PDA

View Full Version : Arbitration offered to Colon and Gordon


Unregistered
12-08-2003, 12:03 AM
From the AP Wire:

CHICAGO (AP) - The Chicago White Sox are going to try and hold onto Bartolo Colon for a little while longer.

The White Sox offered the right-hander arbitration on Sunday night, allowing them to extend negotiations through Jan. 8. Chicago also offered reliever Tom Gordon arbitration.

Gordon has already reached agreement with the New York Yankees on a two-year, $7.25 million deal. But it hasn't been announced, so the White Sox would get a draft pick if Gordon rejects the arbitration offer.

The White Sox declined to offer arbitration to second baseman Roberto Alomar, outfielder Carl Everett, infielder Tony Graffanino and right-hander Scott Sullivan, effectively releasing them.

Chicago general manager Kenny Williams said keeping Colon was one of his priorities this offseason, and he even offered the right-hander a three-year deal he described as the largest ever for a White Sox pitcher. But Colon rejected the offer, said to be worth $36 million, at the end of October.

Though Colon's agent, Mitch Frankel, said the pitcher still wanted to return, Williams said he would have to look in other directions. But with Alomar and Everett gone, the White Sox should have some additional money. Colon made $8.25 million last season.

Hmm, thought they were going to offer Sullivan arbitration. Guess Kenny has other plans...

jeremyb1
12-08-2003, 12:05 AM
Originally posted by Unregistered
From the AP Wire:

Hmm, thought they were going to offer Sullivan arbitration. Guess Kenny has other plans...

I think that's probably smart. I like Sullivan, he's a good pitcher, but he's probably not worth a boatload of money.

nodiggity59
12-08-2003, 12:09 AM
its official:

I now have no idea what KW is doing this offseason.

I dare someone to prove to me what he is thinking.

Not saying thats good or bad necesarily...

Lip Man 1
12-08-2003, 12:58 AM
Another case of nobody really knows what's going on. On the same Tribune web site Teddy Greenstein has a story saying the Sox were going to offer arbitration to both Graffinino and Sullivan. In fact a story in the paper today said the Sox were talking about a multi year deal with Sullivan to take Gordon's place.

Obviously either the reporter is dead wrong or something happened in the last 24 hours, perhaps a trade is blooming or negotiations with Sullivan's agent broke down.

Right now the bullpen, especially from the right side seems a bit thin and dysfunctional. We'll see if that changes.

Jeremy with respect, it seems that you think the majority of Sox players (if not all of them) aren't worth the money. I'd be curious if you could tell me just who you think IS worth the money and what kind of team the Sox will put on the field in 2004...quality or inexperienced (i.e. cheap)?

Lip

jeremyb1
12-08-2003, 01:40 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Another case of nobody really knows what's going on. On the same Tribune web site Teddy Greenstein has a story saying the Sox were going to offer arbitration to both Graffinino and Sullivan. In fact a story in the paper today said the Sox were talking about a multi year deal with Sullivan to take Gordon's place.

Obviously either the reporter is dead wrong or something happened in the last 24 hours, perhaps a trade is blooming or negotiations with Sullivan's agent broke down.

Right now the bullpen, especially from the right side seems a bit thin and dysfunctional. We'll see if that changes.

Jeremy with respect, it seems that you think the majority of Sox players (if not all of them) aren't worth the money. I'd be curious if you could tell me just who you think IS worth the money and what kind of team the Sox will put on the field in 2004...quality or inexperienced (i.e. cheap)?

Lip

I imagine we didn't offer Graff arbitration because he doesn't qualify for draft pick compensation and we're resigned to losing him and have already replaced him with Urbina since there's no point.

Lip, we're operating in an extremely depressed market these days so very few players are signed to deals that are actually worth the money. There's almost always a better option via free agency. Sullivan is good but he made 3 million last season meaning even through arbitration the least he could make is more than 2.5 million a season. That's not a tremendous amount of money but Beck and Leskanic have both signed for less than 1.5 million and are as good or better than Sullivan. Ligtenberg should sign for less than 2 million and he's as good or better than Sullivan. With someone like Maggs, he makes 14 million this season and I'd be shocked to see Vlad get more than 15 million a season. Since the market is nothing like it used to be, free agents are almost always going to be a better value that players that are already signed.

doublem23
12-08-2003, 01:51 AM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
I imagine we didn't offer Graff arbitration because he doesn't qualify for draft pick compensation and we're resigned to losing him and have already replaced him with Urbina since there's no point.


Uribe

doublem23
12-08-2003, 01:51 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1

Jeremy with respect, it seems that you think the majority of Sox players (if not all of them) aren't worth the money. I'd be curious if you could tell me just who you think IS worth the money and what kind of team the Sox will put on the field in 2004...quality or inexperienced (i.e. cheap)?


I have to agree with jeremy, here... Sullivan's a nice pitcher, but we would have payed too much for him.

gosox41
12-08-2003, 07:11 AM
Originally posted by Unregistered
From the AP Wire:



Hmm, thought they were going to offer Sullivan arbitration. Guess Kenny has other plans...

I was surprised the Sox didn't offer Everett arbitration. If Lee/Ordonez are traded I'd like to have him back. If he goes, it's two draft picks.

If Colon leves, the Sox will have 5 first round or sandwich picks in the draft. 5 of the first 50 or so top picks.

For those who think KW is running a great minor league system this will definitely put some heat on him. KW has had 4 drafts so far, and whille it takes time to develop players, I would think a couple would have made an impact in the majors, at least 1 or 2 from the 2000 draft and 1 from the 2001 draft. Most of the players from the Schu era are gone. He only has about 2 of his draft classes left in the Sox system since players quit/get traded/ released over time and after 6 years in the minors most seek out other opportuities.

Bob

Brian26
12-08-2003, 08:15 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Jeremy with respect, it seems that you think the majority of Sox players (if not all of them) aren't worth the money. I'd be curious if you could tell me just who you think IS worth the money and what kind of team the Sox will put on the field in 2004...quality or inexperienced (i.e. cheap)?


To answer the former, Frank Thomas is worth the money.

To answer the latter, quality and cheap-as-possible. That's the role of a good GM, to get the most bang for the buck.

Brian26
12-08-2003, 08:17 AM
Originally posted by gosox41
I was surprised the Sox didn't offer Everett arbitration. If Lee/Ordonez are traded I'd like to have him back. If he goes, it's two draft picks

The Sox offer was contingent on Everett agreeing to decline it. That would have at least given them more time to negotiate. It's possible crazy Carl didn't want to agree to decline arbitration. No doubt he's due a ton of money if it would have gone to an arbitrator.

Hangar18
12-08-2003, 08:20 AM
The worst part of all this, is the Cubs are never too proud to
dig in the White Sox Trash. Graffanino is one of my favorite players, a Valuable guy to have off the bench, and for his Bat,
and I will be Sickened to my stomach if he signs with the Cubs
as has been Reported the last few days .............

Jjav829
12-08-2003, 09:32 AM
Originally posted by Brian26
The Sox offer was contingent on Everett agreeing to decline it. That would have at least given them more time to negotiate. It's possible crazy Carl didn't want to agree to decline arbitration. No doubt he's due a ton of money if it would have gone to an arbitrator.

Yeah, it's happened with a few players that they have agreed to decline it so they could negotiate for a few more days. I wouldn't be surprised if he did say no. If you agree that the team will offer you arbitration and you will decline it, you should know that the team definitely wants you back. Otherwise you are hurting your value on the market/teams interested. For a lot of these guys, their interest on the market is changed based on the fact that they come free (with needing compensation).

I would have liked to have Everett back if Maggs/Lee leave, but since Everett doesn't know for sure, I wouldn't be surprised if he said no thanks and moved on to other teams. But the Sox definitely were not going to arbitration with him.

Brian26
12-08-2003, 10:09 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
I will be Sickened to my stomach if he signs with the Cubs
as has been Reported the last few days .............

Agreed. If Tony G. ends up on the Cubs, it would be a real shame. Graf's been a great player for us for the past 4 years.

surfdudes
12-08-2003, 10:34 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
The worst part of all this, is the Cubs are never too proud to
dig in the White Sox Trash. Graffanino is one of my favorite players, a Valuable guy to have off the bench, and for his Bat,
.............

Ditto on that, but if this is all part of clearing the way for Colon resigning, and we get the GIDPaul for L.A. Perez we have a rotation:

Buerle
Elo
Colon
Perez
Garland

D. Marte
Koch
Flash?

Knowing what Minnesota has lost, I 'll start the season with that.

longshot7
12-08-2003, 10:44 AM
Originally posted by surfdudes
Ditto on that, but if this is all part of clearing the way for Colon resigning, and we get the GIDPaul for L.A. Perez we have a rotation:

Buerle
Elo
Colon
Perez
Garland

D. Marte
Koch
Flash?

Knowing what Minnesota has lost, I 'll start the season with that.

Don't count your chickens, dude. I'm not planning on anyone until they've signed on the dotted line.

surfdudes
12-08-2003, 10:55 AM
Originally posted by longshot7
Don't count your chickens, dude. I'm not planning on anyone until they've signed on the dotted line.

I know, I know, but things look a little brighter than the doom and gloom of last week, and it seems like there's a ton of non tendered guys that just entered the market.

Tekijawa
12-08-2003, 12:46 PM
I was Just reading that David Cone got the biggest ever arbitration award ever in 2000... it was $12 Million... I was thinking that Colon didn't put up numbers last year that were deserving of breaking that "record" number so the Sox should essentially be locking him in for less than what they originally offered him, or 2 draft picks... this was one of the only times I think that KW has been in a Win-win Situation since he's been here!

Lip Man 1
12-08-2003, 01:26 PM
Two points...

I guess it a small possibility that Williams has realized in the past few days that he is not going to be able to deal any of the higher priced players (i.e. Koch, Konerko, Maggs) and is stuck with zero room to add players. if so you'll see the Sox bullpen in 2004 made up of hopefuls like Ginter, Almonte etc...

and Jeremy what you say makes sense if the Sox go out and get anybody and if the people they get are actually better on the field (not in terms of how much they make) then the players who were let go.

Right now for example the Sox are replacing Graffinino with Uribe. that's a step backwards in my opinion, talent wise. (but of course the Sox are saving money on the contract.)

We'll see.

Lip

TaylorStSox
12-08-2003, 01:30 PM
Almonte? You sure about that?

jabrch
12-08-2003, 01:34 PM
For Colon, we would get a #1 and a sandwich pick. What would we get for Flash from the Yanks? Where did Elias have him ranked?

jeremyb1
12-08-2003, 04:04 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
Two points...

I guess it a small possibility that Williams has realized in the past few days that he is not going to be able to deal any of the higher priced players (i.e. Koch, Konerko, Maggs) and is stuck with zero room to add players. if so you'll see the Sox bullpen in 2004 made up of hopefuls like Ginter, Almonte etc...

and Jeremy what you say makes sense if the Sox go out and get anybody and if the people they get are actually better on the field (not in terms of how much they make) then the players who were let go.

Right now for example the Sox are replacing Graffinino with Uribe. that's a step backwards in my opinion, talent wise. (but of course the Sox are saving money on the contract.)

We'll see.

Lip

From the sound of it we would've had to pay Graff a ton or make him a full time player to get him to stick around so I think it was a good idea to make the Uribe deal and part ways with Graff as much as I love the way he hits against lefties.

Daver
12-08-2003, 05:14 PM
Originally posted by Tekijawa
I was Just reading that David Cone got the biggest ever arbitration award ever in 2000... it was $12 Million... I was thinking that Colon didn't put up numbers last year that were deserving of breaking that "record" number so the Sox should essentially be locking him in for less than what they originally offered him, or 2 draft picks... this was one of the only times I think that KW has been in a Win-win Situation since he's been here!


Greg Maddux won the largest arbitration ever last season,16 mil.

Randar68
12-08-2003, 05:15 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
From the sound of it we would've had to pay Graff a ton or make him a full time player to get him to stick around so I think it was a good idea to make the Uribe deal and part ways with Graff as much as I love the way he hits against lefties.

Amen, and Uribe looks like a capable platoon partner based on his splits and #'s against lefties.

Jjav829
12-08-2003, 06:14 PM
Originally posted by Daver
Greg Maddux won the largest arbitration ever last season,16 mil.

Actually he settled before going to arbitration for $14.75 million, a record for the largest one year contract.