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View Full Version : Sun-Times: Ozzie In Charge Could Lure Alomars Back


JRIG
11-04-2003, 10:27 AM
Well then this is all worth it after all!

cheeses_h_rice
11-04-2003, 10:29 AM
I want Robbie back, if that helps the cause.

:)

crector
11-04-2003, 10:39 AM
Just what the Sox need: 2 washed up players hanging on the team.

dickallen15
11-04-2003, 10:40 AM
Start printing playoff tickets

poorme
11-04-2003, 10:44 AM
This could be one definite downside of hiring Ozzie. Although those guys can be OK, depending how much they get paid and how much they play.

hold2dibber
11-04-2003, 10:53 AM
Sandy's about as "good" as any cheap, veteran back-up catcher out there, and there is something to be said, I suppose, for some continuity in terms of working with the pitching staff. So if the choice is Pat Borders or Sandy Alomar, Sandy's just fine. The fact is, the C position is Olivo's next year, and his development is much more critical than the identity of the back-up C is.

With respect to Robbie, it all depends upon how much he costs and what the Sox do to fill other positions. Robbie is a good defender, a great bunter, and he still gets on base at a decent clip. But he has absolutely no power left at all, and he's not a significant base stealing threat, either. If he's cheap and allows the Sox to have $ left to go out and get a quality starter and closer, or to obtain a world beater at SS or CF, fine. But if he's not so cheap or if the Sox expect much out of him offensively in terms of being a catalyst at the top of the order, that would not be good.

crector
11-04-2003, 10:57 AM
I'd much rather resign Carl Everett and have him play DH instead of bringing back either Alomar. At least Everett can hit the ball with power.

poorme
11-04-2003, 10:58 AM
Originally posted by crector
I'd much rather resign Carl Everett and have him play DH instead of bringing back either Alomar. At least Everett can hit the ball with power.

Well, I'm pretty sure Everett wouldn't accept what those guys will be paid next year.

faneidde
11-04-2003, 11:05 AM
Sandy Alomar's just entering his prime and ready to have a huge year.

Hangar18
11-04-2003, 11:05 AM
The Brothers Alomar arent exactly worth "Luring".
Lets see him "LURE" Ivan Rodriguez here.....

DirtySouthsider
11-04-2003, 11:12 AM
Originally posted by crector
I'd much rather resign Carl Everett and have him play DH instead of bringing back either Alomar. At least Everett can hit the ball with power.


I don't think the Sox line up is really hurting for more power. Lee, Thomas, Ordonez, Konerko and even Crede can provide power. Plus I think we are barking up the wrong tree if you are depending on power coming from your 2nd baseman.

JRIG
11-04-2003, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by Hangar18
The Brothers Alomar arent exactly worth "Luring".
Lets see him "LURE" Ivan Rodriguez here.....

More importantly, let's see him lure Luis Castillo here.

john2499
11-04-2003, 11:13 AM
Originally posted by crector
Just what the Sox need: 2 washed up players hanging on the team.

A washed Robbie is better than anything else we have.

Sandy is a backup catcher, they aren't usually high on the priority list.

batmanZoSo
11-04-2003, 11:13 AM
Who else wants Roberto Alomar? I think he'll be back, especially if we retain Sandy. He might take a pay cut just to play with him.

idseer
11-04-2003, 11:26 AM
Originally posted by batmanZoSo
Who else wants Roberto Alomar? I think he'll be back, especially if we retain Sandy. He might take a pay cut just to play with him.

well, what did he make? $8 - 10 M? obviously he'll have to take a cut. the question is how big a cut will he accept.
at $2M i think he'd be the best solution for now.

maurice
11-04-2003, 12:23 PM
"Luring" them away from whom? Is any other team really willing to pay these guys more than a couple mil on a one-year deal? I LMAO every time Robbie and Valentin say that they'll "accept a pay cut," as if any GM is stupid enough to pay them money equivalent to their just-expired contracts, despite the fact that they can't even hit .260! They can bloody well wait until the Sox are damn sure that they won't acquire a better 2B, SS, or backup C.

Foulke You
11-04-2003, 01:03 PM
I for one will be happy to have Robbie Alomar back at 2B and leading off for a full season. Anyone who didn't notice the difference in the infield defense and fundamentals (baserunning, bunting, etc.) he brought to the team had blinders on.

Luis Castillo isn't coming here, nor is any other all star caliber 2nd baseman. We have nothing in the minor league pipeline except for Aaron Miles and does anyone want to make a run at the Central Division with a guy as green as Miles? Robbie will do just fine for our needs and he most likely won't break the bank either. I also liked what I heard about Robbie working out hard in the offseason poised to reclaim some of his former glory. He will be happier than he was in NY and will be playing for his good buddy Ozzie so his mindset will be right from the start. Even if his numbers stayed the same, he is more than adequate at 2B.

steff
11-04-2003, 01:07 PM
Let's lure everyone here!!! We can pay them with the new $100's I just printed in my basement... :D:

Dadawg_77
11-04-2003, 01:19 PM
Originally posted by steff
Let's lure everyone here!!! We can pay them with the new $100's I just printed in my basement... :D:

How we give them some new $20s? But put their car in a lot which you can only pay by machine. Hold their car hostage with an offer to exchange new of a old 20 if they come here.

JRIG
11-04-2003, 01:24 PM
Originally posted by Foulke You
Robbie will do just fine for our needs and he most likely won't break the bank either. I also liked what I heard about Robbie working out hard in the offseason poised to reclaim some of his former glory. He will be happier than he was in NY and will be playing for his good buddy Ozzie so his mindset will be right from the start. Even if his numbers stayed the same, he is more than adequate at 2B.

Last year among AL 2nd basemen with more than 250 at bats, Alomar's OPS ranked 14th out of 15. If' that's "more than adequate" I'd hate to see the alternative.

He's nowhere near the defensive player he was, and even when he was at his best, Alomar was (and still is) the best at making the easy play look hard.

hold2dibber
11-04-2003, 01:33 PM
Originally posted by Foulke You
I for one will be happy to have Robbie Alomar back at 2B and leading off for a full season. Anyone who didn't notice the difference in the infield defense and fundamentals (baserunning, bunting, etc.) he brought to the team had blinders on.


He's pretty bad offensively - I like what he brings to the team in terms of defense, base running smarts and bunting ability. He's a perfectly fine no. 9 hitter, but he shouldn't be in the leadoff spot.

Lip Man 1
11-04-2003, 01:40 PM
FWIW The Cardinals released Fernando Vina today he is now officially a free agent.

Lip

thepaulbowski
11-04-2003, 01:45 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
FWIW The Cardinals released Fernando Vina today he is now officially a free agent.

Lip

It would be interesting to see what kind of money Vina would command. I wouldn't mind seeing him at 2nd.

WillieHarris12
11-04-2003, 02:19 PM
I'd take Robbie for 3 million and use saved money on Orlando Cabrera or Miguel Tejada.

Foulke You
11-04-2003, 02:31 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Last year among AL 2nd basemen with more than 250 at bats, Alomar's OPS ranked 14th out of 15. If' that's "more than adequate" I'd hate to see the alternative.

He's nowhere near the defensive player he was, and even when he was at his best, Alomar was (and still is) the best at making the easy play look hard.

Would you rather have Roberto Alomar at 2B or Willie Harris/Aaron Miles there for a run at the AL Central? The Sox are NOT going to spend a lot of money. Any extra money they spend is going to be on pitching. KW has pretty much said as much. I go by what I saw Robbie bring to the table in the second half of last season and I felt the White Sox were better off with Robbie at 2B. I don't care if he does make "easy plays look hard", the guy has a stack of gold glove awards that says he is a great defensive player. Whether he looks pretty doing it or not, he gets the job done.

So it comes down to this: Would you rather have Robbie at 2B, a starting pitcher to replace Bartolo, and a setup guy to replace Gordon or would you rather have them blow a ton of money on a Luis Castillo and leave holes in the pitching staff? I'll take my chances with Roberto Alomar assuming he signs for a reasonable price ($2 million range).

JRIG
11-04-2003, 02:47 PM
Originally posted by Foulke You
Would you rather have Roberto Alomar at 2B or Willie Harris/Aaron Miles there for a run at the AL Central? The Sox are NOT going to spend a lot of money. Any extra money they spend is going to be on pitching. KW has pretty much said as much. I go by what I saw Robbie bring to the table in the second half of last season and I felt the White Sox were better off with Robbie at 2B. I don't care if he does make "easy plays look hard", the guy has a stack of gold glove awards that says he is a great defensive player. Whether he looks pretty doing it or not, he gets the job done.

So it comes down to this: Would you rather have Robbie at 2B, a starting pitcher to replace Bartolo, and a setup guy to replace Gordon or would you rather have them blow a ton of money on a Luis Castillo and leave holes in the pitching staff? I'll take my chances with Roberto Alomar assuming he signs for a reasonable price ($2 million range).


And we all know how Gold Gloves are an incredibly accurate indicator of defensive ability. Like the year Palmeiro played 20 games at first base and won one.

That's at least $2 million of Roberto, $7 million on the starting pitcher, and (I'm guessing) $2 million on the set up guy.

I propose using the $6-7 million on Castillo, a huge upgrade on Alomar, using $3-3.5 million on a starter (Astacio? Alvarez? Anderson?), and using $1-1.5 million on either Al Levine or Steve Reed in the bulpen.

So yes, I guess I'd "blow a ton of money" on Castillo and fill in from there.

hold2dibber
11-04-2003, 02:57 PM
Originally posted by WillieHarris12
I'd take Robbie for 3 million and use saved money on Orlando Cabrera or Miguel Tejada.

If Robbie costs $3 million, I'd take a pass. And I don't think Cabrera is a free agent. I've seen other people post his name here as a FA, but he's not on any FA agent list I've seen.

MarkEdward
11-04-2003, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Last year among AL 2nd basemen with more than 250 at bats, Alomar's OPS ranked 14th out of 15. If' that's "more than adequate" I'd hate to see the alternative.


It's sad to say, but all Alomar has left is his ability to get on base, and even his OBP was below the league average (.333 to the league's .336).

Bring Graffanino back, or maybe get Walker or Castillo (though I'm not high on Todd).

Foulke You
11-04-2003, 03:54 PM
Originally posted by JRIG

And we all know how Gold Gloves are an incredibly accurate indicator of defensive ability. Like the year Palmeiro played 20 games at first base and won one.

That's at least $2 million of Roberto, $7 million on the starting pitcher, and (I'm guessing) $2 million on the set up guy.

I propose using the $6-7 million on Castillo, a huge upgrade on Alomar, using $3-3.5 million on a starter (Astacio? Alvarez? Anderson?), and using $1-1.5 million on either Al Levine or Steve Reed in the bulpen.

So yes, I guess I'd "blow a ton of money" on Castillo and fill in from there.

Gold Glove Winners from 2001 and 2002...You're right, these guys were hardly deserving of defensive recognition and most likely just made a lot of easy plays look hard to win their awards

2002
P Kenny Rogers Texas
C Bengie Molina Anaheim
1B John Olerud Seattle
2B Bret Boone Seattle
3B Eric Chavez Oakland
SS Alex Rodriguez Texas
OF Darin Erstad Anaheim
OF Ichiro Suzuki Seattle
OF Torii Hunter Minnesota

2002
P Greg Maddux Atlanta
C Brad Ausmus Houston
1B Todd Helton Colorado
2B Fernando Vina St Louis
3B Scott Rolen St Louis
SS Edgar Renteria St Louis
OF Andruw Jones Atlanta
OF Larry Walker Colorado
OF Jim Edmonds St Louis


2001
P Mike Mussina, New York
C Ivan Rodriguez, Texas
1B Doug Mientkiewicz, Minnesota
2B Roberto Alomar, Cleveland
3B Eric Chavez, Oakland
SS Omar Vizquel, Cleveland
OF Mike Cameron, Seattle
OF Torii Hunter, Minnesota
OF Ichiro Suzuki, Seattle

2001
P Greg Maddux, Atlanta
C Brad Ausmus, Houston
1B Todd Helton, Colorado
2B Fernando, Vina St. Louis
3B Scott Rolen, Philiadelphia
SS Orlando Cabrera, Montreal
OF Andruw Jones, Atlanta
OF Jim Edmonds, St. Louis
OF Larry Walker, Colorado

I don't believe you are going to win a World Series with Wilson Alvarez or Pedro Astacio replacing Colon as your #2/#3 starter. I see them as #4/#5 type guys. Al Levine is a decent setup guy who will come cheap but I'd rather sign a top flight reliever with filthy stuff like Latroy Hawkins and get an upper tier starter like Ponson rather than spend $8 million plus on a career NL player (albeit a damn good one) like Luis Castillo.

Castillo is a fine player but I just think the money would be better spent in pitching where the Sox have some huge holes to fill. With Alomar at 2B, I'm not seeing a huge hole. I see Alomar as a capable veteran 2B who is a fine defensive player, brings lots of intangibles, and most likely will come cheap so that the money can be used on pitching.

Tragg
11-04-2003, 11:47 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Well then this is all worth it after all!

Whooopee - the Alomars. The Sox have done nothing but win with Alomars around - from Handy Sandy to Jr to Roberto

A reason NOT to hire him