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View Full Version : Radical idea = Give Konerko to LA for free


Frater Perdurabo
12-19-2003, 11:56 AM
Two biggest needs:

1. Field a team at their self-imposed payroll limit.

2. Pitching.

Two biggest problems:

1. Too many expensive right-handed hitters.

2. Big contracts.

If LA needs a bat and if the Sox really must stay under $58 million, then this subtraction would help. I don't care if the Sox get nothing in return. If it means the Sox can keep Maggs (and play Frank at 1B), they will be OK.

With only Buehrle, Frank and Konerko under contract for 2005, and if they can move Konerko's contract, they can afford to re-sign Maggs for market value (whatever that may be) at mid-season. This is re-loading rather than re-building. It also keeps the Sox very best player on the team long-term.

Meanwhile for 2004, use every available dollar for pitching.

Platoon Reed and Borchard in CF and at DH. This gets more lefties into the lineup. Neither may hit right away, but both will play better defense with better speed than any other CF on the Sox roster right now. LTP in particular may strike out a lot, but given the choice I'd rather have a .200 hitter who can play CF who strikes out a lot than a slow 1B who hits .200 (like for much of 2003) and hits into scores of double plays! A strikeout is much less of a negative than a double play, and CF is a much more important defensive position. It would be a wash if Reed and LTP together could just put up numbers like Konerko did in 2003, and this should not be unrealistic to expect. In fact, I expect that they would produce somewhat better numbers.

Put Uribe or Willie Harris at 2B. I don't care if the lineup isn't at the level to which we are accustomed. Lee, Thomas, Ordonez and Valentin will produce as needed, and Crede will improve. Either Reed or Harris leading off would not be ideal, but we have to deal with reality. <sigh>

Is this perfect? No. But we have an owner that is the opposite of perfect!

However, at least the Sox can field a team if they unload Konerko's contract!

voodoochile
12-19-2003, 11:58 AM
That presupposes that anyone will take him and his contract for nothing.

No guarantees on that one, IMO. The Sox would probably still have to pay part of his salary. PK is due over $17M these next two seasons.

That's a lot of money for a very average 1B even when he is hitting up to the standards he set before signing that contract.

poorme
12-19-2003, 12:00 PM
I think a fair offer would be $5 million plus Konerko for nothing in return.

Frater Perdurabo
12-19-2003, 12:04 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
That presupposes that anyone will take him and his contract for nothing.

No guarantees on that one, IMO. The Sox would probably still have to pay part of his salary. PK is due over $17M these next two seasons.

That's a lot of money for a very average 1B even when he is hitting up to the standards he set before signing that contract.

But there were serious talks of a Konerko for Perez deal with LA, right? Maybe that asking price (Perez) was too high. So, find a career 32 year-old career minor league bullpen catcher and call it even.

Frater Perdurabo
12-19-2003, 12:05 PM
Originally posted by poorme
I think a fair offer would be $5 million plus Konerko for nothing in return.

I have $5 towards making this happen. Now I need one million friends to help out...

voodoochile
12-19-2003, 12:17 PM
Originally posted by Frater Perdurabo
But there were serious talks of a Konerko for Perez deal with LA, right? Maybe that asking price (Perez) was too high. So, find a career 32 year-old career minor league bullpen catcher and call it even.

I have no idea if those contract talks were serious or not. I thought he was a throw in on the Nomar deal to try and dump contract money.

soxfan26
12-19-2003, 12:27 PM
It's not so radical, I'm sure Dan Evans has thought of it.

They get Konerko and we get the bill, sounds like the only way to unload this guy.

maurice
12-19-2003, 03:19 PM
IIRC, George was advocating that the Sox should give Konerko away for free for most of last season.

OurBitchinMinny
12-19-2003, 09:50 PM
Yeah give him away for free. Thats a brilliant idea. The guy had an off year. You trade him away for nothing and watch him turn into a star in LA. He is one year removed from being all star and nearly winning MVP of the all star game. He deserves one more year. By all means trade him if you can get something decent in return, but dont give him away

PaleHoseGeorge
12-20-2003, 10:07 AM
Paul Konerko was *never* worth what the Sox offered him after the 2002 season. Even Konerko said so publicly. He was an all-star caliber ballplayer for exactly 3 months of his entire career. Thinking he is going to recapture lightning in a bottle and ever become worth $10 million is the kind of fantasy world thinking that would do proud any fan of the Lovable Losers.

The only good reason to keep Konerko around is to hope his value can be raised from its current depressed value. Platooning Konerko to strictly face lefthanders (who he can still hit) would be an effective way to trick some stupid GM into trading for him. Other than that he is the #1 financial albatross on a team that doesn't have any money to burn. WE'RE LOSING GOOD BALLPLAYERS BECAUSE OF KONERKO'S SALARY!

If Chairman Reinsdorf has decreed that $60 million is the top-end of his payroll, and we all agree that whining about his lack of commitment to winning is pointless, then we absolutely have to move Paul Konerko.

Trade him for nothing. We're miles ahead just for freeing up payroll.

TornLabrum
12-20-2003, 10:12 AM
The Dodgers would still probably want us to pick up his salary.

Brian26
12-20-2003, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by TornLabrum
The Dodgers would still probably want us to pick up his salary.

That's not an option. If we're going to have to pay him, we might as well keep him on the team. Like PHG said, hopefully he can put up some attractive numbers before we dump him (if it comes to that). I wouldn't give him away for free and pay his salary too. That makes no sense.

Deadguy
12-20-2003, 11:40 AM
Originally posted by Brian26
That's not an option. If we're going to have to pay him, we might as well keep him on the team. Like PHG said, hopefully he can put up some attractive numbers before we dump him (if it comes to that). I wouldn't give him away for free and pay his salary too. That makes no sense.

It makes sense if he's actually hurting the team, like he was for four out of six months last season.

The problem with high salaried players like Konerko is that no matter how much they are struggling, or hurting the team, you HAVE to play them, because there is no way to justify benching them when they are making 6+ million a year. You either have to invent an injury for them and put them on the DL, or just hope he turns it around.

Considering the fact that he ended the season in a 3-48 slump, there are no guarantees that he can turn it around, and he is never going to be someone we can rely on to contribute for an entire season.

If he had been remotely adequate the 1st half of the season, we might have actually won the division this year. At least when that scum bag Jamie Navarro was the worst pitcher in baseball, we were never really in contention (except for maybe 1997). GIDPK, however, fell flat on his face in a year where we needed him the most, and coincidentally enough, it comes a year after he received a fat contract.

I wonder if Konerko has even seen the inside of a gym in the past year.

He also prevents a future HOFer from playing a position where he hits better at, so just having him on the roster hurts us, and his production from last year is laughably easy to replace for less than a million dollars.

SoxOnTop
12-20-2003, 11:41 AM
Originally posted by Frater Perdurabo
I have $5 towards making this happen. Now I need one million friends to help out...

Interesting concept.

Could we, in fact, find 1 million Sox fans to send in $5 apiece to a WSI employee to hold and show Reinsy that there are many die-hard Sox fans out there? Our $5 Million could be used to publicly show JR that there are Sox fans willing to support the team if he is willing to put $$ into the team. This would be a very public showing and maybe back him into a corner. Our pledge would be that we put up, so now he has to put up.

I know this is absolute lunacy, but what if.......

hillbilly
12-20-2003, 12:24 PM
I wonder if Konerko has even seen the inside of a gym in the past year.

In fact, I played with Matt Herges' (relief pitcher for the giants i believe now) little brother for the past two years in college. When Herges and Konerko were both with the Dodgers organization, Herge said that PK was by far the laziest baseball player in the history of baseball. He said he would sit in a recliner and just down beers til the cows came home. I don't consider that means for turning around an extremely declining career. If he had Mickey Mantles talent that would work. :gulp:

Brian26
12-20-2003, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by hillbilly
Herge said that PK was by far the laziest baseball player in the history of baseball. He said he would sit in a recliner and just down beers til the cows came home.

Sounds like he's a fun guy to hang out with at the sports bar or watch wrestling payperviews with, at least.

SluggersAway
12-20-2003, 02:55 PM
Where is PK's fave bar?

Maybe we can go whip him into shape.

Does he live in ri in the off-season?

Brian26
12-20-2003, 06:30 PM
Originally posted by SluggersAway
Were is PK's fave bar?
Does he live in ri in the off-season?

Huh?

ri? Rhode Island?

Mountain Man
12-20-2003, 07:29 PM
Dumping him (Konerko) for nothing only makes sense *if* Jerry will use the $$ to go sign another FA. Which, I doubt he will. I would rather take a chance on Konerko as he gets closer to another contract year. If he is affected by the lazy gene, and the contract contributed to it, getting close to another winning lottery ticket payday could get him off the recliner and into a batting cage and gym.

As far as Frank playing 1st on a regular basis, I think the law of diminishing returns will kick in. His higher BA is partially explained by better hitting off of NL pitchers. I wouldn't mind seeing him play 50 to 60 games at 1st but being the everyday 1st baseman is not the answer. If Frank is playing 1st we need some bat to DH. With our loss of FAs I don;t think we have a good option on the bench right now.

There are a lot of holes to fill and most will need to be filled from outside the organization. I hope Kenny can get a couple things in place before too long.

Frater Perdurabo
12-20-2003, 08:01 PM
Originally posted by Mountain Man
As far as Frank playing 1st on a regular basis, I think the law of diminishing returns will kick in. His higher BA is partially explained by better hitting off of NL pitchers. I wouldn't mind seeing him play 50 to 60 games at 1st but being the everyday 1st baseman is not the answer. If Frank is playing 1st we need some bat to DH. With our loss of FAs I don;t think we have a good option on the bench right now.

Frank's superior #'s @ 1B are over his whole career, much of which came prior to interleague play. In 2004, Frank ought to play 1B four games per week. Not quite full time, but not exactly a platoon either. If Konerko could be unloaded, Frank could DH 2-3 times per week while Gload plays 1B. Maggs, Lee and Valentin could DH once per week each as well.

If both Reed and Borchard are promoted (and I'd promote them unless they completely suck in Tuscon), they can share CF and pick up additional ABs in left and right when Maggs and Lee DH. The two also could DH for more plate appearances when Maggs, Frank, Lee and Valentin all play the field. This also gets two more left-handed bats in the lineup (Reed and Borchard) and adds speed and good OF defense (better than Rowand or Carl Everett were in 2003, anyway). Their superior speed and defense in the outfield also helps the Sox pitchers by getting to more fly balls and allowing fewer extra-base hits to the gaps. Even if Reed and Borchard just replicate Konerko's 2003 numbers (and I think they could produce much better), the Sox will be better off with them patrolling the outfield.

With this arrangement, Ozzie could rotate players at DH without altering the lineup.

Mountain Man
12-21-2003, 09:21 AM
Good point regarding Frank's career numbers. I'm usually too quick to dismiss stats from more than a couple seasons ago. I still have a couple concerns:

Since Frank hasn't played the field in years, will he have the stamina and not burn out by September?

My last concern would be the potential for an injury. Frank hasn't played the field that much in years. I would be worried about injuries.

He is a well conditioned athlete, I would never fault him for that. I'm just worried at an age when many players are looking for a DH spot, he'd be heading out to the field.

Frank is the best hitter I've ever watched in person. In the mid 1990's, bars would become quiet when he stepped to the plate. He's a special athlete and a certain 2nd ballot HoF (not a media darling for 1st ballot)