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View Full Version : A full comparison of the Royals, White Sox and Twins


MRKARNO
01-14-2004, 04:07 PM
Let's just compare the three AL Central Rivals by Position:

Pos. White Sox Royals Twins Advantage
C Olivo Santiago Mauer Royals.
1B Konerko Sweeny Mientkiewicz Royals
2B Harris Relaford Rivas Push
SS Valentin Berrora Guzman Royals w/Sox right behind
3B Crede Randa Koskie Twins
LF Lee Guiel Stewart Sox w/Twins right behind
CF Rowand Beltran Hunter Royals
RF Maggs Gonzalez Jones White Sox
DH Thomas LeCroy Harvey White Sox
SP1 Buehrle Anderson Radke White Sox
SP2 Loaiza May Santana Twins w/White Sox right Behind
SP3 Garland Appier Lohse Sox=Twins
SP4 Schoenweis Affeldt Helling? Royals, or if blisters are an issue, Push
SP5 TBD TBD TBD No way to tell
CP Koch MacDougal Nathan/FA? Twins
RP1 Marte Carrasco Pulido White Sox
RP2 Wright Leskanic Romero Royals
RP3 Wunsch Grimsley Rincon White Sox

Quite Honestly, there is no way to say that the White Sox are out of it, especially if we can get 2 starters to emerge from that list of about 7 to be our 4th and 5th starters, but all of the contenders in our division have 4th and 5th starter problems. If anyone here thinks that the Sox are out of it, they are crazy. I still think the sox are the favorites to win the division, but the team is not as talented as last year unless the current young pitching crop can produce any positive results. You're kidding yourself if you think the other teams in the division are significantly stronger than the sox. The real problem is that our expectations have been raised based on what happened one frightful october 2003 on the other side of town, but the truth is that we have as good of a chance to play in the playoffs in 2004 as they do. If we're in the race, the White Sox do have the resources necessary to swing a trade to get a key player to put us over the hump if need be. Kenny has stated this.

I really think that everyone here will be surprised when they see that we have a good team.

poorme
01-14-2004, 04:13 PM
The Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, A's, and Mariners the the real competition.

MRKARNO
01-14-2004, 04:27 PM
Originally posted by poorme
The Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, A's, and Mariners the the real competition.

Are you indicating that we are bound to make the playoffs?

hold2dibber
01-14-2004, 04:58 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Quite Honestly, there is no way to say that the White Sox are out of it, especially if we can get 2 starters to emerge from that list of about 7 to be our 4th and 5th starters, but all of the contenders in our division have 4th and 5th starter problems. If anyone here thinks that the Sox are out of it, they are crazy. I still think the sox are the favorites to win the division, but the team is not as talented as last year unless the current young pitching crop can produce any positive results. You're kidding yourself if you think the other teams in the division are significantly stronger than the sox. The real problem is that our expectations have been raised based on what happened one frightful october 2003 on the other side of town, but the truth is that we have as good of a chance to play in the playoffs in 2004 as they do. If we're in the race, the White Sox do have the resources necessary to swing a trade to get a key player to put us over the hump if need be. Kenny has stated this.

I really think that everyone here will be surprised when they see that we have a good team.

I largely agree with your position by position analysis, but I don't agree that the sum of the parts for the sox = the whole of the other teams. I simply don't think the Sox roster is well-constructed. For example, the Sox are lacking a lead off hitter. They have no one who can get on base at a half-decent clip at the top of the order. Second, they're extremely right handed. Third, the Sox are paper thin in the rotation. I think the Sox would be more devastated that the other teams by an injury of a top starter. And finally, as we have seen for the last few years, the Sox players as a whole have no stones. Maybe Ozzie can change this, but that's a tall order.

I'm not saying the Sox are out of contention - they could win 85 games and that could be enough to win this pathetic division. But they also could implode and win 75 games. And the frustrating thing is, it wouldn't have taken much money or brilliance to have made the Sox the team to beat in the division. There were plenty of guys out there for the taking who could have plugged some holes and made the Sox the odds on favorite. But the Sox have sat on their hands all winter and missed out on opportunity after opportunity. I'm not without hope - but I'm disgusted nonetheless.

MRKARNO
01-14-2004, 06:59 PM
The biggest issue in my opinion, is the lack of any consistant 1-5 starting rotation on each team. The team which gets the most consistancy will be waaaay ahead of the other teams. None of these 3 teams has their 4 and 5 starters truly set in stone, so the one which resolves this issue the quickest, will come out to an early lead, but the royals taught us all about how unimportant early leads can be.

PaleHoseGeorge
01-14-2004, 07:03 PM
There is a good reason why we play in the A.L. Norris Division. Even the best teams are only mediocre. I want to win the division and take a chance at reaching glory in the playoffs, but I'll be damned pissed if we go 3 and out against another team that is clearly superior to the second-rate product this outfit cranks out.

doublem23
01-14-2004, 07:34 PM
IMO, the Sox may be neck and neck with Kansas City and Minnesota on paper, but I really believe that they have the best potential in the division and need the fewest things to fall their way to have a really good year. There are a lot of "ifs," but if several of them turn out, they could be a good team.

Whitesox029
01-14-2004, 07:59 PM
Originally posted by poorme
The Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, A's, and Mariners the the real competition.
sorry about that last post I messed it up--

I will regret saying this, but I don't think the A's or Angels are going anywhere this year. Colon and Guerrero are impressive in Anaheim, but I don't think that's enough to get past Seattle. As for the A's they lost a load of talent in Foulke and Tejada, which almost offsets the Zito-Mulder-Hudson factor. This is not to say, of course, that these teams won't beat up on the Sox as they perenially do; they will do that undoubtedly. I'm just saying I don't think these are playoff teams this year. I'm picking Boston and Seattle with NY as Wild Card and my guess is as good as yours as to the Sox division.

Daver
01-14-2004, 08:09 PM
Originally posted by Whitesox029
sorry about that last post I messed it up--



I fixed it.

BKozi
01-14-2004, 08:11 PM
Originally posted by poorme
The Yankees, Red Sox, Angels, A's, and Mariners the the real competition.

Don't forget about the Orioles either. I agree with some of the other posters on 2 points:

1. There is a hell of a lot more to determining a better team than a player-by-player analysis. Look at the Mets last year as a prime example of that. If you don't have team chemistry or "key" components (like a lead-off hitter, the ability to move a guy over, an inning's eating pitcher, a reliable closer, etc.), it doesn't matter how much talent your best players have.

2. Even if we do manage to come out of the Central (which I don't think that we have a chance to right now), we have no chance against the winners of the east and west. Winning in a weak division doesn't mean that you have a good team.

Whitesox029
01-14-2004, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by Daver
I fixed it.

fun stuff. I didn't know you could delete them.

MRKARNO
01-14-2004, 09:25 PM
Originally posted by BKozi

2. Even if we do manage to come out of the Central (which I don't think that we have a chance to right now), we have no chance against the winners of the east and west. Winning in a weak division doesn't mean that you have a good team.

Why not? The Cubs were the worst division winner in all of baseball and squeaked out a win by one game. Once they got there, they ended up with home field advantage in the NLCS. They were 5 outs away from the series. My real concern is getting to the playoffs before we start worrying who we're gonna beat or lose to, but if you get hot in Late september, it doesnt really matter. Just ask the Marlins

Eddie Gaedel
01-15-2004, 08:06 AM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Why not? The Cubs were the worst division winner in all of baseball and squeaked out a win by one game. Once they got there, they ended up with home field advantage in the NLCS. They were 5 outs away from the series. My real concern is getting to the playoffs before we start worrying who we're gonna beat or lose to, but if you get hot in Late september, it doesnt really matter. Just ask the Marlins

i agree with all you've said in this thread. thanks for the positivity. it's rare around here these days.

hold2dibber
01-15-2004, 08:22 AM
Originally posted by BKozi
Don't forget about the Orioles either.

The Orioles don't do a thing for me, despite their off season activity. The Blue Jays, I think, made much greater strides and I would be absolutely shockified if they didn't finish ahead of the O's in the standings.

jeremyb1
01-15-2004, 11:11 AM
I think I'd take Jose over Berroa. Their numbers were similar but Jose was allowed to bat against lefties too often last season and his defense is pretty stellar.

jeremyb1
01-15-2004, 11:18 AM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
For example, the Sox are lacking a lead off hitter. They have no one who can get on base at a half-decent clip at the top of the order. Second, they're extremely right handed. Third, the Sox are paper thin in the rotation. I think the Sox would be more devastated that the other teams by an injury of a top starter. And finally, as we have seen for the last few years, the Sox players as a whole have no stones. Maybe Ozzie can change this, but that's a tall order.

I think being "too righthanded" is strongly overrated. The key shouldn't be whether you have a lot of lefthanded or righthanded hitters in your lineup but whether you have a lot of players that only hit right handed pitching or a lot of players than only hit lefties well. If you look at our stats from last season, we were 3rd in the league in OPS against lefties and 6th in the league against righties so you're not looking at a club that was shut down simply by marching a lefthanded pitcher out there.

As far as rotation depth goes, our depth isn't outstanding by any means but it will hold up compared to the other teams in the division. The Twins no longer have the depth of a Santana calliber starter in the pen. We now have Person, Rauch, and Cotts in the mix for the fifth starters spot. By midseason there's a possibility Honel could be called up if we're willing to rush him some. The Twins and Royals aren't bursting with young pitchers reading to step in to their starting rotations if someone goes down by any means. We're in more trouble if we lose a top starter because the top of our rotation is much better than the Twins or Royals but I don't see that as a huge problem.