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DirtySouthsider
01-12-2004, 07:57 PM
This is just a thought......given that the Sox play in the AL Central, which is a weak divison that they have a realistic chance of winning. Do you think it is possible that he is going into the season with what he has and would rather wait until the June trading deadline to make his moves/add payroll and fill the needs they have?

In any other division I would think that is crazy but given the way the AL Central is shaping up it may not be a bad idea. The current roster matches up very well with the Royals even though the Sox have done nothing at all.

I know this isn't a way a team should go about thier business.....but let's remember....we are Sox fans.

If KW could pull off the moves like he did last June it could work out.

tlebar318
01-12-2004, 08:30 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
This is just a thought......given that the Sox play in the AL Central, which is a weak divison that they have a realistic chance of winning. Do you think it is possible that he is going into the season with what he has and would rather wait until the June trading deadline to make his moves/add payroll and fill the needs they have?

In any other division I would think that is crazy but given the way the AL Central is shaping up it may not be a bad idea. The current roster matches up very well with the Royals even though the Sox have done nothing at all.

I know this isn't a way a team should go about thier business.....but let's remember....we are Sox fans.

If KW could pull off the moves like he did last June it could work out.

I am as optimistic as the next Sox fan BUT that said I think KW's hands are tied by the budget...I guess we have to hope we are the next Florida Marlins or Anaheim Angels of 2 years ago--I like Cinderella Stories but being a fan for 38 years I am getting a bit old for fairy tales--JR open the wallet and increase the budget PLEASE!! Beer me! :gulp:

MRKARNO
01-12-2004, 09:02 PM
I think KW will spend if we are doing well enough to potentially win the division

ChiWhiteSox1337
01-12-2004, 09:05 PM
the only spending kw will be doing during the season IMHO is with prospects just like last season because of the new MLB salary cap.

CubKilla
01-12-2004, 11:20 PM
KW has no plan. This is the GM responsible for Botch, Ritchie, K-layton, Barry/Berry, and Paniagua..... to name a few. His bad moves have outweighed the good (Marte, Colon, etc.) moves. Couple KW with an owner like JR and you have White Sox baseball irrelevancy in Chicago by 2005.

Hangar18
01-12-2004, 11:42 PM
Originally posted by CubKilla
KW has no plan. This is the GM responsible for Botch, Ritchie, K-layton, Barry/Berry, and Paniagua..... to name a few. His bad moves have outweighed the good (Marte, Colon, etc.) moves. Couple KW with an owner like JR and you have White Sox baseball irrelevancy in Chicago by 2005.

What an Excellent Post. Kenny could be an OK GM, But Pairing him with this STUPID OWNER exposes all his weaknesses

dmcgarry
01-12-2004, 11:43 PM
Replace Konerko with Erstad

Trade Magglio/Valentin for Nomar/Damon/Williamson

LAST YEAR

C M. Olivo
1B F. Thomas
2B R. Alomar
3B J. Crede
SS J. Valentin
LF C. Lee
CF W. Harris
RF M. Ordonez
DH C. Everett


THIS YEAR


C M. Olivo
1B F. Thomas
2B-------------------JUAN URIBE
3B J. Crede
SS-------------------NOMAR GARCIAPARRA
LF C. Lee
CF ----------------- JOHNNY DAMON
RF-------------------DARIN ERSTAD
DH ??????(Harris, blech)


line up


Damon
Uribe
Garciaparra
Thomas
Lee
Erstad
Crede
Olivio
Harris


looks pretty good

voodoochile
01-13-2004, 12:28 AM
Originally posted by CubKilla
KW has no plan. This is the GM responsible for Botch, Ritchie, K-layton, Barry/Berry, and Paniagua..... to name a few. His bad moves have outweighed the good (Marte, Colon, etc.) moves. Couple KW with an owner like JR and you have White Sox baseball irrelevancy in Chicago by 2005.

I disagree. KW's plan is as follows:

1)Do nothing except let players leave during the off season.
2)Hype the newly redone USCF
3)Put his head in the sand and hope the media gives him a pass
4)Schedule Soxfest for SB weekend so the press won't be paying any attention and most of the really heavy hitters will be out of town.
5)Hope those kids they were talking about a few years ago really can play and then get really really lucky.
6)Thank God every night that the Sox are in the ALC.
7)Brown nose JR on a weekly basis.

voodoochile
01-13-2004, 12:30 AM
Originally posted by dmcgarry
Replace Konerko with Erstad

Trade Magglio/Valentin for Nomar/Damon/Williamson

...

looks pretty good

Hey, Welcome Aboard! :D:

chosk8
01-13-2004, 08:21 AM
Nice article in the USA Today, today...

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al/2004-01-13-albeat_x.htm

The last comment by Williams says it all
"There is a sense of panic on the streets of Chicago as they watched all our free agents leave," Williams said. "We built a team to win last season, and we didn't finish it off. Now, it's time to regroup."

KingXerxes
01-13-2004, 09:31 AM
I wonder what he means by "regroup"?

I don't think KW is all that bad of a GM (he's not that great either), but that last quote illustrates what I can't stand about the guy. When he speaks, he uses words and terms specifically designed to leave himself wiggle room no matter what happens. A few months ago, we were going to go out and get "grinders". Did anybody know what that meant back then? Have we gotten any "grinders"? Are we going to get any "grinders"?

Now we need to "regroup". Does that mean the "grinders" plan is now dead, or is "regrouping" all part of the "grinders acquisition plan"?

It seems that his #1 priority is always to position himself in a nebulous fashion so as not to be ever held accountable for anything.

:reinsy

"He's a quick learner."

Irishlawyer
01-13-2004, 09:48 AM
from article: ""We were outbid on every single corner."

Was he outbid on Alomar?

MisterB
01-13-2004, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by KingXerxes
I wonder what he means by "regroup"?

I believe 'regroup' is the half-assed middle ground between 'reload' and 'rebuild'.

There was a column I read somewhere shortly after the season which stated that, based on the Sox makeup at that point, they should either spend the cash to add some good FA's for a last shot at a pennant with the current nucleus, or completely tear the roster apart and start the next youth movement (i.e. either 'reload' or 'rebuild') and that anything inbetween would be a disaster. KW's actions so far indicate that neither will happen ('regroup').

CubKilla
01-13-2004, 10:28 AM
Originally posted by MisterB
I believe 'regroup' is the half-assed middle ground between 'reload' and 'rebuild'.

When idiots run the Organization, this is what happens. It should be one or the other for the better of the team. I believe if this current crop of White Sox were in any other division besides the AL Central, you'd see a rebuilding. Since we're in the crappiest division in baseball, JR and KW are lying to themselves hoping for a 1st Place finish in the worst division in baseball and clinging to the hope that anything can happen in the playoffs. Considering the Central will never be the division of the WildCard in '04 so the White Sox will probably have to face either the NYY or BOS, I'd say advancing in the '04 Playoffs, if this team is fortunate enough to qualify, at least on paper, is slim and none.

chisoxmike
01-13-2004, 11:38 AM
:angry: The way I see it:

KW doesn't have a plan. He's going to sit back this offseason and wait and see. Which, I don't really have a problem with. Looking at the team going into Spring Training you still have (hopefully) Thomas, Maggs, Lee, Paulie, and you need Loaiza to have a 15-20 win season, same from Buehrle. I expect Garland to have the same year he did in '03. And who knows about the fouth and fifth starters.

I'm psyched about the Valentin to Uribe to Konerko double play combo. (You can't hear my condinsending voice)

But it dones't look REALLY bad. If they don't do well this season, for once they won't underachieve. One thing I do know is that KW will not stand around and wait for this team to get hot. By the all-star break and end of July, if our White Sox are more than six games out, I expect a fire sale, and no big trades like last season.

-mike

Lip Man 1
01-13-2004, 12:38 PM
Gang:

Again I have to go back to Guillen's hiring / press conference and mention that Ozzie used the word 'kids,' at least three times in it.

At the time I raised my eyebrows wondering if it meant something.

At this point it looks like Ozzie perhaps might have been given some hints by ownership that this could happen.

It looks like this is the immediate future for the club especially if they get off to a mediocre start and can't draw fans due to an off season of inactivity.

As far as a 'plan...' Well the plan for myself is to outlive Uncle Jerry
who turns 68 next month.


Lip

Hangar18
01-13-2004, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1

At this point it looks like Ozzie perhaps might have been given some hints by ownership that this could happen.

It looks like this is the immediate future for the club especially if they get off to a mediocre start and can't draw fans due to an off season of inactivity.

As far as a 'plan...' Well the plan for myself is to outlive Uncle Jerry
who turns 68 next month.
Lip

If they " REBUILD" one more time, It could be my last straw....

Dub25
01-13-2004, 04:02 PM
Originally posted by chosk8
Nice article in the USA Today, today...

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/al/2004-01-13-albeat_x.htm

The last comment by Williams says it all

The article says Sox need Loaiza to repeat 21 win season and Robert Person to come back from elbow surgury. Did KW quietly slide one past us and sign another broken down pitcher? Not sure what color to put that in so take it for what it's worth.

JDP
01-13-2004, 04:45 PM
Ownership Creed:

Put the cheapest product possible on the field and try to stay in "contention" in a weak division.

mdep524
01-13-2004, 04:57 PM
Originally posted by MisterB
I believe 'regroup' is the half-assed middle ground between 'reload' and 'rebuild'.

There was a column I read somewhere shortly after the season which stated that, based on the Sox makeup at that point, they should either spend the cash to add some good FA's for a last shot at a pennant with the current nucleus, or completely tear the roster apart and start the next youth movement (i.e. either 'reload' or 'rebuild') and that anything inbetween would be a disaster. KW's actions so far indicate that neither will happen ('regroup').

I TOTALLY agree. That sums up my thinking exactly.

bc2k
01-13-2004, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by MisterB
There was a column I read somewhere shortly after the season which stated that, based on the Sox makeup at that point, they should either spend the cash to add some good FA's for a last shot at a pennant with the current nucleus, or completely tear the roster apart and start the next youth movement (i.e. either 'reload' or 'rebuild')

Those are the two paths I also envisioned for the '04 Sox. Either one makes sense. We have to ask ourselves what motivation does JR have in not following either path: profit.

If he reloads with FAs, attendance would most likely rise but he would have to spend money on the FAs; if he rebuilds, he would most likely see a drop in attendance and a profit loss. But because of the weak ALC, JR can maximize profits by putting a cost-efficient, semi-competitive team that will stay near first place all year and thus keeping attendance at its higher end.