9/11: World Trade Center/Pentagon Bombed!!!

[Chisox353014]

I'm sure we can move this to the Parking Lot, but if you haven't heard yet turn on a TV!!

[CLR01]

or even a radio. South tower of the WTC collapsed. Lets hope they atleast had the rest of the build evacuated and the area cleared.

[CLR01]

There has just been an explosion at capitol hill.

[CLR01]

Yet another hi-jacked plane now enroute to washington.

[Iguana775]

both towers are down and a plane just crashed in pitt.

[DuckSnort]

This is messed up! damned terrorists! takes a real mind to come up with this.

[CLR01]

Originally posted by Iguana775
both towers are down and a plane just crashed in pitt.

The 2nd plane is still headed towards washington and an F-16 has been scrambled. At the risk of sounding like at total *******, if the plane is indeed hi-jacked do they have any choice but to shoot it out of the sky to keep any more deaths from occuring??

[Chisox353014]

It seems trivial now, but I just heard on the radio that the Sox are actually in a midtown Manhattan hotel and they are OK. They aren't near the WTC. Of course the game is cancelled.

[Kilroy]

Originally posted by CLR01


The 2nd plane is still headed towards washington and an F-16 has been scrambled. At the risk of sounding like at total *******, if the plane is indeed hi-jacked do they have any choice but to shoot it out of the sky to keep any more deaths from occuring??

Any more info on the plane in Pitt??

We're not getting anything on that here at work...

[CLR01]

Not yet, they said it was a commercial aircraft either a 747 or 767. They are still tracking the one headed towards the capitol so it is not the same flight

[CLR01]

This is the first i have heard of this, but another plane is reported as going down at Camp David earlier.

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by CLR01


The 2nd plane is still headed towards washington and an F-16 has been scrambled. At the risk of sounding like at total *******, if the plane is indeed hi-jacked do they have any choice but to shoot it out of the sky to keep any more deaths from occuring??

What else could they do? This is really insane. Although, quite frankly it doesn't surprise me that much. It was only a matter of time before something like this happened on US soil. What I don't get is: how could this LARGE and coordinated an effort go down with NOBODY knowing it was coming?

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by Kilroy


Any more info on the plane in Pitt??

We're not getting anything on that here at work...

Just heard on the radio:plane from Chicago to NY, 747 probably, crashed 80 miles south of Pittsburgh in Somerset County PA.

[DuckSnort]

Watching CNN, I'm pretty sure they said it was a 767, either way it was a giant plane... and now all major cities are shutting down, and airports are shut down, even canada...

and now perhaps a car bomb... just went off!! AHH!!! someones gonna get it.

[CubKiller]

Originally posted by Chisox353014
Just heard on the radio...

Chisox353014, are you listening to 780am...? You're way ahead of CNN and MSNBC...

[CLR01]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
AHH!!! someones gonna get it.

[Kilroy]

Originally posted by Chisox353014


What else could they do? This is really insane. Although, quite frankly it doesn't surprise me that much. It was only a matter of time before something like this happened on US soil. What I don't get is: how could this LARGE and coordinated an effort go down with NOBODY knowing it was coming?

Thanks for the info on the Pitt plane. I agree, I can't believe that they didn't have any idea that this was coming. If not, then those agencies that take care of this kind of stuff arent doing a good enuf job.

[CLR01]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
AHH!!! someones gonna get it.


This is what freaks me out about this the most. All of these attacks have been suicide missions. They haven't been able to touch Bein Laden in the last decade. We don't know who is responsible, although it was just reported that Bein laden warned a few weeks ago he would attack american intrests. Who are they going to get? Maybe some lackey of one of these groups will take the fall and spend his life in jail or get the chair or something but I dont see them getting to the real source.

[CLR01]

A possible bomb has been reported in a high school.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CLR01



This is what freaks me out about this the most. All of these attacks have been suicide missions. They haven't been able to touch Bein Laden in the last decade. We don't know who is responsible, although it was just reported that Bein laden warned a few weeks ago he would attack american intrests. Who are they going to get? Maybe some lackey of one of these groups will take the fall and spend his life in jail or get the chair or something but I dont see them getting to the real source.

SOP, all flights cancelled, no plane in air, if there is one, the military will take off. The plane going to wash from oversea, once it hit us airspace, 1 of 2 things will happen, 1. the plane will change direction. 2 if not then it will be shot down.

Did i hear right, did the pentagon (sp) got bonb as well?

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by Kilroy


Thanks for the info on the Pitt plane. I agree, I can't believe that they didn't have any idea that this was coming. If not, then those agencies that take care of this kind of stuff arent doing a good enuf job.

I'm now hearing conflicting reports about the PA plane. It definitely went down in Somerset County, but now they're saying it may have been going to or from Cleveland and that it was a jumbo jet.

[DuckSnort]

We can only hope, that Bein Laden will get what's rightfully coming to him, because this is most likely, his work. this is armageddon like. wow.

[CLR01]

Originally posted by Chisox353014


I'm now hearing conflicting reports about the PA plane. It definitely went down in Somerset County, but now they're saying it may have been going to or from Cleveland and that it was a jumbo jet.


I heard it was enroute to chicago.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


SOP, all flights cancelled, no plane in air, if there is one, the military will take off. The plane going to wash from oversea, once it hit us airspace, 1 of 2 things will happen, 1. the plane will change direction. 2 if not then it will be shot down.

Did i hear right, did the pentagon (sp) got bonb as well?

Thru history shows that you can't beat a group of fanatical religious people who have only one thought, kill in the name of god.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
We can only hope, that Bein Laden will get what's rightfully coming to him, because this is most likely, his work. this is armageddon like. wow.

if they could ever find him

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


SOP, all flights cancelled, no plane in air, if there is one, the military will take off. The plane going to wash from oversea, once it hit us airspace, 1 of 2 things will happen, 1. the plane will change direction. 2 if not then it will be shot down.

Did i hear right, did the pentagon (sp) got bonb as well?

a plane crashed into it

[CLR01]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
Did i hear right, did the pentagon (sp) got bonb as well?

Yes, a plane crashed into a helipad at the pentagon and part ot that building has collasped as well.

[DuckSnort]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


if they could ever find him



Someone didn't respect the bing...!

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CLR01


Yes, a plane crashed into a helipad at the pentagon and part ot that building has collasped as well.

I hate to be morbid, but i feel sorry for the people at the world trad build and everywhere else. But the pentagon, except for those who works to earn a living, the brass at the pentagon i find it ironic.

[DuckSnort]

Question: who all thinks war will stem from all of this?

I personally hope not.. because that's what theywant...

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
Question: who all thinks war will stem from all of this?

I personally hope not.. because that's what theywant...

A war if it was a nation attack. This was a terrorist attack. You can beat the America will wake up and quit being the punching bag for everybody.

If this terrorist has escape the world search, how do you think the usa feds going to do anything. They are sooo inept.

[CLR01]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
Question: who all thinks war will stem from all of this?

I personally hope not.. because that's what theywant...


Well i just heard on NBC, a reporter said that the US warned that if we were attacked that we would hold Afghanistan responsible and that we can expect military retaliation on them. Also the army is on its highest state of alert.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


A war if it was a nation attack. This was a terrorist attack. You can beat the America will wake up and quit being the punching bag for everybody.

If this terrorist has escape the world search, how do you think the usa feds going to do anything. They are sooo inept.

did you hear that alot of islamic nation are rejoicing

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CLR01



Well i just heard on NBC, a reporter said that the US warned that if we were attacked that we would hold Afghanistan responsible and that we can expect military retaliation on them. Also the army is on its highest state of alert.

Try Afghanistan, iraq, iran, libia and even jordon, have train terrorist. Right now, i can tell you that Afghanistan is the leading nation.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


Try Afghanistan, iraq, iran, libia and even jordon, have train terrorist. Right now, i can tell you that Afghanistan is the leading nation.

My question is how were those plane hijack? I mean what kind of weapon were they using.

[Iguana775]

well, one thing is for sure, SOMEONE NEEDS TO BE NUKED!!!!!!!! or at least bombed severly!!

[Dadawg_77]

ABC is reporting the United confirm the flight that crashed into PA was from New Wark,NJ to San Fran. Not to or from Chicago, but if it was hiajacked, who knows where it could of ended up.

Camp David report is looking to be hoaks now.

Car Bomb exploded outside State Dept.

The planes that crashed into the World Trade Center had 81 passenger and 11 crew on one, and 58 passengers and 6 crew on the other.

The question of who we will go to war with, is answered with who? Bin Laden does control a country, he is just a rich terrorist. If the US found out there was a country supporting him doing this, well look out. This thing might go nuke, we havn't been hit this hard ever. Right now we are looking at over 50,000 dead or wounded in these attacks

[Kilroy]

Originally posted by Dadawg_77
Right now we are looking at over 50,000 dead or wounded in these attacks

Don't quote any numbers. There are NO CONFIRMED NUMBERS on any casualties at this time. Unless of course you have some from somewhere that you can link or direct us to.

Also, w/ regard to the hijacked flights, no of them were en-route to, or originating from Chicago.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Dadawg_77
ABC is reporting the United confirm the flight that crashed into PA was from New Wark,NJ to San Fran. Not to or from Chicago, but if it was hiajacked, who knows where it could of ended up.

Camp David report is looking to be hoaks now.

Car Bomb exploded outside State Dept.

The planes that crashed into the World Trade Center had 81 passenger and 11 crew on one, and 58 passengers and 6 crew on the other.

The question of who we will go to war with, is answered with who? Bin Laden does control a country, he is just a rich terrorist. If the US found out there was a country supporting him doing this, well look out. This thing might go nuke, we havn't been hit this hard ever. Right now we are looking at over 50,000 dead or wounded in these attacks


Man, i really do pity the world, if they ever saw our strenght, WHEN, the USA gets pissed off. As i said before, and i remember a discussion on this board last yr about usa being used as a patsy. I wonder when we will wake up..................

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



Man, i really do pity the world, if they ever saw our strenght, WHEN, the USA gets pissed off. As i said before, and i remember a discussion on this board last yr about usa being used as a patsy. I wonder when we will wake up..................


wgn stated that the sox players have called their relative to assure them of there safety.

[voodoochile]

Yes, we will go to war over this, IMO. This is the equivialant of Pearl Harbor except the targets were primarily civilian in nature, from the sounds of things.

Strange days...

Somewhere, someone is going to pay for the slaughter of 100's and possibly 1000's of innocent civilians. Matter of time or not, this was beyond reprehensible, beyond barbaric. The people must be dealt with. If a country shelters the people responsible, then they too are responsible.

The gloves are going to come off now. The beast is awake and they are fuking with the wrong country. NATO will be involved, and it's test time for our ally Russia. Time for them to put up or shut up...

You will remember where you were this day many years from now. This was and act of war...

[Kilroy]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
wgn stated that the sox players have called their relative to assure them of there safety.

I guess that's good.


I just wonder why these people that do these things think that this type of action helps their cause. It only makes them the targets of retaliation. The kind of retalitation that I'm hoping at this moment is swift, public, and complete. No pusssy-footing around with these cowards. Just find them and dis-infect the free world of them.

[Iguana775]

i have no doubt that there will be something with bush in office. he likes a strong military and we will see what he can do.

[Randar68]

It seems to me that there is going to be a VERY large and SWIFT counter attack against someone, somewhere. Diplomacy is not the forte of the Republican party, and I doubt GWB is going to consider the 'feelings' of any country harboring terrorists.

Personally, I think we may see sweeping attacks, on many fronts, against any possible group that may have been responsible for this, and I hope the US strengthens its support of Isreal, as that may be the most effective counterattack.

I am disgusted, and extremely uneasy about the coming time. I, too, think you will all remember where you were on September 11, 2001.

I happened to be drinking my coffee and watching TV at home when they were discussing the first crash, and there was considerable confusion over the nature of it. That confusion quickly melted away, as I sat there shocked after I saw, live, a second plane slam into the second tower. I couldn't even speak.

Hopes and wishes are with the families and victims of these terrible attacks....

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by voodoochile
Yes, we will go to war over this, IMO. This is the equivialant of Pearl Harbor except the targets were primarily civilian in nature, from the sounds of things.

Strange days...

Somewhere, someone is going to pay for the slaughter of 100's and possibly 1000's of innocent civilians. Matter of time or not, this was beyond reprehensible, beyond barbaric. The people must be dealt with. If a country shelters the people responsible, then they too are responsible.

The gloves are going to come off now. The beast is awake and they are fuking with the wrong country. NATO will be involved, and it's test time for our ally Russia. Time for them to put up or shut up...

You will remember where you were this day many years from now. This was and act of war...

All the allies have no choice but as you said put up or shut up. Where we go, England, and Iraselli will go. So eveybody else shoul beware

[FarWestChicago]

I got in my car to drive to work this morning. I had the radio on a sports talk station as usual. But, the guys weren't there and there was news going. I started hearing about a plane crashing into the Pentagon. I'm driving along in shock when they start talking about the destruction of both World Trade Center towers.

A whole bunch of somebodys need to pay for this. And I don't care if any other nations object to what is done.

[Paulwny]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
.

A whole bunch of somebodys need to pay for this. And I don't care if any other nations object to what is done.

Totally agree, a very sad day
Maybe the people in the US will realize you can't use diplomacy when you deal with people whose goal is your destruction. I can't stand looking at the tv any more, too many lives lost.

[idseer]

i understand now the rest of the baseball season has been cancelled. has anyone else heard this?

[idseer]

ok fox just corrected themselves about the cancellations. just all of todays games ........ so far.

[Paulwny]

Just checked the AP, all of todays games are cancelled, nothing about the season.

[mrwag]

This from MLB.COM..

"In the interest of security and out of a sense of deep mourning for the national tragedy that has occurred today, all Major League Baseball games for today have been canceled," said Commisioner Allan H. (Bud) Selig. "I will continue to monitor the situation on a daily basis and make ongoing decisions accordingly. "

[ma-gaga]

Not to be a callous ass, but more than likely, games will only be cancelled 2-3 days. Amazing doesn't even begin to describe what's happened.

ignore my sig.

http://espn.go.com/columns/kreidler/1250483.html

[Paulwny]

Originally posted by ma-gaga
Not to be a callous ass, but more than likely, games will only be cancelled 2-3 days. Amazing doesn't even begin to describe what's happened.

ignore my sig.

http://espn.go.com/columns/kreidler/1250483.html

The US Gov't will want the American people to continue on with their normal lives as soon as possible, shows the rest of the world that no matter what happens life in the US continues as it always did.

[Randar68]

Couldn't agree more. Also, we all know there will be a significant military reaction somewhere. I really don't care what Palestine or Afghanastan think of us anymore, for the sanctity of the American people, "F*ck 'em". Palestine and Saudi terrorists have been fighting a battle against american citizens for too long.


It's time to react....

[Foulke You]

It's amusing to me how these terrorists hope to scare the $#it out of the U.S. when all they seemed to really be doing is pissing everyone off. I share most people's feeling of deep anger and resentment towards those who would do such a cowardly act. Remember, there was a reason why Adolf Hitler was really angry with his Japanese allies after he wasn't consulted on the Pearl Harbor attack. He knew that a bunch of jacked up, pissed off American soldiers would be entering the war soon and tip the scales towards the Allies.

If anything, this day has united our country. I've already seen 3 businesses that have "God Bless America" plastered on their marquee signs. I worry that what occured today may only be the beginning of something on a larger scale.

[CerberusWG]

Ok firsts things first.

1) It was a horrible act.
2) It was horrible to watch live.
3) There is no way in hell we will find Bin Laden

It is almost impossible to find Bin Laden now. He is in the middle of Afghanistn, hid in some mountains, and I highly doubt we will ever find him. Also a senior official from the radical group Jihad said this was because of our actions in the middle east. We all knew something would happen, but not to this magnitude. We all have to admit that whoever planned this attack almost crippled our whole government. They took out our Defense, Economical, and if they hit Pittsburgh, that would of crippled manufacturing throughout the US. This was a VERY well planned attack, and it worked like clockwork.

My dad was flying to NY today and COULD have gotten killed, luckily his plane was diverted to Detroit, and he is driving back to IN today.

My thought and prayers go out to all of the deceased. This is a day that shall live in infamy.

[CerberusWG]

Also, look at today's date. 9/11=911. Odd

[Randar68]

3) There is no way in hell we will find Bin Laden

Don't know about this one, but I have heard that Bush warned Afghanistan that if a Bin Laden lead attack on the US occurred, we'd hold Afghanistan directly responsible. We know what country he's in, and that just means a better chance....we have the best trained special forces in the world, so I doubt he feels very safe, wherever he is....

[Chisox353014]

I just heard that the plane that crashed in PA was headed toward Washington DC and was possibly intercepted and shot down by the military...I can't imagine having to do that, it makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it.

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by Chisox353014
I just heard that the plane that crashed in PA was headed toward Washington DC and was possibly intercepted and shot down by the military...I can't imagine having to do that, it makes me sick to my stomach just thinking about it.

I heard something similar. It does make some sense. Why did that only plane fail to make it to it's target? Can you imagine being the fighter pilot if it was the case? What a thing to have to live with.

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago


I heard something similar. It does make some sense. Why did that only plane fail to make it to it's target? Can you imagine being the fighter pilot if it was the case? What a thing to have to live with.

It's rumored that the target of that particular plane was the White House. Can you imagine if it had made it to it's destination? WTC, Pentagon, and the White House all hit on the same day? Unbelievable.

[KempersRS]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago


I heard something similar. It does make some sense. Why did that only plane fail to make it to it's target? Can you imagine being the fighter pilot if it was the case? What a thing to have to live with.

If someone did shoot down that plabe, he killed many people, but they were going to die anyway. By shooting down that plane, they could have saved thousands more.

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by KempersRS


If someone did shoot down that plabe, he killed many people, but they were going to die anyway. By shooting down that plane, they could have saved thousands more. I still wouldn't want to be the guy. Even knowing you did what was best couldn't make a normal person feel much better.

[Jerry_Manuel]

Originally posted by Chisox353014
It's rumored that the target of that particular plane was the White House. Can you imagine if it had made it to it's destination? WTC, Pentagon, and the White House all hit on the same day? Unbelievable.

Again another rumor but CNN says that the plane in question was going towards Camp David.

[doublem23]

Originally posted by DuckSnort
Question: who all thinks war will stem from all of this?

I personally hope not.. because that's what theywant...

No war will happen because of this unless George Bush gets his way.

This isn't a state or anything. I believ Yasser Arafat when he said the PLO has nothing to do with this because:

A) He's not that dumb to attack the United States. I mean, cmon. Why would you take the limited resources to have to attack the U.S. full knowing they'll retaliate and punish you beyond your wildest dreams.

B) They have bigger problems across the street. The PLO is using its limited resources to attack Tel Aviv, not New York City.

The question we should all be asking isn't who did it? It's why did it happen? What can we do to change the mentalitly of the U.S. so people don't get so pissed off at us to get the balls to hijack a plane and kill themselves? This isn't a cowardly attack. This is a crusade...

Please don't get me wrong. This is a TERRIBLE tradegy, bu I think to just go after whoever did this is a little misguided. We have to figure out why they hate us so much....

[Randar68]

If someone did shoot down that plabe, he killed many people, but they were going to die anyway. By shooting down that plane, they could have saved thousands more.

Well, I've been watching the MSNBC live broadcast on the web, and they haven't mentioned such. The number of false speculations I have heard are rediculous.

Read this one:
http://chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-worldtrade.story?coll=chi%2Dnews%2Dhed

This plane went down right at/near, a small runway in Summerset, similar in size to Kankakee airport, the plane would have been able to crash-land, but not take off. That, to me, sounds like a pilot trying to ditch before the plane was taken over....heroic.....

[Jerry_Manuel]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
I still wouldn't want to be the guy. Even knowing you did what was best couldn't make a normal person feel much better.

Well said West, while Kempers brings up a good point that many lives were saved there were still hundreds lost.

[CerberusWG]

Guys
I just found this on the Internet

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right&th=54ab4d241c34e0cc&seekm=3b8fd177%40monitor.lanset.com#link7

make your own conclusions.

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by Randar68


Well, I've been watching the MSNBC live broadcast on the web, and they haven't mentioned such. The number of false speculations I have heard are rediculous.

Read this one:
http://chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/sns-worldtrade.story?coll=chi%2Dnews%2Dhed

This plane went down right at/near, a small runway in Summerset, similar in size to Kankakee airport, the plane would have been able to crash-land, but not take off. That, to me, sounds like a pilot trying to ditch before the plane was taken over....heroic.....

Randar, you may be right. CBS is now saying those 'shot down by military' rumors are indeed false. They also said the black box from that plane will likely be recovered. That could be a major piece of evidence towards figuring out who was responsible for this. Amazingly, this plane took off from Newark, made it all the way to Cleveland, and then U-turned and headed back to the east coast. That was probably the source of the "Cleveland" rumors I heard earlier as well. You're right, there is a ton of false info out there right now.

[Jerry_Manuel]

The date of that first post is 2001-08-31 today is 2001-09-11.

[CerberusWG]

yes but read his post on 9-4

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
The date of that first post is 2001-08-31 today is 2001-09-11.


I had to go to sleep and rest. But i wanted to ask, what happen to the plane that was rumored to have been hijack, heading to the american air space?

Second have you heard now the that main terrorist is now declining that it was his org that did this deed.

[Jerry_Manuel]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
yes but read his post on 9-4

Interesting but I don't think someone who planned something like this would post it on a message board.

[doublem23]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
Second have you heard now the that main terrorist is now declining that it was his org that did this deed.

Yes, I doubt anyone will take responsibility for this. The United States is too big of a sleeping giant to awake.

[Chisox353014]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
Guys
I just found this on the Internet

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right&th=54ab4d241c34e0cc&seekm=3b8fd177%40monitor.lanset.com#link7

make your own conclusions.

Geez, that is freaky if you go to the end of the thread. What the hell kind of board is that anyway? A prophecy board? How did you find it? It could be a coincidence but who knows? I would at least report this to somebody. If they can track this guy's ISP or something...?

[Randar68]

yes but read his post on 9-4

Good lord, has somebody notified the authorities about this thread????

How did you find it????

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by doublem23


Yes, I doubt anyone will take responsibility for this. The United States is too big of a sleeping giant to awake.

and act of terroristism is to make a point. If you want to make a point, you want to get credit for. nornmal sop for terroristism.

[doublem23]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


and act of terroristism is to make a point. If you want to make a point, you want to get credit for. nornmal sop for terroristism.

I'm pretty sure they got their point across.

[Jerry_Manuel]

Originally posted by doublem23
I'm pretty sure they got their point across.

But we need to find out who "they" is.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


But we need to find out who "they" is.

My nephew is with the navy seal and was on r/r. He was called in and was to leave. Destn unknown.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


My nephew is with the navy seal and was on r/r. He was called in and was to leave. Destn unknown.

I pity all fools who will stand against USA now. This will bring the USA together, something i haven't seen since the Gulf War.

[CerberusWG]

Randar, I have friends who found this. And no we haven't contacted the authorities as of now. If there was a national number I'd call it, but I have no clue which number to call.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


But we need to find out who "they" is.

I am sorry to say this, but our intelligence communtiy is a joke. Our special forces are on the top of any country.

[Randar68]

Cerberus. I submitted it to the FBI through an online form I was able to find...

God I hope they fuking torture anyone involved in this....

[doublem23]

Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


But we need to find out who "they" is.

Why must we find who did it? Will punishing them make this any better? Not in my eyes, it won't.

We have to find out WHY they did it. If it was Arabs (and I'm sure it was. This IS NOT RACIST, but who else has more reasons to hate the U.S.A. more than the Arabians. We stole their land. We steal their oil. We bomb them every now and then...), we've got to understand why someone would hate us enough to pull this off.

Crazy people can't do this. This was a masterpiece of terrorism.

Maybe I just haven't been brainwashed into thinkiing the U.S.A. is always right, but compared to what we've done to the Arabian states, we should have known (and probably did) that this was coming, but to say that this is unrprovoked is wrong and to say that we should retaliate is wrong.

I feel deeply sorry for the people killed, injured, and all the families and friends who will feel the ripples of this, but I don't feel bad because it happened to America. I would feel just as bad if this happened in France or England. People are people. I feel bad every day for the NUMBERS of people all around the world who starve to death because they have NOTHING, while everyday, when I walk to school, I can't throw a rock without hitting a gas guzzling SUV.

Is it any wonder they hit A) The Pentagon - the boys with toys and B) The World Trade Center - the most blatantly obvious sign of American excess?

As long as we continue to live our lives the way we do in America, this sort of thing will happen. To place the blame solely on whoever did it and not blame ourselves for provoking such an attack is utterly superficial.

And to call it a "cowardly attack" I also think is wrong. Hey, they are in an anti-American crusade. They took their lives because they did what they feel is right. Does that make it right? Hell no. But if we think for onew second we can look at ourselves as a nation and feel that we are the innocent victims of a terrorist assault is extremely arrogant. They didn't do this just because they had nothing better to do. The Arabs had bigger problems with the guys across the border in Tel Aviv and such, but they chose to attack America (which makes me believe its an individual organization - possibly even Americans) to get their point across.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
Randar, I have friends who found this. And no we haven't contacted the authorities as of now. If there was a national number I'd call it, but I have no clue which number to call. Local FBI and address them with your name, phone and address at the first and then tell them what you want

[doublem23]

Originally posted by Randar68
God I hope they fuking torture anyone involved in this....

What does that solve? Does that make up for the thousands of lives that have been lost and the hundreds that will be?

I know I may seem a bit controversial, and I understand everyone is angry, and quite frankly, I am, too. This is a blatant attack at human life. They planned this out to hit the WTC after 9 AM so there would be people there, but cmon...

Wanting revenge means you've sunk to their level. The real problem here is why someone would want to do something like this, not who did it and how we can punish them.

[CerberusWG]

Ok thanks Randar, I didnt know what to do. Anyways, if they find this guy and they honor you, mention me ok :)

[Randar68]

Ok thanks Randar, I didnt know what to do. Anyways, if they find this guy and they honor you, mention me ok

I don't want any honors, but justice is fine with me....

[Spiff]

Most of me says you're right, doublem23. I know what you mean and yes, it doesn't solve anything to bomb the f*** out of them.

The rest of me says unless we show that America won't stand anymore of this bull****, it will happen again. And next time it might hit even closer to home.

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
Guys
I just found this on the Internet

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&frame=right&th=54ab4d241c34e0cc&seekm=3b8fd177%40monitor.lanset.com#link7

make your own conclusions.

my god!!!! that is some freaking scheit!!!!!!!!! conspriracy theorist make what you will.

[CerberusWG]

Federal Bureau of Investigation
Room 905
E.M. Dirksen Federal Office Building
219 South Dearborn Street
Chicago, Illinois 60604-1702
(312) 431-1333

[doublem23]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Most of me says you're right, doublem23. I know what you mean and yes, it doesn't solve anything to bomb the f*** out of them.

The rest of me says unless we show that America won't stand anymore of this bull****, it will happen again. And next time it might hit even closer to home.

I know I may be a bit edgy, but that's just the way I am. I'm sorry if I offend anyone. I don't hate America and I definately do NOT condone something like this. I am a man of peace. I'm just saying that to consider ourselves purely innocent victims of this is missing the whole picture. People don't hijack planes, crash into buildings, and kill themselves for no good reason. Obviously someone had a reason to do this...

As long as we oppress the third world for our own personal gain, I won't be surprised when these things happen. I will be saddened, but not surprised.

I was actually more shocked when I watched the buildings collapse than when I heard a terrorist attacked them, actually.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by doublem23


Why must we find who did it? Will punishing them make this any better? Not in my eyes, it won't.

We have to find out WHY they did it. If it was Arabs (and I'm sure it was. This IS NOT RACIST, but who else has more reasons to hate the U.S.A. more than the Arabians. We stole their land. We steal their oil. We bomb them every now and then...), we've got to understand why someone would hate us enough to pull this off.

Crazy people can't do this. This was a masterpiece of terrorism.

Maybe I just haven't been brainwashed into thinkiing the U.S.A. is always right, but compared to what we've done to the Arabian states, we should have known (and probably did) that this was coming, but to say that this is unrprovoked is wrong and to say that we should retaliate is wrong.

I feel deeply sorry for the people killed, injured, and all the families and friends who will feel the ripples of this, but I don't feel bad because it happened to America. I would feel just as bad if this happened in France or England. People are people. I feel bad every day for the NUMBERS of people all around the world who starve to death because they have NOTHING, while everyday, when I walk to school, I can't throw a rock without hitting a gas guzzling SUV.

Is it any wonder they hit A) The Pentagon - the boys with toys and B) The World Trade Center - the most blatantly obvious sign of American excess?

As long as we continue to live our lives the way we do in America, this sort of thing will happen. To place the blame solely on whoever did it and not blame ourselves for provoking such an attack is utterly superficial.

And to call it a "cowardly attack" I also think is wrong. Hey, they are in an anti-American crusade. They took their lives because they did what they feel is right. Does that make it right? Hell no. But if we think for onew second we can look at ourselves as a nation and feel that we are the innocent victims of a terrorist assault is extremely arrogant. They didn't do this just because they had nothing better to do. The Arabs had bigger problems with the guys across the border in Tel Aviv and such, but they chose to attack America (which makes me believe its an individual organization - possibly even Americans) to get their point across.


I agree with some and disagree with most of what you wrote.

1. why are we the most hated, according to people i have seen and talked to when i was accross the pond, it was we help save Isreal, (hitting the pentagon) and b/c we didn't suffer growing up. We had the best that can be provided. Better than what they have. (hitting the world trade)

2. Is it our fault that our parent and you as parents want to provide the best you can for your family?

3. you mention that if we continue to live the way we do etc. I am sorry, i try to do the best i can for my family and no-one is going to tell me how to spoil or not to spoil my family.

4. How can we provoke a reprisal such as this?

5. i will not respond to you last paragraph.

[CerberusWG]

I just called the FBI and passed along this information

[Iguana775]

this is the thing as i see it. if we do not retaliate, we will look like cowards and push-overs. now, i really doubt GW will let that happen. i think there will be a major on going with some sort of search or something.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by doublem23


I know I may be a bit edgy, but that's just the way I am. I'm sorry if I offend anyone. I don't hate America and I definately do NOT condone something like this. I am a man of peace. I'm just saying that to consider ourselves purely innocent victims of this is missing the whole picture. People don't hijack planes, crash into buildings, and kill themselves for no good reason. Obviously someone had a reason to do this...

As long as we oppress the third world for our own personal gain, I won't be surprised when these things happen. I will be saddened, but not surprised.

I was actually more shocked when I watched the buildings collapse than when I heard a terrorist attacked them, actually.

I am NOT a man of peace, i have worked with the dirt of america for many yrs, i was over the pond, even for 8 months until i got hurt, i saw terrible things. But to tell me that people have a reason to do this.

Sorry but i will not agree with you. There is no reason on earth to do this. What have we done over the yrs, help people and nations whether they deserved it or not. We can always count on England and Ireal as allies. Our intelligence community is a joke.

[Iguana775]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



I agree with some and disagree with most of what you wrote.

1. why are we the most hated, according to people i have seen and talked to when i was accross the pond, it was we help save Isreal, (hitting the pentagon) and b/c we didn't suffer growing up. We had the best that can be provided. Better than what they have. (hitting the world trade)

2. Is it our fault that our parent and you as parents want to provide the best you can for your family?

3. you mention that if we continue to live the way we do etc. I am sorry, i try to do the best i can for my family and no-one is going to tell me how to spoil or not to spoil my family.

4. How can we provoke a reprisal such as this?

5. i will not respond to you last paragraph. [/QUOTE

i agree LDF. if i want to provide the best for my family(when i get one) then why cant i? if i have the money and the ability, then i will and i will have those.

[doublem23]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



I agree with some and disagree with most of what you wrote.

1. why are we the most hated, according to people i have seen and talked to when i was accross the pond, it was we help save Isreal, (hitting the pentagon) and b/c we didn't suffer growing up. We had the best that can be provided. Better than what they have. (hitting the world trade)

2. Is it our fault that our parent and you as parents want to provide the best you can for your family?

3. you mention that if we continue to live the way we do etc. I am sorry, i try to do the best i can for my family and no-one is going to tell me how to spoil or not to spoil my family.

4. How can we provoke a reprisal such as this?

5. i will not respond to you last paragraph.

I'll try to answer as best I can...

1) We are hated because we are powerful and we like to push people around. I mean, cmon, the ONLY thing the Middle East has going for it right now is that they have oil. And we don't like paying for it. Thus, there is a conflict of interest.

Now, this doesn't mean countries like the United Kingdom, France, China, Japan, and such hate us. But countries like Iran, Iraq, and the Middle east sans Israel call us the Great Devil, and when you think about it, you really can't blame them for doing so. We pressure the U.N. into placing sanctions on these countries that in turn starves their people. We may have the right goal in mind, but these plans clearly don't work.

Basically, we use the third world as a means of cheap labor to keep ourselves the unchallenged superpower in the world. We didn't like it when the U.S.S.R. rivaled us in terms of world power, and we are determined to remain alone at the top. Thus, we're not to popular.

2. No, but do you NEED an SUV? Do you need a closet full of clothes? Do you NEED to have so much money you don't know what to do with it?

I'm not saying we should all be poor. Hell, all we have to do is try and make life easier in the rest of the world and our problems are solved. I'm just saying, hey... We live in a world of excess while many others live in poverty. Sure we can't blame our parents for wanting the best for us, but we can blame ourselves for wanting to stay #1 so badly we're willing to essentially push the little guys down.

3 & 4. Well, as long as the third world is deprived and it feels the United States not only helps it get better, but actually wants things to get worse, then there is no way to stop terrorists. That's it. As long as they see as as the Great Devil, they will continue to attack, and there is really nothing we can do about it.

5. That's fine. Like I said, I don't think this was cool. This was stupid. It was a blatant attack on human lives, nay, innocent human lives, and I apologize if I offended you. I know I am a bit controversial, but that's just the way I am. But to simply make ourselves to be the innocent victims is wrong. I never want things like this to happen, but I see no way of stopping them with the way things happen now.

[DuckSnort]

this is an E-mail I got from a software company called 'coffee cup' and one reason I'm posting it is because it has some good advice:


" Hello everyone,

This is Nicholas Longo, the CEO of CoffeeCup Software.
As you may have heard the World Trade Center and Pentagon
were attacked about 45 minutes ago.

The Team at CoffeeCup would like to send our heart felt
sorrow to those that perished in these attacks.

We would like to also say on record that if any country
is found responsible for these attacks, we call for that
country's complete destruction and annihilation.

Do not let terrorism which is designed to create fear
and stop production, halt your life or work.

Stay focused and do not stop what you are doing."

[doublem23]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


I am not a man of peace, i have worked with the dirt of america for many yrs, i was over the pond, even for 8 months until i got hurt, i saw terrible things. But to tell me that people have a reason to do this.

Sorry but i will not agree with you. There is no reason on earth to do this. What have we done over the yrs, help people and nations whether they deserved it or not. We can always count on England and Ireal as allies. Our intelligence community is a joke.

That's fine. I respect you and your right to disagree with me. I'm just passing along my opinion.

The reason, if it was an Arabian attack (not racist! Who has more reasons to hate us?), then I see why they would. I obviously do NOT agree with what they did because it was stupid and pointless, but desperation makes you do irrational things.

I'm sorry if I did offend you. Truly. The bigger tradegy here is that thousands of innocent people have to die because some people can't settle their diffrences.

[doublem23]

I have to go, but before I do, let me state how I feel so no one gets the wrong idea of me...

I WILL NEVER CONDONE VIOLENCE AS A MEANS OF GETTING ANYTHING DONE.... If that were the case, all problems would have been solved hundreds, if not thousands, of years ago.

I AM NOT ANTI-AMERICAN, nor do I want us all to take a vow of poverty or anything. I'm just saying that we really have to realize how blessed we are and we have to share that blessing with the rest of the world.

I am truly sorry if you read one of my posts and were upset with me. I never meant for that to happen. I only say somewhat controversial things on this board because I feel that everyone here is intelligent enough to read it and think about it, rather than just pass me off as some anti-American scum. I understand everyone is in shock, and so am I, and full of anger, as am I.

This is a truly tradegic event, and, once again, I DON NOT CONDONE VIOLENCE AS A WAY OF GETTING THINGS DONE. This is a terrible thing to do, a terrible attack on human life, and a day that will forever live in infamy.

Please remember the people killed, injured, and all the families and friends who will be scarred for life. They need our prayers now.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by doublem23


I'll try to answer as best I can...

1) We are hated because we are powerful and we like to push people around. I mean, cmon, the ONLY thing the Middle East has going for it right now is that they have oil. And we don't like paying for it. Thus, there is a conflict of interest.

We pressure the U.N. into placing sanctions on these countries that in turn starves their people. We may have the right goal in mind, but these plans clearly don't work.

Basically, we use the third world as a means of cheap labor to keep ourselves the unchallenged superpower in the world. We didn't like it when the U.S.S.R. rivaled us in terms of world power, and we are determined to remain alone at the top. Thus, we're not to popular.

2. Do you NEED to have so much money you don't know what to do with it?



First where were you born? What is your nationality?

ref #1 you really don't know what you are talking about. The sanction was done against Iraq was b/c of what they did, blew up all the oil rigs, putting many harmful chemical in the air. 2. b/c they used nerve gas during the war and 3 b/c what they did, the slaughters of the kuwaits.

using cheap labor......... that is sooo stupid.

ref #2, r u really serious on this......... again this is a stupid statement.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan





ARE WE BOMBING AFGANSTAN(sp)

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by doublem23
rather than just pass me off as some anti-American scum.

You are doing a damn good impression of "some anti-American scum".

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



ARE WE BOMBING AFGANSTAN(sp) It looks like it.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
It looks like it.

Doublem23 you posted this on the other thread.


You can't blame them for hating us. I mean, compared to the number of Americans who have died tradgically is minimal compared to the number of Arabs, Palestianians, and Iraqis that have died because or American arrogance. <<<<

You piece of shiit, i wish i could meet up with you and discuss this with you.

American Arrogance........... did we told them to try to conquer another country, did we asked them to attack us. If they have a problem, let them step up to the plate. mano ve mano

[FarWestChicago]

You piece of shiit, i wish i could meet up with you and discuss this with you.


Like I said, he's doing a damn good impression of "anti-American scum".

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago


Like I said, he's doing a damn good impression of "anti-American scum".

What gets me is the security of the airport and of the plane.

Many times, while seating in the first class, i saw how the flight att would open the cockpit door, i have always thought if that this would be dangerous. It is logical that is what happen. These guys flew the damn plane, so they talk the talk of the Air Traffic, and was able to get it done. The security really needs to be check.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago


You are doing a damn good impression of "some anti-American scum".

i KNOW i didnt just read all that crap written from doublem. My god, if those are your true feelings, get the hell out of our country!

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Bmr31


i KNOW i didnt just read all that crap written from doublem. My god, if those are your true feelings, get the hell out of our country!

It would be my pleasure to help him to leave or to disappear.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


It would be my pleasure to help him to leave or to disappear.


need any help?

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Bmr31



need any help?

What really bugs me is that nation like PLO and other islamic nation are cheering. ****, what have we done to them. If it wasn't for the USA, and us stopping the Isreal from kicking their arse. They can't even deal is the Isreali and they want to play with us. Isreal, 12 mile either wide or long put a major arse whipping them.

**** them and all who are cheering this.

[Soxfan7070]

I've been watching this terrible event ever since it first came on with the special reports and all...
I still can't believe this happened in this day and age...
I just pray to God that it's over and that nothing else happens..

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by Soxfan7070
I've been watching this terrible event ever since it first came on with the special reports and all...
I still can't believe this happened in this day and age...
I just pray to God that it's over and that nothing else happens..

7070, I fear this is just the beginning if we don't do something severe and soon.

[Jerry_Manuel]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
7070, I fear this is just the beginning if we don't do something severe and soon.

I agree West something needs to be done to prevent this from happening not only in the US but around the world.

[Paulwny]

The group that did this must be eradicated or it will continue to happen.

[CerberusWG]

This attack is far from over guys. Think of how high the gas prices will skyrocket. Think how our stock market will be. Looks like a big depression is about to hit.....

BTW, the people attacking Afghanastan right now is an Anti-Afghan group.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
This attack is far from over guys. Think of how high the gas prices will skyrocket. Think how our stock market will be. Looks like a big depression is about to hit.....

BTW, the people attacking Afghanastan right now is an Anti-Afghan group.

i just heard that they, the govn'mnt may have capture one trying to sneek into american. This one was suppose to bomb LAX in L.A.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


i just heard that they, the govn'mnt may have capture one trying to sneek into american. This one was suppose to bomb LAX in L.A.

You know what gets me is this guy Osama bin Laden has gave warning to the USA last week, has now said that he didn't have anything to do with this........ then why all the posturing last week?

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


You know what gets me is this guy Osama bin Laden has gave warning to the USA last week, has now said that he didn't have anything to do with this........ then why all the posturing last week?

oh he did it and Afghanistan is going to pay........

[voodoochile]

The reason for retaliation by the USA is simple... it must never be allowed to happen again, period. You track down the people responsible and hammer them until they bleed and fall down. Then you keep right on kicking. Every terrorist state and group must be kept on the run forever until they are eradicated or locked up.

Frankly I don't care if you think America is to blame for the deaths of your people by supporting our ally, you just declared war on the USA. Now it is time to put up or shut up.

If you specifically target our civilian population then you must be punished. "It's like that? I didn't realize it's like THAT! I guess I won't be needing these gloves I was wearing..."

Don't like that response? Don't bomb our country. It's that simple. Now the mightiest war maching ever built by man or God will be unleashed on something somewhere and if you thought you would have less casualties by making us think about our own security, think again. This country knows how to make war. Knows it very well and has won almost every war it has ever been involved in. With the aid of our allys (Russia has a pretty nice war machine too, and now they can start earning that aid we have been giving them for free), the people who did this will be paid back in blood.

I'm a pacafist too, but this is an act of pure barbarism... there must be more than retaliation, there must be punishment, so that no one ever believes they can attack us with impuity. Not yesterday, not today and not tomorrow.

Don't like that response? Well *** You then...

[Spiff]

I think everyone is just so tired from being in shock all day they're losing grasp on their emotions. I'm not saying don't be emotional, but use it the right way. Focus on the victims and not the snakes who did this.

And I know doublem, he's a good guy, so at least give him a chance to defend himself whenever he gets back. For now, just try to check your anger and think about the people who are hanging on to life by the thinnest of strings.

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
This attack is far from over guys. Think of how high the gas prices will skyrocket. Think how our stock market will be. Looks like a big depression is about to hit.....


i think that if any type of economic downfall happens, it is because everyone will panic and sell off everything and go out and buy all the gas they can. this is exactally what they want. us to panic. there is NO shortage of oil and the price of gold is fairly good(last time i check which was at 12). please, people, the best thing you all can do right now is to not add to the situation by panicing.


with that said.......KILL 'EM ALL AND LET GOD SORT THEM OUT!!! :)

[Randar68]

The wierd Nastradamos web site with 911 listed as the subject is jus too wierd to ignore. I sent it by e-form to the FBI, and I was glad to see Cerberus had done the same by phone.

What was the weather like in NY on the first??? a Saturday, anyone know???

OK, well, Afghanistan is responsile simply under the prose of hiding Bin Laden. As long as he lives and is allowed to perate, his supporters will only grow in number. Whether or not he is responsible, he and his group must be eliminated.....

End of story. I tried not to be too hard on doublem, because he makes decent points, but this is not the time...there is NO ecuse whatsoever for these attacks. I feel it was an act of terrorism the PLO would have blushed at back in their hey-day...

Our wishes are with the friends and families of the thousand killed or wounded....

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by voodoochile

Frankly I don't care if you think America is to blame for the deaths of your people by supporting our ally, you just declared war on the USA. Now it is time to put up or shut up.

If you specifically target our civilian population then you must be punished. "It's like that? I didn't realize it's like THAT! I guess I won't be needing these gloves I was wearing..."

Don't like that response? Don't bomb our country. It's that simple. Now the mightiest war maching ever built by man or God will be unleashed on something somewhere and if you thought you would have less casualties by making us think about our own security, think again. This country knows how to make war. Knows it very well and has won almost every war it has ever been involved in. With the aid of our allys (Russia has a pretty nice war machine too, and now they can start earning that aid we have been giving them for free), the people who did this will be paid back in blood.
Don't like that response? Well *** You then...

i heard on the radio and i agree, that it would be in the interest of other countries like russia and china to join forces with the use. china is having the olympic soon and russia is just starting to get things together. i dont think russia would want anything like this to happen to them.

[KVinc]

come on guys ease up on doublem23, he is just stating what he feels, and i consider myself proud to be an american citizen but i do agree with some points doublem23 made.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by KVinc
come on guys ease up on doublem23, he is just stating what he feels, and i consider myself proud to be an american citizen but i do agree with some points doublem23 made. \\

What points that he made can justify this? None

Beside that which point that he made that you want us to realize our points were wrong.

post them.

[Jerry_Manuel]

I thought I would pass this along.
Click Here (http://ap.tbo.com/ap/breaking/MGAOXI0VHRC.html)
Here is a brief section of the article.
Read the whole article as well.

In the West Bank town of Nablus, about 3,000 people poured into the street shortly after the attacks on the World Trade Center in New York and government targets in Washington.

Demonstrators distributed candy in a traditional gesture of celebration. Several Palestinian gunmen shot in the air, while other marchers carried Palestinian flags. Nawal Abdel Fatah, 48, wearing a long, black dress, threw sweets in the air, saying she was happy because "America is the head of the snake, America always stands by Israel in its war against us."

[voodoochile]

We want to think of the people who died today and to that end I want you all to consider the last thoughts of the people on the airplanes that slammed into the WTC...

What must they have been thinking as they realized that something was horribly wrong, beyong being hijacked and scared...

This is not the way you wage war, or if it is, then two can play at that game...

Does America deserve this act of barbarism? Does anyone deserve an act like this? Even if you look at it from their perspective it is hard to find a justification for killing potentially 10000+ American civilians in one stroke. There can be no justification for this act ever.

Congratulations, you wanted a war with the USA? You got a war with the USA... This doesn't even leave room for the idea of no retaliation. This HAS to be punished... sheer stupidity and sheer evil...

[Randar68]

The message must be sent, VC. I don't care what Afghanistan or it's putrid allies think. Afghanistan must be made to pay simply for giving that piece of trash asylum. If we go in there and wage a war with the government of Afghanistan, future countries will think twice about housing such violent fundamentalists.

An example must be made. An example for the world to see. No group of people, no government, NO ONE! will be allowed to do this without expecting the destruction of their lives as they know them......

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by voodoochile
We want to think of the people who died today and to that end I want you all to consider the last thoughts of the people on the airplanes that slammed into the WTC...

What must they have been thinking as they realized that something was horribly wrong, beyong being hijacked and scared...

This is not the way you wage war, or if it is, then two can play at that game...

Does America deserve this act of barbarism? Does anyone deserve an act like this? Even if you look at it from their perspective it is hard to find a justification for killing potentially 10000+ American civilians in one stroke. There can be no justification for this act ever.

Congratulations, you wanted a war with the USA? You got a war with the USA... This doesn't even leave room for the idea of no retaliation. This HAS to be punished... sheer stupidity and sheer evil...

I just reread doublem comments and there is nothing there to justify what happen. If you hate us b/c we treat our family right, you hate us b/c we don't suffer as much as you, look at the inner city projects where the poor is.

We have had the opportunity to make the best we have, to be given a chance to better ourself, i saw what the europe has done to themself, and the war there. All we have done to to help people. Many nations owes us huge, b/c of our money.

[voodoochile]

Originally posted by Randar68
The message must be sent, VC. I don't care what Afghanistan or it's putrid allies think. Afghanistan must be made to pay simply for giving that piece of trash asylum. If we go in there and wage a war with the government of Afghanistan, future countries will think twice about housing such violent fundamentalists.

An example must be made. An example for the world to see. No group of people, no government, NO ONE! will be allowed to do this without expecting the destruction of their lives as they know them......

It doesn't get any simpler than that...

It worked on Milosovic...

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


I just reread doublem comments and there is nothing there to justify what happen. If you hate us b/c we treat our family right, you hate us b/c we don't suffer as much as you, look at the inner city projects where the poor is.

We have had the opportunity to make the best we have, to be given a chance to better ourself, i saw what the europe has done to themself, and the war there. All we have done to to help people. Many nations owes us huge, b/c of our money.

show where i am wrong, show me the points that doublem made that people agree with.

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


show where i am wrong, show me the points that doublem made that people agree with.

i really cant. i am with ya, LDF.

[Spiff]

God! Stop arguing! Don't you realize how trivial it is?!?!

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
God! Stop arguing! Don't you realize how trivial it is?!?!

acting like 20,000 plus deaths of innocent people was deserved, is NOT trivial.....

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
God! Stop arguing! Don't you realize how trivial it is?!?!

you were the one who agreed with some of his comments... belly up and back it up.

[Spiff]

Everyone knows this wasn't deserved. Nobody deserves to be killed for something they have nothing to do with. I'm just saying, if you want to argue this crap at least wait until we're not so emotionally charged.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Everyone knows this wasn't deserved. Nobody deserves to be killed for something they have nothing to do with. I'm just saying, if you want to argue this crap at least wait until we're not so emotionally charged.

blah

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


blah

We have one captured terrorist. Does he deserved to have right of the US consititution?

Should he be treated innocent until proven guilty?

Screw the Bill of Rights on him and give him some chemicals to make him tell the truth.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Everyone knows this wasn't deserved. Nobody deserves to be killed for something they have nothing to do with. I'm just saying, if you want to argue this crap at least wait until we're not so emotionally charged.

Im not waiting for anything. His comments were very disturbing.......

[Spiff]

Not carrying on this nonsense.

Maybe you'll wake up tomorrow with a clear head and realize how foolish some of you are acting.

[OfficerKarkovice]

Originally posted by Bmr31


Im not waiting for anything. His comments were very disturbing.......

Care to explain please...

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Not carrying on this nonsense.

Maybe you'll wake up tomorrow with a clear head and realize how foolish some of you are acting. The only nonsense and foolishness I have seen here are anti-American statements.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Not carrying on this nonsense.

Maybe you'll wake up tomorrow with a clear head and realize how foolish some of you are acting.

Bullshiit, maybe you will wake up and realize how much of an arse you were defending someone who implied that b/c we didn't suffer like the middle east or b/c we have a better way of life. Wake up and see what he is shoveling, and what you are swallowing.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


Bullshiit, maybe you will wake up and realize how much of an arse you were defending someone who implied that b/c we didn't suffer like the middle east or b/c we have a better way of life. Wake up and see what he is shoveling, and what you are swallowing.

This guy will say that the pearl harbor was a incident and we have to take a look at japan reasons.


We have in the past is to avoid conflict and go out of our way not to hurt peole.......................

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by OfficerKarkovice


Care to explain please...


go back and read his comments.

[OfficerKarkovice]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



go back and read his comments.

I thought he was referring to comments the captured terrorist made.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
The only nonsense and foolishness I have seen here are anti-American statements.

AMEN!! Making ignorant comments about baseball is one thing, i certainly wont stand around and accept ignorant comments about our own country!!!!

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by OfficerKarkovice


I thought he was referring to comments the captured terrorist made.


sorry.......... i wish i could see what happens to him. Gloves off, be treated as a POW the way that they, the middle east have treated our boys, of the Veit Nam, of Korea or even that of Japan.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Bmr31


AMEN!! Making ignorant comments about baseball is one thing, i certainly wont stand around and accept ignorant comments about our own country!!!!


BMR,,,,,,, wait one minute........ i made some comments about america....... but then again i am 1/2 american indian (apache')

[Spiff]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
The only nonsense and foolishness I have seen here are anti-American statements.

Maybe they are foolish, but can you really not see how absurd it is to be attacking each other while other people who were attacked for no reason lie in hospital beds or under thousands of piles of rubble?

We're lucky to even be alive yet we're scrumming over junk like this.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Maybe they are foolish, but can you really not see how absurd it is to be attacking each other while other people who were attacked for no reason lie in hospital beds or under thousands of piles of rubble?

We're lucky to even be alive yet we're scrumming over junk like this.


UMMMMMMM ITs fools like him that CAUSED this tragedy!

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Maybe they are foolish, but can you really not see how absurd it is to be attacking each other while other people who were attacked for no reason lie in hospital beds or under thousands of piles of rubble?

We're lucky to even be alive yet we're scrumming over junk like this.

make up your mind, you are getting me dizzy.

First you are defending him b/c you agreed w/his comments, now you are defending him b/c its not nice but you did say that they were foolish in content.

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan



BMR,,,,,,, wait one minute........ i made some comments about america....... but then again i am 1/2 american indian (apache') If anybody has a right to be pissed at the US it's Native Americans. But, I see you standing up for your country. I applaud that.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
If anybody has a right to be pissed at the US it's Native Americans. But, I see you standing up for your country. I applaud that.

We had this discussion of US and NA last yr......... which was fun, hot and lively.......... another time for this subject to be brought again............ now its time for us to unite to get tough, not talk it, but to show it.......

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by FarWestChicago
If anybody has a right to be pissed at the US it's Native Americans. But, I see you standing up for your country. I applaud that.

of course! IF i was half native american, id have stuff to say, and rightly so. NOONE and i mean NOONE in this country has the right to make comments like doublem made.....

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Bmr31


of course! IF i was half native american, id have stuff to say, and rightly so. NOONE and i mean NOONE in this country has the right to make comments like doublem made.....

BMR......... peace........ i was trying to bring some light to this day. I was trying to act a clown......... sort off.......... but call that to my face in person.

[FarWestChicago]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan

now its time for us to unite to get tough, not talk it, but to show it....... I'm coudln't agree more!

[Spiff]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


make up your mind, you are getting me dizzy.

First you are defending him b/c you agreed w/his comments, now you are defending him b/c its not nice but you did say that they were foolish in content.


First of all, I didn't defend everything he said, because I don't agree with everything he said. What I said was, give him a chance to defend himself whenever he comes back. I'm as pissed as anyone at the "people" (i use that term loosely) responsible for this. But for now I just think it's in everyone's best interest to calm down and concentrate on recovering from this horrific crime. The scum will get what's coming, I don't doubt that. But I care more about the damage it did.

And I didn't turn around say the Anti-American comments were foolish or not foolish. What I meant was that's your own opinion.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


BMR......... peace........ i was trying to bring some light to this day. I was trying to act a clown......... sort off.......... but call that to my face in person.


call what? Dude i didnt call you anything.....

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00



First of all, I didn't defend everything he said, because I don't agree with everything he said. What I said was, give him a chance to defend himself whenever he comes back. I'm as pissed as anyone at the "people" (i use that term loosely) responsible for this. But for now I just think it's in everyone's best interest to calm down and concentrate on recovering from this horrific crime. The scum will get what's coming, I don't doubt that. But I care more about the damage it did.

And I didn't turn around say the Anti-American comments were foolish or not foolish. What I meant was that's your own opinion.

you are really getting me dizzy now............... what are a priest?

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


you are really getting me dizzy now............... what are a priest?

Love thy neighbor and turn thy cheek................. bs

[Spiff]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


Love thy neighbor and turn thy cheek................. bs

Why do you reply to yourself?

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Bmr31



call what? Dude i didnt call you anything.....

you are misreading it............. i didn't mean you........... its a joke.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


you are misreading it............. i didn't mean you........... its a joke.

ok cool......

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Why do you reply to yourself?

b/c i am posting too fast for my thoughts........... understood.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Why do you reply to yourself?


LMAO!!!!! actually ive done that many of times myself :)

[CerberusWG]

read this.....randar, you can report this too I guess

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&threadm=3B9E976B.587F5EE5%40hotmail.com&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26group%3Dalt.prophecies.nostrada mus

[Spiff]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


b/c i am posting too fast for my thoughts........... understood.

haha at least you're honest about it.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by CerberusWG
read this.....randar, you can report this too I guess

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&threadm=3B9E976B.587F5EE5%40hotmail.com&prev=/groups%3Fhl%3Den%26group%3Dalt.prophecies.nostrada mus

i am sure that every site that has this kind of stuff will be monitored, even this one.

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan

even this one.

i meant that with this one, is that we had discussion going almost non stop, the fbi will send someone to see whats up......... its sop.

[OfficerKarkovice]

Here is the deal: We got BOMBED. A terrorist took our own civilian planes and then bombed one of our countries most prominent buildings with our OWN planes. That is like the big bully who used to take little kids arms and then hit the kid over the head with it. If we just sit here and take this up the ass, like some of you are suggesting, what prevents others from doing this whenever they get a little angry at us. We are supposedly the biggest baddest nation around and we need to prove it. Any of you who think that we should just forgive and forget can move their ass to Canada for all I care. There are going to be over 10,000 casualties when this comes to an end and we cannot just sit and take it. That is all there is to it.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by OfficerKarkovice
Here is the deal: We got BOMBED. A terrorist took our own civilian planes and then bombed one of our countries most prominent buildings with our OWN planes. That is like the big bully who used to take little kids arms and then hit the kid over the head with it. If we just sit here and take this up the ass, like some of you are suggesting, what prevents others from doing this whenever they get a little angry at us. We are supposedly the biggest baddest nation around and we need to prove it. Any of you who think that we should just forgive and forget can move their ass to Canada for all I care. There are going to be over 10,000 casualties when this comes to an end and we cannot just sit and take it. That is all there is to it.


Who said they would do nothing? Im curious...

[CubKiller]

I say the officer is right on the money. The U.S. lay down after something like this...? I don't think so.

[CubKiller]

Originally posted by Bmr31



Who said they would do nothing? Im curious...

Doublem said on page 5 of this thread..."I think to just go after whoever did this is a little misguided. We have to figure out why they hate us so much...."

Maybe that's one of the quotes Officer was talking about...

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by CubKiller


Doublem said on page 5 of this thread..."I think to just go after whoever did this is a little misguided. We have to figure out why they hate us so much...."

Maybe that's one of the quotes Officer was talking about...

west will you let me call doublem an idiot? PLEEEASE??? :)

[OfficerKarkovice]

Originally posted by Bmr31


west will you let me call doublem an idiot? PLEEEASE??? :)

Yeah that is it...usually Doublem has some pretty good points about baseball and all but today he was being rediculous.

[Spiff]

one final thought:

Wake up any morning, and you have no idea what the day will bring you. It could be spectacular, it could be tragic. Turns out this day brought me a few f***heads ruining alot of lives. Well that doesn't make me think twice about the next day, but it does make me think, "you never know."

This is a cash-and-carry world.

[OfficerKarkovice]

Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
one final thought:

Wake up any morning, and you have no idea what the day will bring you. It could be spectacular, it could be tragic. Turns out this day brought me a few f***heads ruining alot of lives. Well that doesn't make me think twice about the next day, but it does make me think, "you never know."

This is a cash-and-carry world.

Well said 00...goodnight all I am off to a vigil being held here at St. Thomas. Lets all just pray and hope that tomorrow brings a better day.

[Iguana775]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


Love thy neighbor

only if she is cute!!!!! lol. sorry. had to make a joke. i needed cheering up. :)

[dimaisback]

Today will go down as one of the truly darkest day of modern, free world. THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE TO ALLEVIATE THE SITUATION OR EVEN DESCRIBE IN WORDS THE PAIN AND SORROW THAT HAS OCCUPIED THE HEARTS/MINDS OF THOSE WHO LOST SOMEONE CLOSE TO THEM TODAY. And the worst part is that this unprecedented catastrophe was man-made. Who could have thought that in the 21st century......

Having said that, I find it it hard to believe that some of you would attack doublem and a few other posters for speaking their minds. Sure, at some point they became devil's advocates, but that's EXACTLY what should be done by someone in a situation such as this. I didn't perceive their posts to be "anti-American" or worse "condoning such acts"....what did surprise me is that sucjh intelligent poststers as FarWest, JM and a few others have been barried away in their response, almost inciting further attacks. Next time close the boards altogether lest something radical/unpopular should be said.

It is obvious that this act of terroism has been expertly masterminded by a very few, insterested, influencial people. One would presume that the Holy Order, a few oil magnates/sheiks, some "shadow" players (perhaps even Europe based) aided by the terrorists like bin Laden are all that's needed for this. A common man such as myself would never even dream of understanding the true motives (or EXACT persons involved) of those evil enough to carriy somthing of this magnitude out in the US, but I do know that they OBSIOUSLY have considered the repercussions (or are they dump arabians too?), ranging from retailiation to full-scale invasion of some Arabiac countries. The fact that they still went ahead says something in regard to the strenght of their convictions (no matte how vile they may be) and the amount of blood they are willing to sacrifice. Remeber that innocent people will die on both sides as a result of a decision made by select few. In addition, "they" have probably (my guess is that despite being rightfully labeled "fanatics", they have rationale in ABUNDANCE) considered the possibly embargos, sanctios, ect. The point is IT WAS STILL WORTH IT TO ENOUGH POWERFUL PEOPLE.

Now I hear read that they could possibly be as many as 30 more attempts in the next 3-4 weeks. With HUGE security holes wide-open, I don't see what can prevent even 1 of them from reaching the target...and no matter what those demagogues in Washington are going to say, the only thing they can do now is to kill as many innocent Arabs as possible. Yet the smarter ones of you have already figured out that bin Laden or even Arafat (who appears to be nothing but a PAWN at this point) DON'T GIVE THE RAT'S BEHIND ABOUT THEIR OWN PEOPLE. The only thing they know is that they owe billion to the US/UN and their rights to vast lands have been violated by the "white devil" for too long a time.


So tell me, oh wise BMR, will it make you feel better if 100, 000 arabs die in the next 3 weeks or so? I know that I myself do not envy our government (not to mention the victims' families) since it has NO CHOICE WHATSOEVER.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by dimaisback
Today will go down as one of the truly darkest day of modern, free world. THERE IS NOTHING THAT CAN BE DONE TO ALLEVIATE THE SITUATION OR EVEN DESCRIBE IN WORDS THE PAIN AND SORROW THAT HAS OCCUPIED THE HEARTS/MINDS OF THOSE WHO LOST SOMEONE CLOSE TO THEM TODAY. And the worst part is that this unprecedented catastrophe was man-made. Who could have thought that in the 21st century......

Having said that, I find it it hard to believe that some of you would attack doublem and a few other posters for speaking their minds. Sure, at some point they became devil's advocates, but that's EXACTLY what should be done by someone in a situation such as this. I didn't perceive their posts to be "anti-American" or worse "condoning such acts"....what did surprise me is that sucjh intelligent poststers as FarWest, JM and a few others have been barried away in their response, almost inciting further attacks. Next time close the boards altogether lest something radical/unpopular should be said.

It is obvious that this act of terroism has been expertly masterminded by a very few, insterested, influencial people. One would presume that the Holy Order, a few oil magnates/sheiks, some "shadow" players (perhaps even Europe based) aided by the terrorists like bin Laden are all that's needed for this. A common man such as myself would never even dream of understanding the true motives (or EXACT persons involved) of those evil enough to carriy somthing of this magnitude out in the US, but I do know that they OBSIOUSLY have considered the repercussions (or are they dump arabians too?), ranging from retailiation to full-scale invasion of some Arabiac countries. The fact that they still went ahead says something in regard to the strenght of their convictions (no matte how vile they may be) and the amount of blood they are willing to sacrifice. Remeber that innocent people will die on both sides as a result of a decision made by select few. In addition, "they" have probably (my guess is that despite being rightfully labeled "fanatics", they have rationale in ABUNDANCE) considered the possibly embargos, sanctios, ect. The point is IT WAS STILL WORTH IT TO ENOUGH POWERFUL PEOPLE.

Now I hear read that they could possibly be as many as 30 more attempts in the next 3-4 weeks. With HUGE security holes wide-open, I don't see what can prevent even 1 of them from reaching the target...and no matter what those demagogues in Washington are going to say, the only thing they can do now is to kill as many innocent Arabs as possible. Yet the smarter ones of you have already figured out that bin Laden or even Arafat (who appears to be nothing but a PAWN at this point) DON'T GIVE THE RAT'S BEHIND ABOUT THEIR OWN PEOPLE. The only thing they know is that they owe billion to the US/UN and their rights to vast lands have been violated by the "white devil" for too long a time.


So tell me, oh wise BMR, will it make you feel better if 100, 000 arabs die in the next 3 weeks or so? I know that I myself do not envy our government (not to mention the victims' families) since it has NO CHOICE WHATSOEVER.


i would feel better if noone would die and the entire world was free. we represent freedom and must respond...

[Bmr31]

In addition, this is OUR COUNTRY, we are talking about, not our baseball team. There is a world of difference between the two. Anyone who bashes their country, deserves what comes to them......

[dimaisback]

yes, but HOW? "They" obsiously could care less if you do since it is not they who would suffer. Bin Laden (or someone else involved) would have been turned in by his own people as the response to embargo and other threats LONG time ago if there were no other interested/influencial following similar crusade/cause....he will be caught, but much too late. The problem of the root will stil remain I am afraid/


And freedom doesn't preclude evil few from existing....terrorists will ALWAYS be there; and don't confuse US with Utopia.


Yes, the sight of some arabic kids dancing in the streets (in the US too!) was nothing short of abominable.

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by dimaisback
yes, but HOW? "They" obsiously could care less if you do since it is not they who would suffer. Bin Laden (or someone else involved) would have been turned in by his own people as the response to embargo and other threats LONG time ago if there were no other interested/influencial following similar crusade/cause....he will be caught, but much too late. The problem of the root will stil remain I am afraid/


And freedom doesn't preclude evil few from existing....terrorists will ALWAYS be there; and don't confuse US with Utopia.


Yes, the sight of some arabic kids dancing in the streets (in the US too!) was nothing short of abominable.


I respect your opinion, but please keep to one or two points, so i can understand it. You are allover the place here. Its not my job to figure out what the right thing to do is.......i dont want more innocent people dying either, but we have a county to protect. In fact, we have the world to protect. IF 100,000 have to lose their lives, to keep peace and order, then so be it.....

[Jerry_Manuel]

From cnn.com
Members of Congress were quick to blame bin Laden, the Saudi millionaire blamed for bombings at two U.S. embassies in Africa. He is believed to be based in Afghanistan.

"This looks like the signature of Osama bin Laden," said Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, who said he had been briefed by officials at the highest levels of government.

Hatch added: "We're going to find out who did this and we're going after the bastards."

[LongDistanceFan]

Doulbem spoke his mind and i spoke mind....... so.

Ref fw and other who are intelligent posters, do you want them to be puppets and can't voice their opinion, esp is it goes against what you may perceived as vile. Whether they want to close the site is their choice not yours or mine. Doublem post was in a way to downplay this attack and asked us to take a look at the reason. The POINT IS THERE IS NO REASON ON EARTH TO JUSTIFY THIS.

When i was in Europe, i asked many people who i was associating with, this is a fact of most people outside the US. No matter how many times people have slapped us in the face, we have also forgiven them and later traded with them b/c of the holy $$$ dollar.

Ref to the arabs innocent losing there live.......... oh well look at our sorrow, our injuried or death. You back up a nation then you deal with it. In addition how can other people justify this, meaning the arabs, laughing and i just saw that some military people saying that not enough damage was done.


You tell me if you can live with the horrors of today and that we should not do ANYTHING!

[dimaisback]

how did he "bash" his country? By suggesting that Arabs are so embittered and rendered helpless by the few despots (and futher confused by religion) that they have nothing else to do but to hate?

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
From cnn.com
Members of Congress were quick to blame bin Laden, the Saudi millionaire blamed for bombings at two U.S. embassies in Africa. He is believed to be based in Afghanistan.

"This looks like the signature of Osama bin Laden," said Sen. Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, who said he had been briefed by officials at the highest levels of government.

Hatch added: "We're going to find out who did this and we're going after the bastards."

GOOD!

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by dimaisback
how did he "bash" his country? By suggesting that Arabs are so embittered and rendered helpless by the few despots (and futher confused by religion) that they have nothing else to do but to hate?

he said we had it coming, among other things.....you know how to read, go read them.

[doublem23]

Originally posted by LongDistanceFan


First where were you born? What is your nationality?

ref #1 you really don't know what you are talking about. The sanction was done against Iraq was b/c of what they did, blew up all the oil rigs, putting many harmful chemical in the air. 2. b/c they used nerve gas during the war and 3 b/c what they did, the slaughters of the kuwaits.

using cheap labor......... that is sooo stupid.

ref #2, r u really serious on this......... again this is a stupid statement.

What can I say?

[LongDistanceFan]

Originally posted by doublem23


What can I say? i guess not much

[Bmr31]

Originally posted by doublem23


What can I say?

dude you may not want to post for a day or two, you have a lot of people pissed at you.....

[dimaisback]

you are the one who keeps missing the point. Bin Laden (if he indeed organized it) DOESN'T CARE ABOUT how many poeple will die. Are you planning to annihilate the whole race now? Besides, you know that dying for Allah is worth 30 concubines and a place in heaven, right?

Are you also thinking about the affect the war will have on America?


Paret of me also says, "get the bastards", but part of me is also realistic. Who are going to get exactly? Not the terrorists, for sure. And who know what the birth rate for arans is extremely high, so yo are guaranteed to have generations of hatred-filled people regardelss..