PDA

View Full Version : Question for Magglio Supporters


gosox41
04-16-2004, 06:20 AM
How many people that want Magglio resigned now were also all giddy with excitement this off season when the Sox were all set to trade for Nomar and move Magglio to LA? Even I liked the deal a little if the Sox could have gotten the rumored 3 pitchers plus a hitter.

I remember a lot of people wanting that whole A-Rod to Boston trade to go down.

On the same note (plus it gives me another reason to bash KW) is the fact that KW wanted this trade to happen. The trade falling apart had nothing to do with KW. It was contingent on the Red Sox getting A-Rod. I think we can all agree to that. So let's assume Boston did get A-Rod and all the other dominoes fell. Right now Magglio would be putting up big numbers for the Dodgers and Nomar would be on the DL for the White Sox.


Do you think that would cause more or less negativity towards KW as a GM? I don't think people should confuse the fact that the trade didn't happen with the fact that Boston's stubborness saved KW a lot of bashing. But KW is not a genius for not trading Magglio. He just got lucky that the trade talks fell apart.


Bob

Jjav829
04-16-2004, 07:13 AM
First off, you have the trade wrong. Maggs would have been sent to the Red Sox for Nomar. It would be pretty hard to trade Maggs to the Dodgers, plus still be able to find a way to trade for Nomar.

Second, it's not fair to say that Nomar would still be hurt. He was injured during batting practice in Red Sox camp. Being with the White Sox may have meant he never gets injured, and he may be putting up monster numbers. Furthermore, the same goes for Maggs. With a new team, who knows if he is still putting up the same numbers. Also, we would have received Scott Williamson in the deal who would have upgraded this bullpen - though he is currently battling some elbow tenderness. Keep in mind that someone would have had to replace Maggs in right. Maybe it would have been Juan Gonzalez and he would be crushing the ball. Or maybe Joe Borchard would have gotten a chance and finally shown some of his potential. We'll never know.

Basically, it seems like you are just trying to go as far out of the way as possibly to bash KW. There is no telling what would be happening had that trade gone down.

BKozi
04-16-2004, 08:39 AM
I am a huge Maggs supporter. You can't help but like the guy. He consistently hits for power and average and he seems to be a great clubhouse guy. With that said, I was in support of the trade at the time, but the only reason was because it everybody was reporting that there was no way Maggs was coming back. Rumors were that we weren't going to pay him what he wanted and that he didn't want to come back to the Sox anyways. If I had a choice, I would have much rather kept Maggs if I knew that we had a shot to sign him, but at the time, it was really a no-brainer to try and get everything we could for 1 year of Maggs' services. Now that it looks like we have a legitimate shot to keep him, I'm glad the deal didn't go down.

rahulsekhar
04-16-2004, 08:42 AM
also, IIRC part of the overall deal was Manos to Seattle for Freddy Garcia. (Not to mention Nomar to LA for pitching). KW also wanted Juan Gone to replace Maggs. Once the deal was quashed by MLBPA, KC signed Juan, & Seattle traded - it was unlikely.

This would be a VERY different team with all if those with much better SP, RP, & while Juan's no Maggs, I think it would be a better team overall (more balanced).

That said I am thrilled to have Maggs and hope they can resign him.

Lip Man 1
04-16-2004, 11:28 AM
Bob says: "He just got lucky that the trade talks fell apart."

Phil Rogers basically says the same thing in his Magglio column today in the Tribune.

Lip

longshot7
04-16-2004, 11:52 AM
I hated the trade when first reported and hate it now. Maggs needs to stay on the south side, period.

NonetheLoaiza
04-16-2004, 12:41 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hated the trade when first reported and hate it now. Maggs needs to stay on the south side, period.

ill agree to that. our pitching would be better without maggs, but i dont trust juan gone as far as i can throw him. not to mention hes the embodiment of the economic disaster baseball is.

gosox41
04-17-2004, 02:37 AM
Originally posted by Jjav829
First off, you have the trade wrong. Maggs would have been sent to the Red Sox for Nomar. It would be pretty hard to trade Maggs to the Dodgers, plus still be able to find a way to trade for Nomar.

Second, it's not fair to say that Nomar would still be hurt. He was injured during batting practice in Red Sox camp. Being with the White Sox may have meant he never gets injured, and he may be putting up monster numbers. Furthermore, the same goes for Maggs. With a new team, who knows if he is still putting up the same numbers. Also, we would have received Scott Williamson in the deal who would have upgraded this bullpen - though he is currently battling some elbow tenderness. Keep in mind that someone would have had to replace Maggs in right. Maybe it would have been Juan Gonzalez and he would be crushing the ball. Or maybe Joe Borchard would have gotten a chance and finally shown some of his potential. We'll never know.

Basically, it seems like you are just trying to go as far out of the way as possibly to bash KW. There is no telling what would be happening had that trade gone down.

That's right, I got my trade ruimors confused. There was talk at one point of trading Magglio to the Red Sox and them moving Nomar to the Dodgers.

There was alsso talk of moving Magglio to LA for Mota, Perez, one of the 2 minor league pitching studs and that CF prospect.

Second, Nomar hurt his heel. If he wasn't stretching it correct, I was just assuming it was going to catch up to him eventually. It's not like he gt hit in the head with a pitch and if he weren't in the Boston camp that day it would have been avoided.

Last, I do enjoy KW bashing because he deserves it. He's getting better but still sucks. IMHO he lucked out here. maybe Magglio wouldn't have the exact same numbers elsewhere, but I'm betting he'd still be productive.



Bob

Jjav829
04-17-2004, 02:58 PM
Originally posted by gosox41
Second, Nomar hurt his heel. If he wasn't stretching it correct, I was just assuming it was going to catch up to him eventually. It's not like he gt hit in the head with a pitch and if he weren't in the Boston camp that day it would have been avoided.


Actually that is kind of how Nomar was hurt. It is his Achilles that he hurt. It happened in batting practice when he was hit in the foot with a ball. That damaged the cartilage which in turn aggravated his Achilles tendon. It was a freak injury. If he was in White Sox camp there is no reason to believe that he would have suffered the same injury.

batmanZoSo
04-17-2004, 03:00 PM
Originally posted by Jjav829
Actually that is kind of how Nomar was hurt. It is his Achilles that he hurt. It happened in batting practice when he was hit in the foot with a ball. That damaged the cartilage which in turn aggravated his Achilles tendon. It was a freak injury. If he was in White Sox camp there is no reason to believe that he would have suffered the same injury.

If he were with us it would've been a complete tear and you know it :smile:

OEO Magglio
04-17-2004, 03:25 PM
The reason I wanted the trade to go down, was because the sox would have ended up with Scott Williamson and probably Freddy Garcia. I would never trade Maggs for Nomar straight up, but overall that would have made the sox a better ball club.

gosox41
04-17-2004, 04:55 PM
Originally posted by Jjav829
Actually that is kind of how Nomar was hurt. It is his Achilles that he hurt. It happened in batting practice when he was hit in the foot with a ball. That damaged the cartilage which in turn aggravated his Achilles tendon. It was a freak injury. If he was in White Sox camp there is no reason to believe that he would have suffered the same injury.

My bad. I thought he strained it. Even so, KW still wanted to trade away Magglio for Nomar. I think Magglio is a better player. I haven't seen the numbers but someone made mention about how much better Nomar does at Fenway then on the road.


If it were up to KW, Magglio wouldn't be here right now. Granted KW wouldn't have given him away, but he was basically going to trade him for an inferior player in the last year of his contract.


Bob

oheeoh...magglio
04-18-2004, 12:07 AM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hated the trade when first reported and hate it now. Maggs needs to stay on the south side, period.

Amen to that. :)