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View Full Version : Possibility of Magg for Soriano trade is back again


MRKARNO
12-09-2003, 11:21 PM
No media outlets have made mention of this but if sheff fails to sign with the yanks, there's no reason that the yanks wouldnt pursue maggs IMHO. We need an 2B. They might need an RF. I think it makes sense still for both teams.

nodiggity59
12-09-2003, 11:28 PM
Hey, I remember that deal...One from the vaults...Can't believe it didn't happen. Ah, the manic offseason.

It might be too late to make a difference in terms of payroll for us. Lots of good pitching is gone. KW doesn't seem to want to move Mags either.

lowesox
12-10-2003, 12:09 AM
Well, it has been written that R. Alomar has received interest from the Yanks... Personally, I would do this trade in a heartbeat if I'm KW. I think Soriano is a gamer and the Sox could use more of those.

ondafarm
12-10-2003, 06:49 AM
I wouldn't touch Soriano with a ten foot pole. His Questec numbers are lousy and since the whole league will be Questec next year, I expect him to actually be called out on strikes as oppossed to his already impressive whiff rate. He can't leadoff, he can't hit second, we already have a primo 3rd hitter, ditto 4 and 5, 6 and 7 are pretty solid so Soriano wouldn't fit higher than 8th. I wouldn't trade for a #8 hitter unless he was an absolute Hoover. Soriano is about the worst defensive 2nd baseman I've seen in years.

PaulDrake
12-10-2003, 07:32 AM
Originally posted by ondafarm
I wouldn't touch Soriano with a ten foot pole. His Questec numbers are lousy and since the whole league will be Questec next year, I expect him to actually be called out on strikes as oppossed to his already impressive whiff rate. He can't leadoff, he can't hit second, we already have a primo 3rd hitter, ditto 4 and 5, 6 and 7 are pretty solid so Soriano wouldn't fit higher than 8th. I wouldn't trade for a #8 hitter unless he was an absolute Hoover. Soriano is about the worst defensive 2nd baseman I've seen in years. Thanks. I can't believe anybody would consider a straight up swap Maggs for Soriano to be a good deal.

hold2dibber
12-10-2003, 07:49 AM
Originally posted by ondafarm
I wouldn't touch Soriano with a ten foot pole. His Questec numbers are lousy and since the whole league will be Questec next year, I expect him to actually be called out on strikes as oppossed to his already impressive whiff rate. He can't leadoff, he can't hit second, we already have a primo 3rd hitter, ditto 4 and 5, 6 and 7 are pretty solid so Soriano wouldn't fit higher than 8th. I wouldn't trade for a #8 hitter unless he was an absolute Hoover. Soriano is about the worst defensive 2nd baseman I've seen in years.

You've got to be kidding. So Soriano and his 40 HRs and 30 SBs and .850-ish OPS is a no. 8 hitter on this team, behind Crede, Valentin, et al.? I know Soriano has some holes in his game, but you're completely off the farm if you really think he's a no. 8 hitter on the Sox.

BeerHandle
12-10-2003, 07:53 AM
Originally posted by ondafarm
I wouldn't touch Soriano with a ten foot pole. His Questec numbers are lousy and since the whole league will be Questec next year, I expect him to actually be called out on strikes as oppossed to his already impressive whiff rate. He can't leadoff, he can't hit second, we already have a primo 3rd hitter, ditto 4 and 5, 6 and 7 are pretty solid so Soriano wouldn't fit higher than 8th. I wouldn't trade for a #8 hitter unless he was an absolute Hoover. Soriano is about the worst defensive 2nd baseman I've seen in years.

I'm with you.......I wouldn't ouch this bum!

BeerHandle
12-10-2003, 07:53 AM
Originally posted by ondafarm
I wouldn't touch Soriano with a ten foot pole. His Questec numbers are lousy and since the whole league will be Questec next year, I expect him to actually be called out on strikes as oppossed to his already impressive whiff rate. He can't leadoff, he can't hit second, we already have a primo 3rd hitter, ditto 4 and 5, 6 and 7 are pretty solid so Soriano wouldn't fit higher than 8th. I wouldn't trade for a #8 hitter unless he was an absolute Hoover. Soriano is about the worst defensive 2nd baseman I've seen in years.

I'm with you.......I wouldn't touch this bum!

jabrch
12-10-2003, 08:06 AM
Originally posted by PaulDrake
Thanks. I can't believe anybody would consider a straight up swap Maggs for Soriano to be a good deal.


Drake, don't you understand that Maggs is a FA after this year and will leave for somewhere he can get 12mm? Wouldn't you rather have Soriano than nothing?

PaulDrake
12-10-2003, 08:50 AM
Originally posted by jabrch
Drake, don't you understand that Maggs is a FA after this year and will leave for somewhere he can get 12mm? Wouldn't you rather have Soriano than nothing? I think I understand. Maggs got his contract at a bad time. It looks like the owners are making another attempt (all others have pitifully failed) to drive down salaries, making Maggs much less affordable. So some fans are eager to dump him before his contract expires and he becomes a free agent. I'm of the mind that you better get a lot more than Soriano. I am not a fan of Soriano, a defensive liability who can't or won't take a walk. I think that AL pitchers are slowly but surely figuring him out. Sorry, I just don't care all that much for Soriano, who seems to be real popular with a lot of WSI posters. I admit I'm a big Ordonez fan. I'm baffled by the amount of negativity he is generating independent of his contract status. He already has a higher OPS than some high profile HOFers and I think he's going to continue to put up impressive numbers. He seems a logical heir to Frank as being "the man" and it upsets me that teams can't keep players of this caliber. No matter who you have if they produce big numbers they are going to want a big paycheck. When does it end? Say you get a really good player or players for Ordonez and they come through for you. Then they want paid. We're starting to look like the Pirates, Reds, Brewers, etc. I want Maggs to stay on the Sox. Failing that, I want a trade better than the one proposed. I'm not wowed by Soriano. If the economics of baseball and/or the inablilty of managment precludes teams like the Sox from keeping their stars like Ordonez then maybe its time for fans like me to start following NASCAR.

Frank the Tank
12-10-2003, 09:05 AM
I can't believe people would seriously consider trading Mags for Soriano. If Soriano was all that great, why would George Steinbrenner be willing to get rid of him. Steinbrenner doesn't care about overspending on payroll, so budgets don't apply to him. Think about this: If Soriano didn't play for the Yankees, would he still be an All-Star? I guarantee if Soriano plays for the White Sox next year, he will not be an all-star.

jabrch
12-10-2003, 10:57 AM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
I can't believe people would seriously consider trading Mags for Soriano. If Soriano was all that great, why would George Steinbrenner be willing to get rid of him. Steinbrenner doesn't care about overspending on payroll, so budgets don't apply to him. Think about this: If Soriano didn't play for the Yankees, would he still be an All-Star? I guarantee if Soriano plays for the White Sox next year, he will not be an all-star.

You can guarantee me that a 2B who hit .290, with 38 HR and 35 SB along with a .338 OBP, a .525 slg and a .863 ops won't be an allstar?

Does anyone know his contract status? My usual source Salaries (http://www.bluemanc.demon.co.uk/baseball/mlbcontracts.htm) seems to indicate he is a FA - but I know that isn't true. How long do the Yanks have Soriano at a bargain price? (800,000 last year).

Remember, nobody wants to trade Mags. But if we can take a 14mm salary, convert it to an all-star calibre 2B for under 1mm then we have room left to work with to get a CF (Cameron?) and/or to spend on pitching.

DSpivack
12-10-2003, 11:45 AM
If you are the Yankees,

Why Maggs?

Vlad is better, and would likely be less than $14mil per.

jabrch
12-10-2003, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by DSpivack
If you are the Yankees,

Why Maggs?

Vlad is better, and would likely be less than $14mil per.

Because Vlad already said that he is not interested in playing in NY.

pearso66
12-10-2003, 02:18 PM
I don't like the trade for Soriano. I thought that he was signed to a big time deal last year? and then if we do trade ordonez, i definitally dont want Cameron. He will probably expect to get paid a lot, and his only claim is the 4 homer game against the sox. I just think he's too overrated

RichH55
12-10-2003, 02:49 PM
Originally posted by DSpivack
If you are the Yankees,

Why Maggs?

Vlad is better, and would likely be less than $14mil per.

A) Vlad will not be less than 14...might not make Manny numbers but he will make more than Mags and for longer

B) The issue is whether Vlad is a NY kind of guy

C) Mags is a damn fine player as well

bc2k
12-10-2003, 06:47 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
but you're completely off the farm if...

:D:

lowesox
12-10-2003, 07:13 PM
I like this trade. But only if the Garciaparra/Damon trade isn't for real. Either way, I think both trades could really improve this team. Look at both scenarios:

1) the boston deal
Damon becomes our CF/leadoff hitter. Garciaparra assumes the cleanup role. Personally, I love Ordonez, but a healthy Garciaparra is much better. This way, Nomar plays shortstop and you can use Jose at either 2b or 1b if you can trade Konerko. Reed or Borchard start in RF. Either way, it improves the nucleus of a team in pieces - I like that.

2) the soriano trade
This trade is nice because of the salary difference. Of course, I only like it if the Yanks take on the entire salary. Then soriano plays 2nd, hits second. Lee moves into the number 4 spot. One of Reed or Borchard start in right. The nice thing is you can use the money you save to sign Ponson and maybe a reliever.

Either way, I don't like trading maggs, but lets face it guys this team if we don't this team is going to be in serious trouble.

jordan23ventura
12-10-2003, 07:19 PM
Too bad we don't have three Magglios. One for Soriano, one for Nomar, and one for ourselves.

My prediction is we end up with none of the above.

poorme
12-10-2003, 07:26 PM
In Gammons latest article, he raises the possibility that the Ramirez/A-Rod deal will not happen. I wonder where that leaves us.

Jjav829
12-10-2003, 08:38 PM
Not that it necessarily means anything, but Nomar's agent is the same as Frank's- Arm Tellem. Maybe Frank can "tell em" (ok ok, that was really bad :smile: ) that Chicago would be a great place for Nomar to play and help bring him here.

ondafarm
12-10-2003, 09:45 PM
Originally posted by Jjav829
Not that it necessarily means anything, but Nomar's agent is the same as Frank's- Arm Tellem. Maybe Frank can "tell em" (ok ok, that was really bad :smile: ) that Chicago would be a great place for Nomar to play and help bring him here.

Nomar wants California. I don't think if KW's mother was his agent that Nomar would play in Chicago.

duke of dorwood
12-10-2003, 09:49 PM
Remember, Maggs is GONE after next season. If you can get a Soriano calibur player, you do it

Randar68
12-10-2003, 10:44 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
Remember, Maggs is GONE after next season. If you can get a Soriano calibur player, you do it

Amen.

Tragg
12-10-2003, 10:44 PM
Originally posted by MRKARNO
No media outlets have made mention of this but if sheff fails to sign with the yanks, there's no reason that the yanks wouldnt pursue maggs IMHO. We need an 2B. They might need an RF. I think it makes sense still for both teams.

Maggs for Soriano? Are you serious? Calling Soriano a second baseman is being ridiculously generous.
And as a general rule, overpaying for players that the Yankees have been trying to unload for a year (weaver and soriano) is not the ticket to the WS
Frank For Weaver

It's the twilight zone

lowesox
12-10-2003, 10:50 PM
Originally posted by Tragg
Maggs for Soriano? Are you serious? Calling Soriano a second baseman is being ridiculously generous.


Does everybody know for a fact that Soriano is awful defensively? Wasn't he a shorstop through the minors? How bad could he be?

I'm not saying anybody is wrong, I'm just wondering if you've had a chance to watch him over an extended period of time? Because I think stats are very unreliable when it comes to defense.

Tragg
12-10-2003, 10:52 PM
Originally posted by lowesox
Does everybody know for a fact that Soriano is awful defensively? Wasn't he a shorstop through the minors? How bad could he be?

I'm not saying anybody is wrong, I'm just wondering if you've had a chance to watch him over an extended period of time? Because I think stats are very unreliable when it comes to defense.
to some extent they are unreliable - that is, they certainly can't prove if someone is an excellent fielder (no errors doesn't mean excellent fielder) - similarly, lots of errors don't mean terrible fielder, but at best they mean average fielder. You don't trade maggs for an average fielder

Randar68
12-10-2003, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by Tragg
to some extent they are unreliable - that is, they certainly can't prove if someone is an excellent fielder (no errors doesn't mean excellent fielder) - similarly, lots of errors don't mean terrible fielder, but at best they mean average fielder. You don't trade maggs for an average fielder

What are you talking about? Soriano has put up numbers to the equal of Maggs from the lead-off SPOT!!!!! In addition, he makes a fraction of what Maggs does and he plays adequate defense.

I don't know what world you're in, but Maggs is not much more than an average RF'er. He's has the defensive skills of a good LF'er, but he doesn't have the arm for RF on most tteams, IMO. Average range, average arm, slightly above-average footwork, generally makes smart throws and hits his cutoff man. Sounds about average to me.

Soriano isn't a gold glover, but he's not much worse thana Ray Durham. In addition, he has 40 SB/40 HR/120 RBI offensive ouotput if he hits #2,#3, or #5...

In fantasy land, the Sox wouldn't trade Maggs, but the financials almost deem it a necessity. Sad truth, but at his salary, Soriano is the best you could possibly get for Maggs, IMO, as only 2 or 3 teams really have the cash to give up value and take the salary. Otherwise, the Sox will eat salary and not get much in return.

Tragg
12-10-2003, 11:10 PM
Originally posted by Randar68
What are you talking about? Soriano has put up numbers to the equal of Maggs from the lead-off SPOT!!!!! In addition, he makes a fraction of what Maggs does and he plays adequate defense.

I don't know what world you're in, but Maggs is not much more than an average RF'er. He's has the defensive skills of a good LF'er, but he doesn't have the arm for RF on most tteams, IMO. Average range, average arm, slightly above-average footwork, generally makes smart throws and hits his cutoff man. Sounds about average to me.


I'll tell you what world I'm in - I'm in the real world of the White Sox and in White Sox world, practically the entire team is full of "swing for the fences" guys; now it appears every player we want to trade is one of those "lazy players who walk too much" and every player we want has no such laziness.
I could quibble about the difference between a mediocre fielding right fielder and second baseman, but I won't.
The Yanks have been trying to dump this guy for a year. And there is a reason and here it is:
Career OBP - 322

Quite a number for a leadoff hitter, isn't it.

Maybe we won't pay Maggs - but we certainly can do better than a Yank castoff with a 322 obp

lowesox
12-10-2003, 11:11 PM
Originally posted by Tragg
You don't trade maggs for an average fielder

Wow - I can't believe how certain everybody is about this. Soriano is a 40 homerun type of player and a high 30's SB player. He's WAY cheaper than ordonez and he'll be around for a while. This is the kind of guy you can build a team around. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure how happy I'd be about this trade if I was on the other side.

Not to mention - let's say the sox didn't cheap out and spent the money they saved it's like getting Soriano and a top-tier player for Maggs. I make this trade.

Randar68
12-11-2003, 11:14 AM
Originally posted by lowesox
Wow - I can't believe how certain everybody is about this. Soriano is a 40 homerun type of player and a high 30's SB player. He's WAY cheaper than ordonez and he'll be around for a while. This is the kind of guy you can build a team around. As a matter of fact, I'm not sure how happy I'd be about this trade if I was on the other side.

Not to mention - let's say the sox didn't cheap out and spent the money they saved it's like getting Soriano and a top-tier player for Maggs. I make this trade.

Tragg != "everybody"

Randar68
12-11-2003, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by Tragg
I'll tell you what world I'm in - I'm in the real world of the White Sox and in White Sox world, practically the entire team is full of "swing for the fences" guys; now it appears every player we want to trade is one of those "lazy players who walk too much" and every player we want has no such laziness.
I could quibble about the difference between a mediocre fielding right fielder and second baseman, but I won't.
The Yanks have been trying to dump this guy for a year. And there is a reason and here it is:
Career OBP - 322

Quite a number for a leadoff hitter, isn't it.

Maybe we won't pay Maggs - but we certainly can do better than a Yank castoff with a 322 obp

The Sox wouldn't be trading for him for the leadoff spot, something he was certainly not real comfortable doing. He's a #2 , #3 or #4 hitter, and in any of those spots the past 2 years, he would have had more RBI's than Maggs. I love Maggs, but the reality is this is the last year he will be with the Sox IF THAT. At his salary and uture salary expectations, you get what you can for him, and unless the Sox are going to pay a good portion of his salary, there are only 2 or 3 teams in all of baseball who you could get decent value out of for Maggs.

THAT is the reality that you appear to be oblivious to. I don't want to see him go, but if he does, it had better not be for nothing or a couple of draft picks...

jabrch
12-11-2003, 11:24 AM
Originally posted by Randar68
THAT is the reality that you appear to be oblivious to. I don't want to see him go, but if he does, it had better not be for nothing or a couple of draft picks...


Exactly...Give me a 40/40/.290 2B who made 800,000 last year even with a .322 obp and I will take that any day over losing Magglio next year and only getting 2 draft picks for him.

Maggs is a FA at the end of the year. He will almost certainly not be returning here for several reasons. If we hold on to him and do not trade him before this year starts, we might as well eat him - cuz midseason he has a lot less value.

BTW, I wouldn't think of leading him off. But hitting him in the 5 spot, behind Lee and Frank, would be a fine place for him.

ondafarm
12-11-2003, 11:27 AM
Originally posted by Randar68
What are you talking about? Soriano has put up numbers to the equal of Maggs from the lead-off SPOT!!!!! In addition, he makes a fraction of what Maggs does and he plays adequate defense.

I don't know what world you're in, but Maggs is not much more than an average RF'er. He's has the defensive skills of a good LF'er, but he doesn't have the arm for RF on most tteams, IMO. Average range, average arm, slightly above-average footwork, generally makes smart throws and hits his cutoff man. Sounds about average to me.

Soriano isn't a gold glover, but he's not much worse thana Ray Durham. In addition, he has 40 SB/40 HR/120 RBI offensive ouotput if he hits #2,#3, or #5...

In fantasy land, the Sox wouldn't trade Maggs, but the financials almost deem it a necessity. Sad truth, but at his salary, Soriano is the best you could possibly get for Maggs, IMO, as only 2 or 3 teams really have the cash to give up value and take the salary. Otherwise, the Sox will eat salary and not get much in return.

What are you talking about? Soriano is such a disaster at 2B that the Yanks will move him to the outfield if they can't unload him. His Questec parks numbers are pretty lousy (subtract 30-50 points off BA, OBP and SLG). His homers are glitzy but he pays for that with a horrible number of strikeouts. Add to that that in non-Q or Yankee stadium no umpire dares call him out on strikes and you have a defensive liability in a critical defensive position who doesn't begin to make up for it with the bat.

Randar68
12-11-2003, 12:36 PM
Originally posted by ondafarm
What are you talking about? Soriano is such a disaster at 2B that the Yanks will move him to the outfield if they can't unload him. His Questec parks numbers are pretty lousy (subtract 30-50 points off BA, OBP and SLG). His homers are glitzy but he pays for that with a horrible number of strikeouts. Add to that that in non-Q or Yankee stadium no umpire dares call him out on strikes and you have a defensive liability in a critical defensive position who doesn't begin to make up for it with the bat.

*****. You called Aaron "Fire Hydrant" Miles a good defensive 2B. What credibility does that leave you with in this regard?

He plays half his games in Yankees Stadium where RH hitters are disadvantaged compared to most any other stadium. "Critical Defensive Position"? You're joking, right? I'd venture to say C, SS, and 3rd base are more important defensive positions than 2B. That makes it the 4th most 'critical' position on the infield. I'm sorry, but Maggs isn't Gold Glove, and neither is Soriano. He has good range and makes the same mistakes many young players do... not sticking the ball in his pocket, trying to make plays happen, brain-farts on easy balls. These are similar mistakes that a 30-year-old Jose was making until this year that people tried to explain-away one after the other!

I'm sorry, but we have a gaping hole at 2nd base, and Soriano would replace Maggs production straight up and fill the 2nd base position with average defense. Would you rather have 2 draft picks or 3rd-rate shmucks for Maggs, because unless you trade him to the Yankees, Dodgers or Red Sox, that's all the Sox will get him for.

Randar68
12-11-2003, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by ondafarm
What are you talking about? Soriano is such a disaster at 2B that the Yanks will move him to the outfield if they can't unload him. His Questec parks numbers are pretty lousy (subtract 30-50 points off BA, OBP and SLG). His homers are glitzy but he pays for that with a horrible number of strikeouts. Add to that that in non-Q or Yankee stadium no umpire dares call him out on strikes and you have a defensive liability in a critical defensive position who doesn't begin to make up for it with the bat.

By the way, pass me the crack...

Soriano's home/away splits are stupid-good. He hit .028 better on the road, and had an OPS .112 better on the road.

Yeah, it's a function of playing in Yankee Stadium...



BLA!

Gumshoe
12-11-2003, 01:07 PM
I'd trade Thomas for Soriano in a second ... then use the money saved to go get some kind of pitcher. Solid.

ondafarm
12-11-2003, 02:15 PM
Originally posted by Randar68
By the way, pass me the crack...

Soriano's home/away splits are stupid-good. He hit .028 better on the road, and had an OPS .112 better on the road.

Yeah, it's a function of playing in Yankee Stadium...



BLA!

Not in Questec parks he doesn't hit better. He feasts on non-Q parks.

Frater Perdurabo
12-11-2003, 02:51 PM
Originally posted by Randar68
*****. You called Aaron "Fire Hydrant" Miles a good defensive 2B. What credibility does that leave you with in this regard?

He plays half his games in Yankees Stadium where RH hitters are disadvantaged compared to most any other stadium. "Critical Defensive Position"? You're joking, right? I'd venture to say C, SS, and 3rd base are more important defensive positions than 2B. That makes it the 4th most 'critical' position on the infield. I'm sorry, but Maggs isn't Gold Glove, and neither is Soriano. He has good range and makes the same mistakes many young players do... not sticking the ball in his pocket, trying to make plays happen, brain-farts on easy balls. These are similar mistakes that a 30-year-old Jose was making until this year that people tried to explain-away one after the other!

I'm sorry, but we have a gaping hole at 2nd base, and Soriano would replace Maggs production straight up and fill the 2nd base position with average defense. Would you rather have 2 draft picks or 3rd-rate shmucks for Maggs, because unless you trade him to the Yankees, Dodgers or Red Sox, that's all the Sox will get him for.

I love Maggs. I hate JR and his self-imposed payroll restrictions. I can either continue to B***H about it or I can deal in reality.

I don't want to see Maggs leave and the Sox get nothing in return but draft picks.

If the deal is Maggs for Soriano straight up, do the it NOW. Promote Reed or Borchard to play RF based on spring training performance. Use the money saved on Maggs to sign Ponson. Trade Konerko and Valentin for Perez. Frank at 1B. Put Uribe at SS. Then, "ta-da," the Sox have the best staff in the AL Central and the best defense, but still have great hitters in Frank, Lee, Soriano, an improving youngster in Crede and two promising left-handed bats in Reed and Borchard. Find a DH. Heck, they might even be able to go sign a legitimate CF who can lead off. BAM! 2004 AL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

Or, hold out for the Boston deal: Maggs and Koch for Damon and Nomar. Then Konerko and Valentin for Perez. Frank at 1B. Find a DH. Sign Ponson. Uribe at 2B. Reed or LTP in RF. Then your top four is Damon...Lee...Frank...Nomar... BAM! 2004 AL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

Randar68
12-11-2003, 02:53 PM
Originally posted by ondafarm
Not in Questec parks he doesn't hit better. He feasts on non-Q parks.

If that's the last straw you're grasping at, good luck with that...

Randar68
12-11-2003, 02:55 PM
Originally posted by Frater Perdurabo
If the deal is Maggs for Soriano straight up, do the it NOW. Promote Reed or Borchard to play RF based on spring training performance. Use the money saved on Maggs to sign Ponson. Trade Konerko and Valentin for Perez. Put Uribe at SS. Then, "ta-da," the Sox have the best staff in the AL Central and the best defense, but still have great hitters in Frank, Lee, Soriano, an improving youngster in Crede and two promising left-handed bats in Reed and Borchard. Heck, they might even be able to go sign a legitimate CF who can lead off. BAM! 2004 AL CENTRAL CHAMPS!

Or, hold out for the Boston deal: Maggs and Koch for Damon and Nomar. Then Konerko and Valentin for Perez. Sign Ponson. Uribe at SS. Reed or LTP in RF. Then your top four is Damon...Lee...Frank...Nomar... BAM! 2004 AL CENTRAL CHAMPS!


Here is exactly why you almost have no choice but to do the deal... Financial Flexibilty to fill the 5 or 6 other major holes on this team. There isn't one RF'er in the game that's worth salvaging a starting CF, 2B, and pitcher for, but that's what Maggs' contract is essentially doing to the Sox.

maurice
12-11-2003, 02:56 PM
Originally posted by Randar68
*****. You called Aaron "Fire Hydrant" Miles a good defensive 2B. What credibility does that leave you with in this regard?

The "ignore" feature is a wonderful thing. Voodoo told me about it awhile back. Automatically skipping the posts of the three most inane hillbilly posters makes the WSI experience much more enjoyable.

(My apologies to the non-inane hillbilly posters at WSI.)

Randar68
12-11-2003, 03:10 PM
Originally posted by maurice
The "ignore" feature is a wonderful thing. Voodoo told me about it awhile back. Automatically skipping the posts of the three most inane hillbilly posters makes the WSI experience much more enjoyable.

(My apologies to the non-inane hillbilly posters at WSI.)

ondafarm has been viable for some very good conversations and discussions in the past and seems to have a good knowledge of the game. However, the whole Aaron Miles comments were baffling, and now Soriano is a product of playing in Yankee Stadium??? I'm starting to question my original impression.

Tragg
12-11-2003, 09:24 PM
Originally posted by Randar68
The Sox wouldn't be trading for him for the leadoff spot, something he was certainly not real comfortable doing. He's a #2 , #3 or #4 hitter, and in any of those spots the past 2 years, he would have had more RBI's than Maggs. I love Maggs, but the reality is this is the last year he will be with the Sox IF THAT. At his salary and uture salary expectations, you get what you can for him, and unless the Sox are going to pay a good portion of his salary, there are only 2 or 3 teams in all of baseball who you could get decent value out of for Maggs.

THAT is the reality that you appear to be oblivious to. I don't want to see him go, but if he does, it had better not be for nothing or a couple of draft picks...

I don't object to trading him if we must - I do object to trading him for a player with skills we don't need, who exacerbates this teams's weaknesses, with such gaping holes on this team.

How about this - how about getting a player we actually NEED and whose skills we lack. We don't need players who steadfastly refuse to walk.

How about perhaps trying to get a lead-off hitter for Maggs instead of a homerun hitter with no patience.

It's simply amazing that the two biggest trade rumors involve the mediocre weaver and the positionless and walkless soriano, two players of which a team that knows how to win have been trying to rid itself.

Rocklive99
12-11-2003, 09:39 PM
Bruce Levine was talking about this on ESPNRadio today. He said it was a real possibility if the Yanks don't get Sheffield. He says it would be a good trade for both teams. Jurko or Harry mentioned Soriano's strikeouts, and Bruce said he's still young, he likes the possibility of 40 HR and 40 steals every year, and that Soriano reminds him of a young Sosa :/

Tragg
12-11-2003, 10:48 PM
Originally posted by Rocklive99
Bruce Levine was talking about this on ESPNRadio today. He said it was a real possibility :/

From a team that is paying jose valentin 5 mill a year, that paid Royce Clayton 5 mill for 2 years, I have no doubts that they would consider such a move.
We'll extend our lead in solo homers.

Randar68
12-11-2003, 10:53 PM
Originally posted by Tragg
I don't object to trading him if we must - I do object to trading him for a player with skills we don't need, who exacerbates this teams's weaknesses, with such gaping holes on this team.

How about this - how about getting a player we actually NEED and whose skills we lack. We don't need players who steadfastly refuse to walk.

How about perhaps trying to get a lead-off hitter for Maggs instead of a homerun hitter with no patience.

It's simply amazing that the two biggest trade rumors involve the mediocre weaver and the positionless and walkless soriano, two players of which a team that knows how to win have been trying to rid itself.

This team's weaknesses??? You mean... like... lack of speed?????


Yeah, he makes us so much worse in that department.