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E Coast Sox Fan
01-29-2004, 03:37 PM
deserve a lot of credit for taking a few well deserved shots at the Sox owners and management team for making incredibly arrogant and utterly stupid statements in which they are inc essence attempting to require that fans come out to watch an inferior product before they'll spend money :angry: .

In the great baseball movie "Field of Dreams" wasn't the famous line..."if you build it, they will come". It seem to me that Sox owners and management team has the equation wrong. I give a lot of credit to the writers at the Herald and Tribune for writing about this :D: .

It leaves me with one question...why haven't we seen articles from the Southtown Economist, the Sun Times, the Sporting News and others. The behavior the Sox Management is appalling and should be more publicly chastised by mainstream sports writers.


:selljerry

Hangar18
01-29-2004, 04:55 PM
Yup.......the reason theyve been Getting Away with Murder,
is because of that fuzzy blue team up north. The Medias too busy writing about Dustys Toothpicks, Little punk Darrens thoughts on baserunning, Sammys new offseason workout regiment, and the Annual "New" Cub player interviews
(since theyre always adding about 10 new guys a year, thats embarrassing) Do that for a decade, and these guys are able to fly under the radar, undetected like this. The Media is as much to blame as anyone. NO WAY should this nonsense
have gone on for as long as it did. One things for sure,
if either:

A) Eddie DeBartolo had bought the SOX instead
B) The Tribune HADNT bought the cubs instead

of those two previous things had happened instead, the cubs
would not have been CELEBRATED for being the losers they
are the SOX wouldnt have pulled PR nitemare stunt after
PR Gaffe. The Media wouldve run him out of town by 1996.

thepaulbowski
01-29-2004, 05:52 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Yup.......the reason theyve been Getting Away with Murder,
is because of that fuzzy blue team up north. The Medias too busy writing about Dustys Toothpicks, Little punk Darrens thoughts on baserunning, Sammys new offseason workout regiment, and the Annual "New" Cub player interviews
(since theyre always adding about 10 new guys a year, thats embarrassing) Do that for a decade, and these guys are able to fly under the radar, undetected like this. The Media is as much to blame as anyone. NO WAY should this nonsense
have gone on for as long as it did. One things for sure,
if either:

A) Eddie DeBartolo had bought the SOX instead
B) The Tribune HADNT bought the cubs instead

of those two previous things had happened instead, the cubs
would not have been CELEBRATED for being the losers they
are the SOX wouldnt have pulled PR nitemare stunt after
PR Gaffe. The Media wouldve run him out of town by 1996.

Actually it's called marketing & the Cubs have done a great job at. The Sox, well.....we know the answer.

Hangar18
01-29-2004, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by thepaulbowski
Actually it's called marketing & the Cubs have done a great job at. The Sox, well.....we know the answer.

thats a tough one. Do you credit the Mighty Cubpoganda Machine, or the Media that Feeds It?

Does the The man who led the Horse to Water get Credited?
Or does the Horse get Championed for drinking it?

thepaulbowski
01-29-2004, 05:57 PM
Originally posted by E Coast Sox Fan
It leaves me with one question...why haven't we seen articles from the Southtown Economist, the Sun Times, the Sporting News and others. The behavior the Sox Management is appalling and should be more publicly chastised by mainstream sports writers.


Maybe if the Sox gave them something to write about they would. Only so many sell Jerry sell articles can be written before it becomes like beating a dead horse. JR isn't selling which means we are all screwed.

Paulwny
01-29-2004, 05:58 PM
Originally posted by E Coast Sox Fan


In the great baseball movie "Field of Dreams" wasn't the famous line..."if you build it, they will come". It seem to me that Sox owners and management team has the equation wrong. I give a lot of credit to the writers at the Herald and Tribune for writing about this :D: .



I think JR took the statement literally. The stadium 's built, nobody said I needed to field a team.

thepaulbowski
01-29-2004, 06:00 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
thats a tough one. Do you credit the Mighty Cubpoganda Machine, or the Media that Feeds It? what came first?
the chicken or the egg?

The Tribune company is the one that deserves all of the credit. They are the ones who created this Cubbie Love all across the land. The took a crappy product and turned them into these "Lovable Losers." Since the Tribune company owns the Cubs, the Tribune & WGN, they control much of the media.

Hangar18
01-29-2004, 06:06 PM
Originally posted by thepaulbowski
The Tribune company is the one that deserves all of the credit. They are the ones who created this Cubbie Love all across the land. The took a crappy product and turned them into these "Lovable Losers." Since the Tribune company owns the Cubs, the Tribune & WGN, they control much of the media.

So....
Man (Media) Provides Horse (Cubs) with Water **OR**
Horse (Cubs) Drinks water provided by Man (Media)

Your in the camp that says that Man gets the credit then.
I agree

gosox41
01-29-2004, 06:38 PM
Originally posted by E Coast Sox Fan
deserve a lot of credit for taking a few well deserved shots at the Sox owners and management team for making incredibly arrogant and utterly stupid statements in which they are inc essence attempting to require that fans come out to watch an inferior product before they'll spend money :angry: .

In the great baseball movie "Field of Dreams" wasn't the famous line..."if you build it, they will come". It seem to me that Sox owners and management team has the equation wrong. I give a lot of credit to the writers at the Herald and Tribune for writing about this :D: .

It leaves me with one question...why haven't we seen articles from the Southtown Economist, the Sun Times, the Sporting News and others. The behavior the Sox Management is appalling and should be more publicly chastised by mainstream sports writers.


:selljerry

JR is far from the only owner who is clueless.

Bob

Lip Man 1
01-29-2004, 08:15 PM
Phil Arvia in the Southtown has taken shots at Sox management ditto for Jay Mariotti and Carol Slezak with the Sun-Times. (I can post some of what they have written if you wish...)

Ken Rosenthal the senior baseball writer for the Sporting News e-mailed me last night and asked if I could send him the story with Kenny's comments linking fan attendance to acquiring players in the Summer. I sent it to him along with the Q & A Williams did. He's going to have a small sidebar story on the Sox next week in the print edition of TSN. He told me when you get right down to it, Reinsdorf is the cause of the Sox constant troubles.

Basically every news organization is aware of management's incompetence and has commented on it.

Lip

PaleHoseGeorge
01-29-2004, 08:18 PM
Originally posted by gosox41
JR is far from the only owner who is clueless.

Bob

Can we give him extra credit for being clueless 23 years straight?

SoxFan76
01-29-2004, 09:10 PM
cubs success (popularity wise) can be credited to the media. the tribune co. is part of the media. therefore, a big section of the chicago media is going to make their team look superior. its that simple. the sox just have some guy who is pretty content with the little that he has.

Lip Man 1
01-29-2004, 10:44 PM
Sox fan 76:

If the media wants to make their club look better how do you account for Phil Rogers saying in his WSI Interview that the Tribune owning the Cubs is a conflict of interest and is "indefensible."

How do you account for the fact that the sports editor of the Tribune Dan McGrath, is a South Side Sox fan who went to St. Leo high school and that other confirmed Sox fans who work for the Tribune are Bob Vanderberg the assistant sports editor who has written three books on the team, Paul Sullivan and Melissa Issacson?

How do you account for the fact that Rich King of WGN-TV sports is a former Sox announcer and a lifetime Sox fan?

Seems to me if the Tribune wants to hire media people to promote "their" team they are doing it in a very strange way.....

The fact is that the Tribune Company can't wait for the Sox to do something because it means higher ratings on WGN-TV and more papers sold. They can also charge higher advertising rates. In short, Sox success means the Tribune Company makes more money.

They'd LOVE to see the Sox win something.

Lip

soxwon
01-29-2004, 11:07 PM
the Annual "New" Cub player interviews
(since theyre always adding about 10 new guys a year, thats embarrassing)


Could somebody do some research- how many players have the Cubs added in the last 5 offseasons, compared to how many the Sox have added.

Id appreciate if someone could look this up.

Hangar18
01-30-2004, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Sox fan 76:

How do you account for the fact that the sports editor of the Tribune Dan McGrath, is a South Side Sox fan who went to St. Leo high school and that other confirmed Sox fans who work for the Tribune are Bob Vanderberg the assistant sports editor who has written three books on the team, Paul Sullivan and Melissa Issacson?

How do you account for the fact that Rich King of WGN-TV sports is a former Sox announcer and a lifetime Sox fan?

Seems to me if the Tribune wants to hire media people to promote "their" team they are doing it in a very strange way.....

Lip

Just because your Workers are Sox Fans, DOESNT mean
the Boss is a Sox Fan. Cubs have it great right now.
they do minimal work for a shoddy product that sells Itself
because the ONLY OTHER COMPETITOR in their Market is
too busy shooting themselves in the Foot for the last 22 years.

Frater Perdurabo
01-30-2004, 09:21 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
If the media wants to make their club look better how do you account for Phil Rogers saying in his WSI Interview that the Tribune owning the Cubs is a conflict of interest and is "indefensible."

The Tribune doesn't censor Rogers. Rather, it lets him print such statements in order to give the appearance of being "fair and balanced." (Oops, did I just violate copyright?)

Originally posted by Lip Man 1
How do you account for the fact that the sports editor of the Tribune Dan McGrath, is a South Side Sox fan who went to St. Leo high school and that other confirmed Sox fans who work for the Tribune are Bob Vanderberg the assistant sports editor who has written three books on the team, Paul Sullivan and Melissa Issacson?

Umm, that being a Cubs fan is not a prerequisite for being hired on by Tribune Company, although I doubt that these folks wore Sox hats to their interviews to be hired on at the Trib.

Originally posted by Lip Man 1
How do you account for the fact that Rich King of WGN-TV sports is a former Sox announcer and a lifetime Sox fan?

See answer above. Rich King has a reasonably attractive TV face and personality with impressive credentials and experience who worked his way up to that position. He probably was the most qualified for the job, but again, I bet he didn't come into his interview with WGN with a Sox mug filled with Sox Kool-Aid.

Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Seems to me if the Tribune wants to hire media people to promote "their" team they are doing it in a very strange way.....

Doesn't seem at all strange to me, Lip. The decisions that their editors make clearly are pro-Cubs. In 2003, when both teams did well (before the Sox collapse in September), the Cubs got more coverage. In 1999, 2001 and 2002, when neither team seriously challenged for a playoff spot, the Cubs got more coverage. But when the Sox clearly were the better team, in 2000, when they had the best record in the AL and the Cubs were under .500, the Sox should have gotten more coverage than the Cubs, right? Wrong.

Originally posted by Lip Man 1
The fact is that the Tribune Company can't wait for the Sox to do something because it means higher ratings on WGN-TV and more papers sold. They can also charge higher advertising rates. In short, Sox success means the Tribune Company makes more money.

They'd LOVE to see the Sox win something.

Sox fans on the staff of the Trib probably would want the Sox to win. Sox success probably would mean more individual copy sales at newsstands.

But in the corporate offices -- where the decisions are made, where the demographics are calculated and the money is counted -- those people want a monopoly on the market. They want each and every division of their company to achieve utter dominance and to eliminate any and all competition. If I were CEO, I would want ruthless and bloodthirsty monopolists running my company, seeking to destroy the competition so I could charge as much as I wanted for my product, whether its newspapers or bleacher tickets. These are the sharks who want the Sox to suck, move or be folded, because they think that they would be able to convert those few remaining Sox fans into loyal Cubs consumers. Besides, then they could show more episodes of Smallville, Charles Bronson movies and tributes to Darren Baker on WGN instead of Sox games.

Lip, don't take offense. I'm not implicating the journalists who work for the Tribune or the profession of journalism. I'm attacking the accountants, bureaucrats and mercantilists who run Tribune Co.

Frater Perdurabo
01-30-2004, 09:22 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Just because your Workers are Sox Fans, DOESNT mean
the Boss is a Sox Fan. Cubs have it great right now.
they do minimal work for a shoddy product that sells Itself
because the ONLY OTHER COMPETITOR in their Market is
too busy shooting themselves in the Foot for the last 22 years.

Hangar, as usual you put succinctly what it takes me a novela to explain. You are spot-on.