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View Full Version : MLB to announce New Rule Regarding PHitters & Pitchers


Hangar18
11-07-2003, 10:24 AM
Supposedly, will allow for a pinch-hitter Without removing
the Pitcher or that Double-Switching Nonsense thats
prevalent in the bogus National League. What does everyone
think about that?

jortafan
11-07-2003, 10:27 AM
So much for the National League being some sort of purist league that plays baseball in a traditional manner.

Actually, if this move really was going to happen, it would be easier (definitely less confusing) for the NL to just go ahead and adopt the designated hitter.

Grobber33
11-07-2003, 10:29 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Supposedly, will allow for a pinch-hitter Without removing
the Pitcher or that Double-Switching Nonsense thats
prevalent in the bogus National League. What does everyone
think about that?

The Players Assn wont go for that since it would be the end of the DH,which would mean the Owners save $$$$ which Donny Fehr wont allow. Second,more people like the double-switching and stuff like that,so dont bet on this happening. Even many AL Players like the NL style better,only DH's like Edgar Martinez would want this change.

crector
11-07-2003, 10:30 AM
Well, it will make N.L. games that much less interesting to watch since it will make things a lot less challenging for N.L. managers.

TDog
11-07-2003, 10:43 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Supposedly, will allow for a pinch-hitter Without removing
the Pitcher or that Double-Switching Nonsense thats
prevalent in the bogus National League. What does everyone
think about that?

This sounds like one of the designated-pinch-hitter ideas that was floating around during the late '60s. What was adopted after the 1972 season by the American League and rejected by the National League (I think the owners were only 7-5 in favor of it) was the straight division of pitching and hitting that had already been in use in much of amateur baseball.

I don't know that there are many fans that like the double-switch -- removing starters for bench players. They would be the same fans who used to go to Sunday Sox games where JM would give his starters the day off.

poorme
11-07-2003, 10:46 AM
Where did you hear about this?

TheRockinMT
11-07-2003, 10:51 AM
If in fact this is a real decision it sounds rather odd. The NL has fought the idea of the DH basically calling it an afront to pure baseball. This idea seems much worse and flies in the face of baseball rules and history. I think it would be much wiser to go with the DH in both leagues.

ondafarm
11-07-2003, 11:14 AM
Almost all minor leagues use the DH. In fact, I can't think of one that doesn't but I'm being diplomatic. IMO, pitchers hitting has gotten worse and worse since the DH was first used. At one time there were several decent hitting pitchers, now just a few. Either the NL needs to change or the AL needs to change. I personally think the NL requires more strategy which requires smarter managers and more use of small ball. Better?

voodoochile
11-07-2003, 11:17 AM
Originally posted by ondafarm
Almost all minor leagues use the DH. In fact, I can't think of one that doesn't but I'm being diplomatic. IMO, pitchers hitting has gotten worse and worse since the DH was first used. At one time there were several decent hitting pitchers, now just a few. Either the NL needs to change or the AL needs to change. I personally think the NL requires more strategy which requires smarter managers and more use of small ball. Better?

It also requires a bunch of intentional walks for weak hitting shortstops batting 8th. Yuck...

washington
11-07-2003, 11:21 AM
I never understood why anyone thinks the double switch is supposed to be so interesting (or strategically complex) in the first place.

poorme
11-07-2003, 11:29 AM
The interesting part is the decision to keep a starter in versus putting in a pinch hitter. There are more variables in the NL. I like variables.

Brian26
11-07-2003, 11:45 AM
I cannot believe they would compromise the integrity of the game with such foolish nonsense. Why not have designated runners? What is this, MTV Rock N Jock softball? Hangar, where did you read/hear about this? I don't believe this is being discussed.

SpringfldFan
11-07-2003, 11:45 AM
Some people hate the DH. Others hate pitchers hitting. Well, my opinion is that they should have eliminated this argument in the beginning by simply not having either. They should have just had an eight man offensive lineup - one which doesn't have a pitcher or a DH in it.

MarkEdward
11-07-2003, 12:11 PM
First, where is the source for this? I don't see it on Baseball Primer or ESPN.com.

Second, although I'm a fan of the DH (growing up a Sox fan and therefore an AL follower), I want to see the NL keep their "pitchers hit" policy. I love the differences in the leagues. I wish Selig would bring back the league presidents. I suppose that's also why I don't like inter league play.

I like seeing the leagues as two separate entities. It makes baseball different from other sports, where football, hockey, etc. are all incorporated into one homogeneous league.

DonkeyKongerko
11-07-2003, 12:45 PM
I can't find this on any news sites. It is plausible but I'm just curious where this came from.

rmusacch
11-07-2003, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Supposedly, will allow for a pinch-hitter Without removing
the Pitcher or that Double-Switching Nonsense thats
prevalent in the bogus National League. What does everyone
think about that?

Are they going to allow the pinch hitter to hit for other positions? Once a pitcher is pinch hit for, does the pinch hitter have to hit for him in subsequent at bats? Can a pinch hitter be used more than once?

voodoochile
11-07-2003, 01:19 PM
Originally posted by rmusacch
Are they going to allow the pinch hitter to hit for other positions? Once a pitcher is pinch hit for, does the pinch hitter have to hit for him in subsequent at bats? Can a pinch hitter be used more than once?

Good questions. I don't see this rule being adopted because it would have so few applications. If you start the game PH for your pitcher in his first AB, you will rapidly drain your bench which could cause problems later in the game. If you PH only in the late game situations, not as many pitchers will be left in anyway - only the realy studs.

If they make a change, just go to the DH and leave it at that...

KingXerxes
11-07-2003, 01:38 PM
I don't believe this story is legit.

Dump the DH and go back to pre-1973 baseball when strategy counted for something in the American League.

voodoochile
11-07-2003, 02:09 PM
Originally posted by KingXerxes
I don't believe this story is legit.

Dump the DH and go back to pre-1973 baseball when strategy counted for something in the American League.

That will never happen. The MLBPA will not allow it. DH's have a high average salary.

longshot7
11-07-2003, 02:34 PM
I'm anti-DH as well, but I don't see it changing anytime soon. The Sox are my team, but the NL is more interesting to watch.

Stoky44
11-07-2003, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by Hangar18
Supposedly, will allow for a pinch-hitter Without removing
the Pitcher or that Double-Switching Nonsense thats
prevalent in the bogus National League. What does everyone
think about that?

ISN'T THAT A DH?? So say an NL team bats the pitcher in the 6 spot and always brings in a Pinch Hitter to bat, but the pitcher can still pitch. DH anybody?

If this is not a DH, then what the heck is a DH?

Maybe I am stupid and am just misreading this thread.

voodoochile
11-07-2003, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by Stoky44
ISN'T THAT A DH?? So say an NL team bats the pitcher in the 6 spot and always brings in a Pinch Hitter to bat, but the pitcher can still pitch. DH anybody?

If this is not a DH, then what the heck is a DH?

Maybe I am stupid and am just misreading this thread.

A DH is a permanent PH. In the rule that Hangar says he heard about, the PH would only be allowed to bat once and then be done. So they would have to use a new PH the next time.

Stoky44
11-07-2003, 03:53 PM
Originally posted by Stoky44
ISN'T THAT A DH?? So say an NL team bats the pitcher in the 6 spot and always brings in a Pinch Hitter to bat, but the pitcher can still pitch. DH anybody?

If this is not a DH, then what the heck is a DH?

Maybe I am stupid and am just misreading this thread.

Wait I think I understand the rule now. Forgive my last post.

TornLabrum
11-07-2003, 03:58 PM
Why not just use a DH?

RichH55
11-07-2003, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
First, where is the source for this? I don't see it on Baseball Primer or ESPN.com.

Second, although I'm a fan of the DH (growing up a Sox fan and therefore an AL follower), I want to see the NL keep their "pitchers hit" policy. I love the differences in the leagues. I wish Selig would bring back the league presidents. I suppose that's also why I don't like inter league play.

I like seeing the leagues as two separate entities. It makes baseball different from other sports, where football, hockey, etc. are all incorporated into one homogeneous league.


I completely, completely agree with this sentiment....the difference between the leagues underscores their history

Daver
11-07-2003, 08:56 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
I wish Selig would bring back the league presidents.


That will never happen.

Why do you think he got rid of them in the first place?

MarkEdward
11-07-2003, 09:33 PM
Originally posted by Daver
That will never happen.

I know, sadly.

Why do you think he got rid of them in the first place?

Because he's an idiot and he think they'll undermine his authority. But mostly because he's an idiot.

StillMissOzzie
11-08-2003, 02:10 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile
That will never happen. The MLBPA will not allow it. DH's have a high average salary.

I just wish that the AL and NL played the same baseball. I'd prefer it to be without the DH, but if the DH is here to stay, why can't it be foisted upon the NL too? Not that it takes a rocket scientist to master the double-switch, but I do like the strategy involved in pinch-hitting for a pitcher when he's pitching well.

I just don't understand how the MLBPA is so strong as to maintain the DH in the AL and not insist the NL get it, too. Wouldn't the MLBPA like more of those high-paying jobs in the NL, at the expense of some light-hitting backup utility infielder?

I don't understand how the NL can withstand the pressure, if any, to get the DH and why the AL can't.

If I had my druthers, I'd set a time limit of, say, 3 more years, so all of the current DH contracts can run out, and then end it.

SMO
:gulp:

doublem23
11-08-2003, 08:18 PM
Originally posted by crector
Well, it will make N.L. games that much less interesting to watch since it will make things a lot less challenging for N.L. managers.

A 5-year-old could grasp the "strategy" of the double-switch in about 10 minutes. National League... Meh.

Brian26
11-08-2003, 08:40 PM
Originally posted by doublem23
A 5-year-old could grasp the "strategy" of the double-switch in about 10 minutes. National League... Meh.

LOL. Nice.

duke of dorwood
11-08-2003, 09:04 PM
When everyone got "pitch Count '" crazy a lot of strategy left the game too. Remember those times a pitcher was "taken out" by bringing in a relief pitcher and moving the pitcher to a position for 1 batter to stay in the game? You dont see those kind of moves any more. No, this rule change will not happen

Brian26
11-08-2003, 09:07 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
When everyone got "pitch Count '" crazy a lot of strategy left the game too. Remember those times a pitcher was "taken out" by bringing in a relief pitcher and moving the pitcher to a position for 1 batter to stay in the game? You dont see those kind of moves any more. No, this rule change will not happen

Britt Burns' 150th pitch sailed into the left field stands in Game 4 of the '83 ALCS. Pitch count is WAY overrated.