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SoxxoS
10-12-2003, 03:23 PM
All this offseason talk we do for 5-6 months is all to do one thing...to get to the World Series. The Cubs are going to be playing in it this year. That is the worst thing about this for me.

Everything we talk about is going to be achieved by the Cubs.

Just a small rant.

GoSox2K3
10-12-2003, 03:48 PM
I totally feel the same way.

All the celebrations going on about the Cubs and I can't help but think - that should have been us this year! Instead, we got a manager who tinkered away wins as our team faded into oblivion. After the Sox's September choke, this is the ultimate salt in the fans' wounds.

The other worst thing about this that most Cub fans are totally underserving of this success. I have always strongly felt that Sox fans are the true underdogs and that we are the real diehards who are angered to see our team lose and yet proudly pull for our team despite the fact that most people in our home city root against them. To be a Sox fan shows real character! Cub fans, on the other hand are mostly the brain-dead masses rooting for the most popular team. They may whine about pennant droughts, but all they care about is how popular their team is. I don't care how long the Cubs have been losing, I have always felt it was one of the easiest thing in the world to be a Cub fan and most people who root for them are just riding the Cubs poplularity bandwagon.

Ah well, too bad life isn't fair.

Brian26
10-12-2003, 03:54 PM
How many douchebags have you seen walking around town with Cub hats this week? I don't think I saw more than a dozen Cub hats all summer. And the hats from this past week, you'll notice, are either brand-spanking new OR about 15 years old (with the old mesh back or the fitted hats w/out the mlb logo on the back).

soxtalker
10-12-2003, 03:59 PM
Did you see the newsclips of Mayor Daley and his wife last night? His enthusiasm seemed to be a tad bit muted for the mayor of a city whose team is about to win the pennant...

Lip Man 1
10-12-2003, 07:26 PM
With respect to all...

The White Sox had their chances to do something in 83, 90, 91, 93, 94, 96, 00 and 03.

They pissed every one away and all for the same reason with the exception of the 83 club, the other years all saw the Sox missing a piece or two. Ownership refused to go out and what what was needed in the stretch run.

They got what they paid for...nothing.

Lip

StillMissOzzie
10-12-2003, 07:36 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
With respect to all...

The White Sox had their chances to do something in 83, 90, 91, 93, 94, 96, 00 and 03.

They pissed every one away and all for the same reason with the exception of the 83 club, the other years all saw the Sox missing a piece or two. Ownership refused to go out and what what was needed in the stretch run.

They got what they paid for...nothing.

Lip

I think 94 was the strike year, but - point well taken. It seems like you'll never get JR to put the crobar on the wallet.

:angry:
:gulp:
SMO

ewokpelts
10-12-2003, 09:36 PM
Originally posted by Brian26
How many douchebags have you seen walking around town with Cub hats this week? I don't think I saw more than a dozen Cub hats all summer. And the hats from this past week, you'll notice, are either brand-spanking new OR about 15 years old (with the old mesh back or the fitted hats w/out the mlb logo on the back).


Yup......at my work...LOTS of new hats/shirts......even the girls are in on it, but they can be forgiven since they are wearing the babydoll shirts, even if it's scrubbie blue

Originally posted by soxtalker
Did you see the newsclips of Mayor Daley and his wife last night? His enthusiasm seemed to be a tad bit muted for the mayor of a city whose team is about to win the pennant...


Looks like a general conceding territory to the enemy......A lot different than a month ago.....

Gene

cheeses_h_rice
10-12-2003, 09:44 PM
Originally posted by Brian26
How many douchebags have you seen walking around town with Cub hats this week? I don't think I saw more than a dozen Cub hats all summer. And the hats from this past week, you'll notice, are either brand-spanking new OR about 15 years old (with the old mesh back or the fitted hats w/out the mlb logo on the back).

Of all the people I've seen wearing Flubbie stuff the past 2 weeks, I'd say maybe 5-10% look like they're wearing stuff purchased prior to October, 2003.

The way Flub fans talk about OTHER teams being "fairweather" just makes this impression a complete ****ing joke. At work, I hear people talking about "the Cubbies" as if they've been following them 162 games a year, year upon year, when the reality is they're about as big a fan of North Side baseball as 90% of Chicago was "fans" of pro basketball from 1991-98.

For all those diehard, knowledgeable folks that truly follow the Baby Bears and live and die with them year after year, hey, good on ya, and enjoy the ride. The rest of these condescending, arrogant, bandwagon-jumping, frontrunning pieces of **** that call themselves "Cub fans" can go **** a ****.

Dadawg_77
10-12-2003, 11:26 PM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
With respect to all...

The White Sox had their chances to do something in 83, 90, 91, 93, 94, 96, 00 and 03.

They pissed every one away and all for the same reason with the exception of the 83 club, the other years all saw the Sox missing a piece or two. Ownership refused to go out and what what was needed in the stretch run.

They got what they paid for...nothing.

Lip

The only missing in 93 was someone not notcing Jack was tipping his pitches. If that didn't happen the Sox would have won the ALCS. 90 and 91 was a young team coming into its own. Those years lead to sucess of 93 and 94. The Sox plan in 95-98 messed up that success that team had.

GoSox2K3
10-13-2003, 12:01 AM
Originally posted by Brian26
How many douchebags have you seen walking around town with Cub hats this week? I don't think I saw more than a dozen Cub hats all summer. And the hats from this past week, you'll notice, are either brand-spanking new OR about 15 years old (with the old mesh back or the fitted hats w/out the mlb logo on the back).

I was my local Osco the other night and they were selling Halloween stuff and Cub souveniers. Right when I walked in, they had a Darth Maul mask and he was wearing a Cubs cap. I found this very amusing and fits in perfectly with my belief that people who root for the Cubs have "turned to the Dark Side".

bc2k
10-13-2003, 01:08 AM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice
The way Flub fans talk about OTHER teams being "fairweather" just makes this impression a complete ****ing joke. At work, I hear people talking about "the Cubbies" as if they've been following them 162 games a year, year upon year,

Ask them specific questions about their team from early in the season. Start with a couple of softballs like, "For which other team did Randall Simon play for in 2003?" And move up to some only fans since the beginning know the answer to, "Mark Grudzielanek was injured in Spring Training. What part of his body was injured?"

And if they're feeling pretty smug for knowing the answers to the tough questions, ask them (just to hear them say it) why Sosa was suspended this season. Followed by which South Side Sox fan is responsible for the success of the Cubs pitching staff? Answer: Larry Rothschild, born and raised on the South Side.

MRKARNO
10-13-2003, 01:10 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
Ask them specific questions about their team from early in the season. Start with a couple of softballs like, "For which other team did Randall Simon play for in 2003?" And move up to some only fans since the beginning know the answer to, "Mark Grudzielanek was injured in Spring Training. What part of his body was injured?"

And if they're feeling pretty smug for knowing the answers to the tough questions, ask them (just to hear them say it) why Sosa was suspended this season. Followed by which South Side Sox fan is responsible for the success of the Cubs pitching staff? Answer: Larry Rothschild, born and raised on the South Side.

Well I think by that point you'd eliminate most fans of any team with such detailed questions

fuzzy_patters
10-13-2003, 01:25 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
With respect to all...

The White Sox had their chances to do something in 83, 90, 91, 93, 94, 96, 00 and 03.

They pissed every one away and all for the same reason with the exception of the 83 club, the other years all saw the Sox missing a piece or two. Ownership refused to go out and what what was needed in the stretch run.

They got what they paid for...nothing.

Lip

Lip, please do not take this the wrong way, but I hate you.

It all started last Spring Training. My first taste of White Sox having success, after the ineptitude of my youth, was the Sox teams of the early 1990's. It is not that I was not a fan of the 1983 White Sox, but as a five year old, I did not have a full understanding of the game, yet. This past history led me to believe that the beginning of this decade was just the reincarnation of the 1990's. I assumed that the young Sox team of 2000 would go through some growing pains, just as the 1990 and 1991 Sox experienced. This led to a joyous optimism that the 2003 Sox, led by free agent acquisition Bartolo Colon, would be destined to head to the playoffs this season. Back in the spring, I figured that the only difference between 2003 and 1993 was that the 2003 Sox were playoff experienced, and thusly would be better prepared to run through the playoffs.

This brings me to why I hate you. All spring long I argued on here with you, as did many others, about the White Sox' fortunes in the upcoming season. We berated you and called you a pessimist at every turn. Now, after sitting through another disappointing season, I believe that I am beginning to understand what it truly means to be a Sox fan. I find myself wondering if any moves the Sox will make in the off-season will be good enough. For example, it seems much easier to find a negative trait in every possible managerial candidate than a positive one.

In other words, I say that I hate you because I fear that I am becoming like you. I do not, of course, truly hate you, because I do not even know you. However, I feel that I truly resent what I have become, and I am transferring my anger to you because of the pessimism you represent.

PS -The above post is only slightly facetious. I now truly understand what it is to be a Sox fan.

soxfan26
10-13-2003, 03:27 AM
Originally posted by fuzzy_patters
I now truly understand what it is to be a Sox fan.

I was 7 in 1983 and my Dad took me to Comiskey a bunch of times that summer. I was at the game before the Sox clinched the west. In my mind they won the world series that night, I never saw Comiskey so crazy. Later my Dad had to explain to me what the ALCS was and just who the Baltimore Orioles were.

I was born again in 1990, but had to watch Comiskey get torn down on TV because we moved out to Virginia. I thought for sure we were going places in 1993, OK but definitely '94.

I watched the 2000 playoffs in Germany, but I was sure we would be all right next year.

I live about 40 miles south of Baltimore now, and I catch the Sox at Camden Yards every year, and 10-15 games on WGN. But the meltdown in September was a tough one to take. They honestly broke my heart this year.

Now I know how my Dad feels. He was at Games 1 and 6 of the '59 series. He knows true pain.

I tried to be an O's fan, no dice. Lived in Denver for two years gave the Rockies a try, no way.

So we are just the next generation fuzzy, destined to follow the Sox through it all. So sit back, keep watching and try to get rid of the bitter taste on your tongue.

:gulp:

soxtalker
10-13-2003, 08:36 AM
Originally posted by soxtalker
Did you see the newsclips of Mayor Daley and his wife last night? His enthusiasm seemed to be a tad bit muted for the mayor of a city whose team is about to win the pennant...


Originally posted by ewokpelts
Looks like a general conceding territory to the enemy......A lot different than a month ago.....

Gene

Retreat is not surrender.

I wonder if the Cubbie fans or the national media notice that his demeanor is not that enthusiastic.

KingXerxes
10-13-2003, 10:19 AM
Before everybody on this thread closes the garage door with the car running, I would like to point out that as of 10-13-03 the Cubs haven't won anything. Let this thing play itself out - methinks you'll be surprised at the outcome.

harwar
10-13-2003, 10:47 AM
Yea,cub fans are coming out of the woodwork just like cockroaches.
I was in a local watering hole up here in wisconsin watching the Bears game and i noticed a guy and his girl wearing cub stuff.I know that they aren't cub fans so i asked whats up.They said that its the chic thing now(like cowboy boots were for awhile).I mean these people don't even like baseball(packers fans).
This will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it.

washington
10-13-2003, 11:49 AM
Another consolation is that I haven't really heard anyone talking about "rally monkeys" this year. Once this season's over and the novelty about the Cubs succeeding ends, the national attention will start being directed elsewhere. The Cubs bandwagoners in Chicago won't ever shut up about it, of course, but that's how they always are.

GoSox2K3
10-13-2003, 12:57 PM
Originally posted by KingXerxes
Before everybody on this thread closes the garage door with the car running, I would like to point out that as of 10-13-03 the Cubs haven't won anything. Let this thing play itself out - methinks you'll be surprised at the outcome.

I'll leave the keys in the ignition tomorrow night just in case. Better yet, I might keep a cyanide capsule in my mouth ready to bite down on as Mark Prior makes the final out.

Lip Man 1
10-13-2003, 01:00 PM
Dadawg says: "The only missing in 93 was someone not notcing Jack was tipping his pitches. If that didn't happen the Sox would have won the ALCS. 90 and 91 was a young team coming into its own. Those years lead to sucess of 93 and 94. The Sox plan in 95-98 messed up that success that team had.

Obviously more information is needed since some of you missed the point, for that I apologize.

Let's look back at these clubs and see what Sox management did in the stretch run to help their chances...

1990- Traded Ron Kittle for Phil Bradley. Ironically enough this was one reason why Jerry Reinsdorf fired Larry Himes in late September of that season. Reinsdorf wanted the Sox to go out and acquire more pitching to stay with the A's. Himes refused to trade any young talent. The Sox played well in September but just didn't have the fire power needed to hang in, obviously Phil Bradley wasn't the answer (and the Sox lost him after the season to free agency.)

1991- On the day of the trading deadline July 31st, the Sox were three games out. General Manager Ron Schueler refused to do anything. On August 12th Bobby Thigpen blew an extra inning save situation in Baltimore starting a collapse that saw the Sox lose 15 of 17 games falling 9 back. This team was a contender that season...Sox management did NOTHING.

1993- I was just recently reviewing that season for a future interactive audio piece and discovered some things that reinforced some initial impressions. Here are the batting averages of some 93 players:

George Bell--.217, Craig Grebeck--.226, Bo Jackson--.232, Ron Karkovice--.228, Dan Pasqua (who started at 1st base in Game #2 of the ALCS)--.205, Steve Sax--.235.

The point is this club needed at least another strong bat Thomas, Ventura and Burks were hauling the entire load (with some "speed" help from Raines, Johnson and Guillen). Jackson and Bell were a combined 0-16 in the post season!

With respect it was more then Jack McDowell (and Alex Fernandez) tipping their pitches. Thomas was walked 10 times in the ALCS because the Jays feared no one else. This club was farther away from making the World Series then you think.

That's why 1994 was a much better club, which of course, our own owner destroyed by his stance during the labor impasse and his desire for revenge on the union in 1995 when he ordered the team gutted.

My point is that the Sox had chances but as Pale Hose George says in his posts our management was to "stupid, timid and cheap," to take advantage of them.

The Cubs finally learned...you want to get to a World Series...spend $$$$$$$$$$ LOTS of it. Will the Sox ever get it?

Sox management is the reason the club had the 3rd best record in baseball during the decade of the 90's and only one playoff appearance to show for it!

Lip

Hangar18
10-13-2003, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by fuzzy_patters
Lip, please do not take this the wrong way, but I hate you.


PS -The above post is only slightly facetious. I now truly understand what it is to be a Sox fan.

Hehh heh. There are a number of us here, some Pessimists, some Optimists, some Conspiracy Theorists, some statistics guys, some minor league guys, some Media watchers, but we are all Graduates of the University of White Sox and we've all "Majored" in these different areas.

Lip Man 1
10-13-2003, 09:32 PM
Fuzzy:

No offense taken. I know others get tired of my "negativity" as well. All I can say is that I call them like I see them.

I wish one day the Sox would totally shock and surprise me but I can't recall it happening more then a handful of times (1977, 1990, and 2000 come to mind.) and of course I'm still waiting for that World Series appearance (43 years and counting...)

Lip

GoSox2K3
10-16-2003, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by KingXerxes
Before everybody on this thread closes the garage door with the car running, I would like to point out that as of 10-13-03 the Cubs haven't won anything. Let this thing play itself out - methinks you'll be surprised at the outcome.

Way to go KingXerxes!!! Thank God you were right!

Jerko
10-16-2003, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
Ask them specific questions about their team from early in the season. Start with a couple of softballs like, "For which other team did Randall Simon play for in 2003?" And move up to some only fans since the beginning know the answer to, "Mark Grudzielanek was injured in Spring Training. What part of his body was injured?"

And if they're feeling pretty smug for knowing the answers to the tough questions, ask them (just to hear them say it) why Sosa was suspended this season. Followed by which South Side Sox fan is responsible for the success of the Cubs pitching staff? Answer: Larry Rothschild, born and raised on the South Side.

Hell, just ask them who Corey Patterson is or what team he's on!

Iwritecode
10-16-2003, 10:36 AM
Originally posted by Lip Man 1
The Cubs finally learned...you want to get to a World Series...spend $$$$$$$$$$ LOTS of it.

and then lose in the second round to a team with a payroll less then half of yours...

Hey Lip, can you drag out that quote of Selig that you always post about only high-payroll teams advancing in the playoffs? Are the Marlins the first team in forever to make it to the WS while having a payroll that ranks in the lower half of MLB?