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View Full Version : Another Good PR Idea .........


Hangar18
04-02-2004, 01:02 PM
Since Bud Selig let his National League Lust Interfere with his duties as "Commissioner" of Baseball, and taking away A Natural Rivalry and giving it to another team 8 miles north,
The SOX should schedule their Final 2 ST games against the Brewers In Miller Park every Year, til A real Commissioner is
Restored to power, and the Brewers are Tossed back to the AL.

fledgedrallycap
04-02-2004, 01:07 PM
I think that would be a great idea. I would take it a step further, I think the Brewers should be on the inter-leauge schedule every single year. A. The regional attraction. B. Automatic wins :D:

SSN721
04-02-2004, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by fledgedrallycap
I think that would be a great idea. I would take it a step further, I think the Brewers should be on the inter-leauge schedule every single year. A. The regional attraction. B. Automatic wins :D:

That I really like, would much rather play meaningful games against the Brewers in interleague games every year then just exhibition games though. It was a fun rivalry that is now lost. What a shame. But if they do play the Sox every year they should bring back the old Baseball glove MB logo from the 80s. Would bring back fun memories. Miss the blue and yellow. :D:

Hangar18
04-02-2004, 01:29 PM
Bud Selig took away A pretty Cool Rivalry between the SOX
and the Brewers. He basically took one rivalry away, and created another .........Net Gain = ZERO. Yet, there he was,
on FOX Sports that one sunny Saturday Afternoon, in the broadcast booth for the 1st ever meeting between the Brewers and Cubs in Milwaukee, Gloating and Patting Himself on the Back telling viewers "Look at the Rivalry we've created between these 2 great fans (as camera panned full outfield stands, never mind those same stands were ALways full for sox/brewers before)
and telling anyone who would listen, how Milwaukee was a NL town, and it was good for "baseball" that they moved
(whereve we heard that before)

mweflen
04-02-2004, 01:32 PM
i agree on missing the sox-brewers rivalry... the two fan bases were far more compatible than brewers-cubs (hell's angels vs. yuppies!)

i disagree on the net gain being zero, though. sox-cubs is far more entertaining than sox-brewers, and we get six interleague games instead of the usual 3 per year.

but it would be nice to have our cake and eat it too... (and get the easy wins against the current brew-crew, yes...)

cubhater
04-02-2004, 02:59 PM
I feel like puking everytime I hear about Selig.

I loved the Sox-Brewers rivalry back in the day. Selig is full of it when he talks about the Cubs-Brewers rivalry. The only thing it does is stuff his daughter's pockets when Cub fans pack Miller Park.

At least the move made the Brewers my favorite NL team. As pathetic as their play is on the field, at least they usually beat the Cubs! :D:

PaleHoseGeorge
04-02-2004, 04:55 PM
I hate to break it to you, but the Brewers (and most of their fans in Milwaukee) are very happy to be in the National League to build a rivalry with the Cubs (and a lesser extent the Cards and Braves) rather than staying in the A.L.

They're not stupid. For most of the 20+ years the Brewers were in the A.L., they got extra games against the Yankees, Red Sox, and Orioles, the very best attendance draws in all of MLB. Playing some games against the White Sox from the old A.L. West was just a bonus.

However that all changed with realignment in 1994. The Brewers lost their extra games with the big east coast teams and got stuck in a division with Minnesota, Kansas City, Cleveland, and the Sox. They bolted at the first opportunity (1998) and have never looked back.

The White Sox are a charter franchise of the American League, but you would be hard-pressed to name any other franchise in any sport that has been treated more like a dirty dish rag than the 103 year-old White Sox. Even a piddly market expansion team that carpetbagged its way to Milwaukee gets treated better than our Sox.

:angry:

soxwon
04-02-2004, 05:00 PM
did anyone here ever see us play hOME games at old county stadium, it was the 70s sometime.

PaleHoseGeorge
04-02-2004, 05:17 PM
Originally posted by soxwon
did anyone here ever see us play hOME games at old county stadium, it was the 70s sometime.

Actually it was 1967-69. Art Allyn was being wooed by Selig and his buddies to sell the Sox to Milwaukee. When Art sold to his brother John instead, Selig went looking for another team. He bought the year-old Seattle Pilots, moved them to Milwaukee just before the 1970 season began, and opened the entire American League to a lawsuit from Seattle for bad faith negotiation.

Selig and the other owners tried to get out from under the lawsuit Selig created by moving the Sox from Chicago to Seattle in 1974-75. However John Allyn held out and sold to Bill Veeck who promised to keep the team in Chicago. Still under threat of litigation, the A.L. owners decided to expand into Seattle (and Toronto) for the 1977 season. Thus were born the Mariners.

It's worth noting that the Tampa Bay Devil Rays were also created as a convenient method to escape litigation caused after the Giants agreed to move into the Suncoast Dome in the early-90's only to later back out.

Ah, the traditions of baseball...

:tool
"This is what happens when you let a used car salesmen from Milwaukee become an owner, and later even commissioner, too!"

jackbrohamer
04-02-2004, 05:44 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
I hate to break it to you, but the Brewers (and most of their fans in Milwaukee) are very happy to be in the National League to build a rivalry with the Cubs

You're right, & they got what they deserve: thousands of moron Scrub fans invading every Brewer/Scrub game in Milwaukee & cheering hysterically for Sammy and his loser teammates.

SoxRulecubsdrool
04-02-2004, 05:51 PM
I do admit I miss the Brewers rivalry. I remember being up in northern Wisconsin during the summer downing a few beers and watching a game at the local watering hole. It was also fun because for so many years we gave them a spanking. I cannot accept the Brewers in the NL.
However I must note, I have bought warm beer at Miller Park. :whiner:
What is up with that?
:gulp:

Hangar18
04-02-2004, 07:00 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
I hate to break it to you, but the Brewers (and most of their fans in Milwaukee) are very happy to be in the National League to build a rivalry with the Cubs (and a lesser extent the Cards and Braves) rather than staying in the A.L.

They're not stupid. For most of the 20+ years the Brewers were in the A.L., they got extra games against the Yankees, Red Sox, and Orioles, the very best attendance draws in all of MLB. Playing some games against the White Sox from the old A.L. West was just a bonus.

However that all changed with realignment in 1994. The Brewers lost their extra games with the big east coast teams and got stuck in a division with Minnesota, Kansas City, Cleveland, and the Sox. They bolted at the first opportunity (1998) and have never looked back.

:angry:

I dont think those people know what they want one way or the other. When I hear their "fans" saying they love the NL now, because of "No dh" and "games are faster", I realize these people have been buying into Seligs Company Line. Are Brewer Fans really much happier to have the Pittsburgh Pirates in their Miller Park for umpteen games? and the Cincinnati Reds?
Who are they kidding. Selig Sold Out their history, albeit brief, in the name of pretending they were the Milwaukee Braves.
A lesser more unknown reason, but reason enough, is most Brewer Fans think this way. "Im not gonna lie, I miss the American League, but now we have a "Better Chance" to get to the World Series being in the NL", said one particular Brewer fan at Milwaukees Miller Park, speaking on condition of anonymity.
I think he speaks for most of them ................

PaleHoseGeorge
04-02-2004, 07:07 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
I dont think those people know what they want one way or the other. When I hear their "fans" saying they love the NL now, because of "No dh" and "games are faster", I realize these people have been buying into Seligs Company Line. Are Brewer Fans really much happier to have the Pittsburgh Pirates in their Miller Park for umpteen games? and the Cincinnati Reds?
Who are they kidding. Selig Sold Out their history, albeit brief, in the name of pretending they were the Milwaukee Braves.
A lesser more unknown reason, but reason enough, is most Brewer Fans think this way. "Im not gonna lie, I miss the American League, but now we have a "Better Chance" to get to the World Series being in the NL", said one particular Brewer fan at Milwaukees Miller Park, speaking on condition of anonymity.
I think he speaks for most of them ................

Hanger, the Brewers are nothing but a very brief (April - June) annual distraction for most Wisconsinites. Otherwise they're talking Packers, 24/7/365. If they know anything about baseball, it's that Hank Aaron and Warren Spahn used to play in the same ballpark the Packers played in.

Oh, and Rockin' Robin Yount was the greatest ballplayer ever... and Paul Molitor, too.

Now let's all do the Chicken Dance!

<clap> <clap> <clap>

:gulp:

Hangar18
04-02-2004, 07:20 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge

Oh, and Rockin' Robin Yount was the greatest ballplayer ever... and Paul Molitor, too.

Now let's all do the Chicken Dance!

<clap> <clap> <clap>

:gulp:

thats what I mean.......Those 2 players are perfect examples of some of the Greatest players to have played the game. Players whose places in Brewer history have now lost some distinction being in the NL. No longer can a Brewer Fans sit in the stands, watching the Yankees and WHiteSOx, and telling stories about how they Remember Molitor hitting a clutch 2run double bottom of the 8th against the White Sox, or Jim Gantner and Cecil Cooper having Late Hits to beat the hated Yankees. Brewers went to the World Series, and man, I remember some of those guys from Cecil Cooper, Jim Gantner, Ben Oglivie................all achievements wiped slate clean now, because theres no way to compare them historically to what the Brewers are doing now.......Playing Against the Pirates. The Reds. The Expos.

The Brewers being in the NL is almost like the Brewers and some of their Great Teams Never Existed. Talk about wiping them off the Cultural Map and Erasing Them from History. On the one hand, I laugh at the stupidity of their fans, for not realizing they threw away a big piece of their history, all in the name of "No Dh's man, its way better now". Then I think about it, and say to myself, since they dont know any better....They deserve everything that comes to them.

Daver
04-02-2004, 07:38 PM
Hangar,take off the tinfoil for a minute.

A good percentage of the Brewers fanbase still refer to them as the Braves,and think of them as an NL team.

Realignment was inevetible,no matter whether the D'backs were placed in the NL or the AL,because the number between the leagues would still not be equal.

If you want to build conspiracy theories,focus on the reasons that the D'Backs and the Devil Dogs exist at all,not the details surrounding it.


You can replace the tinfoil now.

Hangar18
04-02-2004, 07:50 PM
Originally posted by Daver

A good percentage of the Brewers fanbase still refer to them as the Braves,and think of them as an NL team.

Realignment was inevetible,no matter whether the D'backs were placed in the NL or the AL,because the number between the leagues would still not be equal.

If you want to build conspiracy theories,focus on the reasons that the D'Backs and the Devil Dogs exist at all,not the details surrounding it.



If a good Percentage of fans refer to them as still the Braves, I feel sorry for them.

Realignment was inevitable? Sure within the Divisions. The Dbacks and DRays were supposed to be in the AL. 16 teams in the AL and 14 in the NL. Realigning the Leagues so the NL now had 16 teams and the AL 14 really didnt solve the "problem" if there wasnt one to begin with.

Conspiracy Theories? How about Bud Selig Openly saying he missed the Milwaukee Braves and how it Crushed his Spirit, to not see the Dodgers and Giants anymore. Im not denying there was some shady dealings involving the Birth of the Dbacks and DRays (the drays were explained by phg in another thread)
but dont think for a minute, Bud Selig didnt Use his Power of Commissionership to get the NL team hes always secretly wanted. Not for a Country minute do I think the Brewers moving to the NL was because he was "looking out for baseball".
If he was, he wouldve Told Colangelo to Get His Butt To the AL and quit complaining about being in the AL West considering the ink was still wet on their membership to join the MLB. and dont say "well, he asked the Royals and the Tigers if they wanted to move". That was a ploy, KC said privately to anyone listening they werent interested, dont even ask, and the Tigers werent interested in Selling Out their heritage as one of the Charter AL Franchises. :angry:

Hangar18
04-02-2004, 07:57 PM
bottom line, and as always its only my strong opinion, BUD SELIG showed some very VERY Suspect judgement with the Selective use of his power and got himself in the NL to satisfy his NL fix, not to satisy the fanbase. The fact theres an older generation of brewer fans that DONT GET IT, and refuse to believe the Braves left, was a sweet benefit and easy excuse

Daver
04-02-2004, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
bottom line, and as always its only my strong opinion, BUD SELIG showed some very VERY Suspect judgement with the Selective use of his power and got himself in the NL to satisfy his NL fix, not to satisy the fanbase. The fact theres an older generation of brewer fans that DONT GET IT, and refuse to believe the Braves left, was a sweet benefit and easy excuse

Hangar

The reason the D'backs and the Devil dogs exist is because MLB was willing to do whatever it took to get them to pay the franchise fee's to join,plain and simple,if you are going to look past that then you are chasing smoke in a mirror.

Think about it.

TDog
04-03-2004, 12:59 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
I hate to break it to you, but the Brewers (and most of their fans in Milwaukee) are very happy to be in the National League to build a rivalry with the Cubs (and a lesser extent the Cards and Braves) rather than staying in the A.L. ...

I lived in suburban Milwaukee (birthplace of Les Paul, actually) for four years, made it there in time to have a season ticket plan for the last season at County Stadium, but not in time to catch the Brewers in the American League.

The Cubs were big, but the fans I knew talked about how it was fiercer with the White Sox. The Braves were a ballyhooed novelty the first time around. The biggest complaints came from the loss of the Twins rivalry, which was turned into a home-home thing the way the Sox and Cubs play. There aren't any Brewers fans going to the games anymore, so you have to conclude that fans liked it better in the American League.

Hangar18
04-03-2004, 02:23 AM
Originally posted by TDog
I lived in suburban Milwaukee (birthplace of Les Paul, actually) for four years, made it there in time to have a season ticket plan for the last season at County Stadium, but not in time to catch the Brewers in the American League.

The Cubs were big, but the fans I knew talked about how it was fiercer with the White Sox. The Braves were a ballyhooed novelty the first time around. The biggest complaints came from the loss of the Twins rivalry, which was turned into a home-home thing the way the Sox and Cubs play. There aren't any Brewers fans going to the games anymore, so you have to conclude that fans liked it better in the American League.

very interesting ......thank you for the insight

TommyJohn
04-03-2004, 06:29 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
I hate to break it to you, but the Brewers (and most of their fans in Milwaukee) are very happy to be in the National League to build a rivalry with the Cubs (and a lesser extent the Cards and Braves) rather than staying in the A.L.

They're not stupid. For most of the 20+ years the Brewers were in the A.L., they got extra games against the Yankees, Red Sox, and Orioles, the very best attendance draws in all of MLB. Playing some games against the White Sox from the old A.L. West was just a bonus.

However that all changed with realignment in 1994. The Brewers lost their extra games with the big east coast teams and got stuck in a division with Minnesota, Kansas City, Cleveland, and the Sox. They bolted at the first opportunity (1998) and have never looked back.

The White Sox are a charter franchise of the American League, but you would be hard-pressed to name any other franchise in any sport that has been treated more like a dirty dish rag than the 103 year-old White Sox. Even a piddly market expansion team that carpetbagged its way to Milwaukee gets treated better than our Sox.

:angry:

You are correct, sir. And don't forget that the Brewers were in
the A.L. West until 1971, when the Senators were going to
move to Texas. The AL was going to switch the moved Rangers
to the West and a team to the East. John Allyn wanted to move
the White Sox, which would've been a natural fit. The Sox needed
those extra games against the Yankees, Red Sox and Orioles,
which would've helped attendance in those days of the un-
balanced schedule. Plus, the East teams were all the old AL
teams, the West were the expansion teams and the Twins. The
shift to the East would've been a natural fit and would've bene-
fitted the team financially. It also would've cut down the number
of night games on the west coast. But what happened? Bud bud
cried poormouth to the league about needing more games a-
gainst east coast teams in order to stay afloat financially. PRESTO!
The Milwaukee Brewers are shifted to the East, the White Sox are
condemned to the purgatory of the West. John Allyn was furious.
This all according to Rich Lindberg in "Stealing First In a Two Team
Town."

Ironic that every realignment in baseball from the Rangers move to the expansion of 1998 benefitted the Seattle Pilots, isn't it?
Bud sure is every bit the outsider he always claimed to be.

Hangar18
04-03-2004, 08:28 AM
Originally posted by TommyJohn
........................... But what happened? Bud bud
cried poormouth to the league about needing more games a-
gainst east coast teams in order to stay afloat financially. PRESTO!
The Milwaukee Brewers are shifted to the East, the White Sox are
condemned to the purgatory of the West. John Allyn was furious.
This all according to Rich Lindberg in "Stealing First In a Two Team
Town."

Ironic that every realignment in baseball from the Rangers move to the expansion of 1998 benefitted the Seattle Pilots, isn't it?
Bud sure is every bit the outsider he always claimed to be.

"Your Honor, I would like to call anudder witness"
"You cant show another witness at this stage Mr Gambini"
"Your Honah, I would like to call this witness, who has certain evidence unknown to me before, that will further prove that
Mr See-lig is nuttin but a low-down, poor-crying, national league lovin, steinbrenner car-washin, crook"

ode to veeck
04-03-2004, 09:41 AM
Hangar,take off the tinfoil for a minute.

Oh C'mon! That tinfoil should be standard issue for hardcore, hardnosed unbiased Sox fans.

It was a relief to see teams placed in Milwaukee, Tampa, and Seattle, removing historical targets for MLB attempts to move the Sox there.

When talking of contraction, why isn't Brewcrew considered? After their great hitting squads of the early 80s (w/ Olgivie, Thomas, Yount, Cooper, Simmons, Molitor, Gantner, etc) Bud's totally run them into the ground, when picking up Royce is actually an improvement to their squad. Mid 80s Brewers had actually built a decent fan base in small market Wisconsin with these exciting teams, even drawing from far Northen Illinois.

Mr. Bud "best conflict of interest of baseball" Selig's managment vectors makes it more important to spread the wealth and take an active role in running the Expos further into the ground. Other than the new ball park year, where they drew 2.8M, Bud's poor assemblage of a team has drawn prety poorly in recent years.

ode to veeck
04-03-2004, 09:45 AM
Even Les Paul was smart enough to get out of Milwaukee; he still plays weekly sets at the Iridium club in NYC

TDog
04-03-2004, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by ode to veeck
Even Les Paul was smart enough to get out of Milwaukee; he still plays weekly sets at the Iridium club in NYC

I used to have Les Paul's telephone number on my desk at work, in the event I or anyone else in my office ever needed to talk to the inventor of the electric guitar. Among the differences between NYC and Waukesha, Wisconsin, is that New York City doesn't have a sign outside welcoming visitors to the birthplace of Les Paul.

I don't live in Wisconsin anymore, either.

bc2k
04-03-2004, 02:14 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
those same stands were ALways full for sox/brewers before)

:)

springrovesoxfan
04-03-2004, 03:35 PM
Me and a group of about 20, use to go up to old county stadium each year for the Sox games. Most brewers fans back then were scrubfans and they always let the Sox fans know it, even tho they were civil about it most of the time. We ran into a few that just didn't like us. we had a few near brawls but the brewers fans usually backed down.

TDog
04-03-2004, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by springrovesoxfan
Me and a group of about 20, use to go up to old county stadium each year for the Sox games. Most brewers fans back then were scrubfans and they always let the Sox fans know it, even tho they were civil about it most of the time. We ran into a few that just didn't like us. we had a few near brawls but the brewers fans usually backed down.

The dynamic between the Sox-Brewers rivalry and the Cubs-Brewers rivalry are entirely different. My former boss told me that he went to a Sox game in County Stadium on a Saturday afternoon, couldn't get any seats better than deep in the outfield, and management announced they were cutting off beer sales after the second inning due to the nature of the crowd. Sox fans and Brewers fans really didn't like each other.

The Brewers moving into the National League was followed closely by the emergence of Sosa as a baseball poster boy. A lot of people going to Cubs games when I first lived there were going to see Sosa, the same way they went to see McGwire when the Cardinals came to town. Cub fans, however were taking the rivalry every bit as seriously as the Sox fans used to, except they were like the Cubs fans you see at Wrigley and treated County stadium like it was their home park. Brewers fans came to hate Cubs fans as people, not just as baseball fans.

ewokpelts
04-03-2004, 06:44 PM
Henry,
Your idea would rock EXCEPT. ......that the 2nd year the sox went up to miller park, they had less than 20k a game...and the year after when the brew crew hosted the twinkes they were less than 26k a game, and one of them was free tickets! They didnt even open up thier upper deck for those games.
Gene

Hangar18
04-03-2004, 08:19 PM
Originally posted by ewokpelts
Henry,
Your idea would rock EXCEPT. ......that the 2nd year the sox went up to miller park, they had less than 20k a game...and the year after when the brew crew hosted the twinkes they were less than 26k a game, and one of them was free tickets! They didnt even open up thier upper deck for those games.
Gene

20K per game, versus whatever the brewers get in their Spring Training games? This is a Dress Rehearsal for the Team & the Fans.........Cant baseball give something back? Plus, the 20K
was for an exhibition game. We had over 40K for the last Real Games we played up there, per the usual when the SOX and Brewers play. Funny how the Media doesnt talk about that huh?