PDA

View Full Version : OFFICIAL "SS Valentin should be moved/traded because..."


PaleHoseGeorge
09-09-2001, 02:44 PM
This is the official thread for expressing reasons why Jose Valentin must be either moved to another position besides shortstop, or simply traded.

Use this thread to either support or refute a position on this subject.

Go Sox!

-PHG

Spiff
09-09-2001, 02:49 PM
Young pitchers need to be confident in the defense behind them.

dimaisback
09-09-2001, 04:56 PM
young pitchers need defense nehind them

All the more reason for moving a no-range, no arm Clayminator out.

OutcastRadio
09-09-2001, 09:15 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago


In other words, you like seeing Clayton play short for us? :)

Actually, I was lobbying to put Valentin back there....36 errors sounds pretty good to me.

doublem23
09-09-2001, 09:30 PM
Originally posted by Outcast Radio


Actually, I was lobbying to put Valentin back there....36 errors sounds pretty good to me.

Obviously you forget that grab he made against the Tribe in September 2001 (according to the schedule it was September 8), when in the 8th inning (I think), he fell into the stands to make one of the best catches I have ever seen....

The only one better was Ray-Ray's backwards swan dive against the Haloes in the 2000 Home Opener...

Ahhh... fond memories....

harwar
09-10-2001, 10:34 AM
Jose is,hands down,my favorite player on the Sox.However;I'm worried about his age & health next year.I believe that he needs to be the starting shortstop from day 1 of spring training until hes'just not capable of doing it anymore.

Kilroy
09-10-2001, 05:09 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
It's nice we all want to make everyone feel warm and cuddly and find them all a spot to play, but this is going back to the good ol' days of Baseball 101.

Well, since you started with baseball 101, let me refesh your memory about a basic concept that is tried and true.

A team wants its best defense up the middle of the field. Starting with a the catcher, next with the second baseman and short stop, and finally center field. The ball is handled the most by the catcher, shortstop and 2nd baseman. The centerfielder is the leader of the outfield and should be in charge of the right fielder and left fielder, taking most of the plays in right and left center, as well as straight away.

This goes along with the concepts that you hide weak defensive players in left or right field, and on first base.

This is baseball 101 as well. While it's true that Jose is the better all-around member of this team, the fact that he averages 20 errors a season, no matter where he plays, makes him not the best choice for shortstop. Typically shortstop is not a spot where you expect alot of offensive production to come from. A-Rod is the freak-of-nature exception, not the rule. But there isn't a team out there that doesn't want solid D at short.

The best solution, IMO, is for CLee to be traded for catching and pitching prospects. Valentin then plays left, w/ Rowand as the utility OF, w/ Singleton starting, or vice-versa.

That is if Crede can handle 3rd. Jose has to be better in left that CLee. Of course, Clayton stays at short because he is the better shortstop, not the better player.

doublem23
09-10-2001, 11:02 PM
Maybe it's my ultra-liberal side showing once again, but A) we win because we mash the ball, not cuz we make a Web Gem every game. B)WHY CHANGE SOMETHING THAT ISN'T BROKEN? How many more wins did we need in 2000 to prove that we can win with Manos at short???

Kilroy
09-10-2001, 11:25 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
Maybe it's my ultra-liberal side showing once again, but A) we win because we mash the ball, not cuz we make a Web Gem every game. B)WHY CHANGE SOMETHING THAT ISN'T BROKEN? How many more wins did we need in 2000 to prove that we can win with Manos at short???

Answer: 3. That would be 3 more than we got in the ALDS. Mashing the ball is a great way to get to the playoffs, but it just doesn't happen once you get there. I don't know about you, but I wanna make some noise when we get back to the post season.

FarWestChicago
09-10-2001, 11:35 PM
Originally posted by Kilroy


Answer: 3. That would be 3 more than we got in the ALDS. Mashing the ball is a great way to get to the playoffs, but it just doesn't happen once you get there. I don't know about you, but I wanna make some noise when we get back to the post season. OK, I'm know I'm not supposed to participate in this stuff, but are you saying if we had Royce in the playoffs last year we would have beat the Mariniers? I'm just wondering.

Kilroy
09-11-2001, 12:08 AM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
OK, I'm know I'm not supposed to participate in this stuff, but are you saying if we had Royce in the playoffs last year we would have beat the Mariniers? I'm just wondering.

Not at all. I am just saying don't count on mashing the ball in the playoffs. The White Sox, of all teams, should have learned that. They averaged 6+ runs a game in the reg season, but didn't put up that number in any of the 3 div series games. All that offense we had in the reg season didn't mean squat when the playoffs started. And, given that the scoring will be more scarce, the defense had better be solid ALL the time.

FarWestChicago
09-11-2001, 12:16 AM
Originally posted by Kilroy


Not at all. I am just saying don't count on mashing the ball in the playoffs. The White Sox, of all teams, should have learned that. They averaged 6+ runs a game in the reg season, but didn't put up that number in any of the 3 div series games. All that offense we had in the reg season didn't mean squat when the playoffs started. And, given that the scoring will be more scarce, the defense had better be solid ALL the time. Thank you for clarifying. I appreciate it.

Mathew
09-16-2001, 05:08 AM
Cause if you hit yourself on the head several times with hammer, Royce seems like the better player.