. However, the Sox aren't the only team doing that. Check out the prices of tickets for other teams in MLB. I'll check it out just to make sure, but I'm thinking about 1/2 of the teams charge more for weekend/"prime" games than regular prices.

It's all about the Benjamins, baby.

:payrod

He gets it, and now we're about to get it big time.

hsnterprize
04-25-2004, 05:51 PM
I know I'm like the one-millionth person to say something about this...but I'm really sick and tired of this "lack of fans" issue at the Cell. Me, and others have written all we could about why we think the fans aren't flooding U.S. Cellular Field like Wrigley. There are TONS of reasons why, and many of them involve Reinsdorf himself, from the infamous strike involvement, the '97 White Flag trade, the "Chicago has always been a Cubs town" comment in 2000, and other stupid stuff. However, this is really beating a dead horse, so please...as long as there isn't a media barrage going on about it right now, let's not worry about it.

joecrede
04-25-2004, 06:02 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
Once again jerry pissed the fans off. Weekend games were going well last year what does he do? Raise the prices for weekend games. That's NOT attracting a croud . it's chasing them away! This organization just dont get it.

The first 15 rows of the upper deck reserves went for $20 last year. $16 this year on weekends. A 20% discount.

kittle545feet
04-25-2004, 06:12 PM
Originally posted by SaltyPretzel
Just a thought. Do you think there would be any discussions about attendence if the number of women attending Sox games equaled the number of guys? It has to be at least a 3-1 ratio. Just look at the bathroom lines. I hope whoever replaces Gallas does a better job marketing the team towards women. in my humble opinion, i could care less about women going to sox games. in fact, most of them should stay home. they go to wrigley to be seen because most at wrigley are there for the women. its not like that at comiskey. i go to watch a game and if a hottie walks by, yeah, i'll enjoy the scenery. but i'm there for the sox. i can't tell you how many times i get stuck sitting in front of or behind girls who don't stop talking about stupid crap. "did you see american idol?" "you won't believe what jack did............" " Maggs is so hot!" " i'm cold........" " i got this blouse at marshall field's for..........." do i have to go on sox fans? i know most of you know what i am talking about. hey ladies, shut the hell up, i'm trying to watch a sox game!!!!! its at these moments i pray for a line drive foul ball. that'll make 'em pay attention. besides, don't we knock the wrigley fans for going to the games to pig girls and not watch the game? and now we should cater to that crowd? oh please! you will drive away what good fans we do have. anyways, i can't understand all of the small crowds we have had but i think it has something to do with winning. :bart

Brian26
04-25-2004, 06:40 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
For what it's worth WGN-TV Sports had a story shortly before opening day stating that the Cubs had the 2nd highest ticket prices in all of baseball. The Sox were 11th.

Is the team on the field as good as the 11th highest prices in the league? Especially when the last six years the Sox average record has been 83-79.

Just something to consider.

Lip

Chicago is the 3rd largest city in the country. The cost of living in Chicago is higher than it is in Minnesota, Kansas City, or Cleveland (as examples). I don't think it's unreasonable for the White Sox to have the 11th highest ticket prices.

cheeses_h_rice
04-25-2004, 06:52 PM
Originally posted by joecrede
The first 15 rows of the upper deck reserves went for $20 last year. $16 this year on weekends. A 20% discount.

I think you're wrong on this point. On weekends, the upper deck seats go for $22 for "premium" (first X rows between 1st and 3rd base) and $20 for "box." The $16 price tag is for UD box seats during the week.

joecrede
04-25-2004, 07:21 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice
I think you're wrong on this point. On weekends, the upper deck seats go for $22 for "premium" (first X rows between 1st and 3rd base) and $20 for "box." The $16 price tag is for UD box seats during the week.

My fault for not clarifying. Last year the first 15 rows from sections 520-506 and 544-558 were considered box seats and went for (at least) $20. Those same seats are now considered reserve and go for $16 on weekends.

TornLabrum
04-25-2004, 07:31 PM
Originally posted by hsnterprize
I know I'm like the one-millionth person to say something about this...but I'm really sick and tired of this "lack of fans" issue at the Cell. Me, and others have written all we could about why we think the fans aren't flooding U.S. Cellular Field like Wrigley. There are TONS of reasons why, and many of them involve Reinsdorf himself, from the infamous strike involvement, the '97 White Flag trade, the "Chicago has always been a Cubs town" comment in 2000, and other stupid stuff. However, this is really beating a dead horse, so please...as long as there isn't a media barrage going on about it right now, let's not worry about it.

Mariotti had a comment about lack of attendance just after the Comiskey statue dedication. Telander had a comment about it on April 15 or thereabouts in his reasons why there should be media bias towards the Cubs (even though, of course, there really isn't any). It's not a barrage, but there are still incoming shells.

kermittheefrog
04-25-2004, 07:43 PM
I appear to be in northeastern Wisconsin.

cheeses_h_rice
04-25-2004, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by joecrede
My fault for not clarifying. Last year the first 15 rows from sections 520-506 and 544-558 were considered box seats and went for (at least) $20. Those same seats are now considered reserve and go for $16 on weekends.

Ah, I get it. Looks like you picked the only example where seats actually got cheaper in any area of the park; for the most part, they went up everywhere.

chisox06
04-25-2004, 10:15 PM
Originally posted by DrummerGeorgefan
I think the numbers are low because people that go to the games in the summer (HS and College kids) dont go in the spring. They got classes. I went to as many as I could last year and still try to get to a few despite law school finals.

There is a core group of young fans that have to come back from school. Don't worry, as soon as these next two weeks are up, its Baseball time.

I can attest to that but I dont think the sox have any bigger problem with that than any other teams. I have my last week of classes, gonna try to make it to 6 games this summer. Now why am I willing to drive 5 hrs to go the cell and so called Sox "fans" right in the city wont get off there ass and go see some good baseball?

hsnterprize
04-26-2004, 06:49 AM
Originally posted by TornLabrum
Mariotti had a comment about lack of attendance just after the Comiskey statue dedication. Telander had a comment about it on April 15 or thereabouts in his reasons why there should be media bias towards the Cubs (even though, of course, there really isn't any). It's not a barrage, but there are still incoming shells. That's true, Hal. In fact, this morning, Moronotti's column talked about the "whining" the Sox were doing about the constant crap the media writes in the name of "fairness" in reporting towards the north siders.

In fact...here's a quote from the moron himself...

"Face it, Sox fans. In what firmly is established as a Cubs marker, you're stuck in the middle of a Cubs-intensive season that is drawing global notice. Yet the South Side whine quotient only makes this North Side leanings appear more one-sided. Seems everyone is sour, from an owner (Jerry Reinsdorf) who can't stop kicking pebbles at media outlets to a TV boradcaster (Hawk Harrleson) who sounds like he's constipated to a rookie manager who can't get his facts rights. "We have our (home) opener, my first one in my hometown as manager, and we have one or two pages in the paper," Guillen said, "And the Cubs lose the game, and it's 45 pages."

Here's the text of an e-mail sent to Jay...Okay, Jay. As a fellow journalist, I can understand your perspective on this issue. Of course, the Cubs are the more popular team as of now, and historically, the popularity pendulum has swayed from the north to the south and so on. But in this case, there is something you're either incapable of seeing, or selectively aren't willing to look at. (And I'm going to e-mail him with this information.) It seems like even though the Cubs do deserve attention for their success as of late, people like yourself seem to have no problem literally fawning over the Cubs and everything about them. After all, who doesn't love the Cubbies? It's people like you to make Ozzie say things like he does...and it's not like Ozzie personally counted every page to make sure his opening game gets the same amount of inches as the Cubs' opener. It's just that the local media as of late has been making the Cubs look like messiahs, and the Sox look like satan's disciples. Simply put, the image is out there that people like you helped create that the Cubs are all that's right and holy with baseball while the Sox are the rejected stepchildren no one is interested in. And that's not to say the Sox haven't deserved some of the ire they've received over the years. Sox fans have constantly on Reinsdorf's back about the ballpark, stupid comments made about fans, and his apparent lack to aggresively market his team in the face of "Cubdom". And they also give credit to the Cubs for their recent success and popularity. However, as long as people like you, Jay, keep shooting jabs at the south side while acting like the north side is baseball utopia, Sox fans will continue to shoot jabs at you, your paper, your radio show, and anything else you touch.

You say the Cubs "deserve all the attention they're getting." You also said a couple of seasons ago that "Sox fans are better than Cubs fans." Now...what side are you on, here? I know you're not from here, and you say you're not a fan of either team. Well, that's fine, but you're acting like you are one with the constant criticisms of the Sox and your constant fawning over the Cubs. Yes, you've been critical of Cubdom at times...but your praise, whether deserved or not, of the north siders is far above the south siders. And you say Ozzie is "way off base"? When was the last time you looked in the mirror?

He may or may not respond to what I say...I really don't care. He's read stuff like this before, so I don't think he'll blink. But, if it means anything, at least he knows Sox fans aren't going to take his crap against us and our team lying down. Of course we want our team to win, but the constant media blitz swaying towards the north side is ridiculous. It's one thing if the Cubs are winning like they are now. But, it doesn't matter if the Cubs win or lose...they're loved more than God in some cases.

Realist
04-26-2004, 07:02 AM
I go to over 30 games a year, but I still blow off at least 3 games that I have tickets for. Sometimes I have to work. Sometimes I'm just beat from working too much and sometimes I have other social committments.

It's Chicago and it's April. It's cold. If we were the only team in Chicago, we'd be damn near capacity every game.

Chicago has 2 teams and the team on the northside's park is a tourist attraction so their attendance gets a big boost no matter how good we are or how bad they suck canal water.

I used to think it was just a cliche or a bad excuse, but I know now that Sox fans work and have active lives with their families and friends and often don't have time to slither off to a game like many of the fans of the Chubbies.

It wasn't until I began to live and work amongst the Flub fans that I fully understood that many of those people have no substance to their lives what so ever. We're at a Christening, or a graduation party, or a family member's birthday party when the Sox play. Cubs fans don't have this conflict because most of them hate themselves and hate their families. :D:

gosox41
04-26-2004, 07:24 AM
Originally posted by hsnterprize
That's true, Hal. In fact, this morning, Moronotti's column talked about the "whining" the Sox were doing about the constant crap the media writes in the name of "fairness" in reporting towards the north siders.

In fact...here's a quote from the moron himself...

"Face it, Sox fans. In what firmly is established as a Cubs marker, you're stuck in the middle of a Cubs-intensive season that is drawing global notice. Yet the South Side whine quotient only makes this North Side leanings appear more one-sided. Seems everyone is sour, from an owner (Jerry Reinsdorf) who can't stop kicking pebbles at media outlets to a TV boradcaster (Hawk Harrleson) who sounds like he's constipated to a rookie manager who can't get his facts rights. "We have our (home) opener, my first one in my hometown as manager, and we have one or two pages in the paper," Guillen said, "And the Cubs lose the game, and it's 45 pages."

Here's the text of an e-mail sent to Jay...Okay, Jay. As a fellow journalist, I can understand your perspective on this issue. Of course, the Cubs are the more popular team as of now, and historically, the popularity pendulum has swayed from the north to the south and so on. But in this case, there is something you're either incapable of seeing, or selectively aren't willing to look at. (And I'm going to e-mail him with this information.) It seems like even though the Cubs do deserve attention for their success as of late, people like yourself seem to have no problem literally fawning over the Cubs and everything about them. After all, who doesn't love the Cubbies? It's people like you to make Ozzie say things like he does...and it's not like Ozzie personally counted every page to make sure his opening game gets the same amount of inches as the Cubs' opener. It's just that the local media as of late has been making the Cubs look like messiahs, and the Sox look like satan's disciples. Simply put, the image is out there that people like you helped create that the Cubs are all that's right and holy with baseball while the Sox are the rejected stepchildren no one is interested in. And that's not to say the Sox haven't deserved some of the ire they've received over the years. Sox fans have constantly on Reinsdorf's back about the ballpark, stupid comments made about fans, and his apparent lack to aggresively market his team in the face of "Cubdom". And they also give credit to the Cubs for their recent success and popularity. However, as long as people like you, Jay, keep shooting jabs at the south side while acting like the north side is baseball utopia, Sox fans will continue to shoot jabs at you, your paper, your radio show, and anything else you touch.

You say the Cubs "deserve all the attention they're getting." You also said a couple of seasons ago that "Sox fans are better than Cubs fans." Now...what side are you on, here? I know you're not from here, and you say you're not a fan of either team. Well, that's fine, but you're acting like you are one with the constant criticisms of the Sox and your constant fawning over the Cubs. Yes, you've been critical of Cubdom at times...but your praise, whether deserved or not, of the north siders is far above the south siders. And you say Ozzie is "way off base"? When was the last time you looked in the mirror?

He may or may not respond to what I say...I really don't care. He's read stuff like this before, so I don't think he'll blink. But, if it means anything, at least he knows Sox fans aren't going to take his crap against us and our team lying down. Of course we want our team to win, but the constant media blitz swaying towards the north side is ridiculous. It's one thing if the Cubs are winning like they are now. But, it doesn't matter if the Cubs win or lose...they're loved more than God in some cases.

He won't respond. Jay is a wuss. I've e-mail him before. He lacks the cajones to take criticism.


Bob

wdelaney72
04-26-2004, 08:18 AM
I have a 4 month old baby and a 3 yr. old. Plus, I live in the far north suburbs. I support the team the best I can through radio / TV broadcasts.

I will still likely make 3 games this year. Given my situation, I think that's pretty damn good.

ewokpelts
04-26-2004, 12:06 PM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
I know this has been broght up year after year, but I felt I had to let my frustrations known. On a saturday afternoon we only had a little over 17,000. I know the overall cost of going to a game continues to rise and the Sox continue to focus on the families.

The Sox need to find a way to the young professionals that live in the West Loop, South Loop and the Bridgeport area. WE NEED FANS AT THE PARK; THE CELL IS MUCH BETTER THEN THE DUMP ON ADDISON! There is a great product on the field. I wonder how much better the team would do if there was more fans? Don't forget, we were 50-31 at home last year. Could we have won 55 games at home and been in the playoffs? No doubt!

:threadsucks

woodenleg
04-26-2004, 12:15 PM
Originally posted by kittle545feet
in my humble opinion, i could care less about women going to sox games. in fact, most of them should stay home. they go to wrigley to be seen because most at wrigley are there for the women. its not like that at comiskey. i go to watch a game and if a hottie walks by, yeah, i'll enjoy the scenery. but i'm there for the sox. i can't tell you how many times i get stuck sitting in front of or behind girls who don't stop talking about stupid crap. "did you see american idol?" "you won't believe what jack did............" " Maggs is so hot!" " i'm cold........" " i got this blouse at marshall field's for..........." do i have to go on sox fans? i know most of you know what i am talking about. hey ladies, shut the hell up, i'm trying to watch a sox game!!!!! its at these moments i pray for a line drive foul ball. that'll make 'em pay attention. besides, don't we knock the wrigley fans for going to the games to pig girls and not watch the game? and now we should cater to that crowd? oh please! you will drive away what good fans we do have. anyways, i can't understand all of the small crowds we have had but i think it has something to do with winning. :bart

Great. Please tell me you're fourteen years old. Either that, or you're eighty years old, because your attitude is better suited to the fifties.

You obviously aren't aware of the importance of the many moms who raise their kids as Sox fans - including my own.

Mohoney
04-26-2004, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by SaltyPretzel
Just a thought. Do you think there would be any discussions about attendence if the number of women attending Sox games equaled the number of guys? It has to be at least a 3-1 ratio. Just look at the bathroom lines. I hope whoever replaces Gallas does a better job marketing the team towards women.

Maybe half-price tickets or concessions for women on Wednesdays? There isn't a Wednesday gimmick yet, so maybe these would work.

Plus, the weather on this homestand hasn't exactly been walk-up friendly. I was freezing Thursday, Saturday, and Sunday. If the weather was better Sunday, I think they would have had a few thousand more walk-ups, because Willy Wonka Kids Day is usually a pretty decent draw.

BeerHandle
04-26-2004, 05:13 PM
How about "WHITE SOX INTERACTIVE DAY!"