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bartmanisgod
02-21-2004, 02:36 AM
New to this board...but long time sox fan... Just a thought , Is anyone else tired of hearing how the scrubs have the best starting rotation in baseball, and are a shoe in to make the playoffs, while the sox supposedly won't do anything because they didn't make any moves?
How bout this little Scenario! No team in our division has made a significant move! The twins actually lost most of their middle relief without picking up anyone important! Meanwhile the Astros have added two hall of fame pitchers to their staff! The cubbies also have dick for offense, and with all of the steroid use I am predicting another choke season from Corkey! Cubs expectations are high, while Sox are relatively low! Anyone else think that the southsiders could easily end up in the playoffs while the cubs fans watch from the sidelines this year?

Hangar18
02-21-2004, 02:47 AM
Ummmm Yes. Im disgusted to see the Chicago Media act
unprofessional because of Maddux "coming back". However, for the SOX to get Equal coverage, they would have to do TWICE.
Not that thats a bad thing mind you.......hard work is ALWAYS rewarded.........But simply giving up....as Jerry Reinsdorf has done this year, IS INEXCUSABLE. SIMPLY INEXCUSABLE.
IM ASHAMED TO BE CONSIDERED A HUMAN ALONG WITH
MR JERRY REINSDORF. I WOULD NEVER GIVE UP .....LIKE HIM.
AND I WOULD NEVER LET MY ENEMY GET STRONGER ....
at my expense. NEVER.

MRKARNO
02-21-2004, 10:19 AM
Originally posted by bartmanisgod
New to this board...but long time sox fan... Just a thought , Is anyone else tired of hearing how the scrubs have the best starting rotation in baseball, and are a shoe in to make the playoffs, while the sox supposedly won't do anything because they didn't make any moves?
How bout this little Scenario! No team in our division has made a significant move! The twins actually lost most of their middle relief without picking up anyone important! Meanwhile the Astros have added two hall of fame pitchers to their staff! The cubbies also have dick for offense, and with all of the steroid use I am predicting another choke season from Corkey! Cubs expectations are high, while Sox are relatively low! Anyone else think that the southsiders could easily end up in the playoffs while the cubs fans watch from the sidelines this year?

I potentially see this happening. The White Sox have the best team in the worst division in baseball. I dont see the cubs winning the Central, but probably the Wild Card, but if the NL East produces 2 or 3 playoff worthy teams (Marlins, Braves and Phillies), then the CUbs chances could dwindle

jabrch
02-21-2004, 11:06 AM
I don't see what you guys see is wrong with the Cubs. Right now - they deserve all the media attention. They are a far superior team. Their 5th starter is better than our third. Their 1st 3 are probably all better than our #1. They have 2 GG calibre IFs , power at every position except 2B and C, and a deep pen. Being realistic, how do they not perform well this year?

SoxFan76
02-21-2004, 11:17 AM
Our number 2 starter, (Buerhle is still considered no. 1, right?),is better than the Cubs 1-3 starters.

CubKilla
02-21-2004, 11:37 AM
Originally posted by jabrch
Being realistic, how do they not perform well this year?

Injuries to the pitching staff from overuse last season, ShamME falling apart cause the 'roids are no longer binding his "muscles" together, Patterson not being 100% after knee rehab, Alou will sprain a muscle on the treadmill again, and Ramirez eats himself to death. Not to mention, D Lee will set a new Major League single season K-record :D: .

SSN721
02-21-2004, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by jabrch
I don't see what you guys see is wrong with the Cubs. Right now - they deserve all the media attention. They are a far superior team. Their 5th starter is better than our third. Their 1st 3 are probably all better than our #1. They have 2 GG calibre IFs , power at every position except 2B and C, and a deep pen. Being realistic, how do they not perform well this year?

I completely agree, I cant see how anyone here could even compare the staffs of the Sox and the Cubs it isnt even close, 1-5 they are better. I dont think Loaiza will be as good as last year, still think he will win around 15 but I think it is crazy to expect much more than that. And I would take Prior or Wood over him in a second. Loaiza hasnt had more than 10 wins a year til last year. I dont think that the coverage is biased because the Cubs really do have an excellent staff. But I do agree they are not a shoe in for the playoffs, Houston is gonna be a tough team this year and I would say their staff is quite comparable to the Cubs.

kingkirk04
02-21-2004, 12:17 PM
Originally posted by SoxFan76
Our number 2 starter, (Buerhle is still considered no. 1, right?),is better than the Cubs 1-3 starters.

Ha.

SoxFan76
02-21-2004, 01:01 PM
Why do you say "ha"

munchman33
02-21-2004, 02:22 PM
Originally posted by SoxFan76
Our number 2 starter, (Buerhle is still considered no. 1, right?),is better than the Cubs 1-3 starters.

Prior is better than Loaiza. And Wood is better than Buerle. Any of their other starters over Garland is a no-brainer.

santo=dorf
02-21-2004, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by munchman33
Prior is better than Loaiza. And Wood is better than Buerle. Any of their other starters over Garland is a no-brainer.

Wood is not better than Buehrle. Wood has more wild pitches and last year hit more batters than Mark has in his entire carrer.

jabrch
02-21-2004, 02:34 PM
Originally posted by SoxFan76
Our number 2 starter, (Buerhle is still considered no. 1, right?),is better than the Cubs 1-3 starters.


Buehrle is better than Prior? Wood? Maddux? Maybe - MAYBE - if he returns to form from 2002 he is as good as Maddux, but not close to Wood and not even near close to Prior.

jabrch
02-21-2004, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by santo=dorf
Wood is not better than Buehrle. Wood has more wild pitches and last year hit more batters than Mark has in his entire carrer.

That's non-sense. Now I hate Cubsfans and the hype they get as much as the next guy. But lets look at the stats. Wood had a 3.20 ERA and 266Ks. Yeah he had WPs and HBPs, but he lead the league in hits allowed per 9IP and in Ks.

I'd take Wood or Prior over Loaiza or Buehrle. I'd put Maddux in the same class as our guys.

Lets face it - they have a far superior team to us so far. They ownership and their management have, remarkably, done the right things, while JR/KW and crew have floundered away and told us we should be happy with the mediocrity that we get from our Sox.

santo=dorf
02-21-2004, 02:44 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
That's non-sense. Now I hate Cubsfans and the hype they get as much as the next guy. But lets look at the stats. Wood had a 3.20 ERA and 266Ks. Yeah he had WPs and HBPs, but he lead the league in hits allowed per 9IP and in Ks.

I'd take Wood or Prior over Loaiza or Buehrle. I'd put Maddux in the same class as our guys.

Lets face it - they have a far superior team to us so far. They ownership and their management have, remarkably, done the right things, while JR/KW and crew have floundered away and told us we should be happy with the mediocrity that we get from our Sox.

Buehrle is better than Wood. Mark is more consistent, walks less batters, and last year he didn't have a runner steal a base on him until September. Wood is either up or down, almost led the league in walks, and has a lot more wild pitches. Don't forget Kerry has already had Tommy John surgery, and his carrer high for victories in a season is 14. Mark's carrer low for victories in a full season is 14

jabrch
02-21-2004, 02:48 PM
Originally posted by santo=dorf
Buehrle is better than Wood. Mark is more consistent, walks less batters, and last year he didn't have a runner steal a base on him until September. Wood is either up or down, almost led the league in walks, and has a lot more wild pitches. Don't forget Kerry has already had Tommy John surgery, and his carrer high for victories in a season is 14. Mark's carrer low for victories in a full season is 14

Wins are not the best metric of a pitcher's performance. He has not control over too many of the factors that contribute to a win. (Wood was killed by his pen last year)

He lead the league in opp. avg last year. He lead the league in baserunners per 9. He had a 3.20 ERA.

Saying Buehrle is better because of WPs and SBs is like saying Saddam is a nice guy because he gave $1000 to charity in July of 1997. Wood's SBs allowed and WPs are nothing relative to his performance pitching.

As far as Wood's Tommy John surgery, that was 5+ years ago. After 5 years, there is no chance of reinjuring that. Any new injuries would be completely unrelated to the first one.

Dan H
02-21-2004, 03:10 PM
Reality can be tough but face it: The Cubs are a better team and are a legitimate contender. The Sox have hope because of their horrible division.

I am sick of Cub fans already calling this pitching staff the greatest ever. Don't they know of the four 20 game winners on the Baltimore staff in 1970? The great staffs the Dodgers had in the '60's? Even some of the A's staffs in the '70's?

There is some hope. Cub fans were calling their 1969 team the greatest ever and look like happened to them.

WSox8404
02-21-2004, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
I don't see what you guys see is wrong with the Cubs. Right now - they deserve all the media attention. They are a far superior team. Their 5th starter is better than our third. Their 1st 3 are probably all better than our #1. They have 2 GG calibre IFs , power at every position except 2B and C, and a deep pen. Being realistic, how do they not perform well this year?


Well as of right now, the Cubs should be getting more media attention than the Sox. It's just natural. They are making big deals and such, while we are doing close to nothing. However, even when the Sox are doing things and the Cubs aren't, the Cubs still get the media attention. If the Sox and Cubs both play day games, and the Sox win while the Cubs lose, most news telecasts will still talk about the Cubs first in the sports segment. This is not right. The media is totally biased towards the Cubs and this is why the Cubs are drawing more fans than the Sox are.
New people coming to live in the city and people coming here on vacation see how much attention the Cubs get in the media. Its no wonder why they choose to go to Cubs games instead of Sox games. The only way this would change would be for the Sox to win it all and the Cubs finish in last. Although the Cubs clinching last place in their division would probably garner more news coverage than the Sox clinching the division title. But as long as we have our own diehard fans like everyone on this board, I am just fine with the way things are. Cause people like all of you's and me all know the truth to why the Cubs are so popular and that is all that counts. I don't mind being in the minority in this city. Being a Sox fan is all that counts.

doctor30th
02-21-2004, 08:19 PM
As far as Wood's Tommy John surgery, that was 5+ years ago. After 5 years, there is no chance of reinjuring that

Well there is a chance still, its just not as significant as before, there is never no chance whatsoever.

SoxFan76
02-21-2004, 10:45 PM
I think the only pitching stat worth keeping is wins. Buerhle and Loaiza have proved they can win more games than Wood/Prior. K's really mean nothing. ERA is an important stat, but as long as your team scores more runs than the other team, ERA is not very important either.

StillMissOzzie
02-21-2004, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by munchman33
Prior is better than Loaiza. And Wood is better than Buerle. Any of their other starters over Garland is a no-brainer.

I'd say Prior is better than Loaiza, but I don't think Wood is better than Buehrle. K-Wood hit his CAREER HIGH of 14 wins last year. This guy has been coasting on his rookie year strikeout record.

In a related vein, I have a wager outstanding that Loaiza, Buehrle, and Garland will all be better than Maddux in 2004.

Maddux + Quest-Tec in Wrigley = 13-12

SMO
:gulp:

SoxFan76
02-22-2004, 09:35 AM
From a standpoint of K's, the Cubs pitchers are better. But bottom line is they don't win as many games as the Sox pitchers. When your ace has never won more than 14 games, I don't see how you have the most dominant pitching staff in the majors. (according to Gammons on Sportscenter today, what a jerk.)

DrCrawdad
02-22-2004, 09:46 AM
Originally posted by StillMissOzzie
I'd say Prior is better than Loaiza, but I don't think Wood is better than Buehrle. K-Wood hit his CAREER HIGH of 14 wins last year. This guy has been coasting on his rookie year strikeout record.

In a related vein, I have a wager outstanding that Loaiza, Buehrle, and Garland will all be better than Maddux in 2004.

Maddux + Quest-Tec in Wrigley = 13-12

SMO
:gulp:

I believe that somewhere that QuestTec is not going in to The Shrine this year.

A fun drinking game: Listen to a Cubbie broadcast (radio or tv) when Carrie Wood pitches. Drink every time they mention Carrie's 20 strike-out game from six years ago.

jabrch
02-22-2004, 10:47 AM
Originally posted by doctor30th
Well there is a chance still, its just not as significant as before, there is never no chance whatsoever.

What I meant was that any injury to it is completely new and unrelated to the old injury. There is the same amount of chance of reinjury as anyone who never had TJ surgery.

StillMissOzzie
02-22-2004, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by DrCrawdad
I believe that somewhere that QuestTec is not going in to The Shrine this year.

A fun drinking game: Listen to a Cubbie broadcast (radio or tv) when Carrie Wood pitches. Drink every time they mention Carrie's 20 strike-out game from six years ago.

Doc, I've seen/heard conflicting reports about QuestTec at "The Shrine", so I'm not sure what's right anymore. However, I don't think I can drink that much to play your drinking game. [ And I LOVE the "Carrie" slam, too! ]

SMO

DrCrawdad
02-22-2004, 05:30 PM
Originally posted by StillMissOzzie
Doc, I've seen/heard conflicting reports about QuestTec at "The Shrine", so I'm not sure what's right anymore. However, I don't think I can drink that much to play your drinking game. [ And I LOVE the "Carrie" slam, too! ]

SMO

I hear you, you'll be wasted by the 4th inning.

Oh, did I spell Wood's first name wrong? :)

red faber
02-23-2004, 12:07 AM
Originally posted by bartmanisgod
New to this board...but long time sox fan... Just a thought , Is anyone else tired of hearing how the scrubs have the best starting rotation in baseball, and are a shoe in to make the playoffs, while the sox supposedly won't do anything because they didn't make any moves?
How bout this little Scenario! No team in our division has made a significant move! The twins actually lost most of their middle relief without picking up anyone important! Meanwhile the Astros have added two hall of fame pitchers to their staff! The cubbies also have dick for offense, and with all of the steroid use I am predicting another choke season from Corkey! Cubs expectations are high, while Sox are relatively low! Anyone else think that the southsiders could easily end up in the playoffs while the cubs fans watch from the sidelines this year?


as much as i hate to say it,the cubs deserve more attention the sox.because the fact is,they made more moves than we did.