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BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 01:50 PM
ESPN News just reported the deal will be done by 3:00 p.m. EST. It looks like a three way deal involving Maggs. Sounds like Nomar would be going to LA.

Brian26
12-17-2003, 01:51 PM
ARGH! Why are we trading Nomar right to LA? Ugh. If you get rid of Maggs for Nomar, you have to keep Nomar here.

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 01:52 PM
Did ESPN mention what we might be getting?

chisox06
12-17-2003, 01:52 PM
So right now all the sox have done is got rid of Mags, gonna be interesting to see what LA gives up

Tekijawa
12-17-2003, 01:54 PM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
Did ESPN mention what we might be getting?

If Nomar ends up in LA then we get to read two chapters in Billy Beanes next book completely devoted to how dumb KW is!

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 01:55 PM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
Did ESPN mention what we might be getting?

Nope, just said Maggs was involved in the three team trade. Deal was reported to be done by 3:00 p.m. EST. They are in meetings right now.

dickallen15
12-17-2003, 01:56 PM
A three way trade would be Texas, Boston, and the White Sox.

mandmandm
12-17-2003, 01:56 PM
Could it be that the three way involves Sox, Sox, and Rangers and Arod?

mandmandm
12-17-2003, 01:57 PM
You beat me DickA!

Kilroy
12-17-2003, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by Tekijawa
If Nomar ends up in LA then we get to read two chapters in Billy Beanes next book completely devoted to how dumb KW is!

Ask yourself if the Sox have much more of a chance at signing Nomar than they do of signing Maggs after this season. Its true that the Sox lose some "star power" not having Maggs or Nomar, but lets see how far the trades go towards making the Sox a competitor before we decide to hate them...

And that's if they even happen of course...

hold2dibber
12-17-2003, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by dickallen15
A three way trade would be Texas, Boston, and the White Sox.

Unless the A-Rod deal isn't done yet, and it's a Sox-Sox-Dodgers deal for Nomar/Maggs/LA Pitchers

Palehose13
12-17-2003, 01:58 PM
Originally posted by mandmandm
Could it be that the three way involves Sox, Sox, and Rangers and Arod?

That sounds most logical. Most people seem to be forgetting that Arod-Manny isn't official yet.

pearso66
12-17-2003, 02:00 PM
well the maggs to nomar deal wasn't gonna happen unless the A-rod manny deal happened. So to me it sounds like thats the 3 team trade

mandmandm
12-17-2003, 02:01 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
Unless the A-Rod deal isn't done yet, and it's a Sox-Sox-Dodgers deal for Nomar/Maggs/LA Pitchers

I do not think The Red Sox will pull the trigger until Arod is a done deal.

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 02:02 PM
Speaking of ESPN....................
They are currently televising a scrabble tournament. Its a little late for April fools, right?

DirtySouthsider
12-17-2003, 02:02 PM
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

I'm not sure if that is true???

pudge
12-17-2003, 02:04 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

I'm not sure if that is true???

I think I'm gonna be sick....

rdivaldi
12-17-2003, 02:05 PM
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

Actually the deal has us keeping Williamson. If this is true, we made out like bandits...

Jerko
12-17-2003, 02:05 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

I'm not sure if that is true???

So basically they will be trading Mags, Nomar and Williamson for a 3rd starter and a relief pitcher. Kind of the ONE deal I didn't want them to make. Oh well, life goes on I guess. Good thing we'll have 30 relief pitchers to hold all those late inning leads we're gonna have.

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 02:06 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

I'm not sure if that is true???

I really hope not. If this is the case, we traded Magglio for Perez, not Konerko.

Hangar18
12-17-2003, 02:11 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
From wthat i've heard thw W.Sox will get willimson and nomar from r.sox...then send them to dodgers for perez, mota and a top pitchung prospect.

I'm not sure if that is true???

Wait A freaking second. WE couldve made this trade with LA all on our own? Why must the White Sox be the team to Help Everyone Else? Basically, We lose Magglio (because of our Self-Imposed salary limits) and we get Odalis Perez.
Perez better go 22-5 this year directly leading us to the WS.
im already sick

TheRockinMT
12-17-2003, 02:17 PM
If we get a starter with one good year under his belt, along with his supposed bad attitude, and a relief pitcher than I agree we are the losers in this three-way, if it happens. We aren't going to keep Nomar and the rumor/idea of Boston taking Maggs for Nomar didn't make any sense since we were just giving up one potential FA for another and are pleading poverty. I just see this as another dismantling of the Sox team and an exodus of good talent.

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by pearso66
well the maggs to nomar deal wasn't gonna happen unless the A-rod manny deal happened. So to me it sounds like thats the 3 team trade

Correct....the Manny/A-Rod deal will be done.

Then Maggs to Boston
Nomar to the Sox
Nomar to the Dodger
Sox would get Scott Williamson, Odalis Perez, Guillermo Mota and potentially one more.

hold2dibber
12-17-2003, 02:18 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Wait A freaking second. WE couldve made this trade with LA all on our own? Why must the White Sox be the team to Help Everyone Else? Basically, We lose Magglio (because of our Self-Imposed salary limits) and we get Odalis Perez.
Perez better go 22-5 this year directly leading us to the WS.
im already sick

What're you talking about? We got Perez PLUS Mota PLUS Williamson PLUS a stud pitching prospect. That's the rumor, per the Trib, per Otis (my man!) and per ESPN.com.

miker
12-17-2003, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by TheRockinMT
If we get a starter with one good year under his belt, along with his supposed bad attitude, and a relief pitcher than I agree we are the losers in this three-way, if it happens.

Yeah, three-ways never turn out to be as good as they are hyped up to be...

...we're still talking baseball trades, aren't we? :smile:

anewman35
12-17-2003, 02:19 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Wait A freaking second. WE couldve made this trade with LA all on our own? Why must the White Sox be the team to Help Everyone Else? Basically, We lose Magglio (because of our Self-Imposed salary limits) and we get Odalis Perez.
Perez better go 22-5 this year directly leading us to the WS.
im already sick

What are you talking about? The last time we did a major 3 way trade, we were the team that was best off, remember? Anyway, we're going to get a lot more here than just Perez, calm down.

Fenway
12-17-2003, 02:21 PM
Art Martone the sports editor of the Providence Journal just posted on our board the union said no to the ARod deal as presented

all bets are off

http://forums.redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=132&st=2175&

Brian26
12-17-2003, 02:23 PM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
Sox would get Scott Williamson, Odalis Perez, Guillermo Mota and potentially one more.

And we are now officially rebuilding.

Where's the barf bag at?

Gammons Peter
12-17-2003, 02:23 PM
This is the trade we wanted to make with the Dodgers to begin with, except now we also get Williamson.

Sox get Williamson, Perez, Mota, and one or two stud pitching propects for Maggs

Pretty good deal

MRKARNO
12-17-2003, 02:24 PM
Everything could be off now though

Palehose13
12-17-2003, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by fenway
Art Martone of the sports editor of the Providence Journal just posted on our board the union said no to the ARod deal as presented

all bets are off

http://forums.redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=132&st=2175&

DAMN!!! If both sides want it, what's the problem?? I hate unions.

santo=dorf
12-17-2003, 02:26 PM
Originally posted by Gammons Peter
This is the trade we wanted to make with the Dodgers to begin with, except now we also get Williamson.

Sox get Williamson, Perez, Mota, and one or two stud pitching propects for Maggs

Pretty good deal

I swear I read somewhere that this pitching prospect will go to Texas as part of the Manny deal. What ever happened to Wright or Rauch going to the Red Sox then Texas for Williamson?

delben91
12-17-2003, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Everything could be off now though

Why does this not surprise me?

bobj4400
12-17-2003, 02:28 PM
Originally posted by Brian26
And we are now officially rebuilding.

Where's the barf bag at?

Is it really considered rebuilding if you havent won anything in the first place??

habibharu
12-17-2003, 02:29 PM
this has to happen soon cuz selig set a 3pm thurs deadline for trade or talks are off

mandmandm
12-17-2003, 02:30 PM
Originally posted by habibharu
this has to happen soon cuz selig set a 3pm thurs deadline for trade or talks are off

When was the last time something went right with Budlight involved!

lowesox
12-17-2003, 02:31 PM
Out of interest, ESPN reports that:

"The Red Sox might also include reliever Scott Williamson as part of the agreed-upon trade of Garciaparra to Chicago, provided the Rodriguez-Ramirez deal is completed. There have been additional reports claiming right-hander Byung-Hyun Kim also would be part of a Garciaparra trade to Chicago."


Even though, now none of this looks like its going to happen.

Fenway
12-17-2003, 02:32 PM
Selig will give them to March 30th

Reinsdorf, the union, John W Henry you think Bud Light gets involved with this?


Originally posted by bobj4400
Is it really considered rebuilding if you havent won anything in the first place??

Nick@Nite
12-17-2003, 02:36 PM
Originally posted by mandmandm
When was the last time something went right with Budlight involved!

When Odysseus set sail for The Odyssey.. er, I mean never.

Iwritecode
12-17-2003, 02:38 PM
Originally posted by Palehose13
DAMN!!! If both sides want it, what's the problem?? I hate unions.

On the Red Sox board they say the snag is about who will pay 5 million for insurance on A-rod.

I've also heard that any renegotiation would have to add some benefit for the player, according to baseball's labor contract. That's why the union is getting involved.

They are saying the union is going to present a restructured deal that is amenable to the union. If both sides agree, the deal could still go through.

Palehose13
12-17-2003, 02:39 PM
Originally posted by Iwritecode
On the Red Sox board they say the snag is about who will pay 5 million for insurance on A-rod.

I've also heard that any renegotiation would have to add some benefit for the player, according to baseball's labor contract. That's why the union is getting involved.

They are saying the union is going to present a restructured deal that is amenable to the union. If both sides agree, the deal could still go through.

Thanks...ok, still a little ray of light...

PaulDrake
12-17-2003, 02:41 PM
Originally posted by Tekijawa
If Nomar ends up in LA then we get to read two chapters in Billy Beanes next book completely devoted to how dumb KW is! You're wrong. Some here think he's a genius. Far be it from me to disagree.

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 02:44 PM
Originally posted by fenway
Art Martone the sports editor of the Providence Journal just posted on our board the union said no to the ARod deal as presented

all bets are off

http://forums.redsoxnation.net/index.php?showtopic=132&st=2175&

You are correct. That was discussed early this morning on the Score. They are in meetings now, trying to restructure A-Rod's contract. The union is about protecting his high salary even though he would take a cut to make the deal happen.

Lets hold on until MLB annouces anything.

maurice
12-17-2003, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by Palehose13
DAMN!!! If both sides want it, what's the problem?? I hate unions.

The union is involved to make sure that A-Rod is not giving back cash and getting nothing of value in return. That would set a bad, NFL-esque precedent for all major league players. I love unions.

34 Inch Stick
12-17-2003, 03:27 PM
Originally posted by miker
Yeah, three-ways never turn out to be as good as they are hyped up to be...

...we're still talking baseball trades, aren't we? :smile:

Especially when more than one guy is involved.

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 03:33 PM
Originally posted by maurice
The union is involved to make sure that A-Rod is not giving back cash and getting nothing of value in return. That would set a bad, NFL-esque precedent for all major league players. I love unions.

It sounds like A-Rod believe he is overpaid and teams get win with a $25 mil man. Maybe the union should realize baseball players are overpaid, which has caused ticket prices to escalate faster then other sports

longshot7
12-17-2003, 03:33 PM
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.

I'm about to fly to Chicago so I can punch out KW's lights personally. Happy f'in Christmas!

valposoxfan
12-17-2003, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.

I'm about to fly to Chicago so I can punch out KW's lights personally. Happy f'in Christmas!

COME ON!!!! This deal works for us people! If Perez is added to the rotation that only solidifies it. If we can get Guillen from Seattle we are no worse off than last year at all. Nomar is good but his wrist is a major red flag. Moto will be good from the bullpen and the Dodgers have studly pitching prospects, and we will be receiving at least one. Relax and don't freak out before you actually think about the deal. I think we come out on top on this one.

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 03:37 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.

I'm about to fly to Chicago so I can punch out KW's lights personally. Happy f'in Christmas!

Who knows what will happen. Is anyone near a TV to see what is going on ESPN News????

mandmandm
12-17-2003, 03:39 PM
Can we wait until the deal is announced before passing judgement?

JJAustin69
12-17-2003, 03:40 PM
Originally posted by BeerHandle
Who knows what will happen. Is anyone near a TV to see what is going on ESPN News???? I'm watching ESPN right now but they just have their regular programming on. (Celtics vs Houston 1986)

DirtySouthsider
12-17-2003, 03:42 PM
Originally posted by valposoxfan
COME ON!!!! This deal works for us people! If Perez is added to the rotation that only solidifies it. If we can get Guillen from Seattle we are no worse off than last year at all. Nomar is good but his wrist is a major red flag. Moto will be good from the bullpen and the Dodgers have studly pitching prospects, and we will be receiving at least one. Relax and don't freak out before you actually think about the deal. I think we come out on top on this one.

YES....I couldn't agree more!!!!! Nomar is very good....but quality pitching is always better!

Tekijawa
12-17-2003, 03:43 PM
Originally posted by DirtySouthsider
YES....I couldn't agree more!!!!! Nomar is very good....but quality pitching is always better!

When did Perez become a Quality pitcher?

anewman35
12-17-2003, 03:44 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.


Good thing they don't award wins based on drawing power, then!

jabrch
12-17-2003, 03:45 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.

I'm about to fly to Chicago so I can punch out KW's lights personally. Happy f'in Christmas!

Long Shot

Just you wait until next offseason when we lose Maggs and get nothing but the Cubs first round pick and a sandwich pick. Then I don't want to hear you bitching.

If you can't recognize the economic reality that we are operating under, then you miss the entire situation that KW is in.

83 White Sox
12-17-2003, 03:46 PM
Originally posted by longshot7
I hate everything to do with this deal.

Let's get this straight - the Red Sox have acquired ARod, Magglio, Schilling, & Foulke over the winter.

And who did we obtain - Juan Uribe, Scott Williamson, and Odalis Perez? Yeah, that's a much better draw than Maggs.

I'm about to fly to Chicago so I can punch out KW's lights personally. Happy f'in Christmas!

I LOVE THIS POST!!!! My sentiments exactly

duke of dorwood
12-17-2003, 03:50 PM
:KW

Garciaparra is hard to spell-wonder who I will really get?

Huisj
12-17-2003, 03:56 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
:KW

Garciaparra is hard to spell-wonder who I will really get?

ramon garcia and norman parra, two single A outfielders who are in their late 20s.

Jerko
12-17-2003, 04:00 PM
The Sox will not keep Garciaparra for this reason; they have 4 uniforms. Home, Vest, Away, Black. Now at .25 a letter, they would have to shell out 11 bucks just to put his name on all 4 jerseys. Maybe he could ask the union for permission to change his name to Hamm, that will only cost the Sox 4 bucks and Williams can go on and on about how much money he saved on the deal. Then again, I think the ~ on Maggs' shirt was about 1.80 so it probably comes out even anyway.

Dadawg_77
12-17-2003, 04:03 PM
Starks on ESPN News:

Reporting the baseball end of the deal is done. A Rod for Manny and Nomar for Mags. Now Red Sox and Texas are haggling over money now. Jason feels it won't get done today but will happen since Texas and the Red Sox have to make a deal as they have gone so far down the road.

DaveGusinSeattle
12-17-2003, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by Huisj
ramon garcia and norman parra, two single A outfielders who are in their late 20s.

You mean that's all we'll be able to afford next year or so instead of Ordonez.... :whiner:

maurice
12-17-2003, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by maurice
The union is involved to make sure that A-Rod is not giving back cash and getting nothing of value in return. That would set a bad, NFL-esque precedent for all major league players.

Originally posted by BeerHandle
It sounds like A-Rod believe he is overpaid and teams get win with a $25 mil man. Maybe the union should realize baseball players are overpaid, which has caused ticket prices to escalate faster then other sports

I don't think there's any question that Texas overpaid for A-Rod's services. IIRC, their bid was significantly higher than any other team's. The union's job is to make sure that players get as much $$$ out of the owners as possbile and that the owners hold up their end of the deal. As explained by brighter economic minds than me in other threads on this board, player salaries have very little to do with rocketing ticket prices. For many teams, demand for baseball has been ridiculously high, notwithstanding very inflated prices for tickets, parking, beer, etc.

Hangar18
12-17-2003, 04:38 PM
Originally posted by Tekijawa
When did Perez become a Quality pitcher?

Apparently in all the hoopla, he did. WHat I dont like,
is that the Stud Pitcher we get from the Dodgers, becomes
Very Very Good, then in a few years, we go thru this all over
again When he wants more $$$$ and the SOX "cant afford"
him ........

Baby Fisk
12-17-2003, 04:45 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Apparently in all the hoopla, he did. WHat I dont like,
is that the Stud Pitcher we get from the Dodgers, becomes
Very Very Good, then in a few years, we go thru this all over
again When he wants more $$$$ and the SOX "cant afford"
him ........
Remember, being a Sox fan is not about the future!

:reinsy
"It's about the distant future..."

BeerHandle
12-17-2003, 04:48 PM
Hicks said Wednesday that no agreement had been reached and that he has set a deadline of 6 p.m. ET Thursday. If no deal is made by then, he said Rodriguez will remain with the Rangers.

Meanwhile, if a deal is consummated, the Red Sox have conditionally agreed to trade shortstop Nomar Garciaparra to the White Sox for outfielder Magglio Ordonez, ESPN's Peter Gammons has confirmed.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=1688365

StillMissOzzie
12-17-2003, 06:07 PM
Of course any Garciaparra deal is contingent upon the A-Rod - Ramirez deal being consummated. ESPN.com says that the Dodgers are out of the picture (for now), and ESPN 1000, the local station, opines that the White Sox would try to keep Garciaparra!

Here's my take on the "3 year / $36 M" offer KW & JR will make:

2004: $4 M
2005: $5 M
2006: $27M

Maybe adjusted for a signing bonus...

SMO

nasox
12-17-2003, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by Baby Fisk
:reinsy
"It's about the distant future..."

As soon as the team gets sold...

longshot7
12-17-2003, 08:28 PM
Originally posted by valposoxfan
COME ON!!!! This deal works for us people! If Perez is added to the rotation that only solidifies it. If we can get Guillen from Seattle we are no worse off than last year at all. Nomar is good but his wrist is a major red flag. Moto will be good from the bullpen and the Dodgers have studly pitching prospects, and we will be receiving at least one. Relax and don't freak out before you actually think about the deal. I think we come out on top on this one.

Guillen?! Where did that come from?

Nomar is a free agent after next year - just like Maggs. How is this a good deal? Why not just keep Magglio? Mota, Greg Miller & Perez for Magglio (ie Nomar)? ONE okay starter, ONE good reliever and a prospect (who I've seen pitch btw) for our best player???!!!!!

How is this a good deal?

jordan23ventura
12-17-2003, 08:36 PM
Originally posted by longshot7


Guillen?! Where did that come from?

Nomar is a free agent after next year - just like Maggs. How is this a good deal? Why not just keep Magglio? Mota, Greg Miller & Perez for Magglio (ie Nomar)? ONE okay starter, ONE good reliever and a prospect (who I've seen pitch btw) for our best player???!!!!!

How is this a good deal?


you're forgetting williamson. essentially the whitesox are trading a productive RF for a solid bullpen, a no. 4 starter with potential, and a top pitching prospect. i have no idea how much these pitchers are making but KW must also be saving some money too.

MisterB
12-17-2003, 08:45 PM
Originally posted by jordan23ventura
you're forgetting williamson. essentially the whitesox are trading a productive RF for a solid bullpen, a no. 4 starter with potential, and a top pitching prospect. i have no idea how much these pitchers are making but KW must also be saving some money too.

Accounting for a slight pay increase for the guys we get in the deal, we save roughly about $7M.

jshanahanjr
12-18-2003, 12:48 PM
Lock up the Cell and throw away the key if this deal goes down!

BeerHandle
12-18-2003, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by jshanahanjr
Lock up the Cell and throw away the key if this deal goes down!
This is a significant deal to get some of our other trades moving....i.e. Valentin!!