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duke of dorwood
11-15-2003, 08:03 PM
Paul Konerko and his salary to the Cardinals for Tino Martinez, who makes similar $ ?

Martinez will make 7.5 mil next year, but give us left handed hitting at first base.

This wouldn't be a salary dump for either team, but may help both teams.

seventytwo
11-15-2003, 08:07 PM
Is next year the last year of Tino's contract? If so, I would do the deal. We've got enough base-clogging right-handed hitting sloths.

Let's get a left-handed hitting one. :o:

duke of dorwood
11-15-2003, 08:10 PM
It is his final contract year

RedPinStripes
11-15-2003, 08:24 PM
The Cardinals are not the Mets or the Dodgers. I would do it, but i'm sure the Cardinals would laugh at it.

Dadawg_77
11-16-2003, 02:17 AM
NO

SoxxoS
11-16-2003, 12:19 PM
I wouldn't do it, even if Tino has one year left. He isn't good anymore. Tino is just old and bad.

At least Paulie is young and supposedly entering his prime. That would be a definite NO for me.

Brian26
11-16-2003, 12:40 PM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
At least Paulie is young and supposedly entering his prime. That would be a definite NO for me.

LOL. This seriously made me laugh out loud. PK may have already entered, enjoyed, and left his prime at this point. His prime may have been the 2nd half of 2k1 and the first half of 2k2. He walks like a 60 year old man. This isn't any secret, and unfortunately it's the reason the Sox may have trouble getting rid of him. I like the guy, but his age has nothing to do with it at this point.

RichH55
11-16-2003, 03:13 PM
Give me Tino for the one year and a little less in even that year then PK and his albatross status

duke of dorwood
11-16-2003, 08:41 PM
The only way they will be rid of him is to take someone elses similar problem. You can always move the guy you acquire, who may be easier to unload than PK

Gumshoe
11-16-2003, 10:00 PM
Konerko is going to show you guys how absurdly exaggerant you are this year. He is a capable player, an All Star at one time, and is a really good hitter. I expect him to be a solid contributor because he has good talent and work ethic.

JDP
11-16-2003, 11:33 PM
Send the Cardinals Buehrle for Renteria and Ankiel. *nods*

SoxxoS
11-17-2003, 01:24 AM
Originally posted by Brian26
LOL. This seriously made me laugh out loud. PK may have already entered, enjoyed, and left his prime at this point. His prime may have been the 2nd half of 2k1 and the first half of 2k2. He walks like a 60 year old man. This isn't any secret, and unfortunately it's the reason the Sox may have trouble getting rid of him. I like the guy, but his age has nothing to do with it at this point.

I don't care how he walks, I care how he hits. He had a horrible year last year, no doubt. However. He is only 28 years old. He may look like he is 40, but that body is only 28. He hit fine in the second half, minus the GIDP's, and is fine with the glove. He is not worth nearly the money he signed for, but he has a MUCH better chance to have a big year in 2004 than Tino Martinez does.

Frank the Tank
11-17-2003, 01:45 AM
I would be absolutely willing to trade PK to any team, for any player. PK might very well be the worst bargain of a player in baseball. He is a below-average fielder, a below-average hitter, and quite possibly the slowest player in all of baseball and the oldest 28 year old in the world. Yet he makes $8MM. I would trade PK for Albert Belle. I miss booing Belle.....

SoxxoS
11-17-2003, 01:57 AM
Originally posted by Frank the Tank
I would be absolutely willing to trade PK to any team, for any player. PK might very well be the worst bargain of a player in baseball. He is a below-average fielder, a below-average hitter, and quite possibly the slowest player in all of baseball and the oldest 28 year old in the world. Yet he makes $8MM. I would trade PK for Albert Belle. I miss booing Belle.....

Bit of a quick judgement on the hitting. He isn't below average. Willie Harris is below average. Paul Konerko has had one bad year. I will give him the benefit of the doubt. He could be a .280 30 100 hitter in '04, and that wouldn't be that shocking. It's one bad year.

I also would say he is an average fielder.

Not going to argue on the speed and the overpaidness (if that is a word).

Frank the Tank
11-17-2003, 02:21 AM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
Bit of a quick judgement on the hitting. He isn't below average. Willie Harris is below average. Paul Konerko has had one bad year. I will give him the benefit of the doubt. He could be a .280 30 100 hitter in '04, and that wouldn't be that shocking. It's one bad year.

I also would say he is an average fielder.

Not going to argue on the speed and the overpaidness (if that is a word).

Konerko has stunk up the joint well before the '03 season. In fact, he started slumping ever since the second half of that '02 all-star season. He could be a .215 15 55 hitter in '04, and that wouldn't be that shocking.

Deadguy
11-17-2003, 08:40 AM
Originally posted by Gumshoe
Konerko is going to show you guys how absurdly exaggerant you are this year. He is a capable player, an All Star at one time, and is a really good hitter. I expect him to be a solid contributor because he has good talent and work ethic.

He sure as hell better. I really have little to no faith in the guy, though.

He fell flat on his face in a year in which we only finished 4 games out of a playoff spot. This after signing a ridiculous contract, in which he has never even had a year where you could justify his current salary. The Sox gave him this contract with the expectation that he would improve, and they were burned badly.

Not much is really expected of him, and he's not under the pressure that Magglio and Frank are, but he still failed miserably. I disagree with your assessment that he has a solid work ethic, because if he did, then why at the age of 27, did he have the worst year of his career? Unless there was some kind of invisible injury, that is absolutely inexcusable. More than likely he just became complacent after signing a big contract.

I'd almost rather be forced to spend five minutes in a locked room with Joan Rivers than watch GIDPaul come up to bat in a key situation with runners on base and less than 2 outs.

Even before 2003, I would have rather seen the Sox give Carlos Lee a longterm contract, rather than Slownerko, since at least Carlos has show more consistency throughout his career, and doesn't have the history of completely disappearing for a month like Paul has done many times before. If we hadn't signed Paul to a longterm contract, he could finish out his 20's killing rallies for the St. Paul Saints, before moving on to his true calling as a Verizon Wireless Sales Rep.

hold2dibber
11-17-2003, 09:16 AM
Originally posted by SoxxoS
I don't care how he walks, I care how he hits. He had a horrible year last year, no doubt. However. He is only 28 years old. He may look like he is 40, but that body is only 28. He hit fine in the second half, minus the GIDP's, and is fine with the glove.

I'm not sure I'd agree with saying he was "fine" in the 2nd half. He was awesome in July (OPS over 1.000), good in August (.919 OPS) but an absolute nightmare in Sepbember (OPS of .599). Overall, he had 2 good months out of six. And the other 4 months weren't "okay" - they were atrociously horrifically nightmarishly terrible. Royce Clayton was never so bad with the stick as PK was during those other months. You really cannot overstate how bad he was.

With all that said, however, I agree that he has a better chance of a big year (e.g., 25+ HRs, 90+ RBIs, OPS over .850) than Martinez. But he also has a better chance of a "fall off the cliff" year, too, IMHO.

RichH55
11-17-2003, 12:34 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber
I'm not sure I'd agree with saying he was "fine" in the 2nd half. He was awesome in July (OPS over 1.000), good in August (.919 OPS) but an absolute nightmare in Sepbember (OPS of .599). Overall, he had 2 good months out of six. And the other 4 months weren't "okay" - they were atrociously horrifically nightmarishly terrible. Royce Clayton was never so bad with the stick as PK was during those other months. You really cannot overstate how bad he was.

With all that said, however, I agree that he has a better chance of a big year (e.g., 25+ HRs, 90+ RBIs, OPS over .850) than Martinez. But he also has a better chance of a "fall off the cliff" year, too, IMHO.

And a tremendously greater chance of taking up payroll in 2005 as well....not to mention....you can probably move Tino to TB(you have to pay his salary as well)