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View Full Version : Who replaces maggs


SoxFanDan
12-17-2003, 08:12 AM
anybody???

gosox41
12-17-2003, 08:14 AM
Borchard is a strong possibility. Or there are rumors of the Sox re-acquiring Everett from the Expos.

Bob

MRKARNO
12-17-2003, 08:18 AM
Juan Gone maybe

hold2dibber
12-17-2003, 08:47 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
Borchard is a strong possibility. Or there are rumors of the Sox re-acquiring Everett from the Expos.

Bob

I think Reed has a far better shot than Borchard. Reed certainly seems more ready than Borchard to hit major league pitching.

fledgedrallycap
12-17-2003, 08:47 AM
I've heard rumbling of throwing Reed out there along with maybe putting Jose in Right...

idseer
12-17-2003, 08:53 AM
Originally posted by fledgedrallycap
I've heard rumbling of throwing Reed out there along with maybe putting Jose in Right...

jose who?????

cause i KNOW you don't mean valentin!

Frater Perdurabo
12-17-2003, 09:10 AM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
Juan Gone maybe

I would rather be flogged with a cue ball in a tube sock than see Juan Gonzalez anywhere near the Cell's 3rd base dugout. Be afraid of Juan Gonzalez. Be very afraid.

cornball
12-17-2003, 09:10 AM
Not sure who would replace Maggs, but I would think it would be a left handed bat. We are so right handed right now.

Deadguy
12-17-2003, 09:13 AM
Originally posted by SoxFanDan
anybody???

Juan Gonzalez for about 40 games, before he dislocates his pinky toe, and misses the rest of the season.

Deadguy
12-17-2003, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I think Reed has a far better shot than Borchard. Reed certainly seems more ready than Borchard to hit major league pitching.

Eh? At least Borchard has actually faced Major League pitching, before.

fledgedrallycap
12-17-2003, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by idseer
jose who?????

cause i KNOW you don't mean valentin!

That's what I heard, I wouldn't say it was a reputable source (Sports radio); but the point was if you have Nomar (who I doubt we'll keep) playing at short with a hole in right; why not move Valentin.

I for one don't think that will happen, the Jose "outfielder" experiment is over and they learned their lesson.

The Everett trade would be great, but I don't see that getting league approval.

bc2k
12-17-2003, 09:18 AM
:canseco

He'll be easily attainable and affordable. He's willing to play for league minimum.

CLR01
12-17-2003, 09:19 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
:canseco

He'll be easily attainable and affordable. He's willing to play for league minimum.


Does his ankle bracelet go that far or did he get that off?

Deadguy
12-17-2003, 09:49 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
:canseco

He'll be easily attainable and affordable. He's willing to play for league minimum.

So is Rickey Henderson

SoxOnTop
12-17-2003, 09:49 AM
Why not Ellis Burkes? He'll be cheap and can pass on invaluable knowledge to Reed and/or Borch. If we keep Nomar in the trade instead of dealing him to LA, that leaves us with a Line-up of:


Harris
Lee
Nomar
Thomas
Burkes
Konerko
Creede
Rowand
Olivo

Not great, but good enough if we can get Garcia for Valentin to Round out the rotation:

The EL
Buerhle
Garcia
Garland
Cotts/Rauch/fill in your name here.

We would have a sick infield with Nomar, Creede and Harris....

DirtySouthsider
12-17-2003, 10:07 AM
Originally posted by SoxOnTop
Why not Ellis Burkes? He'll be cheap and can pass on invaluable knowledge to Reed and/or Borch. If we keep Nomar in the trade instead of dealing him to LA, that leaves us with a Line-up of:


Harris
Lee
Nomar
Thomas
Burkes
Konerko
Creede
Rowand
Olivo

Not great, but good enough if we can get Garcia for Valentin to Round out the rotation:

The EL
Buerhle
Garcia
Garland
Cotts/Rauch/fill in your name here.

We would have a sick infield with Nomar, Creede and Harris....



We could sign Juan Gone and Burks.....and MAYBE between both of the them we could actually get a full season .

hold2dibber
12-17-2003, 10:10 AM
Originally posted by Deadguy
Eh? At least Borchard has actually faced Major League pitching, before.

Well, Borchard has faced major league pitching, but he certainly hasn't hit it! And in fact, Borchard couldn't even hit minor league pitching last year, despite playing half his games in a band box. Reed, on the other hand, has done nothing but hit, hit, hit at the minor league level. And he has shown fantastic discipline at the plate, which bodes well for his ability to adjust more quickly to major league pitching. I haven't given up on Borchard's long term success (though I have my doubts), but I think you'd have to say that as of right now, Reed appears more prepared to succeed at the MLB level than Borchard (although Reed would be better suited for another year in the minors, I think).

Nick@Nite
12-17-2003, 10:11 AM
Originally posted by SoxFanDan
anybody???

"Is the answer Jesus?"

miker
12-17-2003, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by Frater Perdurabo
I would rather be flogged with a cue ball in a tube sock than see Juan Gonzalez anywhere near the Cell's 3rd base dugout. Be afraid of Juan Gonzalez. Be very afraid.

Amen! Why would anyone want this stiff on a team, especially the one we follow?

jabrch
12-17-2003, 10:35 AM
Originally posted by miker
Amen! Why would anyone want this stiff on a team, especially the one we follow?

Cuz he can flat out hit. If we can get 135 games out of him, he would be as productive as Magglio. I know that is somewhat sacreligious to say, but the reality is that Gonzalez has been a great hitter all his carreer. Even recently in Texas before being hurt.

http://bigleaguers.yahoo.com/mlbpa/players/4398/career

I know this is hard to swallow for us Sox fans, but his carreer numbers (.296, 429 HRs and .907 OPS) are comparable to Frank's. (.310, 418 and .996)

His 3 year averages are also very comparable.

If Gonzalez can be had CHEAPLY, and for only 2 years, I'd be all for it. I would not be interested in a long term, big $ deal

miker
12-17-2003, 11:13 AM
Numbers don't lie, but I'm still leary of him.

Stranger things have happened...

PaulDrake
12-17-2003, 11:19 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
Borchard is a strong possibility. Or there are rumors of the Sox re-acquiring Everett from the Expos.

Bob May he prove me wrong but from what I've seen Borchard can't hit AAA pitching let alone major league pitching. His swing is way too wide, long and slow.

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 01:13 PM
I keep hearing Juan Gonzales as a possible replacement for Mags. I am not sure why his name keeps getting mentioned. Could somebody please tell me how Juan Gone would be possible or at least why he is being discussed?

jabrch
12-17-2003, 01:19 PM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
I keep hearing Juan Gonzales as a possible replacement for Mags. I am not sure why his name keeps getting mentioned. Could somebody please tell me how Juan Gone would be possible or at least why he is being discussed?


Frank

HOW? - He is a FA. Nobody seems to be very interested in him. He will play somewhere next year, right?

WHY? - Cuz if we trade Mags, where else do we find a .300/35/120/100 guy? those are fairly average stats for Gonzalez, if he can stay healthy.

Foulke You
12-17-2003, 01:24 PM
Juan Gone is injury prone but very productive when healthy. If he can be had cheaply, I wouldn't mind having him.

Someone mentioned Ellis Burks but I think his days in the field are pretty much over. He was DH-ing for Cleveland last year and STILL managed to hurt himself. I think he is too over the hill to play right field.

Ok, I might get flamed for this but what about Brian Daubach? He is left handed and can be signed cheap. He has a high OBP and in 2002 when he played every day he had around 25 HRs and 75RBI. I know that isn't Maggs numbers but it is certainly good production for a low cost and he is a proven commodity unlike Borchard and Reed who are too green for a contending team.

MarkEdward
12-17-2003, 01:27 PM
I'm also worried about our offense if the three way deal goes down. If Mags is traded and Nomar doesn't stay, we will be left with big holes at second, center, and right. Couple that with the fact that Valentin and Thomas are a year older, Konerko may not return to his previously average form, and we may turn into the Midwest's version of the Dodgers.

As for Mags' replacements, Juan Gonzalez is a very good hitter. Very close to being a HOFer. However, he's only played 152 games in the past two seasons. Ellis Burks hasn't played right field regularly since 2000. Since then, he's mostly been a DH. Carl Everett would probably be fine, though at age 32, he'll probably start declining very soon.

It's very hard to replace one of the fifteen best hitters in baseball. Hopefully Kenny has a plan in place...

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 01:28 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
Frank

HOW? - He is a FA. Nobody seems to be very interested in him. He will play somewhere next year, right?

WHY? - Cuz if we trade Mags, where else do we find a .300/35/120/100 guy? those are fairly average stats for Gonzalez, if he can stay healthy.

If KW/JR wouldn't pay $7MM for Everett (2 years) or $3MM for RAlomar, what makes one believe they will suddenly find room in the budget for Juan Gone. Juan might be injury prone, but I assure you he will be a heck of a lot more expensive than Everett.

jabrch
12-17-2003, 01:32 PM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
If KW/JR wouldn't pay $7MM for Everett (2 years) or $3MM for RAlomar, what makes one believe they will suddenly find room in the budget for Juan Gone. Juan might be injury prone, but I assure you he will be a heck of a lot more expensive than Everett.

The money comes from having moved Maggs (14mm) and PK (8.5mm). With Juan Gone having little other interest, how much does he go for? 5mm? 6? Not much more than that for a guy who missed half of each of the last two seasons, right?

In our position, that sounds like a risk worth taking to me.

JasonC23
12-17-2003, 01:35 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
I know this is hard to swallow for us Sox fans, but his carreer numbers (.296, 429 HRs and .907 OPS) are comparable to Frank's. (.310, 418 and .996)

Unless by "comparable" you meant "aren't even close," yes, this is hard to swallow. A 1.000 OPS is "comparable" to a .900 OPS? Huh??

Juan Gonzalez has always been incredible overrated because of his RBI numbers. Yes, it's possible he'd sign with us and produce a year like he did in Cleveland when he was playing for a new long-term deal, but it's more likely that he'll give us a year like he gave the Rangers last year.

Frank the Tank
12-17-2003, 01:42 PM
Originally posted by jabrch
The money comes from having moved Maggs (14mm) and PK (8.5mm).

Most of the money saved by moving Mags will be reinvested in the signing of Nomar. Furthermore, I am very doubtful that any team will be willing to take on all of PK's $8MM. Perhaps we could pull it off if we send Nomar to LA, but is it really worth signing Juan Gone if we lose Nomar?

Deadguy
12-19-2003, 12:47 PM
Originally posted by JasonC23
Unless by "comparable" you meant "aren't even close," yes, this is hard to swallow. A 1.000 OPS is "comparable" to a .900 OPS? Huh??



I'm surprised no one else picked up on this.

It's almost like saying Paul Konerko (.812 career OPS), is comparable to Magglio Ordonez (.892 career OPS).

Juan isn't even close to the hitter that Frank has been over the course of his career. The only reason he gets the hype he does is because of his RBI numbers.

Juan just doesn't take walks, which is why is OBP is ussually pretty low. Over the last two years, he has taken just 31 walks, which is a number of walks that Frank ussually draws in 5 or 6 weeks of play.

Over the course of their careers, Thomas already has nearly 1,000 more walks than Juan has gotten.

Thomas has 8,167 Plate Appearances in his career. He has created 4874 Outs.

Gonzalez has 7016 Plate Appearances in his career. He has created 4805 Outs.

Think about that.

mdep524
12-19-2003, 12:57 PM
Why so much love for Juna Gone?? He's terrible, he's old, he'll get injured, and he's a cancer in the clubhouse. All he'll do is whine about Comiskey being a pitchers park. I wouldn't take him if he was free, he'll just be a headache. I would take Jose Guillen over him...even though he's no picnic himself.