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View Full Version : Wow--> Vlad to the Angels!


mdep524
01-10-2004, 11:08 PM
Where did THIS come from??

http://www.newsday.com/sports/ny-mets0111,0,5641377.story?coll=ny-sports-headlines

5 years, $70 million. The Angels are really spending like crazy this off season. It's got to be pretty exciting in Anaheim right now.

Huisj
01-10-2004, 11:13 PM
ESPN was right on the ball again. they said florida would sign him.

article, sorry ESPN (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1704992)

ChiWhiteSox1337
01-10-2004, 11:17 PM
It has to suck to be an O's fan. I don't see them finishing ahead of Toronto without vlad. I'm suprised too because I remember everyone thought the Angels were out of the running for vlad after they signed Colon.

DrCrawdad
01-10-2004, 11:39 PM
Vlad will earn about $12 million next year. Magglio will earn $14 million next year.

Is Magglio worth $2 million more? How much over $12 million a year is Magglio looking to earn?

MRKARNO
01-10-2004, 11:46 PM
Originally posted by DrCrawdad
Vlad will earn about $12 million next year. Magglio will earn $14 million next year.

Is Magglio worth $2 million more? How much over $12 million a year is Magglio looking to earn?

Vlad is still getting on average 14 million a year. Maggs should not get Vlad money, but about 2 million a year less. a 4 year deal worth 50 million would not be out of line in my opinion, but Maggs will obviously want more. But will he sign an in-season extension? or has he already said he wont?

DrCrawdad
01-10-2004, 11:54 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Vlad is still getting on average 14 million a year. Maggs should not get Vlad money, but about 2 million a year less. a 4 year deal worth 50 million would not be out of line in my opinion, but Maggs will obviously want more. But will he sign an in-season extension? or has he already said he wont?

DUH! I guess I should use a calculator for advanced math like this (70 divided by 5).

But you're right and my question would just be changed to, Is Magglio worth the same amount as Vlad?

chisox06
01-11-2004, 12:01 AM
Originally posted by DrCrawdad
Vlad will earn about $12 million next year. Magglio will earn $14 million next year.

Is Magglio worth $2 million more? How much over $12 million a year is Magglio looking to earn?

Is Mags worth 2 mil more than Vlad, of course not. What you have to take into consideration is that Vlad just signed while Mags is on the last year of his multi year deal. Times have changed, and players are being signed for less, there is no doubt about that. Blockbuster signings like the A-Rod deal are a thing of the past (at least for now) and Mags signed his contract when the market was at a much higher peak than it is now. When Mags signed he was probably worth about 14 mil, and if Vlad signed at the same time he would prolly be worth 16-17 mil. Mags wont make 14 mil next year for whoever he plays for, its just a sign of the changing economics of baseball.

DrCrawdad
01-11-2004, 12:08 AM
Originally posted by chisox06
Is Mags worth 2 mil more than Vlad, of course not. What you have to take into consideration is that Vlad just signed while Mags is on the last year of his multi year deal. Times have changed, and players are being signed for less, there is no doubt about that. Blockbuster signings like the A-Rod deal are a thing of the past (at least for now) and Mags signed his contract when the market was at a much higher peak than it is now. When Mags signed he was probably worth about 14 mil, and if Vlad signed at the same time he would prolly be worth 16-17 mil. Mags wont make 14 mil next year for whoever he plays for, its just a sign of the changing economics of baseball.

It seems to me that Maggs thinks he'll make more than that.

chisox06
01-11-2004, 12:14 AM
Originally posted by DrCrawdad
It seems to me that Maggs thinks he'll make more than that.

I agree, but I think he's in for a surprise, much like the wide array of free agents over the past 2 years.

Champ Summers
01-11-2004, 12:27 AM
This means that Erstad will be playing 1B, no more Konerko to the Angels thoughts...

StillMissOzzie
01-11-2004, 01:16 AM
This means that the Orioles will take all of that cash they were offering Vlad and throw it at Ponson instead, and it will be more than JR and KW are willing to spend. sigh...


SMO
:angry:

VeeckAsInWreck
01-11-2004, 04:36 AM
Originally posted by StillMissOzzie
This means that the Orioles will take all of that cash they were offering Vlad and throw it at Ponson instead, and it will be more than JR and KW are willing to spend. sigh...


SMO
:angry:

Me thinks the O's will be just fine. If this article is correct.

I-Rod may go to Baltimore after all. Read it here. (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=fanball-oriolespudgeasbackup&prov=fanball&type=lgns)

Dan Gelo
01-11-2004, 04:56 AM
I'm not quite sure the money was the reason he turned down KW and JR's offer. I'm sure besides his wife there are other reasons. (Insert negative things here)

jabrch
01-11-2004, 06:49 AM
This just doesn't make sense to me. Nomar wants to come to California. He is a FA next year. Why would Anaheim lock up so much $ on Vlad when they have 4 OF/DHs already and havethe opportunity to get Nomar either now or next year?

Garrett Anderson, Vlad, Erstadt, Jose Guillen and Salmon? I guess Erstadt can play 1B, but then which OF moves to CF? Vlad? GA? Guillen? It seems like a strange move. (sour grapes I guess that Anaheim can afford to get all these top tier FAs and we are stuck holding our Uribe.

T-Bag
01-11-2004, 07:38 AM
This means that Erstad will be playing 1B, no more Konerko to the Angels thoughts...

Why have the Angels been talking about moving Erstad to 1st so much? I love watching that dude play CF........I guess to keep him from getting hurt????

Angels are showing how to run a baseball team over there, WOW!!

jabrch
01-11-2004, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by T-Bag
Why have the Angels been talking about moving Erstad to 1st so much? I love watching that dude play CF........I guess to keep him from getting hurt????

Angels are showing how to run a baseball team over there, WOW!!

Now tell me who plays CF? I mean that seriously - as I have no idea. Guillen? I guess Garrett Anderson - and Vlad plays right? Seems strange - when they needed a SS so badly that they would tie long term money into Vlad.

Deadguy
01-11-2004, 09:17 AM
Originally posted by jabrch
Now tell me who plays CF? I mean that seriously - as I have no idea. Guillen? I guess Garrett Anderson - and Vlad plays right? Seems strange - when they needed a SS so badly that they would tie long term money into Vlad.

If you have a chance to get a player like Vlad, why not go for it?

My guess is that Anderson plays CF.

poorme
01-11-2004, 10:29 AM
Must be nice to be a fan of a major league team...

gosox41
01-11-2004, 11:38 AM
Originally posted by Deadguy
If you have a chance to get a player like Vlad, why not go for it?

My guess is that Anderson plays CF.


Here's my idea. Assuming Ordonez is traded for Williamson and Nomar. Nomar is then traded to the Dodgers for Perez, Mota and one of their 2 top pitching prospects.

The next part of the equation depends on Erstad's contract status. If this is the last year of his contract which I think pays him roughly $8 mill, then I'd trade PK + mid level pitching prospect for Erstad adn Washburn.

Now keep in mind I think Erstad is a waste. But if this is the last year of his contract, then he is cheaper then PK. Also, the Angles have a glut of SP's and may look to move a pricey one to save on payroll. We've all heard the Washburn rumors..

This deal basically is a swap of garbage for garbage + a SP. It's even better if Erstad's contract is up after 2004. The key is to get a SP. Having Washburn and Odalis Perez is much of an improvement over what they have now.

Having Mota and Williamson to go along with Marte, Wunsch, Schoeneweis and Politte isn't so bad either.

Bob

mdep524
01-11-2004, 11:39 AM
Originally posted by Champ Summers
This means that Erstad will be playing 1B, no more Konerko to the Angels thoughts...

True, there is no way the Angels will take Konerko now (not that they would have anyway), but this leaves the door open for the Sox to acquire Washburn on the cheap. A lot of sources, even the clairvoyant Peter Gammons, are reporting the Angels want to save a bit of money by unloading Washburn or Ortiz from their surplus of starters. I bet the Sox could get Washburn (I'm not interested in Ortiz at all) for a mid level prospect or two.

jabrch
01-11-2004, 11:43 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
Here's my idea. Assuming Ordonez is traded for Williamson and Nomar. Nomar is then traded to the Dodgers for Perez, Mota and one of their 2 top pitching prospects.

The next part of the equation depends on Erstad's contract status. If this is the last year of his contract which I think pays him roughly $8 mill, then I'd trade PK + mid level pitching prospect for Erstad adn Washburn.

Now keep in mind I think Erstad is a waste. But if this is the last year of his contract, then he is cheaper then PK. Also, the Angles have a glut of SP's and may look to move a pricey one to save on payroll. We've all heard the Washburn rumors..

This deal basically is a swap of garbage for garbage + a SP. It's even better if Erstad's contract is up after 2004. The key is to get a SP. Having Washburn and Odalis Perez is much of an improvement over what they have now.

Having Mota and Williamson to go along with Marte, Wunsch, Schoeneweis and Politte isn't so bad either.

Bob

Hey Bob! I went to my fantasy baseball page and looked for the accept button for that set of trades you are talking about, and it wasn't there!

:)

I'd do it in a heartbeat - but I don't quite see either Boston or Anaheim getting fooled by Kenny Williams. Theo is very careful and I don't see Anaheim falling so hard for PK that they'd give us Washburn to swap PK/Erstadt. I also don't know that LA will trade either Jackson or Miller. Evans is dumb enough to do it, but he is under a lot of pressure not to. Maybe now that Anaheim got Vlad there will be more pressure to make a move.

TheRockinMT
01-11-2004, 11:58 AM
I think it is becoming quite apparent that if Jerry Reinsdorf wants to commit the dollars then the Sox can afford to re-sign Maggs to a long term contract. What the market just showed with Vlad is that his price ahould be about what we are paying him now. However, if Maggs wants more than $12 to $14M I have to believe there is a team out there, the usual suspects that is, willing to give it to him.

gosox41
01-11-2004, 12:08 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
Hey Bob! I went to my fantasy baseball page and looked for the accept button for that set of trades you are talking about, and it wasn't there!

:)

I'd do it in a heartbeat - but I don't quite see either Boston or Anaheim getting fooled by Kenny Williams. Theo is very careful and I don't see Anaheim falling so hard for PK that they'd give us Washburn to swap PK/Erstadt. I also don't know that LA will trade either Jackson or Miller. Evans is dumb enough to do it, but he is under a lot of pressure not to. Maybe now that Anaheim got Vlad there will be more pressure to make a move.

I don't think either trade is that lopsided. All of them were based on rumors heard here. The Red Sox rumor came directly from Otis, and he was right on the first time. He even said the Sox would forward Nomar to the Dodgers.

As for the PK to the Angles, it's a good deal for them because:
1. They save salary which they want to do
2. If PK rebounds he is better then Erstad offensively.
3. Angles would get a mid-level pitching prospect.

I don't think it's that unfair for the Angels. Since they want to dump payroll they need to realize they're not going to get fair value in talent for their players

Bob

duke of dorwood
01-11-2004, 12:10 PM
Even if we resign Maggs, we have not made ANY improvements from last year. The ball is in the Dodgers court-unless they are dead from the neck up like our ownership-they have to counter the big moves made by a local competing team.

ma-gaga
01-11-2004, 02:06 PM
So does anyone know WHEN Magglio signed his deal? Was it a 4 year deal??

It seems like that was the logical time for him, and that means that he was paid an average of $8.3MM a year over the last 4 years. That's not too bad, and it's what people should really be looking at for his salary if we're trying to compare players. Here's (http://www.baseball-reference.com/o/ordonma01.shtml) where I got the info (at the bottom of the page).

On topic, I'm shocked that Vlad only got $70MM. I figured he'd get a six year deal from someone. Hot damn, the Angels got a good deal if this is the case.

lowesox
01-11-2004, 02:13 PM
I think this signing will be very good news for us White Sox fans. Now that Vlad's off the market, I wouldn't be surprised if a few teams start inquiring about Ordonez. Maybe the Orioles? Or the Mets?

Also, if Vlad's making 14 a year, the other GMs will know that Maggs will be crazy to ask for anything more than that when he's a FA.

longshot7
01-11-2004, 04:26 PM
Man, do I love Arte Moreno!! I may even get season tix this year.

But you're right (to whoever said that they'll be looking to unload Washburn or Ortiz. Jarrod would be worth it - Ortiz is very erratic.

The thing that needs bearing out is how much bigger a market is Orange County than Chicago - imo the difference is nearly zip. why don't we have a $90 mil payroll? Only JR knows for sure.

Hangar18
01-11-2004, 08:33 PM
Originally posted by mdep524
Where did THIS come from??
5 years, $70 million. The Angels are really spending like crazy this off season. It's got to be pretty exciting in Anaheim right now.

Yeah.....Filling Holes on Your Team, showing your Fans you
really Care About Winning will do that. 100% of the time
it energizes your FanBase. The Sox however are being
trailblazers, throwing the Proverbial Brick thru the Window Of the theory that Showing-Your-Fans-You-Care-By-Keeping-and-
Acquiring-Players. They are daring.....letting key players go, Handcuffing themselves with a Payroll that certainly will not let them Keep/Acquire key players, thus De-Energizing the FanBase.
Way To Go Sox, Trailblazer Organization of the Year. Show Future Owners how to NOT get to the World Series AND for good measure, Alienate your own fans

Hangar18
01-11-2004, 08:35 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
Man, do I love Arte Moreno!! I may even get season tix this year.
why don't we have a $90 mil payroll? Only JR knows for sure.

Art Moreno. I like him too already ..... wants to win.
and Backs up what he says. Wouldnt it be awesome, he gets to the WS in his first 3 yrs, shows Uncle Jerry how its done.
This is the same Art Moreno WHO LOWERED BEER PRICES!
What a Maverick!

ChiWhiteSox1337
01-11-2004, 10:01 PM
Why couldn't JR sell the team to Art Moreno?!?!?! :whiner:

jabrch
01-11-2004, 11:00 PM
or to Omar Moreno - or to Art Kushner? Or to Mark Cuban!

With Sox fans luck, he will sell it...TO BILL WIRTZ

CubKilla
01-12-2004, 12:38 AM
Originally posted by jabrch
With Sox fans luck, he will sell it...TO BILL WIRTZ

That's the day I say to hell with the White Sox :D: .

That's like a bad "Twilight Zone" episode.

Man Soo Lee
01-12-2004, 04:36 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
The next part of the equation depends on Erstad's contract status. If this is the last year of his contract which I think pays him roughly $8 mill, then I'd trade PK + mid level pitching prospect for Erstad adn Washburn.

Erstad's contract runs through '06.

After all the cash the Angels have spent, I don't see why they'd get cheap and dump Washburn. He's at least an average starter and probably better, their only lefty, and not making a huge sum for a starting pitcher.