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TaylorStSox
11-01-2003, 02:50 AM
Any word on whether the Cards will pick up his option? He looks like the best option in the league at 2nd. He's a "grinder" with an all around game. He's exactly the type of guy the Sox need. I'm assuming he's recovered from his injury this year. Peronally, I'd rather have him than Castillo.

RichH55
11-01-2003, 04:59 AM
Originally posted by TaylorStSox
Any word on whether the Cards will pick up his option? He looks like the best option in the league at 2nd. He's a "grinder" with an all around game. He's exactly the type of guy the Sox need. I'm assuming he's recovered from his injury this year. Peronally, I'd rather have him than Castillo.


The cards won't

Very little reason to want him over Castillo, especially if money is not a factor

Probably doesn't bring more to the table than Robbie Alomar, and definately brings less than Todd Walker

Much better options out there unless Vina only wants 500 K...which he doesn't

Sox Content: Probably not even on their radar screen

Gumshoe
11-01-2003, 11:35 AM
I've always thought about this guy. He is a winner. Just because a guy doesn't have slugging and OPS out of this world, he shouldn't be disregarded, as I believe MANY are on this board. Hey, for a MIL, hell yeah I'd get him, IF
we aren't going to give Miles a shot. He looks like he may have promise.

Gum

soxnut
11-01-2003, 11:42 AM
I've always liked this guy. He is one of the best at going back on a ball. He is a grinder type of guy and is a professinal. I'd take him.

CubKilla
11-01-2003, 01:10 PM
Originally posted by soxnut
He is one of the best at going back on a ball.

Don't forget either that he isn't afraid to take a HBP. I'd consider him but I'm not hearing much interest from any MLB teams for Vina's services. Vina may have to take a $$$$$ cut to play in '04.

MarkV
11-01-2003, 02:16 PM
Vina would be a great addition, but don't expect the Sox to fork over the $4 or $5 mil that he'll be asking for.

TaylorStSox
11-01-2003, 02:40 PM
Vina's value can't be measured in numbers. It's the attitude that he brings to a team. Look at the year St. Louis had without is leadership (and obviously pitching). He's at an age where his value is in the next 2 years. That gives time for Harris to continue developing and be mentored by a winner. Granted, I believe Harris will hit eventually. I wouldn't take him over Robbie. This is just an alternative if it comes down it it.

Gumshoe
11-01-2003, 04:28 PM
Taylor, I think the Willie Harris thing is something that is stymie-ing the Sox. I don't believe he can hit at all, and although he's fast he's just average defensively at 2B. He did OK in CF, but rowand is MUCH better all around. Miles is better than Harris now, he is a switch hitter, and he has much more that makes me think he could be a player at the ML level.

Gumshoe

batmanZoSo
11-01-2003, 05:05 PM
Willie Harris is terrible.

It's nice to have guys with speed, and I'm all for it. But, well, you gotta hit occasionally too.

It seems like the majority prefers Harris to Rowand and I don't get that.

TaylorStSox
11-01-2003, 05:17 PM
I love how Reed hits 400 in the minors and is a savior. Yet, Harris hits 400 in the minors and is "stymying" this team. Give him some consistant AB's, then lets say what he's going to do.

nasox
11-01-2003, 05:21 PM
well, i guess i would take robbie as my first choice but if we have done everything we could to get him and he doesnt want to come, then bring on Vina if he doesnt try to rip the sox off.

Dub25
11-01-2003, 08:06 PM
Originally posted by TaylorStSox
Vina's value can't be measured in numbers. It's the attitude that he brings to a team. Look at the year St. Louis had without is leadership (and obviously pitching). He's at an age where his value is in the next 2 years. That gives time for Harris to continue developing and be mentored by a winner. Granted, I believe Harris will hit eventually. I wouldn't take him over Robbie. This is just an alternative if it comes down it it.

Exactly right. This guy finds a way to get it done. Plus, he is a flubbie killer. I would take a look at this guy.

SouthSideHitman
11-01-2003, 08:17 PM
Due to the fact that Walker will garner more attention and assuming we don't deal for Soriano, I could see the Sox and Vina getting together for a one year deal for right about a million. It would let Vina get back on his feet and reprove himself, give the Sox a sparkplug and grinder at the top of the order and give Harris and/or Miles another year at Charlotte to mature before we put them in pinstripes for good.

Gumshoe
11-01-2003, 08:39 PM
Originally posted by TaylorStSox
I love how Reed hits 400 in the minors and is a savior. Yet, Harris hits 400 in the minors and is "stymying" this team. Give him some consistant AB's, then lets say what he's going to do.

To be fair, Willie hasn't gotten consistent at bats. BUT NEITHER HAS ROWAND. He's the best we have defensively in CF and last year he showed that he has really improved (came up with hits all the time, none of which this board seems to see, save for a few enlightened individuals).

I never said anything about Reed --- I have no idea if he will or won't make it. All I know is that for the $, Rowand is a no brainer, and I think he's a gamer. Willie Harris is SPEED, and that is it. I don't trust Sox scouts enough --- I believe that they just took him because of that speed (although he isn't that bad of an all around player), as many scouts do these days. He's OK, but Rowand is MUCH MUCH better. Recognize this.

Gumshoe

Daver
11-01-2003, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe
To be fair, Willie hasn't gotten consistent at bats. BUT NEITHER HAS ROWAND. He's the best we have defensively in CF and last year he showed that he has really improved (came up with hits all the time, none of which this board seems to see, save for a few enlightened individuals).

I never said anything about Reed --- I have no idea if he will or won't make it. All I know is that for the $, Rowand is a no brainer, and I think he's a gamer. Willie Harris is SPEED, and that is it. I don't trust Sox scouts enough --- I believe that they just took him because of that speed (although he isn't that bad of an all around player), as many scouts do these days. He's OK, but Rowand is MUCH MUCH better. Recognize this.

Gumshoe

Aaron Rowand isn't even the best CF'er on the forty man roster.

Your infatuation with mediocre to bad ballplayers is amusing though.

Blueprint1
11-01-2003, 08:50 PM
harris is the worst hitter on the white sox. The guy has no bat the O's wanted nothing to do with him. Rowand isnt that great of a player but I would take his bat over Harris any day.

Daver
11-01-2003, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by Blueprint1
harris is the worst hitter on the white sox. The guy has no bat the O's wanted nothing to do with him. Rowand isnt that great of a player but I would take his bat over Harris any day.

I wasn't referring to Willie Harris.He can't play CF either.

flo-B-flo
11-01-2003, 09:16 PM
Rowand would have gotten his full shot had he not been injured in that irresponsible dirt bike fiasco. The jury is still out. Harris seems to be a slap contact hitter who doesn't make very much "fair" contact. I don't believe he is the future 2B. The Sox should either sign someone, trade for someone or go with Aaron Miles.

JRIG
11-01-2003, 09:20 PM
Originally posted by flo-B-flo
Rowand would have gotten his full shot had he not been injured in that irresponsible dirt bike fiasco. The jury is still out. Harris seems to be a slap contact hitter who doesn't make very much "fair" contact. I don't believe he is the future 2B. The Sox should either sign someone, trade for someone or go with Aaron Miles.

Aaron Miles is not an option. A 27-year old career minor leaguer who doesn't hit for power or walk or play very good defense is not the answer to any question.

RichH55
11-01-2003, 09:21 PM
Originally posted by Gumshoe
I've always thought about this guy. He is a winner. Just because a guy doesn't have slugging and OPS out of this world, he shouldn't be disregarded, as I believe MANY are on this board. Hey, for a MIL, hell yeah I'd get him, IF
we aren't going to give Miles a shot. He looks like he may have promise.

Gum


Might I add to his negatives...Gumshoe likes him...the kiss of death:)

Just messing around...I think we all like some players more than we should....me? I liked Mckay Christensen....Didn't mean he could hit or made sense to keep...I see parralels here with vina

JRIG
11-01-2003, 09:23 PM
Originally posted by RichH55
Might I add to his negatives...Gumshoe likes him...the kiss of death:)

Just messing around...I think we all like some players more than we should....me? I liked Mckay Christensen....Didn't mean he could hit or made sense to keep...I see parralels here with vina

Man, I loved McKay Christensen. Too bad he couldn't hit a lick. I really wanted him to turn into something besides a wasted first round draft pick.

RichH55
11-01-2003, 09:40 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Man, I loved McKay Christensen. Too bad he couldn't hit a lick. I really wanted him to turn into something besides a wasted first round draft pick.

Though at this point he would make a perfect 4th OF/Bench player

Speed and Defense..thats what you want out of that spot..and cheap too

soxruleEP
11-04-2003, 12:01 PM
Today it was annouced that St. Louis did not pick up his option.

So he is available.

jabrch
11-04-2003, 12:07 PM
Originally posted by JRIG
Aaron Miles is not an option. A 27-year old career minor leaguer who doesn't hit for power or walk or play very good defense is not the answer to any question.


Sure he is the answer to SOME question JRig...

Name a worse option to play CF than Rowand?

Who are three people who have never been in my kitchen?

Who do we have around who is fast, has a mediocre arm and might be able to hit .220?

See! I found 4 questions that Aaron Miles is the answer to without even thinking much!

batmanZoSo
11-04-2003, 12:12 PM
Getting Vina would be a great step in changing the face of this team. Even though Robbie was not a problem here, there's still that lackadaisical element he brings. Vina would be a leader on a team with very few. And he would be reunited with his former dp teammate, Valentin. They turned like 117 together in 96.

And Vina's cheaper than Alomar too, is he not?