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View Full Version : Report: Sox To Make Push For Ponson


joecrede
11-05-2003, 03:26 PM
Acording to the Southtown:

A source within the Sox organization said the team will make a huge push for free-agent starting pitcher Sidney Ponson, who pitched for Baltimore and San Francisco last season and had a cumulative record of 17-12 with a 3.75 ERA. Signing Ponson could ease the sting of losing Bartolo Colon, the workhorse pitcher who walked away from the Sox's offer of a three-year, $36 million deal.

Also:

Another priority for the Sox might be to smooth over any hard feelings with Frank Thomas ... Thomas had privately told several teammates as late as last week that he wouldn't play for Guillen if he was named the manager. Guillen's comments Monday couldn't have helped the situation. Thomas was reportedly irate over what Guillen had said.

Full story. (http://www.dailysouthtown.com/southtown/dssports/pro/051sd7.htm)

jeremyb1
11-05-2003, 03:32 PM
You know I like Frank and I don't think he's a bad person or anything because of quotes like the above but I find it hard to read quotes like that and understand how some manage to bend over backwards to defend every one of his comments. I agree the media has been to hard on him at times and blown relatively harmless comments out of proportion but at the same time I find comments about refusing to play for certain managers and incidents such as his walkout to be completely unacceptable. I'm willing to forgive and forget but not to condone his actions.

nasox
11-05-2003, 03:33 PM
Im glad we are trying to get Ponson but Colon may come back, if the market doesnt give him anything. Ponson will be a very good pitcher IMO.

About the Thomas Ozzie thing, I don't know what to say. We should expect this from the Hurt but really, after what Ozzie said, pointing out Thomas at the conference, thomas will be mad. But, Ozzie and THomas will smooth things over I think-they both respect each other. It is a good thing to point Thomas out because by doing this Ozzie is setting an example and saying if THomas works, everybody is gonna have to work.

nasox
11-05-2003, 03:34 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
You know I like Frank and I don't think he's a bad person or anything because of quotes like the above but I find it hard to read quotes like that and understand how some manage to bend over backwards to defend every one of his comments. I agree the media has been to hard on him at times and blown relatively harmless comments out of proportion but at the same time I find comments about refusing to play for certain managers and incidents such as his walkout to be completely unacceptable. I'm willing to forgive and forget but not to condone his actions.


I agree and I hope more Sox fans do.

poorme
11-05-2003, 03:39 PM
Thomas was reportedly irate over what Guillen had said.

Why should I believe this? Who did Frank tell this to?

Rocky Soprano
11-05-2003, 03:41 PM
The Sox NEED Frank Thomas. I really hope that there is nothing to this story.

I hope Guillen and Thomas can sit down next week like old pals and say "Lets go out there and win!"

SoxxoS
11-05-2003, 03:42 PM
I like Ponson a lot and would be happy to sign him. I don't like how there is already a "report" talking about interest. As we all know, KW loves to work under "wraps" and doesn't like stuff to get out. This being out already makes me wonder a little bit.

If we signed Ponson and Bautista, that would really make me happy. I can live with

Loiaza
Buerhle
Ponson
Garland
Bautista/Rauch

Danny Wright shouldn't even sniff the rotation.

guillen4life13
11-05-2003, 03:42 PM
I really don't know what to say. Some of Ozzie's were really not called for. He has to remember that, despite his legacy in Chicago, he's the new guy again, and Frank is "The Man" on this team. You don't come into a new situation and immediately say this type of stuff. It's not smart, and it's not going to give any good results.

Deadguy
11-05-2003, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
You know I like Frank and I don't think he's a bad person or anything because of quotes like the above but I find it hard to read quotes like that and understand how some manage to bend over backwards to defend every one of his comments. I agree the media has been to hard on him at times and blown relatively harmless comments out of proportion but at the same time I find comments about refusing to play for certain managers and incidents such as his walkout to be completely unacceptable. I'm willing to forgive and forget but not to condone his actions.

There were no quotes in the above article from Frank, though. Nothing written about the recent hiring of Guillen contains a recent quote from Thomas, because he's been in Las Vegas since the end of the regular season. Everything that has been written about Thomas' reaction to Ozzie's hiring and comments at the press conference is coming from suppossed "secondhand sources". The only direct quote from Thomas I've seen about this was a comment he made on the last day of the season questioning his thoughts about Ozzie Guillen becoming a big league manager.

I won't defend his walkout, because that irritated me as well. Any player with a signed contract should just learn to live with the guidelines of the contract, no matter how unfair they may be.

But the ripping on Frank by the media and the fans as a result of Ozzie calling him out is a bit ridiculous. It's like blaming the victim.

Ozzie doesn't have a real good grasp on what the clubhouse has been like since 1997, so he shouldn't ridicule the post 1997 Thomas. If Thomas wasn't a team player from 1990-1997, then Ozzie's comments are a bit more justifiable, since he has first hand knowledge about the clubhouse during that era. However, his comments still should have been made directly to Frank in a one on one conversation, not publicly.

guillen4life13
11-05-2003, 03:51 PM
I'm weary of Ponson because of his price tag. What kind of contract is he reportedly looking to get?

The_Floridian
11-05-2003, 03:52 PM
Reading this article makes me really hope that they re-sign Sandy Alomar. I know Sandy is a backup catcher, but he is something the Sox will need this year: A calming influence in the clubhouse. Sandy seems to me like a mediator--The kind of guy who gets people talking and smooths over the wrinkles. Every team needs a guy like that.

Sandy's going to be a hell of a manager someday.

voodoochile
11-05-2003, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by jeremyb1
You know I like Frank and I don't think he's a bad person or anything because of quotes like the above but I find it hard to read quotes like that and understand how some manage to bend over backwards to defend every one of his comments. I agree the media has been to hard on him at times and blown relatively harmless comments out of proportion but at the same time I find comments about refusing to play for certain managers and incidents such as his walkout to be completely unacceptable. I'm willing to forgive and forget but not to condone his actions.

I don't judge the man for his personal problems that's all. I think Frank is a headcase to some extent and I accept that fact. That means I take the good with the bad. I think Frank's over all benefit to the Sox far outweighs any personal baggage he brings to the team. I also think the team has created some of that baggage through the years making Frank's public problems something of their own making.

In hindsight it might be that Ozzie was responding to Frank's previous comments at the press conference. You can damned well believe that if the press knows about it now, KW knew about it when he hired Ozzie. It thus would be no shock at all to learn that Ozzie knew it too...

Steve Bartman
11-05-2003, 04:07 PM
I personally would rather have Ponson over Colon. Colon had some memorable games, but failed against the Twins when it mattered. His price tag is way too high. Let the Yanks have Fatolo. Give me Ponson and his lower ERA.

steff
11-05-2003, 04:12 PM
Quote:
Another priority for the Sox might be to smooth over any hard feelings with Frank Thomas ... Thomas had privately told several teammates as late as last week that he wouldn't play for Guillen if he was named the manager. Guillen's comments Monday couldn't have helped the situation. Thomas was reportedly irate over what Guillen had said.


How in the heck was Frank mad LAST week when Ozzie didn't open his yap until THIS week...

steff
11-05-2003, 04:12 PM
Originally posted by poorme
Why should I believe this? Who did Frank tell this to?

No one.. it's BS.

voodoochile
11-05-2003, 04:13 PM
Originally posted by steff
Quote:
Another priority for the Sox might be to smooth over any hard feelings with Frank Thomas ... Thomas had privately told several teammates as late as last week that he wouldn't play for Guillen if he was named the manager. Guillen's comments Monday couldn't have helped the situation. Thomas was reportedly irate over what Guillen had said.


How in the heck was Frank mad LAST week when Ozzie didn't open his yap until THIS week...

Old feud from their playing days.

steff
11-05-2003, 04:17 PM
Jim.. I've read the articles.. sure sounds like this is stemming from the press conference. Not the comments, which were clearly from the past, but about when Frank made his comments. Last week..? Ozzie wasn't the manager last week.

steff
11-05-2003, 04:19 PM
And before I forget.. I called Sid here a looooooong time ago. :D:

voodoochile
11-05-2003, 04:20 PM
Originally posted by steff
Jim.. I've read the articles.. sure sounds like this is stemming from the press conference. Not the comments, which were clearly from the past, but about when Frank made his comments. Last week..? Ozzie wasn't the manager last week.

Right. So Frank hears that Ozzie might get the job and tells a friend on the team that he won't play for Ozzie. Maybe he is just mouthing off because he would rather play for Cito or whatever. Maybe he and Ozzie don't get along from their playing days or whatever. So the rumor makes it up the chain to management and KW hears it. He hires Ozzie anyway (heck Frank not liking Ozzie might be an endorsement to KW). Then he tells Ozzie what Frank said and Ozzie goes into the press conference with a chip on his shoulder and fires back at Frank.

Pure speculation, I know, but it fits...

steff
11-05-2003, 04:23 PM
Originally posted by voodoochile
Right. So Frank hears that Ozzie might get the job and tells a friend on the team that he won't play for Ozzie. Maybe he is just mouthing off because he would rather play for Cito or whatever. Maybe he and Ozzie don't get along from their playing days or whatever. So the rumor makes it up the chain to management and KW hears it. He hires Ozzie anyway (heck Frank not liking Ozzie might be an endorsement to KW). Then he tells Ozzie what Frank said and Ozzie goes into the press conference with a chip on his shoulder and fires back at Frank.

Pure speculation, I know, but it fits...


Speculation, I'll give you that.

But no way it happened like this.

LuvSox
11-05-2003, 04:24 PM
Originally posted by guillen4life13
He has to remember that, despite his legacy in Chicago, he's the new guy again, and Frank is "The Man" on this team.

I can't agree. Frank may be 'The Man" amongst the other players, but Ozzie is now in charge, he is "The Man" in the entire dugout. If Thomas is too immature to recognize authority then maybe he should go somewhere else. I doubt it though, sounds like bs to me.

Mammoo
11-05-2003, 04:28 PM
Frank has 6 million reasons why he should get over it! :angry:

chisox06
11-05-2003, 04:34 PM
Wow, not only is Frank my least player on the sox, hes now one of my least liked players in baseball, he's just a complete jerk. Frank is a baby, simple as that, you need to communicate with him like you would to a first grader whos trip to Disney World just got canceled. Grow the hell up Frank, Im mad you resigned your contract, go poison another club house with your childness and negativity.

"I have a lifestyle to maintain" Frank after going on the Free Agent market last year.

jeremyb1
11-05-2003, 04:36 PM
Originally posted by Deadguy
There were no quotes in the above article from Frank, though. Nothing written about the recent hiring of Guillen contains a recent quote from Thomas, because he's been in Las Vegas since the end of the regular season. Everything that has been written about Thomas' reaction to Ozzie's hiring and comments at the press conference is coming from suppossed "secondhand sources". The only direct quote from Thomas I've seen about this was a comment he made on the last day of the season questioning his thoughts about Ozzie Guillen becoming a big league manager.

I won't defend his walkout, because that irritated me as well. Any player with a signed contract should just learn to live with the guidelines of the contract, no matter how unfair they may be.

But the ripping on Frank by the media and the fans as a result of Ozzie calling him out is a bit ridiculous. It's like blaming the victim.

Ozzie doesn't have a real good grasp on what the clubhouse has been like since 1997, so he shouldn't ridicule the post 1997 Thomas. If Thomas wasn't a team player from 1990-1997, then Ozzie's comments are a bit more justifiable, since he has first hand knowledge about the clubhouse during that era. However, his comments still should have been made directly to Frank in a one on one conversation, not publicly.

Obviously its critical to my statement that Frank actually made these remarks. We don't know for certain that he did and I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt, but I trust the Southtown pretty well and these comments don't sound that uncharacteristic of Frank in recent years.

As for Ozzie, "calling Frank out", I think that's incredibly overblown. Ozzie was asked about Frank and simply responded that Frank is going to play the right way and that he won't be above the team. I don't see what else Ozzie could say. He certainly wasn't brought in to give guys like Frank special treatment. He was brought in to reenergize this team and increase its intensity and discipline. I don't see how anyone could disagree that 1) Frank should listen to his manager 2) Frank is not bigger than the team.

Deadguy
11-05-2003, 04:44 PM
Originally posted by chisox06
Wow, not only is Frank my least player on the sox, hes now one of my least liked players in baseball,

According to sources close to Thomas, he doesn't like you either. :smile:

guillen4life13
11-05-2003, 06:42 PM
Originally posted by Deadguy
According to sources close to Thomas, he doesn't like you either. :smile:

Do your sources know if he likes me? :D:

MRKARNO
11-05-2003, 07:20 PM
Back to the title:

Sox to make a push for ponson, here's what I have to say on the matter: What a shock

valposoxfan
11-05-2003, 07:26 PM
Originally posted by Steve Bartman
I personally would rather have Ponson over Colon. Colon had some memorable games, but failed against the Twins when it mattered. His price tag is way too high. Let the Yanks have Fatolo. Give me Ponson and his lower ERA.

I'd personally like to see Pettite over either of them...

Daver
11-05-2003, 07:35 PM
Originally posted by valposoxfan
I'd personally like to see Pettite over either of them...

I highly doubt you will see Pettite in any other uniform than a Yankee or Ranger.

MRKARNO
11-05-2003, 07:45 PM
Originally posted by Daver
I highly doubt you will see Pettite in any other uniform than a Yankee or Ranger.

Houston?

batmanZoSo
11-05-2003, 07:55 PM
Pettitte's "dying to play for Houston" because he lives there. Seeing that it's nearby, the Rangers are a possibility, but that's not the Texas team he's looking at.

Corkinator
11-05-2003, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by poorme
Why should I believe this? Who did Frank tell this to?

Exactly! There are no Thomas quotes in the story. Are we to assume Frank had some guarentee from management that Ozzie wouldn't be hired before he exercised his option? If Thomas is so irate over Ozzie's comments wouldn't one of our ambitious media types have gotten the quotes?

thepaulbowski
11-06-2003, 07:37 AM
Originally posted by The_Floridian
Reading this article makes me really hope that they re-sign Sandy Alomar. I know Sandy is a backup catcher, but he is something the Sox will need this year: A calming influence in the clubhouse. Sandy seems to me like a mediator--The kind of guy who gets people talking and smooths over the wrinkles. Every team needs a guy like that.

Sandy's going to be a hell of a manager someday.

I think that's why Sandy sticks around with the Sox. He's really good with the pitchers and younger players, and I think KW likes that leadership. He also knows how JR goes out of to may sure minorities have a fair shot, I think Sandy thinks he could work his way through the organizational ranks. And hopefully he will, I think he's a realy positive for this team.