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SpringfldFan
10-20-2003, 10:57 AM
I just saw a my favorite movie on tv again this weekend and it got me to thinking. As we have been reminded again this fall, the Cubs dominate the media and popular culture, especially when compared with the Sox. It seems every song and movie that mentions Chicago baseball mentions it in the context of the Cubs, as if they *are* Chicago baseball. It kind of makes you wonder what they got that we don't.

Well, that brings me back to my favorite movie, Field of Dreams. This movie is one of the greatest movies ever and I don't think it is a coincidence it involves mostly Sox players. Think of what this movie involves. It involves passionate players (Shoeless Joe and the Sox) who played hard but in the end were victims of an unfair characterization (their perceived role in the 1919 scandal, which may or may not be true). For the players, the game of baseball is THE primary focus, and they understood how the intricasy and beauty of the game mirrored the best things in life - love, family, honest work, and yes, even spirituality. The paychecks weren't important, and neither were huge crowds of hero worshippers. All they cared about was to do baseball proud by playing an honest game surrounded by a few deeply devoted supporters who believed in them. Don't you think these qualities reflect us true Sox fans and what attracts us to the team today? Could you imagine these qualities being the focus of a movie involving the Cubs and its fans? I hardly think so.

mike squires
10-20-2003, 11:16 AM
Funny how they talk about Brooklyn and the Dodgers as the teams they were passionate about to start the movie. Also, there is a scene in the movie where they are watching a Sox game on TV. I'd have to go back and check again but it may have actually been Don Pall.

TDog
10-21-2003, 03:43 AM
Joe Jackson's legacy enjoyed a cinematic renaissance at the end of the 1980s with "Field of Dreams" and "Eight Men Out" both treating him as a victim. Early in the decade, Harry Stein wrote a novel in which one of the narrators was Buck Weaver (fictitiously), and I think it would have made a better movie than "Eight Men Out." In 1992, Harvey Frommer came out with the biography "Shoeless Joe and Ragtime Baseball." Joe Jackson was definitely hot about 10 to 15 years ago.

Whether or not the perception is accurate, Joe Jackson and (to a lesser extent) Buck Weaver can be thought of in the way that people think of central characters in Shakespearean tragedies. But the same can be said of Cubs baseball in general. W.P. Kinsella's "Shoeless Joe" actually had a character who claimed to be the world's oldest living Chicago Cub. And his next baseball novel, "The Iowa Baseball Confederacy" involved a never-ending mythical game involving an early 20th century Cubs team.

OneDog
10-21-2003, 06:48 AM
Field of Dreams is a good film. However, Ray Liotta was a poor choice to play Shoeless Joe. Jackson threw right and hit left. In the movies, Liotta threw left and hit right. Also, Liotta had too much of an NY/NJ accent to be playing a southern farm boy. However, this is only a minor problem and does not detract all that much from the film.

MarqSox
10-21-2003, 07:59 AM
Originally posted by OneDog
Field of Dreams is a good film. However, Ray Liotta was a poor choice to play Shoeless Joe. Jackson threw right and hit left. In the movies, Liotta threw left and hit right. Also, Liotta had too much of an NY/NJ accent to be playing a southern farm boy. However, this is only a minor problem and does not detract all that much from the film.
Not to mention, Liotta came off sounding relatively intelligent, and from all accounts, brains were not Joe's strongest suit.

Procol Harum
10-21-2003, 09:59 AM
Originally posted by MarqSox
Not to mention, Liotta came off sounding relatively intelligent, and from all accounts, brains were not Joe's strongest suit.

Formal education was not Joe Jackson's strongest suit, like many of his peers in his economic class in that section of the country at that time. Don't confuse that with a lack of intelligence.

idseer
10-21-2003, 10:00 AM
Originally posted by MarqSox
Not to mention, Liotta came off sounding relatively intelligent, and from all accounts, brains were not Joe's strongest suit.

well, when you're dead ... you wise up! :D:

MarkEdward
10-21-2003, 12:33 PM
Originally posted by Procol Harum
Formal education was not Joe Jackson's strongest suit, like many of his peers in his economic class in that section of the country at that time. Don't confuse that with a lack of intelligence.

Didn't he successfully run a hardware store after his playing days in either South Carolina or Georgia?

TDog
10-21-2003, 12:42 PM
Originally posted by MarkEdward
Didn't he successfully run a hardware store after his playing days in either South Carolina or Georgia?

He ran a small liquor store. He worked at the front counter. He was unable to read the labels but distinguished between the products by the artwork on the labels.

His wife was the brains of the outfit.